What am I doing wrong, What am I doing right.

[Pres.Merkin]

Hi all, I wanted to take a moment to post here and hopefully get some feedback. I have been on the freshwater side of this hobby for several years with a few different tanks. I finally made the decision to add a saltwater tank to the mix. Since this is new to me, I thought maybe I could layout what Im working with and get some feedback. Anything regarding whats Im doing wrong or right would be appreciated.

 

Here is where I stand. The tank is a 15G column tank that I wasnt using anymore. I know the advice about the bigger the better for first time, but I just couldnt bring myself to purchase a tank when I had a spare. Ive got 15lbs of sand on the bottom and Ive got 15lbs of rock in it. the rock was dry when purchased, but the guy at the store said it was treated or something so that it would help kick start the cycle once I added water. Looking back Im not sure on that deal. I have a Aqua Clear 50 HOB filter and I also added a Koralia 240 for extra flow. The only other thing int he tank is a heater. The Hood is the one that came with the tank and the small flourescent bulb.

 

The plan is to keep this as a FOWLR tank for the foreseeable future. I would like to upgrade the hood and lighting in the near future. The tank is mostly cycled. I started it up several weeks back using a small piece of shrimp every now and then. Admittedly I probably should have waited a bit longer to add fish, but I did get impatient and add 2 clownfish two days ago. I am thinkgin of adding some kind of goby and a CUC down the road and leave the stocking at that.

 

Right now Ive got the water holding at 78 degrees, and a ph of 8 which Im afraid may be a little low. I bought my water premixed at the store and its at 1.024 Ive got a bucket of RO water and 2 buckets of the premixed on standby for water changes and evaporation control. So again Im just curious what other think and looking forward to learning from everyone.

[jservedio]

Looks good to me - the only potential mistake I see is that you are testing your pH and considering doing anything based on those tests! Throw out your pH test kit unless it's a properly calibrated probe, the number you get is incorrect.

 

You might want to use less sand if you don't want to deal with a DSB, but that's really up to you and just something you might want to think about.

[Seadragon]

On 2/4/2020 at 2:20 PM, Pres.Merkin said:

Hi all, I wanted to take a moment to post here and hopefully get some feedback. I have been on the freshwater side of this hobby for several years with a few different tanks. I finally made the decision to add a saltwater tank to the mix. Since this is new to me, I thought maybe I could layout what Im working with and get some feedback. Anything regarding whats Im doing wrong or right would be appreciated.

 

Here is where I stand. The tank is a 15G column tank that I wasnt using anymore. I know the advice about the bigger the better for first time, but I just couldnt bring myself to purchase a tank when I had a spare. Ive got 15lbs of sand on the bottom and Ive got 15lbs of rock in it. the rock was dry when purchased, but the guy at the store said it was treated or something so that it would help kick start the cycle once I added water. Looking back Im not sure on that deal. I have a Aqua Clear 50 HOB filter and I also added a Koralia 240 for extra flow. The only other thing int he tank is a heater. The Hood is the one that came with the tank and the small flourescent bulb.

 

The plan is to keep this as a FOWLR tank for the foreseeable future. I would like to upgrade the hood and lighting in the near future. The tank is mostly cycled. I started it up several weeks back using a small piece of shrimp every now and then. Admittedly I probably should have waited a bit longer to add fish, but I did get impatient and add 2 clownfish two days ago. I am thinkgin of adding some kind of goby and a CUC down the road and leave the stocking at that.

 

Right now Ive got the water holding at 78 degrees, and a ph of 8 which Im afraid may be a little low. I bought my water premixed at the store and its at 1.024 Ive got a bucket of RO water and 2 buckets of the premixed on standby for water changes and evaporation control. So again Im just curious what other think and looking forward to learning from everyone.

 

Welcome to NR!  Like you, I've had my freshwater tanks for a long time and started my reef tanks last year.  I wouldn't believe much if anything a salesperson tells you, especially when it comes to cycling a tank at the beginning.  Going slow and researching a lot is the key to success in this hobby -- I would've recommended using "Instant Ocean BIO-Spira" as a great source of starter bacteria and also "Coralline Algae in a Bottle + Nitrifying Bacteria for Saltwater Aquariums, Purple Helix Strain" if you'd like to seed your tank with a beautiful purple coralline algae that will later make those rocks turn into a beautiful purple color (with live coralline algae) and at the same time help control nuisance algae from growing on top of the coralline algae as well as provide additional nitrifying bacteria.

