All my corals dying

[darksun92]

Hi community! I've been struggling with some problems in my tank, but after 3 months I cannot find which is the problem, all my corals are getting worse everyday first of all this is my setup

 

Tank - 10g AIO 14X14X14

Lighting - Prime HD Since December with this schedule 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Skimmer - Bubble Magus qq1 Since 10 Days ago

Flow - 800L/H Return pump as flow, I have a Jebao sw4 but it's too much flow for a 10g

Filtration - Filter Floss with marine pure spheres in the overflow, added 1 week before the problem started, and before that I had 1 bag of clear fx during 3 months September 2019 to January 2020

and before that from July 2019 to September 2019 I used a Purigen bag with some Phosguard and Matrix carbon 

Fish - Clown Goby 

Corals - Various Zoanthids, Hammer, frogspawn, Goniopora, Birdnest and other SPS.

 

Well my tank Started in may 2019 "Cycled" with caribsea live sand, dry rock and a prodibio bacteria, that what in the aquarium told me that works 😪 after 15 days I added my first clowfish and everything was going good, I didn't know the proper way to cycle a tank and that I should check parameters even that were no algae issues or dead fish, then I bought my first test kit from red sea and started to check parameters and everything was good supposedly... but something that I notice was that my nitrates always was on 50ppm, that's the reason that I always tried to low using chemical filtration, Then I added my first coral in July the hammer that I have until now, then I continue adding corals, even the first week of January everything was good and used to look like this

 

 

The nitrates were on 20ppm and after that I removed the clear fx bag and added the marine pure spheres for "more filtration" and a person who sells corals In my city suggest me to remove the clear fx and the filter floss and add the spheres, after one week some corals began to lose colors, everything started to look skinny and stretched I was not too much worry about it I thought it was something temporary but after 2 weeks the hairy algae exploded and my some of my sps got totally bleached other lose a lot of color most of the zoas didn't open and lose a lot of color too and started to look like this 

 

 

Basically there's no more color in the corals all is a mess...

The first that I did is checking my parameters and the first I noticed was my Kh that was on 5! But then I checked my ph and it appears to be on 8.2 but I read that when the Kh is too low normally the ph gets low too, something was suspicious for me, the nitrates was on 50ppm again, So my first conclusion was the Kh but before buying something to dose I tried with and elos test of Kh and it was 7, so I don't know which was good and I checked with a salifert test and it gives 7 too, so in that moment I knew that my test kit was wrong, I started to do WC more frequently every 2 days until my kh was on 10 and that happened 2 weeks ago, then I added the skimmer that is getting just a bit of gunk but everything remains in the same condition, then I tested calcium and magnesium and everything was good 450 and 1320 respectively, I don't have nitrates and phosphate test yet due to the covid-19 and some money problems, I don't know what else can be doing this problem, I hope someone experienced can help me, the temperature is always between 77 in the night and 80 during day I live on the Caribbean, I feed my clown goby with frozen brine  shrimp and 5 months ago I used to feed the corals with reef roids and no algae issue, actually I'm not feeding cause of the algae.

[Tamberav]

Seems like everything was fine and then you decided to chase numbers and it went to poo? In reaction to everything dying you made more changes.

 

I would just pull the Marine pure and extra crap and go back to good old water changes and feeding.

 

Why would you need so much filtration for one clown goby?

 

You can get pest algae from phosphate or nitrate being too low.

 

There's no need for so many products in a 10g tank.

 

Make sure to calibrate your refractometer and double check your salinity.

 

 

[darksun92]

1 hour ago, Tamberav said:

Seems like everything was fine and then you decided to chase numbers and it went to poo? In reaction to everything dying you made more changes.

Nope, When the corals was in its worse moment I checked the Kh and it was at 7 I do my water changes more frequently to reach 10 (I was thinking that it was the problem) but it doesn’t change too much. 

 

1 hour ago, Tamberav said:

Why would you need so much filtration for one clown goby?

 

You can get pest algae from phosphate or nitrate being too low.

