30 Gallon Stocking

[jt8791]

slowly setting up my 30 gallon tank. Running it with live sand at the moment. Will have it connected to a 20 high refugium before cycling is over, probably before I get live rock. Went a bit heavy on the sand, 60lbs of fiji pink, debating if I should try to take off 1/2-3/4" and move that over to the fuge or just leave it and stock a bit lighter with more sand sifters. Aiming for lots of copepods in the fuge, with chaeto and live sand and at least a few small rocks, not sure how much sand I want to do yet. Planned on sticking to 1.5 lbs per gallon of sand but ended up buying 3 bags and put them all in. Basic pvc pipe bridge to connect them and debating on live rock rubble piles below the pipe opening. 

 

150w Aqueon pro heater at 78F

2 Koralia Nano 425

36x12x16

 

with Green star polyps as far as tank space goes in the 30 alone, how does this stocking sound? Plan to let it spread over all the rocks, debated on xenia on the back glass but not sure if it would work well with a stand 30 gallon, 12" deep tank.

 

2 Ocellaris clownfish

Bicolor Blenny

Yellow watchman goby with pistol shrimp

tuxedo urchin

lots of snails, no turbos

 

Just shy of 25 gallons water volume at the moment not including rock so that extra sand may limit me stocking wise depending on how much water the rocks displace, no big deal if I need to move some to the 20, less sand to buy. 

 

Got it posted over on reef2reef as well, figured it can't hurt to try a few forums and see what else I can learn. 

 

Any other suggestions would be appreciated, only thing set in stone is the clownfish, kids are determined to get a pair in this tank. Guess the good question is what is the best tank mates to balance out the tank, the whole tank just for 2 clownfish sounds a tad dull but want to keep it relatively simple to maintain

 

[Clown79]

How are you cycling without liverock or dry rock?

 

Without anything in the tank there is no surface for bacteria to build.

 

Sand doesn't do much and neither does water for cycling.

 

Sand depth is personal choice but as you get deeper, there are more issues or restrictions. 

 

The fish choices are fine but snails, you should only house what you need otherwise they starve and die.

[jt8791]

although I would like an experienced reefers opinion about gsp on the rocks and xenia on the back glass. Think it will really come down to how I do the aquascaping if it will work but I leaning toward just one or the other being the simple route. I may use the same live rocks as last time for this build, although not as heavily as I did in my first tank. Ended up with a wall or mountain, whichever you want to call it. Gonna take a long time before finally decide on a final aquascape so just gsp may be my simple bet. Seen a few GSP with it spread all over and it looked really nice, I don't have the budget for more than 2 corals anyways. 

[jt8791]

Oh I didn't think of that, I'm in no rush to put livestock in but I'll go to Petco friday with a bucket of saltwater and see what I can get for live rock for now. Would that be fully stocked? 

[jt8791]

Probably won't consider it technically starting to cycle until I setup the fuge and all the live rock is in its final position, seems like the safer bet.

 

Actually I'm just gonna assume that's fully stocked for now, not sure I need to push a 5th fish or if there is even one that would work for the space and tank mates. 

 

Haven't decided what snails but it will be slow and small numbers. Although with all that sand I'll want plenty of nassarius, but think I may move some over to the fuge so it's closer to 2" after I get all the live rocks in. 

[jt8791]

On live rock, how does caribsea life rock stack against competitors quality wise or functionality or filtration wise? Suppose there are many ways to compare them, not concerned with how it looks, figure corals will cover it anyways.

 

40# for under $200 sounds pretty good but curious to hear if it would be worth it to spring for something higher quality. Thinking that should be enough for the 30 and later put 20# in the fuge

 

[Nano_Addict]

Looks like you're off to a good start!  Couple of questions...what do you mean by considering the tank "fully stocked"?  You're talking about in the future once you've added the livestock listed in the original post?  If you're planning to keep corals, you will also need some sort of aquarium light that provides enough PAR to support them.  GSP is a very neat coral, but it can absolutely take over a tank, same with xenia, in the end it's personal preference.

 

I agree with others that you may have a bit much sand in the display.  Over time if you're not meticulous about constantly cleaning/vacuuming the sand it can turn into a fish poop trap that is a ticking time bomb of nutrients in the tank. You might consider cutting the amount of sand in half so it's easier stirred and cleaned.