 

Personally, I don't try to chase a certain PH, but then again, I used filtered ocean water (and distilled water for my top offs).  At the beginning, I tested Ammonia, Nitrites, and Nitrates to see where I was in the Nitrogen cycle.  If I were you, I'd just make sure your Ammonia is at 0 PPM before adding more livestock.  I also wouldn't have made the sand bed that deep (the 1:1 ratio for sand to gallons of water works better for long tanks rather than tall tanks).  You may run into issues years down the road if you stir up the sand and Hydrogen sulfide has formed in the lowermost layers of your deep sand bed which is extremely toxic.

 

Since you're thinking of future fish and CUC to add at a later time, I'll give you a few to research while you wait:

• Tailspot Blenny - an amazing fish with a HUGE personality!
• Stocky Cerith Snails - the jack-of-all-trades in the snail world, eats a little bit of everything in terms of algae, and loves to burrow in the sand.  Probably critical for your deep sand bed.
• Banded Trochus Snail - speedily eats brown diatom and film algae off your glass.  Would do well with your large glass panels in your tall aquarium.

 

For later:

• If you get nuisance algae in your tank (such as GHA, Cotton Candy algae) look into getting some Mexican Turbo Snails.
• If you get any hint of Cyanobacteria on your sand bed, look into the Tiger Sand Conch.  They eat cyanobacteria and are also excellent at sifting and burrowing in the sand.

 

Also keep an eye on your salinity, some hobbyists go on vacation and the water evaporates too much and animals start dying when the salinity gets too high.  One of the common themes for stuff dying.  Good luck and keep asking questions!

[WV Reefer]

On 2/4/2020 at 2:20 PM, Pres.Merkin said:

Hi all, I wanted to take a moment to post here and hopefully get some feedback. I have been on the freshwater side of this hobby for several years with a few different tanks. I finally made the decision to add a saltwater tank to the mix. Since this is new to me, I thought maybe I could layout what Im working with and get some feedback. Anything regarding whats Im doing wrong or right would be appreciated.

 

Here is where I stand. The tank is a 15G column tank that I wasnt using anymore. I know the advice about the bigger the better for first time, but I just couldnt bring myself to purchase a tank when I had a spare. Ive got 15lbs of sand on the bottom and Ive got 15lbs of rock in it. the rock was dry when purchased, but the guy at the store said it was treated or something so that it would help kick start the cycle once I added water. Looking back Im not sure on that deal. I have a Aqua Clear 50 HOB filter and I also added a Koralia 240 for extra flow. The only other thing int he tank is a heater. The Hood is the one that came with the tank and the small flourescent bulb.

 

The plan is to keep this as a FOWLR tank for the foreseeable future. I would like to upgrade the hood and lighting in the near future. The tank is mostly cycled. I started it up several weeks back using a small piece of shrimp every now and then. Admittedly I probably should have waited a bit longer to add fish, but I did get impatient and add 2 clownfish two days ago. I am thinkgin of adding some kind of goby and a CUC down the road and leave the stocking at that.

 

Right now Ive got the water holding at 78 degrees, and a ph of 8 which Im afraid may be a little low. I bought my water premixed at the store and its at 1.024 Ive got a bucket of RO water and 2 buckets of the premixed on standby for water changes and evaporation control. So again Im just curious what other think and looking forward to learning from everyone.

 

I think it looks great so far! I love the shape of the rock scape. 

[Pres.Merkin]

Thanks for the input everyone. The depth of the sand bed is definitely something I didnt research very well. I went with the 1lb to 1G rule and it seems I have to much so I will probably take a bit out next time I do a big water change.

[WV Reefer]

4 minutes ago, Pres.Merkin said:

Thanks for the input everyone. The depth of the sand bed is definitely something I didnt research very well. I went with the 1lb to 1G rule and it seems I have to much so I will probably take a bit out next time I do a big water change.

I was so busy looking at the rock I didn’t notice. It is a little deep but will be easy to remove.  

[Clown79]

2 inches isn't considered a dsb. 4+ inches is

[Pres.Merkin]

1 hour ago, WV Reefer said:

I was so busy looking at the rock I didn’t notice. It is a little deep but will be easy to remove.  

I'm glad you like it. I spent several hours playing with different combinations and arraingments before settling on this one.

[jservedio]

40 minutes ago, Clown79 said:

2 inches isn't considered a dsb. 4+ inches is

I can't tell how deep it is since you can't see the bottom rim, but if it's only like 2", you are right. However, if it isn't that deep, it's still clearly more than a SSB and just an awkward in-between depth that doesn't provide the DSB benefits, but is also a little too deep to thoroughly clean.

 

2 hours ago, Pres.Merkin said:

Thanks for the input everyone. The depth of the sand bed is definitely something I didnt research very well. I went with the 1lb to 1G rule and it seems I have to much so I will probably take a bit out next time I do a big water change.

