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Coral Kingdom Of Thras ~ Waterbox 130.4 💦 ~ Gem Tang & Flame

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Humblefish

I will also say that once you see the red sores on chromis damsels, you might as well just go ahead & euthanize them. Dosing metro won't work fast enough to save them, and the H2O2/formalin bath will burn the living hell out of the sores. And kill them anyway.

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Thrassian Atoll
4 hours ago, Humblefish said:

 

IME; a 30 min 150ppm H2O2 bath OR 45 min 250ppm formalin bath will kill external uronema. See links below:

 

https://www.nano-reef.com/forums/topic/405330-hydrogen-peroxide-fish-treatment-information/

 

https://www.nano-reef.com/forums/topic/401678-formalin-fish-medication-information/

 

However, one caveat about uronema is it can also spread internally, but I've only seen evidence of this in chromis damsels. So they should always be given a proper QT by dosing + food soaking metronidazole (which also treats uronema.) This is irregardless of whether you have already treated them with H2O2 or formalin.

 

So let’s say after 30 days the Anthias doesn’t show any signs of Uronema.  Should I give it a dip before I put in the main display?  How should I sanitize the QT afterwards?

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Humblefish
1 hour ago, Thrassian Atoll said:

So let’s say after 30 days the Anthias doesn’t show any signs of Uronema.  Should I give it a dip before I put in the main display?  How should I sanitize the QT afterwards?

Uronema will show within 30 days, so no need to dip before placing in your DT. If you really wanna give the fish a bath for good measure, I would opt for H2O2 over using formalin.

 

If you suspect the QT has Uronema break everything down & sterilize with bleach. OR follow this regimen to sterilize while the tank is still full:

  1. Dose 100ppm chlorine as per this guide: https://dec.vermont.gov/sites/dec/files/dwgwp/DW/chlorinedosageemergencydisinfection.pdf
  2. Circulate well for 48 hours, and then use sodium thiosulfate to neutralize the chlorine in the water. Most pool places sell a product called Chlor Out which contains sodium thiosulfate and is safe to use. You can use this website to determine how much sodium thiosulfate to dose: https://www.edspumps.com/water-treatment/documents/Antichlorination.pdf
  3. After you are all finished, your alkalinity might need to be raised. If so, use baking soda as per this calculator: http://reef.diesyst.com/chemcalc/chemcalc.html
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Thrassian Atoll
19 minutes ago, Humblefish said:

Uronema will show within 30 days, so no need to dip before placing in your DT. If you really wanna give the fish a bath for good measure, I would opt for H2O2 over using formalin.

 

If you suspect the QT has Uronema break everything down & sterilize with bleach. OR follow this regimen to sterilize while the tank is still full:

  1. Dose 100ppm chlorine as per this guide: https://dec.vermont.gov/sites/dec/files/dwgwp/DW/chlorinedosageemergencydisinfection.pdf
  2. Circulate well for 48 hours, and then use sodium thiosulfate to neutralize the chlorine in the water. Most pool places sell a product called Chlor Out which contains sodium thiosulfate and is safe to use. You can use this website to determine how much sodium thiosulfate to dose: https://www.edspumps.com/water-treatment/documents/Antichlorination.pdf
  3. After you are all finished, your alkalinity might need to be raised. If so, use baking soda as per this calculator: http://reef.diesyst.com/chemcalc/chemcalc.html

Awesome!  Thanks so much.

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ECLS Reefer
52 minutes ago, Humblefish said:

Uronema will show within 30 days, so no need to dip before placing in your DT. If you really wanna give the fish a bath for good measure, I would opt for H2O2 over using formalin.

