Help! My parameters are extremely high

[Anzus]

I have a system of 120 lt in the main display and a 40 lt sump, i have a sock and a skimmer red devil nano, i also keep chaeto in a small refugium .

I started usign purified water, here in Mexico is really common since you cant drink from the tap. Little I knew that it had 75 ppm of nitrates! The aquarium fought 6 months and for miraculous reasons I was able to keep it fine.. I got sick and I couldn't take care of it.. that's when the algae bloom happened..  for 3 months I've been using nopox and osmosis water, but I cant see a change

. My parameters are stuck in 

.25 ppm of phosphate 

75 ppm of nitrate 

I know this hobby is about patience but.. 3 months of not change at all?!  

I'm desperate.. I don't know what else to do I only have 3 fish: 2 clowns and a cardinal pajama.. I dont even feed them much . Please help me.

[Humblefish]

Can you get a RODI (to make your own water)? If your source water is reading 75 ppm nitrate, then I don't see how you'll ever get it down so long as you continue to use that water. I've had success using bio pellets + dosing vinegar, but it still took a few months and I was using 0 TDS RODI. 

[Clown79]

Reverse osmosis water isn't pure. It's the same thing as spring water.

 

You need distilled water or RODI which both are pure. 

 

Unfortunately as long as the water used has tds, nitrates, phosphate in it, it will be very hard to lower it in the display. Waterchanges won't help because nutrients is always being added.

[Anzus]

Im using water with no phospahtes or nitrates.. thats why i ask for help. I used very high nutrient water before, but not now 

[DISQUALIFIED-QQ]

What's living in your tank?

[Clown79]

38 minutes ago, Anzus said:

Im using water with no phospahtes or nitrates.. thats why i ask for help. I used very high nutrient water before, but not now 

It will take 1 very large waterchange with 0 tds water to drop down the nutrients. 50% should reduce the nutrients by 50%.

[mcarroll]

13 hours ago, Anzus said:

I got sick and I couldn't take care of it

Sorry to hear about that – but life does happen!  

 

I basically had my reef on the back burner for around 5 years and it ended in more or less the same shape as yours.  Much better now though!

 

Let's get your tank back in shape!  I think you'll be surprised how easy it is.

 

13 hours ago, Anzus said:

that's when the algae bloom happened..  for 3 months I've been using nopox and osmosis water, but I cant see a change

13 hours ago, Anzus said:

. My parameters are stuck in 

.25 ppm of phosphate 

75 ppm of nitrate 

 

Unfortunately the old "starve it out" approach was largely incorrect.  Your nutrient levels are fine, as surprising as that may sound.  

 

Do integrate an RODI filter, but stop trying to tweak nutrient levels directly.

 

Stop with the organic carbon dosing or any other extra filtration you have going on.

 

13 hours ago, Anzus said:

know this hobby is about patience but.. 3 months of not change at all?!  

I'm desperate.. I don't know what else to do I only have 3 fish: 2 clowns and a cardinal pajama.. I dont even feed them much . Please help me.

Don't feel desperate!  

 

You will see that your "lack of success" is actually going to be a victory in short-order.

 

My first question is what is the problem in the tank? 

 

For example:

Are your fish having problems?

 

Are your corals dying?

 

Is your cheato dying off?

 

Unless you answered yes to those, there might not even be a problem.

 

Congratulations on your victory!   Don't fight the current conditions of the tank in any way.

 

Once you start using RODI water, things will change on their own to the full extent that it should change.  I wouldn't expect any bad side-effects since you're still going to be feeding your fish – that means lots of good nutrients still going into the tank.  (Just no more excess nitrate.)

 

For what it's worth, my system has levels even higher than yours....don't sweat it!

 

Of course, if your corals are dying, fish suffering and chaeto dying off, I hope you'd have already mentioned it.  😉

 

FYI, in the long run, you may not be able to keep the chaeto alive without dosing liquid nutrients.  IMO, remember that it's a fish and coral tank...the chaeto isn't a necessary part of the system and let it go when that time comes.

 

Algae

Can you post a picture of the tank that shows the algae growth?  How many herbivores are in your cleanup crew right now, and what kinds?

 

More than likely your algae is too long for your cleanup crew.  Hand pull algae "from the roots"...work carefully, pinch by pinch.

 

It's also likely that you don't have enough cleanup crew.  You may have to add 5-6 more big snails after you clean the big algae for them...like Astrea, Trochus or Turbo.

