The NPS garden; my NPS coral/macroalgae tank (with pictures!)

[Subsea]

30 minutes ago, Jeff Hood said:

Cool. Thanks for the info.  I’ve got a biology degree but it’s been decaids and haven’t really thought this stuff through in a while but what You said was my gut feeling. I’ve always said I wanted two refugiums but now I want them for different reasons than before.  I’m also helping a friend build a 800 gallon office reef and we both love your ideas.  

   Thanks again for your time and info. 

 

Jeff, 

you are very welcome.   On a project of that size, start up a discussion thread, I would be tickled pink to get involved with the discussion.   My marine engineering degree from 1974 introduced the chemistry but I read research papers on this subject matter.  The more I learn, the more I realize how complex biochemistry is.  

[AlmightyJoshaeus]

This sun coral is going to be SUPER easy...it has opened already and the tank lights aren't even out!

 

 

And, as promised, here is a full tank shot:

 

 

 

 

 

[Jeff Hood]

12 minutes ago, Subsea said:

 

Jeff, 

you are very welcome.   On a project of that size, start up a discussion thread, I would be tickled pink to get involved with the discussion.   My marine engineering degree from 1974 introduced the chemistry but I read research papers on this subject matter.  The more I learn, the more I realize how complex biochemistry is.  

I’ll see if the owner is willing to start one here. He’s a big Internet forum guy and loves DIY so I bet he will.  If not I am willing to be the middle man and start it.  I ran a pretty successful, 600 gallon system and used your principals with out really knowing it.  It ran perfect for 3 years and died because of an air conditioner failure.  Looking forward to doing it again with someone else’s money 😂

[Subsea]

16 minutes ago, AlmightyJoshaeus said:

This sun coral is going to be SUPER easy...it has opened already and the tank lights aren't even out!

 

 

And, as promised, here is a full tank shot:

 

 

 

 

 

I love the red.  I want one.

[Cannedfish]

Are you dipping?

[AlmightyJoshaeus]

Admittedly no...why? Parasites?

[12scanlon]

14 minutes ago, AlmightyJoshaeus said:

Admittedly no...why? Parasites?

Parasites/Bad hitchhikers stuff like that...  always dip.

[Subsea]

https://www.algaebarn.com/blog/corals/keeping-and-feeding-the-sun-corals/

 

[These are very hungry animals that (by many reports) can be “trained” to open for midday feedings when prompted by heavy spot-feeding. And indeed, spot-feeding may provide them with a substantial amount of sustenance (and be a lot of fun for the keeper). And they do seem to be able to capture and even ingest rather large amounts of food in short time. Nevertheless, like so many non-photosynthetic (NPS) corals, sun corals should be allowed to feed continuously as they are in their natural environment. Exclusively pulse feeding them may tax their digestive systems as well as be inefficient metabolically. Thus, the constant availability of a nutritious live food source will do much to maximize their health and reproductive rates.

The easiest way to accomplish this is to establish a large, stable population of zooplankton within the aquarium system itself. The harpacticoid copepod Tigriopus californicus (e.g. Tig Pods) can serve this purpose well. These hardy, highly productive copepods adapt easily to ordinary marine aquarium conditions. Reaching a length of as much as three millimeters, it is a very large copepod species and is thus quite suitable for sun corals, which prefer a rather big bite size. Tig Pods, which are benthic as adults, may be ensnared as they crawl onto the coral; they also have a habit of skipping into the water column and may jump right into the coral’s stinging tentacles. Rich in astaxanthin, Tig Pods are an excellent source of the biopigments needed to maintain the coral’s vibrant orange coloration. Occasional offerings of high-quality Artemia (i.e. brine shrimp) nauplii can help to boost growth rates. If pod predation intensifies as the sun coral colony grows larger and larger, the standing pod population can be replenished simply by adding a new bag of Tig Pods from time to time. Maintaining high pod densities in this way will do much to keep to the sun coral (and likely many of its tankmates) happy and growing vigorously. What’s more, these pods scavenge heavily on detritus and undesirable algae throughout the tank, and so will be an important part of the aquarium clean-up crew.]