As I wrote my nitrate is always between 50ppm or more and even with too much chemical filtration I can’t low it, I based the filtration system in Cannedfish 10g and it worked for some time. 

 

1 hour ago, Tamberav said:

Make sure to calibrate your refractometer and double check your salinity.

I check it twice per day and is always 1025 

[mitten_reef]

4 hours ago, darksun92 said:

I based the filtration system in Cannedfish 10g and it worked for some time. 

I don't suppose you tried to copy his feeding regimen as well?  If so, that would be why you're having extra nutrient issue.  His feeding regimen is based on his tank, which is full of livestock.  Your tank is, for all intents and purposes, brand new with happy coral frags but had yet to see any growth spurt yet.  If feeding was the issue, then I would dial it back 25-30% (reduced quantity, frequency or both), to see where your nitrate end up.

 

how long between your dKh dropped to 5 and your frequent water change to raise it back to 10?  that also might cause alkalinity shock to some of the coral.

 

4 hours ago, darksun92 said:

As I wrote my nitrate is always between 50ppm or more and even with too much chemical filtration I can’t low it,

can't just rely on chemical filtration.  If it gets that high, you need to look to the root cause.  Do you need to feed less?  Do you need to do water change more often?  The simplest and most reliable way to remove excess nutrient is water change.  Yes there are many other methods, but when you don't know where things aren't right, a fresh batch of freshly mixed saltwater should help.  even with water change, there's still a caveat.  IF you're using red Sea Coral Pro regularly, keep some Red Sea Blue Bucket for emergency water change situation, because you don't want to introduce a large volume of fresh saltwater with high alk to your system - potentially creating alk spike/shock as I asked above.

   

[Tamberav]

6 hours ago, darksun92 said:

Nope, When the corals was in its worse moment I checked the Kh and it was at 7 I do my water changes more frequently to reach 10 (I was thinking that it was the problem) but it doesn’t change too much. 

 

As I wrote my nitrate is always between 50ppm or more and even with too much chemical filtration I can’t low it, I based the filtration system in Cannedfish 10g and it worked for some time. 

 

I check it twice per day and is always 1025 

You said you added marine pure or such a week before everything went bad.

 

If you did a 50 percent water change that would bring it to 25 nitrates. That's not even 5g of salt needed. 

 

If you always have 50 even after a water change then the test kit is bad or your water source is bad.

 

Copying another's tank rarely works....every tank seems to operate different. Likely due to the variety of microorganisms and bacteria in each tank. It is more about what makes your tank happy.

 

I would probably switch salts so you don't spike to 10 with water changes. Red sea blue bucket is nice.

 

[Clown79]

 the first thing I can think of is your nitrate test may be crap or the water you are using is introducing nutrients into the tank.

 

In a new tank that's small with only 1 tiny fish, too much chemical media will become a problem. Over filtering isn't the answer- it's just a quick way to possibly more problems.

 

Filter floss changed 2 times a week, isn't a problem. Small amounts of carbon change 2-3 weeks, isn't a problem.

 

When you start getting into nitrate/phos reducers- it can become a big problem. Imbalance in nutrients and stripping a tank leads to lack of coral growth, death, and possibly dino's.

 

Always research why 1 person does something, why a product is used. Understanding is the key.

 

Never blindly go into a method, don't rush decisions and changes.

 

The first question I would ask if I had been in the same situation- 

 

Why would someone recommend removing floss?

 

It catches particles to prevent detritus building up, breaking down, and creating nutrients. It's a common go to filter media that if used properly, really isn't a negative.

 

Your alk was fine at 7. Why change it to 10? Stability is the most important thing- not a number as long as its within range.

Natural sea water alk is 7.

 

If your nitrates are indeed 50, then you need to determine the problem, media won't fix it.

[darksun92]

3 hours ago, mitten_reef said:

8 hours ago, darksun92 said:

 

I don't suppose you tried to copy his feeding regimen as well?  If so, that would be why you're having extra nutrient issue.  His feeding regimen is based on his tank, which is full of livestock.  Your tank is, for all intents and purposes, brand new with happy coral frags but had yet to see any growth spurt yet.  If feeding was the issue, then I would dial it back 25-30% (reduced quantity, frequency or both), to see where your nitrate end up

Very good point, I tried to reduce the feed of my only fish but there’s no nitrate change. 