 

If you hand pull the algae from an area and the snails still don't keep it clean, repeat those two steps....hand pull again, add a few more snails.  Not too many at once since you don't want to over shoot.

[mcarroll]

P.S.  Any chance your nitrate test kit is malfunctioning or maybe expired?  Do you get different test results if you test some different sources, like RO water, bottled water, tank water, tap water, etc?  An expired test kit might give you 50 ppm no matter what sample you test.

[Humblefish]

17 hours ago, Anzus said:

I started usign purified water, here in Mexico is really common since you cant drink from the tap. Little I knew that it had 75 ppm of nitrates!

Have you ran a NO3 test of just the purified water?

[Anzus]

10 hours ago, Diamonds x Pearls said:

What's living in your tank?

Just 2 starfish, 1 paly frag and 3 fish, two clowns and a pajama cardinal

[Anzus]

6 hours ago, mcarroll said:

P.S.  Any chance your nitrate test kit is malfunctioning or maybe expired?  Do you get different test results if you test some different sources, like RO water, bottled water, tank water, tap water, etc?  An expired test kit might give you 50 ppm no matter what sample you test.

No my tests are fine, i tested the destilated water and it has 0 nutrients, i tasted tap water and is consistent with the quality water here. So no , my tests are fine

[Anzus]

5 hours ago, Humblefish said:

Have you ran a NO3 test of just the purified water?

Yes.. I have salifert NO3 test.. I did the test to my aquarium and to the water I'm currently using.

[Anzus]

7 hours ago, mcarroll said:

Sorry to hear about that – but life does happen!  

 

I basically had my reef on the back burner for around 5 years and it ended in more or less the same shape as yours.  Much better now though!

 

Let's get your tank back in shape!  I think you'll be surprised how easy it is.

 

 

Unfortunately the old "starve it out" approach was largely incorrect.  Your nutrient levels are fine, as surprising as that may sound.  

 

Do integrate an RODI filter, but stop trying to tweak nutrient levels directly.

 

Stop with the organic carbon dosing or any other extra filtration you have going on.

 

Don't feel desperate!  

 

You will see that your "lack of success" is actually going to be a victory in short-order.

 

My first question is what is the problem in the tank? 

 

For example:

Are your fish having problems?

 

Are your corals dying?

 

Is your cheato dying off?

 

Unless you answered yes to those, there might not even be a problem.

 

Congratulations on your victory!   Don't fight the current conditions of the tank in any way.

 

Once you start using RODI water, things will change on their own to the full extent that it should change.  I wouldn't expect any bad side-effects since you're still going to be feeding your fish – that means lots of good nutrients still going into the tank.  (Just no more excess nitrate.)

 

For what it's worth, my system has levels even higher than yours....don't sweat it!

 

Of course, if your corals are dying, fish suffering and chaeto dying off, I hope you'd have already mentioned it.  😉

 

FYI, in the long run, you may not be able to keep the chaeto alive without dosing liquid nutrients.  IMO, remember that it's a fish and coral tank...the chaeto isn't a necessary part of the system and let it go when that time comes.

 

Algae

Can you post a picture of the tank that shows the algae growth?  How many herbivores are in your cleanup crew right now, and what kinds?

 

More than likely your algae is too long for your cleanup crew.  Hand pull algae "from the roots"...work carefully, pinch by pinch.

 

It's also likely that you don't have enough cleanup crew.  You may have to add 5-6 more big snails after you clean the big algae for them...like Astrea, Trochus or Turbo.

 

If you hand pull the algae from an area and the snails still don't keep it clean, repeat those two steps....hand pull again, add a few more snails.  Not too many at once since you don't want to over shoot.

Ok my answer to the question is

 

Yes: my melanarus wrasse died a week ago along a turbo snail( I think bc it was flipped over)

 

Yes: all my corals died.. some were completely eaten by algae, others like pocilliopora just.. started to die slowly.

That's why I'm worried about the nutrients.. my corals weren't happy.. they died.

 

And.. no but I dont see it getting bigger (chaeto) 

 

 My cleanup crew is just 4 turbo snails, but 1 died so now there is just 3 of them I also have a peppermint shrimp but he only eat aiptasias ... now I think about it is a very small cleanup crew..  but I dont want my turbo to starve so I bought just a few.

 

I have brittle stars.. hidden, they were already with the rock but that's basically all. 

