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Fish keep dying? Mystery...


Rathje70

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4 hours ago, Clown79 said:

That is what I mentioned before regarding parasites being a cause and that keeping the tank fallow for 8 weeks would prevent any more fish death.

 

If 1 of the original fish that died had a parasite, every other fish added after would contract it and die.

 

You mention being away often, in a day or 2 you may have missed the visual signs of the parasite on the fish.

 

 

 

 

4 hours ago, Clown79 said:

That is what I mentioned before regarding parasites being a cause and that keeping the tank fallow for 8 weeks would prevent any more fish death.

 

If 1 of the original fish that died had a parasite, every other fish added after would contract it and die.

 

You mention being away often, in a day or 2 you may have missed the visual signs of the parasite on the fish.

 

 

 

10-4 - that could be quite possible! Leaving it fallow for 8 weeks it is.......is it okay to continue adding corals in that period?

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34 minutes ago, Rathje70 said:

is it okay to continue adding corals in that period?

Yes.  While it's possible that cysts could be on the frags from tanks with fish, it's no more likely during this period than at any other time.  The parasite can only feed on fish (no inverts), so you can use this time to let your tank mature, get a decent cleanup crew, and even add a few corals.

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10 hours ago, markalot said:

Get some marine flake food and feed heavily.  If the fish is still eating it actually stands a good chance at survival.  Ich will be in your tank forever, as it's in both of mine, but fish can and will survive and eventually show no symptoms.    If you go fallow you can eliminate it, supposedly, but there are a growing number of stories about ich free tanks (it's Marine Cryptosomething actually but Ich is what more are familiar with) that suddenly get ich when a stressful event happens.

 

This ^^^^. The key is getting the fish to settle in, once they are happy and healthy the ich isn't an issue.  I suspect most tanks have ich and we just don't realize it because it doesn't manifest in an outbreak.  

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My personal experience: I lost a whole 40 gallon tank of fish due to a new fish that had Ich.  I believed similar posts and I even tried a few "reef safe remedies".  All the existing fish were well fed and otherwise healthy (and the tank wasn't experiencing any other problems at the time).  Now I always recommend treatment for an outbreak.  That said, it's not like I don't believe people like markalot; it seems to work out for some people.

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35 minutes ago, seabass said:

My personal experience: I lost a whole 40 gallon tank of fish due to a new fish that had Ich.  I believed similar posts and I even tried a few "reef safe remedies".  All the existing fish were well fed and otherwise healthy (and the tank wasn't experiencing any other problems at the time).  Now I always recommend treatment for an outbreak.  That said, it's not like I don't believe people like markalot; it seems to work out for some people.

 

Yea, I just don't think we have all the information.  There could be different strains, or similar diseases.  QT is always the best option, don;t get me wrong, and there are no magic cures.   Either it's kept out or it's in there forever as far as I know.  

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14 minutes ago, sadie said:

I remember doing a freshwater dip to treat my clown with ich.  

 

It was 100 yrs ago, not sure if that is still done.

 

Doubt it. The cycle is that visible cysts will fall off and reproduce in the tank, then re-infect and start the process all over again.  Many times people that have fish with Ich will do something, dip, magic potion, you name it, see the cysts fall off and declare victory.  It's just part of the cycle of Ich.  You may in fact have something worse if it's rapidly killing fish.  If you can't keep fish alive then your only choice, IMO, is a fallow period to clear the tank of whatever it is you have, as seabass has suggested. 

 

My comment was only to try and keep fish alive and then move forward from there.   If you can keep them alive then you have to decide if you continue to stock, knowing every new addition will probably get Ich and need to be carefully tended too.  It works for both my tanks, and my last two editions to my 40 gallon (wrasse and tang) never showed any symptoms (doesn't mean it's not there).  It's experiences like these that makes me question if we know everything we need to know about this parasite.   

 

It doesn't change the best answer though, and that's to QT if you can and go fallow if it gets introduced to the tank. 