 

If you suspect the QT has Uronema break everything down & sterilize with bleach. OR follow this regimen to sterilize while the tank is still full:

  1. Dose 100ppm chlorine as per this guide: https://dec.vermont.gov/sites/dec/files/dwgwp/DW/chlorinedosageemergencydisinfection.pdf
  2. Circulate well for 48 hours, and then use sodium thiosulfate to neutralize the chlorine in the water. Most pool places sell a product called Chlor Out which contains sodium thiosulfate and is safe to use. You can use this website to determine how much sodium thiosulfate to dose: https://www.edspumps.com/water-treatment/documents/Antichlorination.pdf
  3. After you are all finished, your alkalinity might need to be raised. If so, use baking soda as per this calculator: http://reef.diesyst.com/chemcalc/chemcalc.html

I had no idea thiosulfate had used outside of human medicine 😳. I learn something amazing every time you come onto NR and educate us!

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mcarroll

You're definitely having not-great luck in this QT so far.  IMO stick with fish you can observe and select locally.

 

I'm glad this thing with the Chromis didn't present like uronema....I suppose that's the "good news"!

 

Still, it makes me wonder about your salinity and temperature in the QT.  Any way you can double check the gear you're using on the QT?  At least one source claims Uronema may only be infectious at salinity levels under 31 ppt/1.023 s.g. and under 82 degrees F.  If you aren't already at these levels, you can raise the temp. in the QT to 83+ and salinity to 1.024+ and possibly help.  If you are already, then just double check the numbers your test gear is giving you.  These levels should be fine for the QT inhabitants.

 

The same source also says UV (tuned for larger parasites) should be effective in cleaning up the water column if it was Uronema. Presumably a micron filter would be helpful on a similar basis.

 

Keep up the good feeding (minimize flake, maximize bright orange frozen) on your remaining fish and maybe consider adding UV or a micron/polishing filter to the QT.

 

How big is the display where the Anthias is headed?  Says in "Marine Fishes" that the Bartlett's can be pugnacious and likes bigger tanks (eg 55 Gallon).

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Thrassian Atoll
6 hours ago, mcarroll said:

You're definitely having not-great luck in this QT so far.  IMO stick with fish you can observe and select locally.

 

I'm glad this thing with the Chromis didn't present like uronema....I suppose that's the "good news"!

 

Still, it makes me wonder about your salinity and temperature in the QT.  Any way you can double check the gear you're using on the QT?  At least one source claims Uronema may only be infectious at salinity levels under 31 ppt/1.023 s.g. and under 82 degrees F.  If you aren't already at these levels, you can raise the temp. in the QT to 83+ and salinity to 1.024+ and possibly help.  If you are already, then just double check the numbers your test gear is giving you.  These levels should be fine for the QT inhabitants.

 

The same source also says UV (tuned for larger parasites) should be effective in cleaning up the water column if it was Uronema. Presumably a micron filter would be helpful on a similar basis.

 

Keep up the good feeding (minimize flake, maximize bright orange frozen) on your remaining fish and maybe consider adding UV or a micron/polishing filter to the QT.

 

How big is the display where the Anthias is headed?  Says in "Marine Fishes" that the Bartlett's can be pugnacious and likes bigger tanks (eg 55 Gallon).


Thanks!  My QT is actually at 1.021.  That’s what the salinity was from Saltwaterfish.com.  That’s the method I have been going with the past couple of shipments.  I want to raise it up over a month to the display salinity.  That’s been the method I have read that’s the easiest on the fish.  The QT is 45 gallons with a aquaclear 110, bioballs chemipure, sponge.  I drained the water completely after the wrasse and put fresh saltwater in.  The tank has been up for 6 months.  I had 4 fish in it for 3 months before I got the main display.

 

The main display is a 110 gallon with a 20 gallon sump.  That’s the 130.4 number.  130 gallons and 4 feet.  

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Tamberav

That fish clearly had a mark when it arrived in the photo you posted. IMO, they sent you an already injured or sick fish or it happened during shipping. I have bought Divers Den fish that looked excellent in the photo only to arrive with a red sore and melted fins. It sounds like they told you the other chromis they had didn't look good either. 

