2 Gallon Pico Reef Jar - Snail Kingdom 🐌

[NoOneLikesADryTang]

On 10/14/2020 at 3:20 AM, Ratvan said:

so about 3 weeks MONTHS until the annual update then?

There - I fixed it for you. 

 

You're up now, CM! 

[waldoz]

2nd that!

 

[Christopher Marks]

Well deserved ribbings all around! 😅

 

So...

 

The pico reef jar is alive! It has endured a great deal of neglect on my part, for which I am not proud, but I am thankful I decided to keep things simple. The zoanthids don’t seem to mind the lack of water changes too much, but the LPS would be happier with a refresh, the acans called it quits.

 

The biggest issue has been battling hair and bubble algae. It can mostly be tackled with manual cleanup, and I had hoped it would exhaust its fuel source over time. I reduced the lighting intensity last May, and it indeed started to slow down over time.

 

 

 

I took these photos of the cleanup routine, this was after a particularly long stretch of growth. I think it’s important to show the ups and the downs of reef keeping. I am optimistic that I can turn the course of the tank around, with its basic needs and inhabitants, if I just give it more regular support. I have been considering moving towards chemical warfare on the algae, chemiclean or something. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Present day the tank needs another full water change and a good scrub again. Bubble algae has taken root as well, a hitchhiker from a frag plug I failed to eradicate. A new cleanup crew would also be good, the few snails I had haven’t endured, and never made a dent in the algae before I let it get out of hand.

 

I hope to refresh the whole tank in the coming weeks. I haven’t been to my LFS since the lockdown last year, it will be nice to get back on track again soon. I will scrub and siphon as much algae as possible, and probably remove some of the surface sand bed as well.

 

I wish I had something more spectacular to show after all this time, but in this hobby you only get out what you put in. Hopefully the maturity of the system can work in my favor moving forward. I’ll share more once the refresh is complete.

[Firefish15]

I appreciate the candid photos! It’s always tempting (for me anyways) to always show photos the day after a water change. Working on more accurately documenting things.

[debbeach13]

From what I can see the zoa.'s and remaining coral look pretty good. Looking at the before clean up pictures I was expecting much worst. 

[seabass]

I might temporarily take out the rock, stir up the sand real good, pour out the dirty water, add clean water and your rock.

 

I agree with Deb, I was a little scared after seeing the first three pics; but it cleaned up pretty well.  It still has lots of potential.

[A.m.P]

Could try drip dosing peroxide.

[waldoz]

2 hours ago, A.m.P said:

Could try drip dosing peroxide.

And tooth brush 😁

[Christopher Marks]

20 hours ago, debbeach13 said:

From what I can see the zoa.'s and remaining coral look pretty good. Looking at the before clean up pictures I was expecting much worst. 

I have gotten off easy, despite my neglect. The zoanthids truly are quite durable. The only ones I've lost are where bubble algae got root and covered them over through multiplying. The first bubble algae came in on a frag plug well over a year ago, I thought I had gotten it all during a water change, but no such luck. An emerald crab might do the trick, but I'm curious about other approaches.

 

16 hours ago, seabass said:

I might temporarily take out the rock, stir up the sand real good, pour out the dirty water, add clean water and your rock.

 

I agree with Deb, I was a little scared after seeing the first three pics; but it cleaned up pretty well.  It still has lots of potential.

Full rock removal would be ideal, perhaps I'll go all in on the next clean up. Pretty sure my peppermint shrimp is still in there too, I'll know for sure then.

 

16 hours ago, A.m.P said:

Could try drip dosing peroxide.

I'll have to research this some more. Is there a specific algae type or nutrient that hydrogen peroxide dosing targets?

[A.m.P]

1 hour ago, Christopher Marks said:

I'll have to research this some more. Is there a specific algae type or nutrient that hydrogen peroxide dosing targets?

Simple structured algae and dissolved organics mostly take a hit, anything without the ability to keep the h202 from doing its' oxidation-thing.
Fair warning, it'll tick your zoas off lol, might cause a small bacterial bloom, but some crazy germans swore by it via oxidators for decades and spot-treating with peroxide works wonders on anything which isn't a complex macro. 

