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Thrassian Atoll

Coral Kingdom Of Thras ~ Waterbox 130.4 💦

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Thrassian Atoll
5 minutes ago, Dirté Sanchez said:

I had a McCoskers wrasse that did the same thing one day. He looked fine but couldn’t swim, never got better even after rest and meds for two weeks. 

Yeah, I feel death is inevitable.

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Elizabeth94

Gosh I am sorry to hear this 😞 I just asked a couple days ago how he was. Crazy how fast things can go downhill. I wish I had advice but I never had luck with fish bladder issues. 

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spectra

Have a wrasse now that is doing the same thing.............it has been a week now and am sure its a bladder issue...........eats but sits upside down on the bottom..........

 

Good luck with it hope it pulls through............

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Thrassian Atoll
4 hours ago, spectra said:

Have a wrasse now that is doing the same thing.............it has been a week now and am sure its a bladder issue...........eats but sits upside down on the bottom..........

 

Good luck with it hope it pulls through............

You too!  Luck of the draw I guess.

 

4 hours ago, Elizabeth94 said:

Gosh I am sorry to hear this 😞 I just asked a couple days ago how he was. Crazy how fast things can go downhill. I wish I had advice but I never had luck with fish bladder issues. 

Not a whole lot to do.  Yeah, he was great one minute and this way the next.  

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spectra
13 minutes ago, Thrassian Atoll said:

You too!  Luck of the draw I guess.

 

Not a whole lot to do.  Yeah, he was great one minute and this way the next.  

Was there today when I got home............but tonight when feeding could not find it..............have a real good clean up crew so may have been cleaned up already.................

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Humblefish
6 hours ago, Thrassian Atoll said:


He looks normal and healthy to me.  He just ate some mysis.  He can barely swim though.

A few long shot things you can try:

  1. Dose magnesium sulfate (Epsom Salt) at 1 tablespoon per 5 gallons.
  2. Give the affected fish a 30 minute Methylene Blue bath.
  3. Dose Metronidazole in conjunction with Neomycin. (You can food soak this combination as well.)
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Thrassian Atoll
1 hour ago, Humblefish said:

A few long shot things you can try:

  1. Dose magnesium sulfate (Epsom Salt) at 1 tablespoon per 5 gallons.
  2. Give the affected fish a 30 minute Methylene Blue bath.
  3. Dose Metronidazole in conjunction with Neomycin. (You can food soak this combination as well.)


I’ll go grab some Epsom salt in the morning.  I have metroplex but not Focus.  I’ll see if the local fresh water fish store has any so I can mix it with food rather than treat the whole tank.  I don’t think I have enough to treat 45 gallons and he’s still eating as of now.  I can also try some more peas but he didn’t even look at the last one.

 

Not sure what the methylene blue is.

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Humblefish
19 hours ago, Thrassian Atoll said:


I’ll go grab some Epsom salt in the morning.  I have metroplex but not Focus.  I’ll see if the local fresh water fish store has any so I can mix it with food rather than treat the whole tank.  I don’t think I have enough to treat 45 gallons and he’s still eating as of now.  I can also try some more peas but he didn’t even look at the last one.

 

Not sure what the methylene blue is.

Make sure the Epsom salt is USP grade and contains no scents.

 

If you can't find Focus, you can use unflavored gelatin or agar as a food binder instead.

 

More info on Methylene Blue: https://www.nano-reef.com/forums/topic/401839-methylene-blue-fish-medication-information/

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Thrassian Atoll
1 hour ago, Humblefish said:

Make sure the Epsom salt is USP grade and contains no scents.

 

If you can't find Focus, you can use unflavored gelatin or agar as a food binder instead.

 

More info on Methylene Blue: https://www.nano-reef.com/forums/topic/401839-methylene-blue-fish-medication-information/


He’s still alive but in really bad shape. I added Epsom salt this morning.  Used the equate stuff that’s only Epsom salt.  I couldn’t find focus anywhere.  I ordered some, but won’t be here until Monday.  I am just soaking some mysis in metroplex.  He ate some earlier, but I don’t know how much he is absorbing.  I’ll see about the gelatin.  That would make more sense to bind it rather than hoping the mysis soaks it up.  
 

I still haven’t seen him poop.

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Thrassian Atoll

He’s still eating but now he’s floating at the surface.  When he swims to eat he’s upside down.  He’s definitely getting worse.  He’s a fighter though.  I am guessing this means it’s 99% a swim bladder issue if he’s floating at the surface?
 

