New Reef, Need Equipment Suggestions

[Father sergius]

I am setting up a 40 gallon breeder as a reef and would like to take advantage of the sales to buy some equipment. However, it's all a bit overwhelming. I am also setting up a 20 or 29 gallon Aqueon as a quarantine tank (I'm sure at some point it will become its own tank). I already have the tanks and a BRS RODI unit.

 

1. I'm thinking I will get a Seachem Tidal 110 filter for the 40 and a Tidal 55 for the 20 gallon.  

 

2. I would like to buy some of the expensive items during the sales, like lights. I was thinking of the Current USA IC Pro for the quarantine. Suggestions for the 40 gallon? 

 

3. Another expensive item seems to be wavemakers/powerheads. Suggestions for those? 

 

4. Any other great deals or expensive items I should this season?

 

 

Thank you.

[I'm Batman]

I’m not a biologist but here’s my 2¢

 

1) Seachem Tidal is $84 at marine depot right now.. why not just go with an AC70, fork out the 50 bucks for a media basket, run an HOB skimmer and call it a day... maybe a fuge?

 

2) Get a Hydra 32 for the breeder. May need even more... don’t waste your money on cheap unless you’re going hardware store 24” and running t5’s. 
 

3) Run a gyre. Good sales on those right now too. 

 

4) yeah get your lights and HOB filters on sale!!! Don’t forget auto tip off!!! Duetting XP is $100!!! 

 

 

[mcarroll]

I just answered another thread very similar to this one:

2 minutes ago, mcarroll said:

Once you're up into the 20+ gallon range you can start considering a more standard reef build for "filtration".....which is to say liverock and a protein skimmer.  Skip most everything else filter-wise.  

 

I'd recommend a pair of Tunze 6045's for flow.  

 

Lighting depends on a more specific tank choice.  Take a look at the kits Current USA have for starters.

 

7 hours ago, Father sergius said:

1. I'm thinking I will get a Seachem Tidal 110 filter for the 40 and a Tidal 55 for the 20 gallon.

I'd condsider live rock and a protein skimmer for each tank instead.

 

7 hours ago, Father sergius said:

I was thinking of the Current USA IC Pro for the quarantine. Suggestions for the 40 gallon?

Those lights would be good candidates for both tanks.  Having he same lights on each tank will minimize light stress if/when you transfer corals between the tanks.  Lots of other great options too tho....from DIY, to AI, Kessil, etc.

 

7 hours ago, Father sergius said:

3. Another expensive item seems to be wavemakers/powerheads. Suggestions for those? 

Lots of great flow options these days too, but I'm still partial to the classic Tunze nanostreams.  A pair of Tunze 6045's would rock either tank and they go for about $80/each – these are workhorses and probably my favorite reef pump of all time.  Use them with a pair of regular appliance timers or a controller to simulate the reversing flows of the tides.  (4-6 hours in one direction, then 4-6 in the other, etc)  There are smaller pump models you could select for the 20 gallon....eg the 6015, 6025 and 6020....all about half the cost.

 

7 hours ago, Father sergius said:

4. Any other great deals or expensive items I should this season?

Check out a Tunze Osmolator nano or an Aquahub kit as options for your ATO.

[jefferythewind]

i'm a beginner and i've got a 29 gallon with a Seachem Tidal 75. Im interested in the comments above about having just live rock and a protein skimmer instead of a filter like the tidal. I assume this means you need a sump system to house the live rock, but Im not sure what the protein skimmer actually helps with. Overall why is the sump and skimmer system better then a Tidal filter?

[Clown79]

11 hours ago, I'm Batman said:

I’m not a biologist but here’s my 2¢

 

1) Seachem Tidal is $84 at marine depot right now.. why not just go with an AC70, fork out the 50 bucks for a media basket, run an HOB skimmer and call it a day... maybe a fuge?

 

2) Get a Hydra 32 for the breeder. May need even more... don’t waste your money on cheap unless you’re going hardware store 24” and running t5’s. 
 

3) Run a gyre. Good sales on those right now too. 

 

4) yeah get your lights and HOB filters on sale!!! Don’t forget auto tip off!!! Duetting XP is $100!!! 

 

 

The seachem tidal is worth every penny. 10 times better than any AC.

 

Better pump, full flow control, huge basket, surface skimmer which is pretty important with hob's, silent.

[Clown79]

3 hours ago, jefferythewind said:

i'm a beginner and i've got a 29 gallon with a Seachem Tidal 75. Im interested in the comments above about having just live rock and a protein skimmer instead of a filter like the tidal. I assume this means you need a sump system to house the live rock, but Im not sure what the protein skimmer actually helps with. Overall why is the sump and skimmer system better then a Tidal filter?

Its personal opinion.

 

I've run an aio(which is a sump), i've run with a skimmer, i've run hob's.

