Lizzyann's IM 20 Peninsula

[SeaFurn]

1 hour ago, lizzyann said:

Thank you both! It definitely makes me feel better that somewhere out there there's strangers cheering me on, hah!

Of course! And when you beat them I’ll know what thread to go back to to figure out what to do when it happens to me! 

[lizzyann]

17 hours ago, TatorTaco said:

I think I'm also experiencing dinos.  Did you purchase a one, or did you just have one laying around?  Apparently, I'll be in the market for one very soon. 

 

Also, could you ID that green coral you have next to your gorgonian - the green one on it's own island? 

I took a look at your thread, definitely looks like the dinos in my tank but yea, you probably want a microscope. I was able to borrow one from a friend. It was a really old child's microscope kit, but worked well enough to ID! I think it really does help, at least makes me feel more confident, to know what type it is since different treatments work a lot better than others on specific species.

 

The green coral is mint pavona! I love it. Really hardy and pretty fast growing SPS, though it is starting to bleach at the edges because it's one of the corals that's catching all the dino slime.

[lizzyann]

Y'ALL!! 

 

Dinos were gone overnight after I installed the UV sterilizer! 

 

I'm going to leave it running for a week probably, as I know just because I can't see them doesn't mean they aren't just going to come right back.

 

There's lots of algae and some other gunk growing but I'll take it over dinos choking out every single coral.

 

I also added pods and phyto to increase biodiversity but I'm guessing the UV sterilizer is what did it overnight. Now hopefully they (and all the coraline and less desirable algae) can help keep it at bay.  

 

I'm trying to decide if I should do a water change now or wait a while longer. Also need to set up my new dosing pump. I ended up getting a bubble magus t11 like new but much cheaper from someone online, so that worked out alright.

 

I'll share some new pics soon, but for now just had to shout my excitement from the rooftops!

[billygoat]

1 hour ago, lizzyann said:

Y'ALL!! 

 

Dinos were gone overnight after I installed the UV sterilizer! 

 

I'm going to leave it running for a week probably, as I know just because I can't see them doesn't mean they aren't just going to come right back.

 

There's lots of algae and some other gunk growing but I'll take it over dinos choking out every single coral.

 

I also added pods and phyto to increase biodiversity but I'm guessing the UV sterilizer is what did it overnight. Now hopefully they (and all the coraline and less desirable algae) can help keep it at bay.  

 

I'm trying to decide if I should do a water change now or wait a while longer. Also need to set up my new dosing pump. I ended up getting a bubble magus t11 like new but much cheaper from someone online, so that worked out alright.

 

I'll share some new pics soon, but for now just had to shout my excitement from the rooftops!

That is awesome news! Dinos are tenacious as hell, but hopefully increased biodiversity from the pods combined with the UV sterilizer will keep down in the dirt, and they won't bounce back. Congratulations on your triumphant victory 💪

 

One possible downside is that the sterilizer is likely to also kill a lot of the phytoplankton you added, but as long as the Dinos are gone I'd say it doesn't matter much!

[lizzyann]

Good to know about the phytoplankton, I didn't think about that. I've got plenty so I'll add more when I take out the sterilizer.

[TatorTaco]

Can you provide a link to the UV Sterilizer you used?  I wanted something small and discreet myself, but if it's only in the tank for a day or two, I suppose it's size is of little importance. 

[lizzyann]

On 4/4/2019 at 4:35 PM, TatorTaco said:

Can you provide a link to the UV Sterilizer you used?  I wanted something small and discreet myself, but if it's only in the tank for a day or two, I suppose it's size is of little importance. 

Sorry I've been busy the past few days. I got this one, the 18 watt https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0034VDEPA/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 It's ugly and I had to get big ugly tubing to go with it, but I plan for it to be very temporary and it gets the job done!

 

 

[thecoralbeauty]

Came over here from @billygoat's comment on my thread about the dinos- and i'm glad he did. I'm in love with this tank!! and your possum wrasse. I really want one of my own now. SO CUTE!! 

 

My kitties are also obsessed with my tank. I'm pretty sure the lawnmower blenny enjoys teasing my girl kitty.

 

Will be interesting to hear about your experience with the UV sterilizer! fingers crossed it works like a charm. dinos are the worst. 

[SeaFurn]

That's unbelievable that the dinos went away right after installing the UV sterilizer!  Are they still at bay?

[lizzyann]

1 hour ago, SeaFurn said:

That's unbelievable that the dinos went away right after installing the UV sterilizer!  Are they still at bay?

I think so. I haven't seen anything stringy like before, there's some brown on the sand but it's possible that's just diatoms as there's also a lot of pods, algae, and cyano now. I need to get the brown bits left under the microscope! I took down the sterilizer today since nothing's come back for a few days and it's starting to get in the way, let lots of snails escape, etc. I'm pretty curious to see what will happen!

[lizzyann]

I realized this week my tank has reached its one year birthday! I don't know if it counts since I changed tanks, and it certainly doesn't feel like a year old tank with the issues I'm dealing with, but as a newcomer to reefing, I'm pretty happy with how much I've learned and built in a year.