 

I don't have a lot of experience with live rock outside of what I've picked up at my local fish store, but I've seen plenty of people who seem to have had good experiences with https://www.kpaquatics.com/product-category/aquacultured-live-rock/

 

However, if you get this rock you're likely to get a heavy cycle due to the die off from transport.  You can also end up with some cool hitchhikers like sponges or some bad ones like gorilla crabs.

 

Good luck!

[Clown79]

4 hours ago, jt8791 said:

On live rock, how does caribsea life rock stack against competitors quality wise or functionality or filtration wise? Suppose there are many ways to compare them, not concerned with how it looks, figure corals will cover it anyways.

 

40# for under $200 sounds pretty good but curious to hear if it would be worth it to spring for something higher quality. Thinking that should be enough for the 30 and later put 20# in the fuge

 

I love caribsea liferock. You don't need 40lbs of it for a 30g. 

As its dry rock, you will need to decide on an ammonia source to add to start the cycle.

 

Am i reading correctly, you will be adding a 20g refugium? Do you plan on a lot of macro in the refugium?

 

I ask because you will need to consider maintaining a good amount of nitrate and phos to not only support the macro but the corals as well.

 

0 nutrients isn't beneficial and leads to nuisance algae with the worst and most likely negative effect is loss of corals and lots of dino. 

 

Gsp is beautiful and so is xenia. Both grow on the back wall easily.

 

Even on separate, isolated rocks it spreads and can quickly but easily pruned. 

 

You will need appropriate lighting even for these corals. Xenia doesn't like low light. 

 

What have you planned for filtration and water movement?

 

 

 

[jt8791]

Yes I’m gonna use about half that sand in the 20, I should have called it good at 40#. Only planning on chaeto so far in there and could stick to one coral if it makes things simpler, corals are new to me anyways.

 

the 30 has 2 koralia nano 425 wave pumps and planned on 2 240 for the 20. Planned on fluval marine 3.0 for the display and plant 3.0 for the 20, may settle for the planted plus depending on budget. Not sure if the fluval is better but figure it would look a bit cleaner being same brand, have yet to own either fluval light.

 

yes you are right, by if it was fully stocked would it keep nutrients high enough to sustain  corals and macro in the 20. That’s what I’ve been trying to figure out on the stocking but I may just have to test as I go before crowding the display.

 

Almost wonder if I may end up having to put a small fish in the 20 to help the bioload without crowding the display. But seems counterproductive if I want copepods in there. 

 

I’ll have to start doing research on an ammonia source. Went with live rocks out of petcos tanks last time but I don’t want to spend $400-600 on rocks for two tanks.

 

[jt8791]

Will order the 40# box and probably put 10# of it the fuge along with a good chunk of the sand. with saving money on live rock that will be my project next month instead of the month after.

 

what do you guys recommend for an ammonia source? Think I always used fish food before but there are so many different bottled bacteria and additives for saltwater.

 

While I’m saving money on rocks I might as start it off right, granted I want to take my time with cycling and stocking.

 

trying to shop smart this time and save money where I can to have for extra equipment. I am debating on a protein skimmer in the 20 and a uv sterilizer.

 

Wasn’t sure if I wanted to hang any filters on the back, but a surface skimmer would be handy and a place for filtration media so I may end up having to look into another solution or an  aqua clear filter

 

[Clown79]

Uv sterilizer shouldn't be used regularly.

 

Skimmer is debatable. Many don't use them. Usually on larger systems.

 

The most commonly used media is filter floss and carbon. All else is as needed 

[jt8791]

Oh, one other question I keep forgetting to ask and can’t seem to find much information on, wave controllers.

 

with soft corals should I consider getting a wave controller? If so, since the pumps run intermittent, should I buy more powerful wave pumps?

[jt8791]

Debating on upping the light budget and going for AI Prime 16hd, would I need one for the display, two or go to the 32hd? Might even spring for the fuge light too just have it all matching.

 

not finding much information on wave controllers other than them being tough on ac wave pumps, no ramp up. Have seen dc adjustable wave pumps, but is it the same controller for either type of wave pump?

 

did find a hydro wave controller for sale on r2r though, locally too at that. So not a complete loss

[jt8791]

Never mind on the controllers. I found the dc wave pump controllers. Way too pricey, I’ll pickup the ac controller and upgrade the wave pumps. Thinking get into the evolution series, thinking probably the 750-850gph. That’s assuming you only count one since they run intermittently, correct me if I’m wrong.