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Humblefish

Yeah, most likely a gas bubble has formed in his swim bladder and that's what's making him buoyant. You could lance the air out using a 30 gauge insulin syringe, but you first need to see the bubble protruding outward so you have a "target" to prick.

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Thrassian Atoll

I don’t see any bubbles unfortunately.  He looks normal.  He’s just floating around the top of the water today.  He tried to swim a little to get some food.

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Thrassian Atoll

3 MONTH UPDATE

 

Tank is doing ok.  I finally got my Alkalinity, calcium and magnesium really stabilized.  I finally started using the trident auto dosing and it’s working really really well.  The only issues I had was when it was getting low on reagents and needed those changed and recalibrated.  
 

The toughest thing I have had to deal with so far is nutrients.  It’s been hard to get them dialed in.  I really need more fish.  I have had to dose a lot of neonitro to get my nitrates up from zero.  Phosphates have slowly been increasing and are a little higher than I want.  I deciding to throw a half cup of regular GFO in the reactor yesterday.  That’s like a quarter of the recommended starting dose.  
 

Trying to get everything dialed in hasn’t been good for the new corals I have purchased.  They aren’t doing so well.  The stuff I previously had is doing fine.  Growth hasn’t been great but color wise and polyp extension has been good.  I guess they have just been a lot hardier than the new stuff?  I don’t know.  Even the new montis aren’t doing well.  
 

I need to just keep stuff stable and nutrients up.  Been dealing with a little cyano and getting a lot of algae on the back wall.  But I am making sure I have nutrients.  Zero nutrients has always been my downfall.  
 

The rocks aren’t white anymore.  Which is good.  I am finally seeing Coraline algae start to produce now.  I still have not been able to turn my pumps up a lot without getting a ton of sand movement.  Hopefully in a month or two I can keep raising the output of the mp40s.  Trying to go slow this go around but it’s always hard.  

C8C7ED10-E737-42C1-9F6E-A5165B5EAFE3.thumb.jpeg.11be42aefbe3c770d52dffeb0899bc80.jpeg

A9DE1D44-D1F0-4B1D-8C6D-48A3B5092609.thumb.jpeg.15ea11fae82ca6fc61f9f3eb8be29377.jpegD277954B-41C9-4951-89F8-A3CF5708B67F.thumb.jpeg.45f84b3478b6619390dfaf35f95b94a5.jpeg192C37A2-A1CB-41C6-934F-00B9DD120362.thumb.jpeg.d18e6013895c1e4b37fd3c36bcd175c9.jpeg016B7E81-9AD7-4ED8-BFAD-6EEDFE0E016F.thumb.jpeg.b3d908a856bbd678e9a42440df947fac.jpegFE0E42ED-DB76-4D12-AAD0-6E8BD28165CC.thumb.jpeg.451c65e7138a4ddcf6e226506cce8e3e.jpeg

 

On another not.  My lineatus fairy wrasse is on his last leg.  I honestly can’t believe this guy is still alive.  I know he’s suffering and there is nothing else I can do.  He can’t swim and he’s not eating anything.  He just floats in the corner of the QT.  Poor guy.  
 

 

33B92C7B-0B1B-4550-A83C-491DF04A702C.thumb.jpeg.0a767ce80ec05b279427f7bbe1159a0f.jpeg

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William
25 minutes ago, Thrassian Atoll said:

3 MONTH UPDATE

 

Tank is doing ok.  I finally got my Alkalinity, calcium and magnesium really stabilized.  I finally started using the trident auto dosing and it’s working really really well.  The only issues I had was when it was getting low on reagents and needed those changed and recalibrated.  
 

The toughest thing I have had to deal with so far is nutrients.  It’s been hard to get them dialed in.  I really need more fish.  I have had to dose a lot of neonitro to get my nitrates up from zero.  Phosphates have slowly been increasing and are a little higher than I want.  I deciding to throw a half cup of regular GFO in the reactor yesterday.  That’s like a quarter of the recommended starting dose.  
 

Trying to get everything dialed in hasn’t been good for the new corals I have purchased.  They aren’t doing so well.  The stuff I previously had is doing fine.  Growth hasn’t been great but color wise and polyp extension has been good.  I guess they have just been a lot hardier than the new stuff?  I don’t know.  Even the new montis aren’t doing well.  
 

I need to just keep stuff stable and nutrients up.  Been dealing with a little cyano and getting a lot of algae on the back wall.  But I am making sure I have nutrients.  Zero nutrients has always been my downfall.  
 