I honestly use H202 as part of my dip nowadays in a 1-5 ratio, doesn't really hurt corals, but stuns just about everything else off them.

[ReefSmart]

Glad to see its still going!! Nothing a good maintenance routine cant take care of! Looking forward to seeing the reboot 😄

[Christopher Marks]

Well, it took a literally 12 months to happen, but the pico reef jar finally got its water changed! The glowing blue-green jar in my living room is now clear!

 

The hair algae seems to have finally run its course and exhausted its fuel source, I didn’t need to remove any from the tank. I can still see a few short strands left rooted in the rock, hopefully my next cleanup crew can deal with it.

 

The main nuisance left is a brutal outbreak of bubble algae, which has snuffed out two of my zoanthid colonies - both my red ones. They were too stubborn to remove during this water change, but I think I’ll get more aggressive before the next water change. Physical removal seems key. I think they’re mostly still clumped around the frag plugs they rode in on, perhaps I can remove most of it in one go if I aim for the plug.

 

 

Lastly, the soft clumpy/powdery green-blue algae or cyano that likes to cover the glass remains an issue. You can see it on the glass in the before photo above. I feel like this is the same stuff that’s been a problem for me since the start. Dunno if it’s a lack of biodiversity, lack or nitrates, or a phosphate issue. Sometimes I wonder if this is the fate of all tanks that start with dry rock. I know I should test the water and try to quantify what’s happening. It’s super easy to brush off the glass and siphon out during a water change. The tank is crystal clear now, but it will very slowly return. What you see in the pre-cleaning photo above is many months of accumulation, dividends of my procrastination. Perhaps it will finally fade out with better maintenance?

 

In the short term, I think I’d like to get a cleanup crew going again. There are a few super tiny baby snails still cruising the tank, but all the larger snails died well over 6 months ago. The peppermint shrimp I had in there hasn’t shown itself in a few months, so I’m unsure if it’s still alive. It’s historically great at hiding. All aiptasia anemones have been eradicated though. I haven’t introduced any crabs yet, but I’m kind of tempted to get a hermit or two for some interest. New snails are my first priory though, particularly a nassarius to stir the sand bed again. 

 

The main lesson is, I need to keep up with water changes! I have 2.5 gallons of saltwater water left for the next one. Somebody remind me, ok? 🤪

 

More photos soon, post cleanup!

[debbeach13]

Now that it is cleaned up you should post a picture.

[seabass]

16 minutes ago, Christopher Marks said:

I have 2.5 gallons of saltwater water left for the next one.

Make sure that you put a cap on that water, or it will never last the 12 months until you do your next water change.

[Christopher Marks]

I am debating running a Chemi Pure Blue nano pouch in the jar, with this little air bubble filter I bought years ago. I can attach it to my air line bubbler to circulate water through the media.

 

 

Of course I haven’t tested for phosphate or nitrate, so this may be ill advised, and why I haven’t tried it yet. My worry is the media could strip phosphates from the water entirely, and create and different problem. If I do try it, I would only keep it in the jar for 24hrs or less.

 

Anyone have an opinion on this?

[Christopher Marks]

5 minutes ago, seabass said:

Make sure that you put a cap on that water, or it will never last the 12 months until you do your next water change.

😂

 

I still had 2 gallons of Catalina filtered seawater on hand from the last round, and I was surprised/not surprised to find it growing clumps of algae! It only happened after I moved the jug near a window recently. 

[NoOneLikesADryTang]

1 hour ago, Christopher Marks said:

In the short term, I think I’d like to get a cleanup crew going again.

Come on out to Mesa - we can pluck out any clean up crew you want out of our 80 gallon. I've got a rack full of frags too, that the tank keeper would love nothing more than for me to give away to get that rack out of the tank.

 

Seriously - we could get you a solid clean up crew, and pops of color for your jar. Hell, the tank keeper would probably even fill your water jug, for your annual 2021 water change. 😆

[waldoz]

If our other tank comes down for some reason I will do one of these.   All the little left overs are secretly for this project. 😛

[Christopher Marks]

45 minutes ago, NoOneLikesADryTang said:

Come on out to Mesa - we can pluck out any clean up crew you want out of our 80 gallon. I've got a rack full of frags too, that the tank keeper would love nothing more than for me to give away to get that rack out of the tank.