 

I can't truly say that one ran better than the other. 

 

I actually had less issues on my 15g with an hob than my aio's, thats the honest truth.

 

Every reef has its issues.

 

There are many ways to have a reef, theres not just 1 way

[jefferythewind]

Yeah I was just kinda wondering in general why we need a protein skimmer at all? I understand that the sump system is just kinda like a filter, creates flow and a place to hold media. But when I look on wikipedia under Protein Skimmer: "A protein skimmer or foam fractionator is a device used to remove organic compounds such as food and waste particles from water". This is what I have heard. Now like with my tank I don't have any issues with high Nitrate/Phosphates, which is what I would associate with "organic waste". However I seem to have noticed that things seem to deteriorate if I don't do any water changes, so I'm wondering if the skimmer will still be beneficial even if you don't have a high nitrate/phosphate problem. 

[MrP]

16 hours ago, Father sergius said:

I am setting up a 40 gallon breeder as a reef and would like to take advantage of the sales to buy some equipment. However, it's all a bit overwhelming. I am also setting up a 20 or 29 gallon Aqueon as a quarantine tank (I'm sure at some point it will become its own tank). I already have the tanks and a BRS RODI unit.

 

1. I'm thinking I will get a Seachem Tidal 110 filter for the 40 and a Tidal 55 for the 20 gallon.  

 

2. I would like to buy some of the expensive items during the sales, like lights. I was thinking of the Current USA IC Pro for the quarantine. Suggestions for the 40 gallon? 

 

3. Another expensive item seems to be wavemakers/powerheads. Suggestions for those? 

 

4. Any other great deals or expensive items I should this season?

 

 

Thank you.

The Tidal is a great filter and are on sale at Saltwateraquarium.com 

 

I have a lightly used Current USA pair of lights with the bluetooth controller I will sell for a great price! I also have a few like new wavemakers. These would be great for a quarantine tank. Let me know if you're interested.

 

As for your display, the AI Nero pumps are great pumps and not overly expensive. If you want something less expensive, Jebao are decent for the money.

[Clown79]

2 hours ago, jefferythewind said:

Yeah I was just kinda wondering in general why we need a protein skimmer at all? I understand that the sump system is just kinda like a filter, creates flow and a place to hold media. But when I look on wikipedia under Protein Skimmer: "A protein skimmer or foam fractionator is a device used to remove organic compounds such as food and waste particles from water". This is what I have heard. Now like with my tank I don't have any issues with high Nitrate/Phosphates, which is what I would associate with "organic waste". However I seem to have noticed that things seem to deteriorate if I don't do any water changes, so I'm wondering if the skimmer will still be beneficial even if you don't have a high nitrate/phosphate problem. 

You don't need a skimmer, especially on a nano.

 

Many of us have no skimmers. There are hobbyists with no filter or sumps either.

[jefferythewind]

This looks pretty cool. I am starting to look around at sumps. I see it is a much "cooler" option than the hang-on filter. Also I think in the long run you'd be happy you bought this over the Tidal. Like in my case I wish I had bought something like this one originally.

 

http://www.eshopps.com/filters/reefsumps/rs-75

 

I think it would just fit in my cabinet.

 

Although I would add that I am pretty impressed with the Tidal 75. For a hang on filter it is pretty nice, little bit noisy but the features are great, big basket.

 

P.S. sumps seem to get expensive especially with all the pieces that you have to buy to install them correctly. The more I look the more the red sea reefer aquariums seem like a great deal. You get that amazing glass with an integrate sump. 

[Father sergius]

Which brands do you recommend for test kits?

 

Also, is there a Kessil light that would cover 30" in a quarantine tank?

[mcarroll]

On 11/26/2020 at 6:55 AM, jefferythewind said:

i'm a beginner and i've got a 29 gallon with a Seachem Tidal 75. Im interested in the comments above about having just live rock and a protein skimmer instead of a filter like the tidal. I assume this means you need a sump system to house the live rock, but Im not sure what the protein skimmer actually helps with. Overall why is the sump and skimmer system better then a Tidal filter?

If you've already got a setup, and unless you're unhappy with part of it, then I'm not sure I'd necessarily drop it for what I'm talking about.  But on a new build live rock+protein skimmer is how I'd do it.

 

"Live rock+protein skimmer" just means that you don't need anything in the tank but live rock and a protein skimmer.....doesn't mean anything about sumps or anything else.  A sump (and anything else) is optional.

 

Just for reference:

My current 125 Gallon is just live rock and a protein skimmer (Tunze 9012).  There is a filter module where I can run media or a coarse filter pad, etc, but it runs empty 99% of the time.  (The filter, skimmer, and ATO came as part of the Tunze Reefpack 500 kit.) 

