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crashburnoveride

CBO's 15g softy build

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crashburnoveride

Yes I am definitely doing an ATO now. Something I can refill when I do my weekly water change. Totally new to this nano thing. My old tank was much bigger it was more forgiving. 

 

One of the things that I'm really enjoying about this project so far is all the gadgets Ive been researching that weren't available to me back in like 2007. Smart wifi power strips, reefpi, LED lighting, etc. If I do the reefpi I think it would be for 1 reason. The salinity probe (over $100 tho 🥴) because I dream of a screen next to the tank displaying temp, salinity, ph and whatever else that I can glance at as I walk by. The tech just seems so cool. I wouldnt mind some wifi cameras either. One in sump and one in/on display so I can check in whenever. Pipe dreams? Refer dreams? 😆 🤷‍♂️ 

 

Aj if it will cost more to build my own LED light than just buying a black box I'll probably just buy the box tbh. 😆 This light I have now has a 150w MH, 28w of t5 actinic and 4 blue nighttime leds. Its honestly too much light, and its form is too big. I do like how I can control each one seperate on timers tho. Its for sale btw 😉 I could hang it but I know my rambunctious 5yo son would throw a ball at it or something its inevitable. 

 

How come I cant link a picture from URL on mobile? Trying to use flickr to host. 

 

-CBO

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ajmckay
3 hours ago, TatorTaco said:

Lessons I've learned the hard way that I hope you consider:

 

Definitely get an ATO.  This makes the hobby so much easier. 

 

Definitely get a temperature controller.  This is the one I got and it works like a charm.    

This is the one I use as well!  Works awesome.   It looks like they have a wifi enabled one as well for not a lot more.  I also have a DIY style controller based on the small inkbird panel mount temp controller that's like $10 or $15 on eBay and it works equally well. 

 

55 minutes ago, Firefish15 said:

How’s that one been working @TatorTaco? Does the probe rust at all?

Had it for at least 5 years and so far no rust.  They sell a longer probe that's really nice if you use a probe holder.  I use both versions though (on different controllers) and they are both rust free. 

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crashburnoveride

Sketch and mock up. 

 

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I really am pretty sold on this scape. Left side kind of wraps around the overflow with an arch branching out. And the opposite side is more open and simple. 👌

 

-CBO

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ajmckay
4 hours ago, crashburnoveride said:

Yes I am definitely doing an ATO now. Something I can refill when I do my weekly water change. Totally new to this nano thing. My old tank was much bigger it was more forgiving. 

 

One of the things that I'm really enjoying about this project so far is all the gadgets Ive been researching that weren't available to me back in like 2007. Smart wifi power strips, reefpi, LED lighting, etc. If I do the reefpi I think it would be for 1 reason. The salinity probe (over $100 tho 🥴) because I dream of a screen next to the tank displaying temp, salinity, ph and whatever else that I can glance at as I walk by. The tech just seems so cool. I wouldnt mind some wifi cameras either. One in sump and one in/on display so I can check in whenever. Pipe dreams? Refer dreams? 😆 🤷‍♂️ 

 

Aj if it will cost more to build my own LED light than just buying a black box I'll probably just buy the box tbh. 😆 This light I have now has a 150w MH, 28w of t5 actinic and 4 blue nighttime leds. Its honestly too much light, and its form is too big. I do like how I can control each one seperate on timers tho. Its for sale btw 😉 I could hang it but I know my rambunctious 5yo son would throw a ball at it or something its inevitable. 

 

How come I cant link a picture from URL on mobile? Trying to use flickr to host. 

 

-CBO

I also like the gadgets and DIY opportunities.  One of the coolest aspects of this hobby is that there are so many different ways to do it.  And tech certainly has kept up with the growth as well.  Even in the last year or so there have been some really cool developments in pump design, like the AI Nero. 

 

On the topic of LED - I spent $400 on a light for a 36"w x 18"d x 16"t tank. So roughly the equivalent of 2 high high end pendant lights - and to buy 2 of those would cost $800 or so.  If you were to light a 15g DIY style, and with today's options (and a more reasonably sized heatsink), then you could land between $100 and $200.  Power supply and heatsink being some of the major items.  It's hard to beat something like an AI prime for a tank your size though. 