 

debating if ai prime 16hd lights are worth the money on a 12” deep tanks with a 2’x2’ light spread, especially since the tank is 3’ wide.

[Clown79]

1 minute ago, jt8791 said:

Never mind on the controllers. I found the dc wave pump controllers. Way too pricey, I’ll pickup the ac controller and upgrade the wave pumps. Thinking get into the evolution series, thinking probably the 750-850gph. That’s assuming you only count one since they run intermittently, correct me if I’m wrong.

 

debating if ai prime 16hd lights are worth the money on a 12” deep tanks with a 2’x2’ light spread, especially since the tank is 3’ wide.

 

Are we talking wave maker/powerhead or a return pump.

 

Return pumps aren't used intermittently but wavemakers in the tank can be set up that way. 

[jt8791]

The hydor wave pump controller for the ac hydor wave pumps. Haven’t found a ton of information on them yet but would assume since it runs them intermittently I should base the flow off one pump. Thinking of ordering 2  koralia evolution 750-850gph, think the two 425s would be useless on a wave controller in that tank, maybe for the 20. Correct me if I’m wrong.

 

also if I put all the live rock in the middle 24” would one ai prime 16hd do the job? Would rather spend the extra on the fuge model than 2 in a 3’ DT. Would make caves and openings throughout out but leave outside 6” on each side bare sand to save on lighting.

Edited December 10, 2020 by jt8791
Typo, made more sense if I fixed it

[jt8791]

 

2 koralia evolution 750-850 gph, run one at time, would that be too much for gsp or Xenia? If so I could drop down to the 550-600 model. I’ve heard anywhere from 20x-30x turnover rate

[jt8791]

almost wonder if I should treat it more like a macro tank and stock both lightly but imagine it would be challenging to sustain copepods if I went this route.

 

30
2 ocellaris 
Bicolor blenny 
Ywg With tiger pistol shrimp 

20
Wheelers or Randall’s shrimp goby 
With candy cane pistol shrimp
Tail spot

 

Back to original gsp on rocks, red Xenia on back glass and chaeto floating with red graciliara on the rocks. 

 

Debating on leaving that 60lbs of sand where it is, drop 40lbs oolite in the 20. 40# life rock, 30 in the 30 and 10 in the 20. Assume I would need more nassarius snails for each tank

 

ai prime 16hd reef with all rocks and corals in the middle 2’, I’ll try for a few caves, but leave the outside 6” sand clear. Then ai prime fuge

 

will be getting 2 wave timers and upgrade the wave pumps in the 30, those will go to the 20, running one at a time. 

 

Let me me know how good or bad this sounds, imagine I could add phytoplankton and copepods right into the chaeto but still see maintaining them challenging. Live rock rubble piles maybe in the tank corners.

[jt8791]

Holding off on wave maker upgrades and wave controller, Looking into tunze wave makers and battery backup, at least on one per tank. 

 

Probably look into a few other products from them. The rock coral rack looks sharp compared to plastic. Debating on picking up the controller and hooking it into the computer at some point, as long as the computer doesn’t have to be on. The magnetic holders for 1” pipe could work for the pvc water bridge.

 

Will see what kind of pieces I get in the 40lb box of life rock. Think they will be too big for the 20 at 5-9” so I’ll see what I can make out of the box within that 2’ space. If I’m putting fish in the 20 would just assume get the 20lb box of medium sized rocks, even if I don’t use them all in that tank.

 

other than nassarius what would my options be for cuc to maintain the sand beds? Sure the pistols and gobies will stir some up but not really cuc

 

[Tamberav]

You do your own maintenance  in the sand bed. Ceriths and conches can clean it some but it will always get filthy unless you maintain it.

 

I am not sure what you are asking about with copepods? If you want more copepods then feed them. Photo or even pellets and let the glass get dirty. Their numbers will depends on food available and how many predators are eating them.
 

Putting fish in the fuge part will be a hinderance if your goal is copepods.

 

I have some Jebao wave makers going strong after two+ years but you really can’t go wrong with Tunze in terms of warranty and longevity.