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Humblefish
2 hours ago, Thrassian Atoll said:


Thanks!  My QT is actually at 1.021.  That’s what the salinity was from Saltwaterfish.com.  That’s the method I have been going with the past couple of shipments.  I want to raise it up over a month to the display salinity.  That’s been the method I have read that’s the easiest on the fish.  The QT is 45 gallons with a aquaclear 110, bioballs chemipure, sponge.  I drained the water completely after the wrasse and put fresh saltwater in.  The tank has been up for 6 months.  I had 4 fish in it for 3 months before I got the main display.

 

The main display is a 110 gallon with a 20 gallon sump.  That’s the 130.4 number.  130 gallons and 4 feet.  

How long do you typically expose the fish to medications?

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Thrassian Atoll
2 hours ago, Tamberav said:

That fish clearly had a mark when it arrived in the photo you posted. IMO, they sent you an already injured or sick fish or it happened during shipping. I have bought Divers Den fish that looked excellent in the photo only to arrive with a red sore and melted fins. It sounds like they told you the other chromis they had didn't look good either. 


Yeah, it definitely had the gray spot when I got him.  He was only an inch long, so pretty hard to see with him swimming around.  I didn’t really notice until it was pointed out in the photo.  
 

Yeah, the first time they were going to ship they didn’t have any chromis that were healthy.  Took them a couple weeks to finally make the shipment.  

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Thrassian Atoll
2 hours ago, Humblefish said:

How long do you typically expose the fish to medications?

I haven’t actually medicated any fish besides the wrasse when it was already too late for him.  Besides the wrasse, these are the only fish I have actually quarantined.  The ones I mentioned that were in there for a few months were ones I already had for about 6 months in my lagoon tank.  I had to tear that down when I got the bigger tank so I used the QT as just a transfer/holding tank.  If that makes sense.  

I figured I needed to start quarantining fish as I don’t want to introduce anything to the main tank.

 

In the main display is a longnose hawkfish, 4 line wrasse, helfrichi firefish, black storm clown, orchid dottyback.  

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Thrassian Atoll

I am actually pretty nervous about medicating fish.  There’s a lot to take in information wise.  Plus, I think my QT is a big large at 45 gallons.  That takes a lot of medication, and water to do water changes.  I think I need to get like a 20 long.

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Elizabeth94

Gosh what bad luck with fish so far. Just reading about uronema makes me nervous. I was planning to get 3 green chromis  for their movement and color. Definitely a fish to quarantine for this disease alone. 

 

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Thrassian Atoll
3 hours ago, Elizabeth94 said:

Gosh what bad luck with fish so far. Just reading about uronema makes me nervous. I was planning to get 3 green chromis  for their movement and color. Definitely a fish to quarantine for this disease alone. 

 

From reading online about it, it’s super common.  Definitely want to get healthy fish from a LFS that you can see first.

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Humblefish
7 hours ago, Thrassian Atoll said:

I am actually pretty nervous about medicating fish.  There’s a lot to take in information wise.  Plus, I think my QT is a big large at 45 gallons.  That takes a lot of medication, and water to do water changes.  I think I need to get like a 20 long.

It's not for everyone, but I hit all incoming fish with copper + API General Cure on Day 1:

  1. I use Copper Power, and the fish is dropped in at 1.0 ppm. I also dose API General Cure (which contain prazi + metro) that night before I go to bed.
  2. Over the next 72 hours I gradually raise the copper level to 1.5 (minimum therapeutic), and then raise it to 2.0 ppm over another 72 hours.
  3. 7 days after I first dosed General Cure, I dose it again.
  4. 14 days after the fish reached 1.5 ppm copper, I transfer them into a (non-medicated) observation tank at least 10 feet away from the treatment tank. I only transfer the fish; nothing else. Nothing from the treatment tank is reused to setup the observation tank.
  5. The observation tank contains black mollies: https://www.nano-reef.com/forums/topic/406744-black-molly-quarantine/

Does every fish survive this QT protocol? No. But my success rate is 80-90% on most orders. And I've only had prazi resistant flukes make into observation a few times. Fenbendazole takes care of those.