 

Not sure on the flikr question... maybe try a different link? 

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crashburnoveride

Wow I love how it turned out. Took me 3 hours. 

 

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I think I might put them on eggcrate only under the big rocks. Just paranoid my kids stomping will cause something to crack. 😬 Did I mention he's rambunctious? 😅

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ajmckay

Liking the scape!!!  That front rock would be a nice GSP (green star polyp) island.  

 

Looks like a decent amount of coral placement opportunities.  Just make sure you have some nice hidey holes for whatever fish you end up with.   Speaking of which, now that your tank is just about ready to add water have you thought more about what you want to try for fish and corals? 

 

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crashburnoveride
4 hours ago, ajmckay said:

now that your tank is just about ready to add water have you thought more about what you want to try for fish and corals? 

 

For fish I'm just starting with a clownfish and hoping to resist the urge to add more. I would like a purple dottyback someday tho. I had a convict goby for years and loved that fish, but sadly I don't think I have enough room to keep one. I will also get a clean up crew. Undecided on hermits or an emerald crab. And need to research snail species. It will be interesting to see what happens in the tank with my skimmer and the chaeto fuge. Maybe crabs won't have enough to munch on... 

 

For corals I know I want a photosynthetic gorgonian, a toadstool, mayyybe a kenya tree, gsp, and hoping to find some colorful zoas locally without an astronomical price tag, as well as a colorful mushroom. Nothing crazy, just want to have some success and enjoy the tank.

 

-CBO

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ReefCap

Hermits over emerald always, and personally I like snails VS crabs because so many crabs (even hermits can eat corals) trocus snails are my favorite for rocks and glass, nassrius for sand.

 

For corals I’d be hesitant of GSP and Kenya tree, they spread like weeds. Good colored Zoas are not to hard to find for cheap so that’s a great plan. Yes to the toadstool and gorgonian. Look at cabbage leather (there’s some very bright green ones) and some easy LPS like acans and hammers/frogspawn. Lots of color and movement for not to much.

 

Glad to see you’ve figured out your over flow. Can’t wait to see more!

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crashburnoveride

So for my ATO what depth should my return chamber be? I had planned on a 6" tall baffle. I could go up to 8" but wanted some space for backflow. 

 

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-CBO

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crashburnoveride
20 hours ago, ReefCap said:

Glad to see you’ve figured out your over flow. Can’t wait to see more!

Yeahhhh... I went back to design 1 with a few modifications. 😆 

 

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Sizing the elbow coming out of the T fitting on the durso down to a 3/4" saved a lot of room. This will ultimately turn out to be better I think because the water level in the overflow box will be much higher and therefore more quiet. Every piece is completely removable though! 

 

-CBO

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ajmckay
13 hours ago, crashburnoveride said:

So for my ATO what depth should my return chamber be? I had planned on a 6" tall baffle. I could go up to 8" but wanted some space for backflow. 

 

-CBO

My recommendation is to maximize the size of the return chamber (within reason).  Depending on what pump you put in there it could start to suck in water from the surface. Also, even though you'll have an ATO a slightly larger volume will make it turn on less often and in the chance that your ATO reservoir runs dry it gives you a bit more time. 

 

That being said as you note you don't want an overflow.  So calculate the depth of your return line and whatever that volume is then reserve that much, +10-20% for when you shut off the return pump.

 

Finally - agree on your decision to keep the overflow water level higher.  Less noise is nice.   

 

do you have a sump drawing? 

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crashburnoveride

Thanks for the input again AJ. Yes I have a sump drawing. I still haven't worked out the filter floss area yet. Both ends of the fuge are black acrylic to avoid light spill, and the other baffles are clear lexan. 

 

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I have a question on the return lines. If I hook both to a Y, and one pump turns off will the flow from the remaining pump come back down like this?

 

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Rather than buying the fitting and testing it I figured I'd just ask. Thanks y'all!

 

Man, I'm getting so close to water it's exciting. I'm going hunting tonight and its sad I'd rather work on the tank! Haha, but gotta try to fill the freezer first. Have a good day everyone!

 

-CBO

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crashburnoveride

Put the fiji pink in today and mixed up some saltwater. It's so exciting to finally have a wet tank!! Been quite the project. 