 

Seriously - we could get you a solid clean up crew, and pops of color for your jar. Hell, the tank keeper would probably even fill your water jug, for your annual 2021 water change. 😆

That's very generous of you, I might take you up on that sometime soon! Have some snails to spare?

 

I haven't added any frags to this pico reef since I acquired a bunch of frags at a 2019 Black Friday sale at Ocean Floor in Phoenix. It will be nice to make some additions again, once I get things back on track, and there's nothing cooler than starting another colony with a frag from a local reef keeper! 

 

I've been observing the tank this morning with the new clear view, and I am just perpetually amazed by this little 2 gallon ecosystem. A full 12 months without a proper water change, with high salinity swings, cold top-off water, and hair algae removal only. I lost my acans early on, but all the other corals (zoanthids, favia, blastommusa, and maze brain) have held on. They have not thrived, by any stretch of the imagination, but they've endured and some have even grown a little. Copepods and amphipods are still abundant. The resiliency of all this life!

 

I chose to keep a pico reef jar for its durability, and limited my livestock to invertebrates only, knowing my inclinations towards procrastinating maintenance. Pest algae has been a struggle, and I foolishly thought I could avoid introducing hitchhikers like bubble algae, but these are things every hobbyist must face eventually. Early intervention is key, and I let it go. As the hair algae and green cyano got out of hand, despite my early attempts to water-change my way out of it, I hoped that it might run its course and eventually exhaust its fuel source, if perhaps the 'Real Reef Rock' was leaching phosphates, or something. In the end I have no idea, because I never tested for phosphates to see, but I do think this could be the light at the end of the hair algae tunnel.

 

I am reminded how much we can speculate about what's going on with a tank, based on experiences we've seen or read about, but it's all just a best guess if we don't test and quantify. While I like to 'feel things out,' I know it's not the best approach to reef keeping whatsoever. That being said, this is why a reef jar appealed to me, that one can find some success despite all this, as long as things stay simple. So, here I am, pushing the boundaries of slacker reef keeping.

[NoOneLikesADryTang]

57 minutes ago, Christopher Marks said:

That's very generous of you, I might take you up on that sometime soon! Have some snails to spare?

 

We've got lots- we always kept plenty in the 80 gallon, so we could put them in the mantis and gorilla crab tanks, as needed (they never lasted long). Sadly, they both passed away a couple months ago, but we still have plenty of cleanup crew. The tank keepers picky polyclad will never go through snails as quickly as they reproduce. We might even be able to find some tiny (I mean tiny!) hermits. LE Corals had a sale on hermits about a month ago, and they were the smallest hermits I'd ever seen, but I think we picked up a dozen or so of them. If we can find some, you're welcome to those as well. 

[vlangel]

CM, I also would love to see a pic now that the jar is clear!

[Christopher Marks]

I decided to visit another LFS today, just to get out of the house, and maybe buy some pods or phytoplankton for the tank. I hadn’t been to this one in over a year. It was peaceful taking it all in. It proved to be an expensive trip though, as someone backed into my car while I was there! 🙃

 

As I’ve been reading more about getting rid of nuisance algae, increasing biodiversity seems to be a common solution. I thought a little dose of phytoplankton and rotifers might help give the pico reef ecosystem a little boost. The local store cultures their own, so I came home with two little bags, way way more than I can possibly use.

 

 

I dosed 0.75ml of each into the tank and turned the air pump off for a bit. The corals have all responded positively, the blue maze brain coral frag up front immediately put its feeder tentacles out. I hesitate to add any more, just to be safe. Open to suggestions, I may have already gone overboard. 
 

 

I am reminded how difficult this tank is to photograph with the optical distortion of the jar. It’s best experienced in person. Maybe I can figure out a video sometime.

 

 

That’s coralline algae on the upper glass of the jar, I need to get a razor blade for it. 

 

Some of the zoanthid colonies with a bristle worm creeping in. 