It isn't an immediate concern at all, but you should definitely spend some time researching Shallow Sand Beds and Deep Sand Beds when you have time. If you want a Shallow Sand Bed, the goal is to make it look nice, but not be overly difficult to clean. You don't want to have lots of detritus [read: fish and critter crap] getting trapped in there. The shallower and less sand you have, the, the easier it is to clean. Yet another of the seemingly endless things you'll have to research!

[Seadragon]

2 hours ago, jservedio said:

I can't tell how deep it is since you can't see the bottom rim

 

I browsed a bunch of empty 15 gallon aquariums and every single aquarium that I know of, including the ones that I own, the glass goes below the top of the black plastic support piece.  So, to quote the Transformers... there's "more than meets the eye".  Sand in this case.

 

 

 

Seems more than 2 inches.  What do you think @Matteo?

[Jmevox]

Some people like the deep sand bed. I personally hate sand. It looks nice but its a pain and traps detritus and nitrates. My next tank is bare bottom. Sand definitely looks nice though. I also hate crabs they killed every snail I’ve owned, eat 80 dollar zoas, i hate those things with a passion but other people never have an issue

[Seadragon]

45 minutes ago, Jmevox said:

I also hate crabs they killed every snail I’ve owned, eat 80 dollar zoas, i hate those things with a passion but other people never have an issue

 

You should try a Porcelain Anemone Crab, one of the most peaceful decapod crustaceans in existence, and beautiful as well!  They'd never hurt a snail or a zoa.

 

[Jmevox]

9 minutes ago, Seadragon said:

 

You should try a Porcelain Anemone Crab, one of the most peaceful decapod crustacean in existence, and beautiful as well!  They'd never hurt a snail or a zoa.

 

I may do that but im hesitant, I just assume all crabs are jerks lol. I baste my rocks so much i don’t really need crabs 🦀   I may keep one or two in my sump

[Seadragon]

1 minute ago, Jmevox said:

I may do that but im hesitant, I just assume all crabs are jerks lol. I baste my rocks so much i don’t really need crabs 🦀   I may keep one or two in my sump

 

Well, I do agree with you that there's a lot of jerks out there... such as the ~14 Hermit crabs in my School NR.  My wife had a horrifying experience where she noticed that a snail was upside down on the sand and the cleaner shrimp + the hermit crabs swarmed the snail to remove it from it's shell and eat it while it was still squirming and alive.  Now, I have to give away the hermit crabs in the near future and declare our family snail-only from now on with the exception of the Porcelain Anemone Crabs.

[Clown79]

48 minutes ago, Seadragon said:

 

Well, I do agree with you that there's a lot of jerks out there... such as the ~14 Hermit crabs in my School NR.  My wife had a horrifying experience where she noticed that a snail was upside down on the sand and the cleaner shrimp + the hermit crabs swarmed the snail to remove it from it's shell and eat it while it was still squirming and alive.  Now, I have to give away the hermit crabs in the near future and declare our family snail-only from now on with the exception of the Porcelain Anemone Crabs.

They usually do that as the snail is dying. 

 

Cleaner shrimps don't normally go after healthy snails or crabs

 

 

[Seadragon]

26 minutes ago, Clown79 said:

They usually do that as the snail is dying. 

 

Cleaner shrimps don't normally go after healthy snails or crabs

 

Yeah, either the snail was already dying or the hermit crabs injured/killed the snail and the cleaner shrimp smelled death in the water and came running for a free snack.  I tried questioning all of the eye witnesses in the tank, but no one is talking.

[Clown79]

3 hours ago, Seadragon said:

 

Yeah, either the snail was already dying or the hermit crabs injured/killed the snail and the cleaner shrimp smelled death in the water and came running for a free snack.  I tried questioning all of the eye witnesses in the tank, but no one is talking.

According to documentaries, only certain hermit species intentionally kill snails.

 

I know I've had a few that did, zebra, another striped legged, and the red tipped but my blue legged and scarlets don't even touch my flipped over snails. 

[Jmevox]

6 hours ago, Clown79 said:

According to documentaries, only certain hermit species intentionally kill snails.

 

I know I've had a few that did, zebra, another striped legged, and the red tipped but my blue legged and scarlets don't even touch my flipped over snails. 