I'm somewhat embarrassed about the pic of how it got but you must understand I spent a month in bed.

 

[Anzus]

Just now, Anzus said:

Ok my answer to the question is

 

Yes: my melanarus wrasse died a week ago along a turbo snail( I think bc it was flipped over)

 

Yes: all my corals died.. some were completely eaten by algae, others like pocilliopora just.. started to die slowly.

That's why I'm worried about the nutrients.. my corals weren't happy.. they died.

 

And.. no but I dont see it getting bigger (chaeto) 

 

 My cleanup crew is just 4 turbo snails, but 1 died so now there is just 3 of them I also have a peppermint shrimp but he only eat aiptasias ... now I think about it is a very small cleanup crew..  but I dont want my turbo to starve so I bought just a few.

 

I have brittle stars.. hidden, they were already with the rock but that's basically all. 

I'm somewhat embarrassed about the pic of how it got but you must understand I spent a month in bed.

 

After hours of cleaning looks like this  

 

[Tired]

Doesn't look bad. Not much color, but you don't have anything that would add color. 

[mcarroll]

On 4/14/2020 at 5:53 PM, mcarroll said:

Algae

Can you post a picture of the tank that shows the algae growth?  How many herbivores are in your cleanup crew right now, and what kinds?

 

More than likely your algae is too long for your cleanup crew.  Hand pull algae "from the roots"...work carefully, pinch by pinch.

 

It's also likely that you don't have enough cleanup crew.  You may have to add 5-6 more big snails after you clean the big algae for them...like Astrea, Trochus or Turbo.

 

If you hand pull the algae from an area and the snails still don't keep it clean, repeat those two steps....hand pull again, add a few more snails.  Not too many at once since you don't want to over shoot.

 

On 4/15/2020 at 2:00 AM, Anzus said:

This is a good example of how I was saying the algae can be too long for the snails to eat.  All they really have is a tongue, no real mouth or teeth.  Their tongue is very gnarly, but can't rip at algae like a Tang would, for example.

 

Snail tongue:

Closeup:

 

Your rock is REALLY bare after the cleanup...doesn't look like there's ever been coralline algae on any of the rocks or glass.

 

So don't be surprised if you have to add more cleanup crew now that the algae will actually be small enough for them to eat.  

 

Look out for any patches that get too large and deal with those by hand as soon as you notice them.  When you need to do a hand-pulling in the future, you should add 1-3 new herbivorous snails at the same time.  Sooner or later, they will handle all the algae and you shouldn't have to do hand pulling any more.  👍

[Anzus]

21 hours ago, mcarroll said:

 

This is a good example of how I was saying the algae can be too long for the snails to eat.  All they really have is a tongue, no real mouth or teeth.  Their tongue is very gnarly, but can't rip at algae like a Tang would, for example.

 

Snail tongue:

Closeup:

 

Your rock is REALLY bare after the cleanup...doesn't look like there's ever been coralline algae on any of the rocks or glass.

 

So don't be surprised if you have to add more cleanup crew now that the algae will actually be small enough for them to eat.  

 

Look out for any patches that get too large and deal with those by hand as soon as you notice them.  When you need to do a hand-pulling in the future, you should add 1-3 new herbivorous snails at the same time.  Sooner or later, they will handle all the algae and you shouldn't have to do hand pulling any more.  👍

 

21 hours ago, mcarroll said:

 

This is a good example of how I was saying the algae can be too long for the snails to eat.  All they really have is a tongue, no real mouth or teeth.  Their tongue is very gnarly, but can't rip at algae like a Tang would, for example.

 

Snail tongue:

Closeup:

 

Your rock is REALLY bare after the cleanup...doesn't look like there's ever been coralline algae on any of the rocks or glass.

 

So don't be surprised if you have to add more cleanup crew now that the algae will actually be small enough for them to eat.  

 

Look out for any patches that get too large and deal with those by hand as soon as you notice them.  When you need to do a hand-pulling in the future, you should add 1-3 new herbivorous snails at the same time.  Sooner or later, they will handle all the algae and you shouldn't have to do hand pulling any more.  👍

Thanks! Actually what you say is true! Snails like to eat were the algae is short, i will buy more snails, any suggestions of more members of the cleanup crew? I had an emerald crab once.. but he liked to eat corals 

[mcarroll]

Cerith, Nerite, Astrea, Trochus or Turbo....

 

[Tired]

Go look on ReefCleaners for advice and CUC.