 

After reading the above, I suggest you remove your carnivore fish from this tank, to allow pods to proliferate for 60 days.  In that manner, your display tank becomes a zooplankton refugium that feeds SUN Coral.  Once pods are well established, get an Algae Blennie for your fish.

 

 

[Tamberav]

Algaebarn just trying to sell pods... ha! Neat idea though to farm pods for em. 

[AlmightyJoshaeus]

Fed the sun coral tonight 🙂 Used the seachem phyto/zooplankton mix to convince the polyps to come out, and then fed most of them frozen food (some of them were not open yet). Side note...have any live phytoplankton brands to recommend for feeding the NPS corals?

[Subsea]

41 minutes ago, Tamberav said:

Algaebarn just trying to sell pods... ha! Neat idea though to farm pods for em. 

 

Capitalism works.  However, the point was to turn display tank into a zooplankton reactor with NPS as the center piece of display.

[Subsea]

19 minutes ago, AlmightyJoshaeus said:

Fed the sun coral tonight 🙂 Used the seachem phyto/zooplankton mix to convince the polyps to come out, and then fed most of them frozen food (some of them were not open yet). Side note...have any live phytoplankton brands to recommend for feeding the NPS corals?

Did you read the blog about feeding Sun Coral the same as an LPS.  All coral do not eat the same size food.  I am not an expert on this coral, however, I doubt it will thrive on phytoplankton.  Feed phytoplankton to your pods and let them feed your Sun Coral.

[AlmightyJoshaeus]

1 minute ago, Subsea said:

Did you read the blog about feeding Sun Coral the same as an LPS.  All coral do not eat the same size food.  I am not an expert on this coral, however, I doubt it will thrive on phytoplankton.  Feed phytoplankton to your pods and let them feed your Sun Coral.

I know they don't eat phyto, but most smaller polyped NPS corals do...hence why I ask. I am feeding frozen foods and eventually reef roids to the sun corals, and reef roids and phyto to smaller polyped NPS corals like gorgonians. Plus any copepods the phyto produces.

[Subsea]

With respect to live phytoplankton culture, brands don’t much matter, fertilizer is more important.  Florida Aqua Farm pioneered F2 formula for phytoplankton 30 years ago.   

 

http://floridaaquafarms.com/product-category/store/live-cultures/

You can get everything here.

 

The chemical composition of micro algae (phytoplankton)  is 116:16:1  of carbon/nitrogen/phosphorus.  This relationship is called the Redfield Ratio.

 

The chemical composition of macro algae is 560:30:1.  

[Lula_Mae]

4 hours ago, AlmightyJoshaeus said:

Fed the sun coral tonight 🙂 Used the seachem phyto/zooplankton mix to convince the polyps to come out, and then fed most of them frozen food (some of them were not open yet). Side note...have any live phytoplankton brands to recommend for feeding the NPS corals?

 I've gotten live phyto from Algae Barn and Mike's Phyto and had no issue with either. 

[Lula_Mae]

13 hours ago, banasophia said:

Thanks for that lead! They have all kinds of gorgeous macros posted on their site! I especially like the plating ones. I love plating corals like monti caps, but in my highly fed tank, they are a no go, so I think plating sponges or macros are a great idea. 🙂

 They do have some gorgeous macros. Some unfortunately have not been in stock in a very long time but others are restocked pretty regularly. 

13 hours ago, Subsea said:

I also like the growth form of Pandina.  

 

@Lula_Mae  

Have you purchased Blue Scroll from lareef.  Their footnote said they supplied small cuttings.  That is not reassuring to me, unless I knew it was not recently cut and that it had started to regrow.

I have purchased it a couple of times. The clippings are pretty generous for the price point. Some of their macros come banded to frag plugs. The blue scroll has always been loose. Usually it's 1-2 plates/scrolls/leaves/whatever the proper name for them is, about 2-3 inches. It's not a puny half inch clipping like some vendors. 

 

In my experience, it needs high light to bring out the blue sheen. Otherwise it'll be a brown scrolling algae. When it first appeared in someone's tank on Nano-Reef years ago, it actually grew on someone's powerhead. So it likes flow. 