 

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I mixed 15 gallons of saltwater but the display only needed 10. Still need to finish the sump and I also have a surprise aquarium hood that I've built. Loving this tank already!

 

-CBO

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ajmckay

So did ya fill the freezer?  What are you hunting for? 

 

I still think your return area is a bit too small...  Just remember that the return area is where all the water level changes will accumulate.  I might consider giving it an extra inch or so.  Chaeto and a heater don't need much room really.  BRS made a pretty cool video on refugiums.   I really like the sump design they show at 14:08 (except that one has no room for filter socks).  I don't think it really matters if you put the skimmer before or after the refugium.  I have my skimmer before.

 

 

I really like your idea to use black acrylic on either side of the refugium.  You can run a nice light and not grow things in the drain or return chambers.

 

For the dual return idea, yes in that system the water would flow back - at least partially.  To get water up through the tubing the pump has to build up pressure which it can't do very well if there's an outlet along the length of the tube.  I actually have a splitter on my return line just like your drawing - but the other end isn't a pump, it's a way to use the return pump to do a quick water change by directing the flow into a bucket.  Honestly return pumps don't fail very often at all.  You would probably be covered if you just kept a spare around.  If you're worried about when you go on vacation or something then you could put a temporary heater in the main tank while you're away.  Heat + the internal powerhead should cover you in the event the return fails. 

 

Congrats on getting it wet!  Quite the project indeed.   Excited to see the hood you built.  

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crashburnoveride
6 hours ago, ajmckay said:

So did ya fill the freezer?  What are you hunting for? 

Yes! Whitetail deer. He's still hanging in the garage right now. I'm sitting around waiting for my LFS to open up so I can buy a new heater! I had 2 left over in storage and both of them suck. I checked the tank last night and it was 82 and climbing so I just unplugged them. So I'll buy one new heater today and one down the road. Gonna put em on a heater controller. 

 

So I already have 2 of 3 bubble trap panels siliconed in. To expand the return chamber I can just leave off the third and final panel. Looking like this:

 

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From what I've read the mini skimmer produces some micro bubbles when breaking in but not many at all after a while. After flowing thru the fuge and what I have here hopefully enough to stop bubbles?? Should I add a small piece at the front of trap like this?

 

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6 hours ago, ajmckay said:

If you're worried about when you go on vacation or something then you could put a temporary heater in the main tank while you're away.  Heat + the internal powerhead should cover you in the event the return fails. 

Genius lol. Perhaps I've been over complicating things. Thanks for all the feedback AJ you've really been a help for this build. 👏👏👏

 

Hood update later today?? Maybeee... 😁

 

-CBO

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ajmckay

Nice on the deer!  We eat a lot of venison here.  What state are you in?  

 

I think that sump design is better.   When you set up the return pump you'll want to "tune in" your max/min lines in that return area.  To do that you'll:

1) Empty the top tank down to the level of the return line.  Usually when a pump turns off the return line becomes a siphon so lower it until the return would be able to suck some air.

2) Fill the sump full full

3) Turn on the pump and wait for a few minutes until the system equalizes

4) Mark a line in the return area - that's your max fill line and where you'll set your ATO sensors. 

5) optional but once you mark the max you can start taking water out of the system until the pump starts sucking air.  Then mark that as the minimum. 

 

My fav heaters are Eheim Jaeger.  They're a little more but they seem to seal better and their cords are more robust than other brands. Plus when they are no longer useful there's some nice nichrome wire in there that you can harvest. 

 

Finally - happy to help.  With reefing you want to have redundant systems but you'll never be able to plan for everything so think about what works best for you.  For example if you travel a lot, I would rather have a UPS battery backup connected to my Koralia than have a second return pump.  And a good justification to pick up an extra heater is to make a water mixing station.  I just use a trash can with a lid (If you have a menards they sell these 10 gallon food-safe ones that are perfect) with a spare heater and pump and now you have water mixed and ready whenever you want to do maintenance.  For me that is super important because I found that if my first step in doing maintenance is to mix saltwater I would skip it.  It works for me that the first step is cleaning the tank then filling it and replenishing the water last.

 

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crashburnoveride
On 1/16/2021 at 12:35 PM, ajmckay said:

Nice on the deer!  We eat a lot of venison here.  What state are you in?  