 

 

[jt8791]

40# Caribsea life rock is ordered. Tank is moved over to the corner, got 6" from the wall. Yeah just doing the 30 now, will pickup a cpr aquafuge2 large on the back right side, will use some sand from the tank and make rubble out of the extra life rock. Will probably build some type of support under it, not sure that weight is good for the tank. Will also put an ac70 next to the fuge for filter media, eventually getting the ultimate filtration kit from oceanbox/intank with the ato. Will leave left side of tank open for a hob protein skimmer later on.

 

Anyone here have feedback on this updated stocking I am considering?

2 ocellaris clownfish

2 yellow watchman gobies-will be first 2 fish and I'll wait until I find a pair matched up in the store, could take a while to find.

with 2 candy cane pistol shrimp, 2 peppermint and 1 scarlet skunk cleaner

rest of cuc will be heavy on snails, maybe a tuxedo urchin. Thinking I will avoid crabs this time

 

 

Not sure if I want to push a 5th fish, but let me know you if think that tank size will work for a goby pair. Would make use of this sand and it's not deep enough for a jawfish, maybe a someday 55 downstairs with dsb. Planned to run it through the winter before livestock building up the biofilm, ghost feeding I think the word is, could spend that time building up copepods, does sound more useful.

[jt8791]

Aquascape is finished, might be a bit overkill on the life rock. No idea what to stock in it, got a few ideas but hard to say what the best livestock would be for this layout. No idea what I was going for, but suppose it's better than the wall I made last time and at least I glued it this time around.

Think I will pass on ywg and pistol shrimp this time

 

So far considering

Pair of ocellaris clownfish

bicolor blenny

court jester goby

royal gramma basslet

orchid dottyback - slight maybe

 

Trochus 5-10

Cerith 5-10

Nassarius 10-20

scarlet skunk cleaner shrimp

peppermint shrimp maybe 2

tuxedo urchin maybe someday

yellow tip hermit crab 5-10

zebra/orange&black hermit crab 5-10

emerald crab maybe 1-2

 

Black Bar Chromis? was thinking maybe 6-7 of them but R2R says 55g for them so maybe not. No idea when I would find these anyways.

 

 Nothing is really set in stone fish wise, I'm up for suggestions too. I'm more worried about having the bioload to grow macro than what fish are in it. Not sure if I will go for a variety or just go simple with red and green ogo and some chaeto. Lighting will be Fluval Plant 3.0

 

Seems much easier to care for one group of the same fish rather than many different fish with different dietary needs but may not be possible in a tank this size.

[Nano_Addict]

One thing that seems to be missing is a source of filtration other than the sand and the rock.  Did I miss it in the thread? Are you planning to add a hang on filter or some other sort of filtration?

 

Stocking list looks pretty decent on first glance, but I would doublecheck on the compatibility of each fish with one another.  Remember to go slow when adding fish!  A good rule is not to more than double the bioload of the tank at any one time (i.e. if you have one fish, add no more than one additional.  If you have two fish, add no more than two additional fish) then give the tank time to stabilize (a month or two probably).

 

I Like the live rock and aquascape.  They way you have it set up the tank would even work as a peninsula if you had a place for that!  

 

I would definitely cut way back on the number of snails and hermits.  I would say you don't need more than 1-2 of each type especially in a new tank where there isn't a ton for them to eat.  Think of it this way, the snail eats the algae converting it to energy and body mass.  If the algae runs out and the snail dies all of that previously consumed food will be released back into the tank during the decay process like a little nutrient bomb.  So, just as with the fish, go slow and add only what is absolutely necessary at the time.  Start with 2-3 total snails and see how that goes.  If they're not keeping up with your tank's algae production add 1-2 more (currently I have two snails and one hermit in my 20 gallon)  Hermit crabs are a mixed bag, some people love them because they give you something to look at, others hate them because they will climb all over and steal food from the coral.  Personally, I try to stick with scarlet hermit crabs, they're much more expensive, but they also seem to be the most peaceful plus their bright red color is awesome.

 

Good luck and keep up the updates!

[jt8791]

Filtration is still up in the air, was thinking an ac70 next to the large aquafuge2. Probably the most reasonable route, on the left backside with the intank basket and surface skimmer and ato. The fuge might be a bit overkill but worth it for the extra water volume. No corals planned so I'm not too worried there. Was going to but decided macros were my simple bet.

[Nano_Addict]

Macro tanks are very cool and you can definitely get away with minimal filtration if you keep the bioload light.  Have you seen this thread?