My blue legged hermits were the culprits. I never had issues with snails dying until I had them. For now on snails only for me. Also, i had issues with a fire shrimp taking food away from my hammers and frogspawn. I couldnt spot feed them at all 

[jservedio]

50 minutes ago, Jmevox said:

My blue legged hermits were the culprits. I never had issues with snails dying until I had them. For now on snails only for me. Also, i had issues with a fire shrimp taking food away from my hammers and frogspawn. I couldnt spot feed them at all 

Screw shrimp, but if you do away with all hermits, you are getting rid of one of the most important detritivores you can possibly have in your tank - they are probably the most important member of your clean up crew since they actually clean things up before they can be broken down into nutrients and become algae. Nassarius snails will do the same, but they are nowhere near as effective and simply can't get into the nooks in your rock.

 

Another factor is how hungry your hermits are - if you put 14 hermits in a newish nano, they are going to starve and eat whatever they can to survive - whether it's stealing food from corals, eating snails, or eating each other they will do what they must to survive. I've got two in my 20g, they are both ancient and huge (one red and one blue legged) and have never once been a problem. I did have a third one that got greedy when I fed a large acan, but he was eaten by said acan - I'm not going to trash an entire class of animals because of one greedy hermit.

 

  

10 hours ago, Seadragon said:

 

Yeah, either the snail was already dying or the hermit crabs injured/killed the snail and the cleaner shrimp smelled death in the water and came running for a free snack.  I tried questioning all of the eye witnesses in the tank, but no one is talking.

Or the hermits were just starving to death - they will eat whatever they can get their tiny little claws on, living or not, before they will starve to death. They'll eat each other if they have to. Just watch them at the LFS when they stuff hundreds of them in a tiny little 5g area.

[Seadragon]

2 hours ago, jservedio said:

Or the hermits were just starving to death - they will eat whatever they can get their tiny little claws on, living or not, before they will starve to death. They'll eat each other if they have to. Just watch them at the LFS when they stuff hundreds of them in a tiny little 5g area.

 

Yeah, I can see that happening.  Unfortunately, the caretaker of that tank tends to overfeed which actually bothers me more.  Either way, at some point, I need to find a new home for the hermit crabs.  (There's also 1 Electric Orange Hermit Crab that has gotten much bigger than the Blue Leg Hermit Crabs.) . I really want to add a Tiger Sand Conch to that tank, but I'm scared the hermit crabs will kill the conch and steal it's shell.

[Clown79]

7 hours ago, Seadragon said:

 

Yeah, I can see that happening.  Unfortunately, the caretaker of that tank tends to overfeed which actually bothers me more.  Either way, at some point, I need to find a new home for the hermit crabs.  (There's also 1 Electric Orange Hermit Crab that has gotten much bigger than the Blue Leg Hermit Crabs.) . I really want to add a Tiger Sand Conch to that tank, but I'm scared the hermit crabs will kill the conch and steal it's shell.

Only certain hermits use conch shells like the Halloween hermit.

 

Unfortunately, conches don't last long in nano's, lack of food source for them due to sizes of tanks.

[Seadragon]

1 hour ago, Clown79 said:

Unfortunately, conches don't last long in nano's, lack of food source for them due to sizes of tanks.

How long do you think a Tiger Sand Conch would last in a nano and how long should they last otherwise?  Since I’ll have a few conchs, I can report back if your estimates are correct.

[Matteo]

On 2/5/2020 at 4:46 PM, Seadragon said:

 

I browsed a bunch of empty 15 gallon aquariums and every single aquarium that I know of, including the ones that I own, the glass goes below the top of the black plastic support piece.  So, to quote the Transformers... there's "more than meets the eye".  Sand in this case.

 

 

 

Seems more than 2 inches.  What do you think @Matteo?

I feel like a true deep sand bed is 6+ inches. Reason being is if you have higher flow, do water changes frequently, and spot clean... You're sand bed is almost always stirred up a bit or messed with. 

 

When you have 6+ inches the top 2" usually gets stirred up while the lower inches stay put and do their deep sand bed spooky stuff. 

 

My sand bed can get up to 6in on the right side of my tank but with flow and the Clown fishes moving it around it never stays put really. 

 

Depends on the tank. 

[Clown79]

21 hours ago, Seadragon said:

How long do you think a Tiger Sand Conch would last in a nano and how long should they last otherwise?  Since I’ll have a few conchs, I can report back if your estimates are correct.

6 months at most in my 25g

 

Nano's simply don't offer the amount of food they need.

[mcarroll]

On 2/4/2020 at 2:20 PM, Pres.Merkin said:

So again Im just curious what other think and looking forward to learning from everyone.

Looks OK so far, but what have you been able to read so far?  How much do you know about saltwater and saltwater animals?

 

Any books?

 

(Check out this thread for reading ideas: Chime in with your reef-oriented reading list!)