Fish always die over night. Long read and need help.

[Tamberav]

A pic under whites would have been helpful...blues make it so hard to see anything. His face looks dark? I can't tell if his fins are intact.

 

Adding so many fish one after another could introduce something nasty like brooklynella.

 

I would probably just leave the tank without fish for 6 weeks then try from a different store.

[3s1k]

2 hours ago, Snow_Phoenix said:

Do all your fish die with mouths gaping open like the pic? Seems like a lack of oxygen issue.

I never noticed, I just took the picture for documenting purposes. What would cause a lack of oxygen? I have 2 spin streams agitating water and a IM Wavelink that ripples the water also.

 

First chambers have filter floss, 2nd chamber has the skimmer. Also, how would I check for oxygen levels?

[3s1k]

1 hour ago, Tamberav said:

A pic under whites would have been helpful...blues make it so hard to see anything. His face looks dark? I can't tell if his fins are intact.

 

Adding so many fish one after another could introduce something nasty like brooklynella.

 

I would probably just leave the tank without fish for 6 weeks then try from a different store.

His face was a little dark but his fins looked in tact. He didn't look like something got to him and try to eat him.

[Tamberav]

10 minutes ago, 3s1k said:

His face was a little dark but his fins looked in tact. He didn't look like something got to him and try to eat him.

I was more wondering about disease.. something fast killing without much symptoms.

[Recci]

Yeah I would try a different store and leave the tank fallow for at least 6 weeks. There is something in your tank killing the fish or all the store's fish are infected with something.

[3s1k]

6 hours ago, Recci said:

Yeah I would try a different store and leave the tank fallow for at least 6 weeks. There is something in your tank killing the fish or all the store's fish are infected with something.

I think the latter maybe the case. He was fine at the LFS and has been there a few weeks. I'll let the tank sit then. Whatever it is just seems to affect the fish and not corals.

[mcarroll]

dissilved oxygen would drop if you had a large crop of algae growing in bright light and the lights go out.  The algae start respiring along with the animals  instead of photosynthesizing.

 

 if the tank oxygen levels were already borderline for some reason such as being over stocked with fish, then this effect from algae could be significant. 

 

I don't see that many fish or that much algae to see this as a possible explanation.  Plus your flow/aeration seems good.

 

 

[mcarroll]

Next time, examine the dead fish to see if you can figure out why it died.  

 

There are youtubes and PDF guides out there that show how and what to look for.   (search for fish necropsy, for example)

 

An easy one is to use a magnifier at least as powerful as a jewelers loop to simply look at his gills.  This is tissue that many disease organisms target first.

[3s1k]

9 hours ago, mcarroll said:

dissilved oxygen would drop if you had a large crop of algae growing in bright light and the lights go out.  The algae start respiring along with the animals  instead of photosynthesizing.

 

 if the tank oxygen levels were already borderline for some reason such as being over stocked with fish, then this effect from algae could be significant. 

 

I don't see that many fish or that much algae to see this as a possible explanation.  Plus your flow/aeration seems good.

 

 

Here's picture of the tank when I got home the day the fish died. I have no other fish besides the that one. There's a small cleanup crew of 6 different snails,  the Duncan and GSP coral.

 

@mcarroll, I will do some more research on that. I definitely want to solve this problem.

[Coinee]

3 minutes ago, 3s1k said:

Here's picture of the tank when I got home the day the fish died. I have no other fish besides the that one. There's a small cleanup crew of 6 different snails,  the Duncan and GSP coral.

 

@mcarroll, I will do some more research on that. I definitely want to solve this problem.

Is it possible the fish or snail may be disturbing the sand and releasing an ammonia pocket that is killing your fish in the night? Then the ammonia dissipated by the time you tested?

I'll admit it seems unlikely since it happened to all the fish but this is quite a mystery we have here. 

[3s1k]

I wouldn't rule anything out at this point. I did siphon the sand last weekend which was a few days before I got the fish.

[3s1k]

Ugh one thing after another. I was doing some maintenance and found a dead Turbo Snail. I lifted his shell and his disk fell out and then his body fell out and went all over the place.

 

Maybe that's what killed the fish. It seemed pretty, maybe just coincidence. Still everything in the stand seems unaffected my this.