[yoshii]

Following along 🙂 It's good to plan, even if those plans end up changing a lot!

 

Padina usually like med-high light, but as Subsea said it's also a slow grower. That's not a problem for you since it's just for looks. If you ever get the blue scroll though, just a heads up it needs intense lighting to get that blue sheen (which sounds like something you don't want for your NPS).

 

Live-plants.com (Gulf Coast Ecosystems) is still my favorite place to buy macros. I think they just moved or renovated their facility, but they usually have a good amount of macro in stock even during the off season.

 

I may have missed it, but how many gallons is the tank?

[Subsea]

4 hours ago, yoshii said:

Following along 🙂 It's good to plan, even if those plans end up changing a lot!

 

Padina usually like med-high light, but as Subsea said it's also a slow grower. That's not a problem for you since it's just for looks. If you ever get the blue scroll though, just a heads up it needs intense lighting to get that blue sheen (which sounds like something you don't want for your NPS).

 

Live-plants.com (Gulf Coast Ecosystems) is still my favorite place to buy macros. I think they just moved or renovated their facility, but they usually have a good amount of macro in stock even during the off season.

 

I may have missed it, but how many gallons is the tank?

@yoshii

I remember that first picture of blue scroll.  At the time, I thought the colors were computer enhanced.   Speaking about enhanced, how is academia coming along for you.  Last I remember, you were in a graduate/doctorate program in Southern  California.  

 

Soon enough, you will have more degrees than a thermometer.  Good fortune on your journey.

[AlmightyJoshaeus]

5 hours ago, yoshii said:

Following along 🙂 It's good to plan, even if those plans end up changing a lot!

 

Padina usually like med-high light, but as Subsea said it's also a slow grower. That's not a problem for you since it's just for looks. If you ever get the blue scroll though, just a heads up it needs intense lighting to get that blue sheen (which sounds like something you don't want for your NPS).

 

Live-plants.com (Gulf Coast Ecosystems) is still my favorite place to buy macros. I think they just moved or renovated their facility, but they usually have a good amount of macro in stock even during the off season.

 

I may have missed it, but how many gallons is the tank?

The tank is a 10 gallon. It will also have a 2.6 gallon refugium for copepods and sponges. The tank will be well lit, but any light sensitive corals will be tucked away in caves...only light tolerant NPS corals will be out in the open. The padina is at the top of the tank so it can get high light.

 

I have ordered from gulf coast ecosystems before...good company. Very generous with how much macro they send. I will actually be getting my NPS gorgonians form them.

[AlmightyJoshaeus]

6 hours ago, Lula_Mae said:

 I've gotten live phyto from Algae Barn and Mike's Phyto and had no issue with either. 

How long does live micro typically last in the fridge? I've found one brand stocked with algae designed to last 5 months (this was a fish breeding facility,  coincidentally...they tested it) but not sure about the others.

[AlmightyJoshaeus]

...AND the scroll algae is falling apart 😞 leaves keep flying off of it in the current.

[Subsea]

Shipping stress is a big deal.  

 

Macro has great regenative properties.  I have had live rock for several years that all of a sudden grew ornamental macro.  

[AlmightyJoshaeus]

1 minute ago, Subsea said:

Shipping stress is a big deal.  Macro has great regenative properties.  I have had live rock for several years that all of a sudden grew ornamental macro.  

Oh...good. Hope it recovers then.

[Subsea]

Consider this as nutrient enrichment.  Amino acids are the building blocks for everything that grows.  Amino acids are produced by bacteria breaking down proteins.  Their are more than 20 different amino acids of which 2/3 are derived from animal proteins.  The remainder of amino acids are derived from algae protein.  

 

Your tank is in the process to mature into a living breathing ecosystem that feeds itself.

[Lula_Mae]

1 hour ago, AlmightyJoshaeus said:

...AND the scroll algae is falling apart 😞 leaves keep flying off of it in the current.

 You could try moving it to a lower flow area for a few days so it can attach to a piece of rubble or something. Once attached, it can be moved into higher light.