I'm in good ol Nebraska. Once I'm finished processing this deer then it's back to tank work. Gotta finish the sump and decide if I'm gonna use the canopy hood thing or not. 

 

-CBO

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crashburnoveride

We got sump work.

 

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Yah finally got the sump done. Water will fall into a small chamber in the back left with pipe below water line. Overflow into and over filter floss. Then under that baffle to skimmer section, then fuge. Gonna build a little egg crate tower to hold the floss.

 

I was gonna show off the canopy tonight, but I need to sand and paint it. 

 

-CBO

 

 

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crashburnoveride

So what the heck should I do for lighting? I dont know if Ive shared what light I currently have. Its a 178watt hybrid. It is 18" wide. Has a 150w metal halide, 2 t5 actinic 14w bulbs, and 4 blue nighttime leds. 

 

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I really like that each type of light has its own chord to put on seperate timers. I just don't need this much light! I tried to sell it on my local reefing group for $100 nobody was seriously interested. 

 

So I can keep it and use the leds and t5s and just leave the MH not even plugged in. Thats option 1. For this I could buy 1 new bulb in the 10000k spectrum and keep the other actinic. Or just leave them both blue I guess... I can get 2 new t5 bulbs on ebay for 15 dollars so thats probably the cheapest option as well. 

 

Option 2 I'm considering is just using two par38 bulbs mounted under the canopy. Very simple and easy to do. 

 

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Or buy a light like the hipargero led. I just don't know which route to go! I'm also considering starting a YouTube channel for the build/progression. Should I do it? 

 

-CBO

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ajmckay
On 1/18/2021 at 10:36 AM, crashburnoveride said:

I'm in good ol Nebraska. Once I'm finished processing this deer then it's back to tank work. Gotta finish the sump and decide if I'm gonna use the canopy hood thing or not. 

 

-CBO

Oh nice!  I have a decent amount of family in Omaha and I used to live in KC. I was born in Denver and I've just been working my way east apparently!  Deer hunting is pretty good in Michigan though.  I don't see really big ones that often but it's rare I don't see at least a few deer in a typical day. 

 

Sump looks great - I think you'll be happy with that setup.   I can't really tell from the pic but is the water level baffle after the fuge lower than the one before?   Not that it really matters, but I find that if it's lower you get a bit more turbulence coming out of the skimmer chamber.   Did you do the math on how much water will back-siphon into the sump?  

 

Lighting:  you would be fine with your current light - but not sure how common those MH bulbs are anymore.  Honestly I'm not surprised that you didn't sell it.  I don't think anyone would buy it for more than like $10 or something.  I loooove metal halide - I designed my LED output around a 250w hamilton 14k.  But unless you have a really high end name brand unit most aren't interested.  I have a 36" twin bulb T5 that I think I'm going to end up giving away for someone to gut and maybe retro LED's into. 

 

So your option of replacing the bulbs should work just fine for that size tank.  Won't get you much past some lower light LPS though and bulb choice is important for tank aesthetic so if you go this route get decent bulbs.  I'm not a T5 guru but I always liked the giesemann actinic/15k combo.  

 

I don't think you would like the LED PAR bulbs....  Those have some pretty tight optics so you would need to mount them pretty high up off the surface - would look really spotlighty inside a canopy.

 

For the soft corals you're looking to keep I would look at one of those LED strip lights on Amazon.  They're in the $50 range for a 24".  Something like the Nicrew or Hygger maybe?  Get one that you can adjust the amount of blue.  I think those would be enough for a 12" deep tank - though I've never actually kept coral under one.   I just replaced the dual bulb T5HO with a hygger one for my display sump and we'll see - but so far I like it and have no reason to believe it won't grow coral well.  I went with a FW light for macros though. 

 

I think you'll do fine with almost any decently powerful LED light.  Most nano style ones are designed for a 24" spread - but depending on the optics you could see a lot less light around the corners than in the middle.   For that hipargero light it looks like someone used 2 for a 30" wide tank and 1 over a 24" tank worked - but there were lower light spots around the edge. 

 

The current Orbit marine isn't a bad light.  Similarly you could always go the DIY LED route.  This weekend I'm going to see if I can convert my arduino based light controller over to a wi-fi enabled ESP8266.  Fingers crossed but it should be a substantially cleaner setup. 