 

3 hours ago, mitten_reef said:

how long between your dKh dropped to 5 and your frequent water change to raise it back to 10?  that also might cause alkalinity shock to some of the coral.

It took one month to raise, but remember that it fact was from 7 to 10 because my first test was wrong. 
 

3 hours ago, mitten_reef said:

can't just rely on chemical filtration.  If it gets that high, you need to look to the root cause.  Do you need to feed less?  Do you need to do water change more often?  The simplest and most reliable way to remove excess nutrient is water change.  Yes there are many other methods, but when you don't know where things aren't right, a fresh batch of freshly mixed saltwater should help.  even with water change, there's still a caveat.  IF you're using red Sea Coral Pro regularly, keep some Red Sea Blue Bucket for emergency water change situation, because you don't want to introduce a large volume of fresh saltwater with high alk to your system - potentially creating alk spike/shock as I asked above.

I use instant ocean salt, when I was changing every 2 days the whole February month the nitrates were the same. 
 

2 hours ago, Tamberav said:

You said you added marine pure or such a week before everything went bad.

 

If you did a 50 percent water change that would bring it to 25 nitrates. That's not even 5g of salt needed. 

 

If you always have 50 even after a water change then the test kit is bad or your water source is bad.

 

Copying another's tank rarely works....every tank seems to operate different. Likely due to the variety of microorganisms and bacteria in each tank. It is more about what makes your tank happy.

 

I would probably switch salts so you don't spike to 10 with water changes. Red sea blue bucket is nice.

I’m going to buy other nitrate test as fast as I can, just to be sure that it is too high or not too low, I’m waiting to spent my whole bucket of salt from instant ocean to return to coral pro, cause the water changes doesn’t appear to help to much with nutrients. 
 

1 hour ago, Clown79 said:

the first thing I can think of is your nitrate test may be crap or the water you are using is introducing nutrients into the tank.

 

In a new tank that's small with only 1 tiny fish, too much chemical media will become a problem. Over filtering isn't the answer- it's just a quick way to possibly more problems.

 

Filter floss changed 2 times a week, isn't a problem. Small amounts of carbon change 2-3 weeks, isn't a problem.

 

When you start getting into nitrate/phos reducers- it can become a big problem. Imbalance in nutrients and stripping a tank leads to lack of coral growth, death, and possibly dino's.

 

Always research why 1 person does something, why a product is used. Understanding is the key.

 

Never blindly go into a method, don't rush decisions and changes.

 

The first question I would ask if I had been in the same situation- 

 

Why would someone recommend removing floss?

 

It catches particles to prevent detritus building up, breaking down, and creating nutrients. It's a common go to filter media that if used properly, really isn't a negative.

 

Your alk was fine at 7. Why change it to 10? Stability is the most important thing- not a number as long as its within range.

Natural sea water alk is 7.

 

If your nitrates are indeed 50, then you need to determine the problem, media won't fix it.

I’m going to buy other nitrate test pretty soon to verify that I’m not too low on nutrients, I use human consumption water for changes for a well know brand in country  that many aquarist use too cause is the “cleanest”, I’m trying to determinate the problem but I can’t find yet and I don’t what to do actually, what test or what else to do. 

[Clown79]

9 minutes ago, darksun92 said:

Very good point, I tried to reduce the feed of my only fish but there’s no nitrate change. 

 

It took one month to raise, but remember that it fact was from 7 to 10 because my first test was wrong. 
 

I use instant ocean salt, when I was changing every 2 days the whole February month the nitrates were the same. 
 

I’m going to buy other nitrate test as fast as I can, just to be sure that it is too high or not too low, I’m waiting to spent my whole bucket of salt from instant ocean to return to coral pro, cause the water changes doesn’t appear to help to much with nutrients. 
 

