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Snow's Empty 60G - Post-hybrid TTM QT

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seabass

I'm not sure about any alternatives, but keep in mind that the micro inverts might suffer losses from peroxide dosing.

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Snow_Phoenix
8 minutes ago, seabass said:

I'm not sure about any alternatives, but keep in mind that the micro inverts might suffer losses from peroxide dosing.

Yeah, I suspect as much. 😔

 

I don't see much of a choice though. Even with this line of treatment, there will most likely be fish & invert losses in the DT as well. That's why I quickly caught my fire shrimp and transfered him to the nano. 

 

My mandy, Poseidon, and GCG, Goblin, started showing weird *nodules on the surface of their bodies today. Some of my fish are breathing harder than usual, and I caught one of the wrasses flashing off the rocks as well. 

 

I can't treat all the diseases at once, but I need to focus on the most pressing disease atm - velvet. Once that has been kept under control or eradicated, then I'll treat the fish with Prazi. I'm expecting the whole course of treatment(s) to stretch out up to 3+ months. 

 

Afterwards, I'll add a tiny goby or other small nanofish to see if anything flares up - if everything checks out, I can resume my original plan of adding a starry blenny to the tank. 

 

And, I think it's best to just QT any future additions from now on - at least for 2 to 3 weeks. 

 

I still am not sure *how velvet got into the system, but I wouldn't wish this experience on any other reefer. It's horrible. The fact that it kills so quickly is what bothers me the most. 😕

 

I miss my clown. 😔

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Calculations done for a tank with a volume of ~80G (including current volume of the sump - bearing in mind that it is not filled all the way to the top --> if it was, total system volume will be 83+ G). No dilution - peroxide used is 6%, not 3%. 

 

20211027_211357.thumb.jpg.cb482b6d70b3840870d694600c5821fd.jpg

 

I'm not sure how I'll be able to dose the tank for 15 minute intervals from 11pm to 4am during the 3rd week though, since I'll be asleep. That's the only part that worries me. 

 

Thinking of going lightless for the duration of treatment. 🤔

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So tired and stressed out. Heading off to bed. Hopefully tomorrow will be a better day with a brighter outcome for the tank. My angel is still surprisingly alert. 

 

Just worried over the potential losses in the future. 😔

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Several interesting observations - I've now completed 2x dosings of peroxide in the DT. 

 

1. Fish are breathing more normally. Poseidon the mandarin has less nodules on his body, and is a bit more active than yesterday. 

 

2. Illaron the scooter is also breathing less quicker, and less harder. Goblin the GCG appears *okay, but I haven't seen him up close yet. Not all of the fish are awake yet, but I did spot Bo the lubbocks wrasse, Charlie the angelfish & Mercury the ruby dragonet. These three fish have remained unaffected, even when velvet struck, so I'm secretly thankful that they are alright. 

 

3. Turban snails and urchins are fine. However, I did spot a dead asterina on my sandbed today:

 

20211028_094556.thumb.jpg.67bc50f50a7380f82e1d3a8d4f806856.jpg

 

And unfortunately, Patrick the starfish appears to be slowly disintegrating as well. 😔

 

20211028_094530.thumb.jpg.b149548832e634af83d9b85e95498106.jpg

 

Both critters were fine yesterday, prior to dosing. I have a hunch I *might lose all the microbrittles in my fuge as well. 😔

 

I'll try to see if I can catch a few of them and move them to the nano. I'm reluctant to move Patrick at this point because he is not doing well, and might disintegrate in my nanoreef, which in turn *might cause that tank to crash. 

 

So I have no choice but to let him be, and let my system ride this out. 

 

Another point of interest - I rescaped the tank a *bit yesterday when I was catching my shrimp. Mostly moved the main LR ledge up by a few inches so that the *cave underneath is larger and roomier for my foxface. 

 

I also had to readjust the position of the rock that previously had my yumas on it. And by a tiny miracle, I discovered that the super tiny chunk of rainbow yuma that I had left behind, has began to grow back: 😅

 

20211028_094508.thumb.jpg.80bb97ef68b77aa8369a0188262ba517.jpg

 

The shroom's reselience is quite fascinating. It, as well as the ugly brown palys that I have on this rock, remain unaffected. 