The rocks aren’t white anymore.  Which is good.  I am finally seeing Coraline algae start to produce now.  I still have not been able to turn my pumps up a lot without getting a ton of sand movement.  Hopefully in a month or two I can keep raising the output of the mp40s.  Trying to go slow this go around but it’s always hard.  

C8C7ED10-E737-42C1-9F6E-A5165B5EAFE3.thumb.jpeg.11be42aefbe3c770d52dffeb0899bc80.jpeg

A9DE1D44-D1F0-4B1D-8C6D-48A3B5092609.thumb.jpeg.15ea11fae82ca6fc61f9f3eb8be29377.jpegD277954B-41C9-4951-89F8-A3CF5708B67F.thumb.jpeg.45f84b3478b6619390dfaf35f95b94a5.jpeg192C37A2-A1CB-41C6-934F-00B9DD120362.thumb.jpeg.d18e6013895c1e4b37fd3c36bcd175c9.jpeg016B7E81-9AD7-4ED8-BFAD-6EEDFE0E016F.thumb.jpeg.b3d908a856bbd678e9a42440df947fac.jpegFE0E42ED-DB76-4D12-AAD0-6E8BD28165CC.thumb.jpeg.451c65e7138a4ddcf6e226506cce8e3e.jpeg

 

On another not.  My lineatus fairy wrasse is on his last leg.  I honestly can’t believe this guy is still alive.  I know he’s suffering and there is nothing else I can do.  He can’t swim and he’s not eating anything.  He just floats in the corner of the QT.  Poor guy.  
 

 

33B92C7B-0B1B-4550-A83C-491DF04A702C.thumb.jpeg.0a767ce80ec05b279427f7bbe1159a0f.jpeg

Tank looks great and sorry to hear about the wrasse. Have you considered euthanizing it? It seems like there is little point in prolonging it’s suffering. 

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Thrassian Atoll
18 minutes ago, William said:

Tank looks great and sorry to hear about the wrasse. Have you considered euthanizing it? It seems like there is little point in prolonging it’s suffering. 

Yeah, I have been thinking about it.  I want to send photos to liveaquaria though and see what they say.  I don’t want to just take it out of the tank and let it suffocate.

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William
19 minutes ago, Thrassian Atoll said:

Yeah, I have been thinking about it.  I want to send photos to liveaquaria though and see what they say.  I don’t want to just take it out of the tank and let it suffocate.

I have had to euthanize 3 fish and I have done it chemically (I have access to medications as part of my job). I think the fastest and kindest way though would be physically  (using a knife to cut the head off etc) 

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ECLS Reefer
3 minutes ago, William said:

I have had to euthanize 3 fish and I have done it chemically (I have access to medications as part of my job). I think the fastest and kindest way though would be physically  (using a knife to cut the head off etc) 

Or freeze it. Then they just go to sleep. 

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Thrassian Atoll
7 minutes ago, William said:

I have had to euthanize 3 fish and I have done it chemically (I have access to medications as part of my job). I think the fastest and kindest way though would be physically  (using a knife to cut the head off etc) 

Yeah, those photos wouldn’t look good sending in.  He’s been surprising me that he’s still alive, but I don’t know how he could be alive in another day or 2.  

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Thrassian Atoll
4 minutes ago, Dirté Sanchez said:

Or freeze it. Then they just go to sleep. 

Yeah, I could do that.  I am going to freeze him anyways when he dies in case liveaquaria wants me to mail him back to them.

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William
15 minutes ago, Dirté Sanchez said:

Or freeze it. Then they just go to sleep. 

You would need to freeze it in enough water than it does not suffocate first. Just putting it in a bag in the freezer is actually pretty cruel. There was a long thread on one of the other forums about this 

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ECLS Reefer
7 minutes ago, William said:

You would need to freeze it in enough water than it does not suffocate first. Just putting it in a bag in the freezer is actually pretty cruel. There was a long thread on one of the other forums about this 

More cruel than cutting its head off? You know, nerve endings don’t just die immediately because the head is gone. And besides, not everyone is a sushi chef with perfect aim. Might miss and cut it in half or the tail or just the nose. Much to go wrong there. I couldn’t do that- beheadings don’t go under my list of euthanasia methods.

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mcarroll

Do the best you can....we don't know enough yet to say "what's best" but there's research happening re: pain and feelings in fish, what they're like, what they're not like, etc.

 

Freezing in water (like Han Solo in carbonite) is one of the more common ways.  All I've done.   I've also heard of folks slowly OD'ing the fish on clove oil.  I've heard of using a massive trauma of a very hard impact to the whole fish.....or possibly removing the fish's noggin may achieve the same effect.

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