I’m going to buy other nitrate test pretty soon to verify that I’m not too low on nutrients, I use human consumption water for changes for a well know brand in country  that many aquarist use too cause is the “cleanest”, I’m trying to determinate the problem but I can’t find yet and I don’t what to do actually, what test or what else to do. 

Most tap water, regular drinking water isn't clean enough.

 

It can still have tds in it and nutrients. 

It's fine for drinking but not for reefs.

 

That's where you nitrates and phosphates may be coming from.

 

Test your water for nutrients- not the tank, the actual water you use.

 

You need a good phosphate tester too. If possible tds meter. 

 

If your alkalinity is being consumed daily by your corals, you either need to do more waterchanges through the week or start dosing.

[mitten_reef]

28 minutes ago, darksun92 said:

instant ocean salt

That’s another salt that has high alkalinity out of the box, just like the coral pro. Hence, why you were observing rise in dKh as you’re doing more frequent water change. Both should be used carefully in relating to alkalinity. They both work great, and are great salts; you just need to understand how they work with your system and maintenance routine. 

[Clown79]

4 minutes ago, mitten_reef said:

That’s another salt that has high alkalinity out of the box, just like the coral pro. Hence, why you were observing rise in dKh as you’re doing more frequent water change. Both should be used carefully in relating to alkalinity. They both work great, and are great salts; you just need to understand how they work with your system and maintenance routine. 

Regular instant ocean isn't known for high alk or high ca. It often runs low to normal.

 

My alk never got higher than 7.5 with IO. Ca never higher than 370

 

Reef crystals is supposed to have higher alk, that IO's product for higher parameters 

 

 

They also have no batch controls- so each box is different and no way of knowing.

 

 

If you like red sea but not high alk- red sea blue bucket is an awesome salt. 

[mitten_reef]

7 minutes ago, Clown79 said:

Regular instant ocean isn't known for high alk or high ca. It often runs low to normal.

 

My alk never got higher than 7.5 with IO. Ca never higher than 370

 

Reef crystals is supposed to have higher alk, that IO's product for higher parameters 

 

 

They also have no batch controls- so each box is different and no way of knowing.

 

 

If you like red sea but not high alk- red sea blue bucket is an awesome salt. 

Funny, I think I read the opposite. IO has less concerns about alk as it’s meant for general purpose, while they control alk a bit more with reef crystal. But who knows, the source where I found that could be wrong. 
 

Either way, my days of IO salt brand are long in the past. 

[Clown79]

41 minutes ago, mitten_reef said:

Funny, I think I read the opposite. IO has less concerns about alk as it’s meant for general purpose, while they control alk a bit more with reef crystal. But who knows, the source where I found that could be wrong. 
 

Either way, my days of IO salt brand are long in the past. 

Lol. Mine too.

 

I got sick of it hardening even though it was in properly stored, the long mixing times, and the inconsistencies in parameters.

 

I rather pay more for less issues

[darksun92]

2 hours ago, Clown79 said:

Most tap water, regular drinking water isn't clean enough.

 

It can still have tds in it and nutrients. 

It's fine for drinking but not for reefs.

 

That's where you nitrates and phosphates may be coming from.

 

Test your water for nutrients- not the tank, the actual water you use.

 

You need a good phosphate tester too. If possible tds meter. 

 

I just ordered my tds reader the Xiaomi one is good? I use and hydrometer to check the salinity so I think i'm going order my salility digital tester then I'll do the proper test and post what are the results.

 

2 hours ago, mitten_reef said:

That’s another salt that has high alkalinity out of the box, just like the coral pro. Hence, why you were observing rise in dKh as you’re doing more frequent water change. Both should be used carefully in relating to alkalinity. They both work great, and are great salts; you just need to understand how they work with your system and maintenance routine. 

Sorry my salt is reef crystals 😛 it comes with 11 alk from the mix.

 

[darksun92]

Update, Today I test nitrates and phosphates with Elos test the results are 

Salinity 1022

dKh 8 

PH 8.2

Nitrates 15 

Phosphates 0 

temp 28.7