 

I'll do a headcount on the rest of the fish later. Hopefully everyone is okay. 👍

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So I prepared all the items and equipment I need for a WC - I'll only be doing a WC later in the evening because I need to head out to the hospital after lunch:

 

20211028_121031.thumb.jpg.f2c93d59f070dca832648157edc24b94.jpg

 

The main floss (dark green) I'm using this time will be different. It is thicker, washable and re-usable:

 

20211028_114820.thumb.jpg.44eabd0a1c680c586acf5b86bb9963ae.jpg

 

The lighter green floss is standard floss which is thinner and tears easily if left in the water for too long (more than a month) - this floss will be in the last compartment of the sump, near the motor pump. It will trap any debri that filters out of the fuge and prevent it from clogging the pump:

 

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Both flosses side by side:

 

20211028_114750.thumb.jpg.9a25270ad45ef45d6daac1bb6d71b08c.jpg

 

I finally managed to check up on all of the fish. Wrasses are fine and very active. Foxy the foxface has a few whitespots though. 😔

 

However, Poseidon looks much better. Goblin is a mess though. Lil' guy is riddled with spots and lumps, and is breathing hard:

 

20211028_121618.thumb.jpg.ad41361ce78dc965f26217ead708eae9.jpg

 

20211028_121604.thumb.jpg.153232c1ea7ac832b7668d697d42e0f3.jpg

 

If I can catch him somehow, I'll isolate him and QT him separately to do TTM + Prazi, with FW dips daily. Acriflavin baths too, if necessary. I need to go a bit slow on him though, on account for his age. 

 

I truly hope he pulls through. He's a great fish, and very peaceful. 

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Okay, so I believe Poseidon has Ich as well. Because of the thick slime coat that dragonets have, it manifests weirdly - like there are nodules under the slime coat as opposed to visible white spots:

 

20211028_125251.thumb.jpg.41c297ac5a8b8d591303fa515f8c986b.jpg

 

20211028_125312.thumb.jpg.ed4e9a6171db47e862e6730172c1408d.jpg

 

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20211028_125403.thumb.jpg.70197790e289f1775392848f60285974.jpg

 

His appettite has dropped a bit, but he is still eating. Will add garlic to his food to boost his immune system. His gill movements are slow and rhythmic. But he is not too active, and that concerns me. 

 

Will update more later. 

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seabass

It could be that the star's deterioration has something to do with treatments; but it seems to me that sand sifting stars usually don't do well long-term, unless in a much larger tank.  It's difficult to monitor their health and they usually appear alright up until they fall apart.  I believe that most of them ultimately run out of suitable food.  I can't remember when you got it, but I've been impressed that it has lasted as long as it did.

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1 hour ago, seabass said:

It could be that the star's deterioration has something to do with treatments; but it seems to me that sand sifting stars usually don't do well long-term, unless in a much larger tank.  It's difficult to monitor their health and they usually appear alright up until they fall apart.  I believe that most of them ultimately run out of suitable food.  I can't remember when you got it, but I've been impressed that it has lasted as long as it did.

According to my records, I've had it since 20th Feb 2021 - which puts at slightly more than ~8 months in this tank. Was genuinely hoping it would last a year at least, since it seems reasonably active. 

 

Starfish are gorgeous, but it's a shame that most of them can't live long in reeftanks (unless the tank is super large and has a very old, mature sandbed/LR). 😕

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Pellets soaked in garlic & FW for everyone today: 

 

20211028_155741.thumb.jpg.0541545d1c4742262f8ca4b9f1d730ea.jpg

 

Mixing up some salt in advance:

 

20211028_155805.thumb.jpg.6ae3babf2d995dc9a865f87c913cb60a.jpg

 

Trying to finish the one supposedly good bag of Aquaforest salt left, but it always, *always leaves behind some residue no matter how long I mix it. 

 

I'm resting my foot for now. Will slowly clean the sump, replace the floss, remove as much of the dirt as I can, toss out the 2 old bags of coral stones & re-fill the whole thing with SW later today. 👍

 

If I'm too tired by the end of it, I'll only clean up the equipment tomorrow. 👍

 

If I'm also strong enough tomorrow, then I plan on WCing at least 10G of the DT as well. The film algae on the glass doesn't perturb me too much, but the amount of dirt on the rocks do. 😕

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seabass

Wow, you are really fighting through this.  I wish you well.

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Snow_Phoenix

Took a very long time, but I did it! omgomgomg

 

20211028_201635.thumb.jpg.5c54b156b480298a7c24efdbf5bae6fd.jpg

 

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No matter how hard I tried though, there will always be a thin layer of crud in the final compartment because the fuge is filthy. ☹

 

The amount of sediment and dirt that I siphoned out was enormous though. I made 40G of SW throughout the day. Used 20G to *flush the sump (drain, refill, drain, refill etc etc.). 