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Thrassian Atoll

I have most of the medications including copper power.  I wonder if I should setup a smaller tank to treat the Anthias with CP at least and then transfer it back to the QT when the treatment is done.

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Elizabeth94

Any updates? Curious if you happened to pick up anymore fish. 

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Thrassian Atoll
21 hours ago, Elizabeth94 said:

Any updates? Curious if you happened to pick up anymore fish. 

Hey, thanks for asking!  With all the deals and stuff I actually made some transactions this weekend.  

Unfortunately, I believe my 4 line wrasse died a couple of weeks ago.  One day he was doing great and the next day he disappeared.  My wife and I looked everywhere for him multiple times.  Behind and under the tank, in the overflow, in the sump, in all of the piping.  He just vanished.  I assume he died though as my ORP dropped quite a bit after a couple of days of him being gone.  I know that can be a sign of a fish dying.  

 

I moved over the the Bartletts anthias Saturday to the main display.  This guy has been looking great and doing well since I got him.  He’s been doing great in his new home.  
 

This weekend I ordered a blue flasher wrasse terminal phase male from Divers den.  This guy looked sweet on the website.  I really wanted a red fish.  For him, I am going to put him in the main display right away.  I am going to trust Divers den that the fish and is doing great and been treated for any diseases already, as their site claims.  I know the salinity should be 1.025 as well in the bag.  
 

The next fish I ordered was a African midas Blenny from LA.  This guy will go into the QT for observation.  I wanted a yellow fish so this is what I chose.  
 

Lastly, I ordered some sps from aqua dd.  My tank has been doing well, my numbers are consistent and my nutrients have been doing well.  We shall see how those go.

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Elizabeth94

We have very similar tastes in fish. Looking forward  to seeing the wrasse I hope he has some brilliant blue in him! 

 
Stinks about the 4 line, but it was probably just a random thing. Clean up crew probably got to him already. 
 

Any issues with the Trident so far? Curious how they hold up over time. 

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Thrassian Atoll
1 hour ago, Elizabeth94 said:

We have very similar tastes in fish. Looking forward  to seeing the wrasse I hope he has some brilliant blue in him! 

 
Stinks about the 4 line, but it was probably just a random thing. Clean up crew probably got to him already. 
 

Any issues with the Trident so far? Curious how they hold up over time. 

Yeah, I just think it was one of these things with the 4 line.  I know they can become bullies though, so I avoided having to deal with that.  He was going to be the last fish in my lagoon so I wasn’t worried how he would deal with new fish.  
 

The next fish will definitely be a couple fairy wrasses, probably lineatus for sure and not sure on the other.  
 

The trident has been great.  The only issue I ran into was the calcium climbing when the reagent was low.  That’s a big issue Neptune’s been having in general with them.  They changed up the calibration and reagent replacement procedures though.  We shall see when the reagents in there now get low.  My tank is still too young for my calcium and alkalinity to be really stable for dosing.  I have been trying to using the automated dosing with the trident but I keep having to change the amount of 2 part I have to dose per day.  It’s been going up and down between 20 and 30 mls for each.  

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Thrassian Atoll

Midas Blenny is doing good and eating well in the QT.  He’s a longer longer than I thought he would be.  I would say he’s about 4” long.  
 

I only saw the flasher wrasse once since I put him in the main tank.  He hasn’t been out swimming at all.  Hopefully he comes out in another day or so and at least goes after some food.

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Thrassian Atoll

No sooner after writing the last post, the flasher is out and swimming around.  I’ll try and get some photos this week of the new guys.

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Elizabeth94

Thats good to hear! Its about time you get some better luck with fish. 

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Thrassian Atoll
10 hours ago, Elizabeth94 said:

Thats good to hear! Its about time you get some better luck with fish. 

For sure!  My fish luck is terrible.  😂

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mitten_reef

waiting to hear when this thing will start getting corals.......😴

Did you get any coral pack over the shopping wknd? 

😁

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