[Christopher Marks]

I forgot to mention, I increased the air flow on the bubbler with a new air pump. This new pump has a lithium ion battery backup, it will keep running for 17hrs if the power ever goes out. This should improve circulation in the jar, and provide some peace of mind during summer monsoon storms.

 

I still have to clear the air line outlet inside the tank of salt creep every 3 months or so, or the airflow slowly becomes restricted. Turning the air pump off for a few minutes lets some water in to dissolve most of it, buying some extra time between deep cleans. Salt creep buildup on the jar rim and light lens happens as well, but it’s a minor nuisance. A little circulation pump would be so quiet, but this air line adds no heat to the water, and I figure the bubbles can’t hurt either. 

[seabass]

12 hours ago, Christopher Marks said:

Open to suggestions, I may have already gone overboard. 

Rotifer water is usually pretty dirty.  I culture them for when I might eventually get around to raising clownfish fry.  I'm really not sure why I don't dose them into my tanks more often; but when I do, I use a 53 um plankton sieve to strain the rotifers out of the water first.

 

I do love to dose phyto though.  To be honest, I'm sure that I over do it, as I have dosed more than a quart (around 24 ml per gallon) of phyto into my 40 gallon tank on several occasions.  But I usually hesitate to recommend doing what I do.  Actually, most of my phyto goes down the drain, as I make two to three gallons a week.

 

Culturing each of them requires weekly maintenance (about 15 minutes a week), but it couldn't be much easier.  Since I can't purchase either of them locally, I have to get them online, and shipping makes regular dosing too expensive (except for use as starter cultures).  Plus, clownfish fry need so many rotifers, that there is really no other way to have enough, except to culture your own.

 

Since you already have pods in your tank, regular dosing of small amounts of phyto should help support your pod populations.  Some people suggest that it's the pods (and their larvae) versus the actual phyto that's helpful; but I like to think that the phyto itself is providing some direct benefit.  I suppose the nutrients are doing some good, even if most of the corals aren't consuming the phyto directly.

 

I don't really know what an appropriate dose of phyto might be; maybe start with a couple of drops per gallon and work up to 1 ml per gallon a few of times a week.  You should refrigerate your phyto to maintain it longer.  But every day it's refrigerated, it gets a little less nutritious.  Still, it should be good for a couple of weeks in the fridge (gently shake it occasionally).

 

I'm not really sure about storing the rotifers in the fridge, as I wonder how long they would survive.  Can you see them moving, especially towards a light?  I'd almost think that straining and freezing them might be a better way to maintain them as food; however, you might be surprised about how small the total mass of rotifers you can collect from a bag like you purchased.  But most fish stores sell frozen rotifers as fish and coral food (although dry coral foods might be easier in the long run).

 

You can send me a message, ask me here, or tag me in another thread if you want any suggestions as far as culturing either.  I think maybe someday I'll try culturing some other pods too. 🤔

 

It's impressive how resilient our tanks can be.  Your low maintenance approach might actually have some benefits.  I feel that much of what we do, to try to make our tanks pretty, can set them back in ways (pretty and healthy aren't always the same).  But it is nice when things are looking good.  I hope that the maturity that your tank has achieved helps make your jar flourish going forward.

[Christopher Marks]

Thanks for the tips @seabass! I was actually reading your phytoplankton culturing article again last night. 

I don’t think I have the attention to culture my own, but an occasional LFS visit isn’t so bad (assuming no one backs into my car again, dealing with insurance this morning 😒). Providing food to the base life in the reef seems like a good move, as long as it’s not enough to foul the water.

 

I’ll keep the phytoplankton in the fridge and maybe dose one or two more times in the coming days. The rotifer culture might only last 24hrs max, the LFS thought, because of their high metabolism. It was an inexpensive curiosity! Glad I didn’t overdo it. 

 

I saw some beautiful red Tigger Pods from Ocean Nutrition at the store, those would be a cool pod to introduce to the pico reef. Such a bold color! A whole bottle seemed excessive though, for my tiny tank. I may try a diverse order from Pod Your Reef instead. I would imagine that most pods introduced could thrive and remain breeding in the pico reef, since there are few predators.