 

The remaining 20G was used to finally fill up the sump itself. Unfortunately, when I turned the pump on, some dirt did get sucked up & pushed back into the DT. 😕

 

I am extremely tired though. My back & ankle are both painful - because I had to refill the sump the traditional way - using a bucket. 

 

I think I'll rest a few more days, then tackle cleaning up the DT. I left all the equipment outside - will clean it up tomorrow. 

 

It's almost 9pm and I can finally have dinner. 👍

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Third dose of peroxide done. 👍

 

Poseidon appears okay. He's resting on the sandbed and partially tucked in in the sand granules. Patrick the starfish is next to him. 👍

 

Tank's settling in for the night. 

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He looks much better:

 

20211028_221213.thumb.jpg.4a9102ac07301ab9137421d774ba25c4.jpg

 

20211028_221230.thumb.jpg.20db23d0ac8f6aa0341e14e5d1cc4cbc.jpg

 

Nodules in the slime coat appear to be absent. His breathing is slow and steady - no rapid gill movement, no spasms, flashing or jerking. 

 

I *think he can make a full recovery - I'm cautiously optimistic though. 

 

Looks like the large WC and full clean up of the sump helped in a way, but I can only gage the full impact of the WC by observing *all of the fish and remaining inverts tomorrow. 

 

I'll keep adding garlic to the food for the next few weeks to entice all the fish to eat as much as possible. I'll be cutting back on frozen helpings and mostly feeding pellets. If I have a chance to pick up a bottle or two of live pods from my store, I'll do it. 

 

Problem is, live pods aren't always readily available. I do have frozen pods though. So that will have to do for now. 👍

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Just completed my 4th dose of peroxide. 

 

Patrick the starfish appears okay (tentatively) : 

 

20211029_103631.thumb.jpg.feab4135fced3b690ff22b3472131f39.jpg

 

Goblin also appears to be more active and has less white spots, although this could simply be the Ich going through its life cycle:

 

20211029_103710.thumb.jpg.b2d6d3d336d91df3f62a3b0cf2770d19.jpg

 

One chunky asterina on the rocks. Was very actively moving over the surface of the rocks when I turned the lights on:

 

20211029_103710.thumb.jpg.b2d6d3d336d91df3f62a3b0cf2770d19.jpg

 

Poseidon is completely clear of any nodules and was quite active this morning. Mercury the ruby dragonet, however, appeared to be breathing slowly and remained stationary on the sandbed, so I am a bit concerned for him. 😕

 

Illaron the scooter was actively hunting for pods. Most of the other fish weren't awake yet because I had just turned the lights on when I took these pics. 

20211029_103650.jpg

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It looks like I have to replace the floss daily in this section over the next few days. 😕

 

20211029_103551.thumb.jpg.0b9e337441b67174a35e4dea934ceca1.jpg

 

The fuge doesn't look too great, especially after I threw out most of the GHA & cotton candy algae yesterday. It's almost barren: 😔

 

20211029_103531.thumb.jpg.4af3e4d38f47563de52255b2e0859386.jpg

 

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But the limpets are surprisingly still alive and anchored to the glass:

 

20211029_103444.thumb.jpg.0ced334d2c43fbd08beb1c542800ab56.jpg

 

Not much sign of any other microfauna. I hope they will eventually make a comeback & repopulate the fuge. 

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Staying in one spot, fins are clamped. Doesn't look too good. 😔

 

20211029_121629.thumb.jpg.49690e9a7a39749bbf6ba7dba057c7a9.jpg

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Managed to net him - he was so weak, that he didn't put up much of a fight. 😕

 

Gave him a 10 min. FW dip, because dragonets do *not handle dips well. Mercury went belly up at several points:

 

20211029_124302.thumb.jpg.0902592eba8c312ab260d6b85d0b7996.jpg

 

Immediately released him back into the DT after. His coloration is a bit stronger, but he is still very lethargic and unmoving. Gills are moving slowly, but looks sluggish to me. 

 

20211029_124227.thumb.jpg.ff7a80b4807368214451142d565bc40f.jpg

 

Truly hope he can pull through. 😔

 

I love my little dragons. They're difficult fish, but beautiful & rewarding fish to keep. 

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I took a closer look at Mercury - it appears to be a flare up of black ich, and this strain is prazi-resistant. 😕

 

I've tried dosing prazi before, to minimal effect. And I lost 4 out of 7 dragonets due to this strain. 😔

 

It appears that the velvet has triggered an outbreak of the two diseases that I have kept to manageable levels in this tank - Ich & Black Ich. 