 

[Coinee]

8 minutes ago, 3s1k said:

Ugh one thing after another. I was doing some maintenance and found a dead Turbo Snail. I lifted his shell and his disk fell out and then his body fell out and went all over the place.

 

Maybe that's what killed the fish. It seemed pretty, maybe just coincidence. Still everything in the stand seems unaffected my this.

 

That may have caused pockets in the sand that fish/snails may have gotten into and caused the fish to die, possibly. Put the livestock you have in another tank and try to stir and check the sandbed for any other surprises you might have. Then test your params afterwards and do a water-change accordingly. 

[3s1k]

I always try to siphon some of the sand up when I do water changes. I need some sort of sand sifting critter. 

 

I'll do a water change and check params.

[brianinak]

Nice to find a fellow Alaskan on the forum.  Which Petco do you like?

 

Not sure if this relevant or not, but to add to the discussion about Oxygen in the tank.  Although you have suffienct surface agitation, I would consider the level of co2 in your home.  Up here we keep our houses pretty closed up during the winter and newer homes have very high energy rating that can result in more co2 than ideal.  In addition, your tank is in the basement, Co2 is heavier than oxygen I believe.  In a air tight home with windows closed, family breathing out co2, pets, and in tank in basement, you may have high co2 in home, so surface agitation or not may not oxygenating your water.  Although your PH seems right on and better than mine.  Wood heat by chance?

 

Just some thoughts. 

[3s1k]

I live near the Southside petco but nobody is every around to help. The North side Petco remodeled they're aquarium section and it looks great but they're still cycling the tanks. If I go to Petco I usually get cleanup crews or occasion coral.  I usually go to AK corals though, they're great there.

 

Interesting thought, we had the crawl space reinsulated a year ago which helped seal the house more. We have forced air heating and a gas fireplace on the 2nd floor. My fish tank is on the perimeter wall on the first floor in a living room.

[mcarroll]

Good idea!!

 

A pH test in combination with an alk test will give you data that you can use to compute CO2 levels in the house. 

[mcarroll]

One example pH/Alk chart:

(use a calculator to convert meq/L to dKH or ppm)

[jservedio]

On 1/18/2019 at 9:51 PM, 3s1k said:

I was planning on getting an RODI unit but my water pressure is only 45psi. The cost of the RODI unit and pump to increase pressure was beyond my budget. So, I top off with tap and get 6 gallons for water changes every so often.

45psi isn't optimal, but it'll work fine in an RODI machine - you will just get more waste water. Since you will have more water running over the membrane just get a backflush valve (they are cheap) and run it every so often.

 

I lived briefly in a 3rd floor apartment that had 35-40psi and was able to get water out of my RODI machine - it took much longer than it would have with 70psi and used more water than it needed to, but it worked.

[3s1k]

@jservedio I just setup the RODI system and your right about the waste water. It is much much more than the clean water that comes out.

 

TDS in - 100-105ppm

TDS out - 1ppm

 

Just an update for everyone. Corals still look good and invertebrates as well. My LFS is more involved and offer a few more fish to get it figured it out.

 

I'm getting a 2nd multimeter next week to verify any stray voltage.

 

Then setting up a temp tank to test my rocks/water with fish vs LFS rocks/water with a fish.

[3s1k]

Update - Blue Damsel I got from Petco is still alive after adding him on 1/28. Only change since them is I top off with RODI water now. I'm also doing 10% water changes instead of 20$ a week. So far so good, keep everyone posted.

 

Note - These stupid turbo snails can't right themselves when they fall. I'm worried one will fall and die and I won't see it.

[Newstead]

Glad to hear the damsel is still alive - a good sign!

 

I have that same fear about my astreas. I count them at least once a day to make sure no one has died.

[Clown79]

Your cuc will clean up the snail if it dies.

 

Turbo snails can right themselves, astreas can't.

[mtnbikeracer]

Good to hear that the damsel is doing well.

[3s1k]

Update - Blue Damsel still alive and a lot more active and comes up when I get close to the tank. I'm very happy to see that he's still alive after all this.

 

I hope whatever it was it has passed or I got one badass Damsel😎