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6 minutes ago, sadie said:

so if the tank does go fallow for the period, is there still a need to put the first fish in a QT tank still?  

If you want to prevent possibly getting another parasite, then yes qt all fish being purchased before adding them to your tank.

 

The first fish you added may have had ich, velvet, brook etc. We don't know. 

 

We know your fish keep dying and I doubt it's from not feeding for 2 days and I doubt it's from feeding brine shrimp. To me both those would cause death eventually. 

 

I think it's far too coincidental that every fish you get dies- that's why I thought from the beginning you had something in the tank causing the deaths of fish.

 

So ya, a fallow period would ensure any parasite you have will die because fish parasites need a fish to host.

 

To prevent any future parasites, you need to qt EVERY fish before it goes into your tank. 

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1 minute ago, Clown79 said:

If you want to prevent possibly getting another parasite, then yes qt all fish being purchased before adding them to your tank.

 

The first fish you added may have had ich, velvet, brook etc. We don't know. 

 

We know your fish keep dying and I doubt it's from not feeding for 2 days and I doubt it's from feeding brine shrimp. To me both those would cause death eventually. 

 

I think it's far too coincidental that every fish you get dies- that's why I thought from the beginning you had something in the tank causing the deaths of fish.

 

So ya, a fallow period would ensure any parasite you have will die because fish parasites need a fish to host.

 

To prevent any future parasites, you need to qt EVERY fish before it goes into your tank. 

sorry, it wasn't my post, I don't have any fish, that's why I asked.  Just trying to learn as much as I can.  My last fish died of snow or flake like 2 yrs ago and I'm going to be getting some fish in a bit.  So I just asked the question out of curiosity. 

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9 minutes ago, sadie said:

so if the tank does go fallow for the period, is there still a need to put the first fish in a QT tank still?  

There is.  While you can't infect any other fish, you wouldn't be able to treat this first fish in a reef tank.  Which means that you would still need to treat in a hospital tank, and start a fallow period.  If you QT this fish, and it happens to have Ich, you can treat it in the QT.

 

That said, some might consider not quarantining a lone fish an acceptable risk.  Obviously the risk of losses goes up when you have more fish.

 

I admit to not currently having a QT tank.  I buy most of my fish from LiveAquaria's Diver's Den, which quarantine their fish before selling them.  However, this is still no guarantee.  I purchased an angelfish from them, which came in with Ich.  Still, I believe the risk is lower when buying from them (and have received many healthy fish from them).  I believe that they still recommend quarantine prior to introducing fish to your display.

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On 7/11/2018 at 7:00 AM, seabass said:

Yes.  While it's possible that cysts could be on the frags from tanks with fish, it's no more likely during this period than at any other time.  The parasite can only feed on fish (no inverts), so you can use this time to let your tank mature, get a decent cleanup crew, and even add a few corals.

Sounds good - will keep loading it up with corals!

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Well I thought I owe everyone an update.....one of my two clowns passed away on Wednesday but the other one seems to have fought the ich and is doing much better! I fed the flake food thanks to many of the suggestions here. I honestly am not too excited about setting up a QT tank, I just don't have the room for it.....

 

Now that my fish has battled ich, does that mean it likely wouldn't attract it again? I guess my question is around whether or not the parasites will actually die now that I will have a fish in the tank that is living and has battled them once.

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2 hours ago, Rathje70 said:

Well I thought I owe everyone an update.....one of my two clowns passed away on Wednesday but the other one seems to have fought the ich and is doing much better! I fed the flake food thanks to many of the suggestions here. I honestly am not too excited about setting up a QT tank, I just don't have the room for it.....

 

Now that my fish has battled ich, does that mean it likely wouldn't attract it again? I guess my question is around whether or not the parasites will actually die now that I will have a fish in the tank that is living and has battled them once.

The only way to get rid of ich is by the tank being fallow for 8 weeks.

 

As long as there is a host(fish) the parasite lives on and multiplies.

 

That means at any time your fish can get re-infected and any new fish additional can also get infected by it.

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