 

So now the fish are fighting against 3 things at once (which I'm aware of, and I'm...tired. 😔)

 

I managed to get a close up of Poseidon for a few seconds. The nodules aren't completely absent like I first presumed - instead, they have simply lessened in number:

 

20211029_132111.thumb.jpg.3029326bf4736277a438fd4d95f7d1e5.jpg

 

He can swim better, but is mostly a recluse, and not scouring the rockwork for live pods. A very dangerous direction to head on to, because dragonets *need live pods to remain chunky. 

 

I'll keep up with the peroxide treatment for a month, then switch over to prazi-dosing. Unfortunately, both treatments *cannot be done simultaneously - I checked with Humblefish. 

 

My foot is very painful today because I overused it yesterday. My back is better, but my body is aching. 😕

 

If I was healthier, I'd quickly WC either 10G or 20G of the DT today, but it looks like I'll have to wait. 

 

I'll try to replace the light green floss in the sump though - the one near the motor pump. I think I'll temporarily switch over to using the cheap white floss that I have since I have to do daily replacements until most of the crud from the fuge is cleared out. 🤔

 

Will keep using my last bag of Aquaforest Reef Salt - I estimate I have around 2.5kg++ left. Once that has been depleted, I'll switch over to Fritz RPM (blue box). 

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I lost Mercury. :tears:

 

20211029_173521.thumb.jpg.ee04c151bed29738d1a9a5d136fd3329.jpg

 

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Judging by how things are currently going, I might most likely lose Poseidon, my mandy, & Goblin, my GCG as well. 

 

I feel very crushed and defeated. Depressed too. There are some days I genuinely wonder if I'm in the correct hobby at all. 😔

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seabass

That is so sad and devastating.  I lost a tank of fish before and it was crushing.  I'm not sure what to say.  All I can offer is that you can get past this and move forward if you wish.  I'm sorry for what you are going through.

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Xj reefing

I’m so sorry for your losses and I hope that you don’t end up loosing any more fish. I hope you get feel better soon. 

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Snow_Phoenix
54 minutes ago, seabass said:

That is so sad and devastating.  I lost a tank of fish before and it was crushing.  I'm not sure what to say.  All I can offer is that you can get past this and move forward if you wish.  I'm sorry for what you are going through.

 

I have experienced crashes before, and I was heartbroken when it happened. But this time I feel as if I could have done better - although tbh, from the readings I've done online recently, velvet is usually fatal at the final stages no matter how much you try to treat the fish. 😔

 

And even with peroxide treatment from experiences & data shared on Humblefish's forum, I noted that some % of fish will *not make it, although the fatality rate is significantly lessened if you treat the fish quickly, and in early stages of the disease. Some velvet strains take weeks - others take hours. 

 

I believe I drew the short straw on this one - mine kills quickly. A fish can look/behave perfectly fine a day earlier, then die within hours of showing visible symptoms. The simultaneous Ich & Black Ich outbreak is not helping either. 😔

 

I'll see how this pans out. If I lose all the fish, I'll take some time off the tank and let it sit while I make a choice - either keep trying to keep a FOWLR, or completely strip down the tank and restart it as a FW tank. Hopefully it won't come to that, but I'm no longer optimistic. 😕

 

25 minutes ago, Xj reefing said:

I’m so sorry for your losses and I hope that you don’t end up loosing any more fish. I hope you get feel better soon. 

I hope so too. 😔

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debbeach13

I am sorry for the losses. I sound like a broken record but I am more worried about you. Please don't over do it. You must rest that foot and take care of you.

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Snow_Phoenix
27 minutes ago, debbeach13 said:

I am sorry for the losses. I sound like a broken record but I am more worried about you. Please don't over do it. You must rest that foot and take care of you.

It's alright, Deb - you don't sound like a broken record to me. Because you *are right - I've been neglecting self-care in favor of constantly looking into the needs of my animals. 

 

Even my mum noticed this & brought it up today. 

 

I was in pain throughout the night. My ankle was screaming bloody murder. Even though I WCed & cleaned my sump in stages, I was still limping badly by the end of it. 

 

This - the tank issue, is completely out of my control though. It is a bit scary because until now, I'm not sure *how this got into my tank in the first place. I have to ride it out the hard way, I'm afraid. I'll keep up with the peroxide treatments, but I'm not sure how many more fish I'll lose before I can even complete the first 3 weeks of treatment. 

 

Any dragonet deaths are particularly hard because it took a lot of time and effort to get them onto prepared, and to keep them healthy everyday. It's exhausting, but I love this particular fish species, as well as blennies. 

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