 

Overall the tank still looks like poo. After I took the UV off, brown stuff started to grow back on the sand, and a little on the rock, but not at all to the extent of before, and it doesn't seem to be very stringy like the past dinoflagellates. I got a new sample under the microscope and it seems like there are definitely still dinos in there, but not as many, and there's also a new, much smaller, little critter in there. I'm hoping that this might actually be ciliates that prey on dinos. So I don't want to put the sterilizer back on as it would kill the ciliates as well, and I'm hoping they will naturally balance things out. Here's some vids if anyone wants to check them out. Kinda wishing I had a better microscope at this point, but it'll do.

 

 

 

So hopefully that's on the way out but I also have tons of green hair algae and some cyano and probably diatoms that are growing as well. It started before I even put the UV sterilizer on, but now has gotten out of control. My nitrate has been .3 - .5 and phosphate at 0 for the past three weeks, so I guess it's one of those "the algae is consuming nutrients before they can be read" situations? I'm kinda at a loss on how to combat the algae and dinos at the same time, since different things are recommended for them. I've been feeding a little heavier and waiting longer between water changes because I thought my low nutrients were helping the dinos flourish, but that might have just greatly encouraged these other nuisances. For now I'm just going back to a normal routine. Going for manual removal of the algae but this type isn't coming off with tweezers as easily as I remember before. It just kinda smooshes around and won't come off in a clump. Toothbrush works but then I have to try to get all the algae floating all over the tank out. 

 

 

Thankfully most of the corals have been doing well regardless, and I even got a few new pieces! I was so annoyed at myself for it, but I bought a black sun coral and red goni right before the dinos really exploded and I realized I had a problem on my hands, but they made it through. When things were looking better I saw the exact pipe organ I have been looking for for a year in the Diver's Den, so I HAD to get it. Y'all, I totally understand the people that say buying corals is an addiction and I'm officially an addict. I had trouble deciding which goniopora to get, then when that pipe organ showed up it seemed idiotic not to get a second coral to get free shipping, so I got a purple and green goniopora as well so I could decide which I liked better.

 

I don't have many photos I'm proud of with the tank looking the way it is but I still want to show off my new coral!

 

The pipe organ is HUGE, I'll definitely have to frag it. 

 

 

Here's the black sun coral to go with my pink one. It's polyps don't extend as eagerly as the pink, but after the first couple days of training it still opens up every evening to eat! Pictures don't really do it justice. It's a beautiful, dark, velvety green, with hints of black and brown, while the polyps and tentacles are more of a brown/black color.

 

 

 

The red goni is hard to photograph where it's located, but it seems to be doing well enough.

 

 

And here's the purple/green one:

 

 

I really wanted that long polyp look from these, and they haven't extended that far yet, but they have been open and healthy looking so hopefully we'll get there.

 

The room is a mess from all the work I've been doing in here, I need to mount corals, and like I said, it's not in the best state, but I figured I would throw in a quick FTS as well.

 

 

Since all the issues right now seem like new tank syndrome stuff, I'm just hoping I can continue to stay on top of the routine, make small changes if necessary, and things will naturally start to mellow out. I also moved the tank over to a stand instead of having it on the desk, so I finally have somewhere to organize all my cords and containers and such and will FINALLY set up my dosing pump. Alkalinity, calcium, and magnesium have definitely gotten out of wack with me trying to dose manually, so I'm sure the corals will really appreciate some steady parameters. I'm sure everything will be fine, but I'm really missing having a pristine, colorful tank right now.

[billygoat]

5 hours ago, lizzyann said:

I realized this week my tank has reached its one year birthday! I don't know if it counts since I changed tanks, and it certainly doesn't feel like a year old tank with the issues I'm dealing with, but as a newcomer to reefing, I'm pretty happy with how much I've learned and built in a year.

Every tank has its issues, and it's important to remember that those issues don't necessarily detract from the beauty of all the amazing things we keep in our little boxes of water. Of course every aquarist wants his or her system to eventually be perfectly pest-free, but don't sell yourself short on how far you've come just because there is further still to go! 😄

 

So congratulations on your anniversary! That's definitely a really big milestone. Your pictures look gorgeous, and the FTS is very beautiful. I love the contrasting light and dark colors on that enormous pipe organ coral! And I also like how much open space there is in your display. Some reefers like to fill the whole thing up, and that's certainly a strategy that can be very lovely as well, but I personally like the way large areas of negative space set off the rocks and corals.

[SeaFurn]

Congratulations one 1 year! I think the tank looks great despite the issues. We all deal with them and it’s just part of the hobby. 

 

Love the sun corals! Maybe I’ll be brave enough to get one of those I the future. 

 

[markalot]

Congrats on 1 year.  I think the tank looks great!  Continued good luck with those damn dinos!

[lizzyann]

Good news, bad news, random news.

 

I got the UV sterilizer back on and it seems to have cleared up most of the dinos again, but the algae and cyano are still a problem. Nitrates and phosphates are at 0. What do I do?? Things seem like they're just so out of balance. I started using some Dr. Tim's waste away and will probably try to add other bacteria mixtures as well. Maybe more pods and phyto? Maybe an algae reactor to soak up whatever the cyano and fluffy algae seems to be using? Could it help to dose nitrate and phosphate? Maybe just nuking with chemiclean or something...