 

Lastly - the youtube thing is a cool idea.  If you have the time I would say go for it.  I mean don't have expectations that it's going to go viral or something - but it's really fun a few years down the road to revisit the tank in it's setup stages and see how much it's matured.

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crashburnoveride
7 hours ago, ajmckay said:

I can't really tell from the pic but is the water level baffle after the fuge lower than the one before? 

The baffle leading into the fuge is 9.5" tall and the baffle exiting is 9" tall. 

 

I went ahead and ordered 2 new t5s one is actinic and the other 10000k. These are 14w bulbs for an 18" fixture (bulb length 16.5" I think) and I think they may be specific to this odyssey brand light. Because I am not finding that size anywhere other than one seller on ebay. So idk if a 15000k is available. Shoot if this MH is that lowly sought after now then I wont feel so bad about modifications to the fixture. But for now I'll just rock the t5s. 

 

Last night I stayed up way to late trying to get the sump going. I am very frustrated as I can't get a good seal on the bottom bulkhead. 

 

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I feel kind of defeated. I cant crank on that nut any harder by hand, and im not even sure if I have a tool that can fit in there anyways. Should I try to silicone the seems in the overflow? That kind of makes it permanent. To be honest when dealing with this that 29g biocube sitting in my basement was really sounding good. 🤣 But the sump and fuge will be so cool once its up and running. I won't give up yet! However, I want to have full confidence in the seals on this thing. Also, that "quiet one" pump is a joke. Its loud af! And not just humming. It sounds like its kicking around a rock in there. Yayyy spend more money!!! 😐 

 

-CBO

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crashburnoveride
8 hours ago, ajmckay said:

I have a decent amount of family in Omaha and I used to live in KC.

Cool are any of them into the hobby? I'm not too far away here in lincoln. I haven't been to fish freaks in omaha, but I gather their reef community up there is better than down here. We used to have 2 fish stores that sold marine stuff and then petco. One of them closed and the other severely dialed back their marine section. Now its basically to where petco has the best to offer and that sucks. 

 

Well, I was gonna wait to post the hood until I replaced the doors, but here it is. I built it 5 years ago for the 20tall build I had going on. And since the 20tall and 15g have the same footprint it fit right on.

 

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I think it completes the look. It's nice that it hides the light too. I plan on replacing the doors to a smooth flat door like this to make it more sleek. Plus that paint bubbled up. 

 

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Another benefit is it has built in plumbing so instead of the return line having three 90° bends to get up and into the tank its just 1. Then some locline. 

 

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So as you can see a lot of work has gone into this setup and it'd be a shame to give up and just use the biocube. Plus then no refugium. So I must figure out this dang bulkhead! 

 

-CBO

 

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crashburnoveride

Filled everything up. Ran it. Thought I was leak free and good to go. After a while water appeared on the bulkhead threads. Still leaking. So I am very frustrated. The only way I can silicone around that bottom bulkhead is if I remove all the pipes. Then I would be forced to go back to the bottom BH being the emergency pipe and the durso out the back because with the BH siliconed in I'd have to thread in the pipe from the top to install it, and the durso won't spin in there. So that means redoing the plumbing design AGAIN. So I guess I'll give that a try and see what happens. 

 

The biocube is lookin reaaal nice right now. 🤦‍♂️

 

-CBO

 

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Firefish15

Cripes man, that’s tough. I don’t think anyone would blame you for taking the bio cube. 
If you want to stiffen your resolve though, you could burn the ships and sell the bio cube. 
Up to you! 🤷🏻‍♂️

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crashburnoveride

I believe I found the problem with the seal. The hole was drilled too close to the side and the plastic underneath was not letting the nut sit flush on the glass. This picture shows what I mean and what I'm considering as a fix. 

 

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I flipped the bulkhead upside down and trimmed a small section off for clearance. Other than trimmimg the tank plastic this is the only option I can see. The gasket is still on the wet side. Should I add another gasket on the bottom as well? Or just silicone it on the the wet side for extra sealing. 🤔 

 

Plumbing round 3. I was able to reuse the grey union I got from brs thankfully.

 

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Tanks still alive. 

 

-CBO

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