 

The former version of my system was two smaller tanks (still about 100 gallons) tied into one sump where the skimmer and ATO lived....for about ten years there was no filter module at all on that version of the system...just a protein skimmer.  (First skimmer was a classic Oceanic Plus Series, second was another classic AquaC EV90 and last was a modern classic, the Tunze 9410.)

 

You can get skimmers rated all the way down to 5 gallons (and probably less), such as Tunze's DOC Skimmer 9001.  

 

Up front skimmers tend to be a little pricey (eg. $117 for that 9001), but consider that there's nothing more to buy for the life of the unit.  In the long run they are a pretty cheap addition to your reef.  What you get is light filtration and excellent aeration.  

 

Cleaning and maintenance can be just about as aggressive or lax as you see fit.  For maximum results I've gone for long periods where I empty/clean the skimmer daily.  These days (where I have a lot more going on) I clean it when I feel like it....every few weeks on average.

 

As for the question about sumps, I'd say that on average I probably prefer to have one, but it's a weak preference....I like to do what's best for a given installation vs being dogmatic.  That's why I had a sump on the pervious setup and I enjoyed it a lot – in fact I think it was damn-near perfect. (Way better than commercial options.)   Even so, I switched to sump-less on my new setup – it just made sense for this one due to placement and other factors.

On 11/26/2020 at 12:12 PM, jefferythewind said:

wikipedia

If you see anything on Wikipedia concerning aquarium topics that sounds like it was written by a hobbyist, or cites hobby literature like forums or aquarium magazines, you have to be very circumspect about whatever it says.  Several articles there are composed almost entirely of forum rumors and innuendo...I think one of the algae articles was like that.  "Trust, but verify!"  LOL  (Indeed, students of any age aren't generally allowed to cite the W in writing...only to use it as a starting point for research.  Even W doesn't claim any authority in what is posted there...only that what is posted was previously published somewhere else "legitimately".)

 

On 11/26/2020 at 12:12 PM, jefferythewind said:

Protein Skimmer: "A protein skimmer or foam fractionator is a device used to remove organic compounds such as food and waste particles from water".

That's actually not a bad summary.  Bu for reference, compare with some of the articles here:

https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C47&q=foam+fractionation+seawater&btnG=

 

Lots of good reading there!!!

 

On 11/26/2020 at 12:12 PM, jefferythewind said:

However I seem to have noticed that things seem to deteriorate if I don't do any water changes, so I'm wondering if the skimmer will still be beneficial even if you don't have a high nitrate/phosphate problem.

My old setup (2 tanks+sump) was also fish-less, so by definition it was low nutrient (I pulled zero "low nutrient" gimmicks like using GFO...but actually NEVER tested phosphates or nitrates.  The skimmer was still excellent to have IMO.

 

On 11/26/2020 at 4:02 PM, jefferythewind said:

This looks pretty cool.

There is lots of room for personal preference and lots of room for trendiness (what is hip?♪).  Personally though I find standard sumps to be limiting to the point of irritation....over-designed in most cases.   I like starting with a standard glass tank (acrylic if you want) and adding what I need.  When all you're housing are the ATO, the return pump and the protein skimmer, you don't need a lot.  And at least IMO you need almost nothing that standard sumps come with.

 

On 11/26/2020 at 4:02 PM, jefferythewind said:

The more I look the more the red sea reefer aquariums seem like a great deal.

A quote comes to mind..."Comparison is the thief of all happiness".  

 

I think it was attributed to T. Roosevelt.  A derivation of that was (is?) my sig file on my Reef2Reef account.  😉

 

If there's nothing truly wrong, try to enjoy what you have while you have it.  It will be legitimately outgrown soon enough anyway as long as you get good at growing corals in it.  

 

👍 🤞

 

 

[Father sergius]

Change in plans.... I picked up a 25.3 gallon SR Aquaristick today for $35. That will be the quarantine tank and then definitely become its own reef. Its dimensions are 25"x15"x15", so reef light's coverage are more in-tune with its dimensions. I'm thinking to get a Kessil AP700 for the 40 gallon breeder. I'm considering a Kessil A360X for the 25 since it is a nice tank and should become a good reef. Thoughts?

[mcarroll]

On 11/28/2020 at 4:19 PM, Father sergius said:

I'm thinking to get a Kessil AP700 for the 40 gallon breeder. I'm considering a Kessil A360X for the 25 since it is a nice tank and should become a good reef. Thoughts?

Excellent lights, but overkill.  

 

A 40 Breeder is a pretty shallow tank...a pair of A160's will be plenty.  

 

The 15" high tank isn't significantly taller, so I'd probably go with the same – another pair of A160's.

 

(Abut $860 total.)

 

Assuming you have a light meter to help you gauge your settings, going bigger won't hurt anything since you can obviously control intensity.  

 

If budget isn't an issue, then maybe no big deal.   ($860 vs $1100 I think?  For the difference you could order a 5th A160 and set up another tank.  😇)