 

I did get my bubble magus doser set up and it's working like a charm. Magnesium, calcium, and alkalinity are all finally high and stable. I'm trying to keep 1350 mag, 450 cal, and 8.5 dkh.

 

This plus the UV has the corals looking better than they have in a while. 

 

Orange ricordea bubbles as huge as ever

 

Older pipe organ is growing babies

 

Zoas are happy

 

And my acans seem to be getting some really nice color (also might have to do with me lowering the light a little bit at the front)

 

In weird and random news, I found a new funny, somewhat rare, hitchhiker

 

Thankfully I've only seen it on the rock and not bothering anything. Though I haven't seen anything that looks 100% the same, from my research it seems to either be this nudibranch that eats only spiorbid worms, or a juvenile of another kind that eats algae. I've seen several of them!

 

I also found out my pistol shrimp is stuck in the back third chamber 🤦‍♀️. Probably gonna be such a pain to get out but feel like I can't even deal with that right now because, on to the especially bad news...

 

Before I got the UV going, one of my big snails died, then another one passed after, and maybe other smaller ones I haven't noticed. I assume this has to do with the toxic nature of the dinoflagellates. I was pretty worried and put in some extra carbon (the other being in the chemipure). Then I realize something weird is going on with Graygrumps. I noticed he was seeming less and less interested in food, then the past couple days he was less active, not actually eating at all, and doing the heavy breathing/gasping thing. I finally tried to investigate further and realized he has a big sore on both sides of his belly. It's really hard to see in his cave and I haven't been able to get a good picture, but it looked like a red sore with this clear blister bulging over it. I would think injury but it's symmetrical on both sides, which makes me think something is going on internally. Whatever it is, it probably has to do with the toxins that caused the snail deaths as well, or at least that lowered his immune system drastically to make him susceptible to something else? Seems too coincidental for him to have eaten something that caused a blockage or something like that. I don't have any experience with marine fish diseases but so far I haven't been able to pinpoint exactly what this could be. I tested ammonia and nitrite just to be sure and it was all 0.

 

I don't have any medicines and wouldn't know what to even treat for at this point. Bacteria would be my first guess but gram negative or positive? Is it worth it at the point of having multiple open sores on the body? I'm trying to do some extra water changes and keep things clean and steady. Would you try to quarantine and treat him? The possum wrasse (now calling her Lily 🤣🤷‍♀️, maybe I should just go with The Fish of Many Names) seems great but I certainly worry about the illness being contagious, though I guess she's already been exposed to it at this point anyway. The sweet thing is constantly going over to Graygrump's cave to cuddle and eat stuff. 

 

The photo isn't any good cause I'm trying to take a picture into a cave, but 😍😰😭

 

Ugh. So. We'll see what happens? So frustrated that things have gotten so out of whack... I feel like I've been doing everything right!

 

I'll end with a cute pic of Lily to try to keep things positive...

 

 

[billygoat]

5 hours ago, lizzyann said:

Ugh. So. We'll see what happens? So frustrated that things have gotten so out of whack... I feel like I've been doing everything right!

 

Don't get too discouraged! Despite your algae issues and persistent dino blooms, your tank is very beautiful. It's easy to get caught up in the problems we have, but it's important to remember that our tanks can be lovely even while all that bad stuff is going on. I think your pictures are marvelous and that there are thousands of reefers out there that would love to have a system that looks like yours, even with the dinos and cyano going on. 😊

 

Regarding poor ol' Graygrumps: at this stage I think the stress of extracting him and moving him into QT would outweigh the benefits of being able to treat him, even if you knew exactly what the cause might be. I am not the most experienced aquarist on the block, but if it was me I would leave him in there and just hope for the best. It's in his hands now. 😢

 

Hang in there, and don't go changing too many things all at once! Things are going to turn around in there for sure.

[lizzyann]

🤗 Really appreciate it billygoat! Definitely agree with you about not transferring Graygrumps, especially after this evening. He moved around a little during feeding time and the sores look pretty awful, just two holes in each side of his stomach area. Just going to try to make things calm and steady until he gets better or likely worse, then try to deal with the issues.

[Ratvan]

5 hours ago, lizzyann said:

🤗 Really appreciate it billygoat! Definitely agree with you about not transferring Graygrumps, especially after this evening. He moved around a little during feeding time and the sores look pretty awful, just two holes in each side of his stomach area. Just going to try to make things calm and steady until he gets better or likely worse, then try to deal with the issues.

This may sound strange but have you looked into/tried using Tea Tree Oil to try and soothe the sores? I'll admit that i have never used this on Marine but used to work great in my Fresh Water and Brackish tanks. Have used it to treat open wounds, sores etc. Could be worth looking into as its natural could be kinder than QT. 

 

You need to make sure that the active ingrediant is Melaleuca Oil and that it does not contain Ethanol

[SeaFurn]

Quite an update. 

Sorry to hear about Graygrumps.

If I had any clue about what’s ailing him and how it could be treated I’d feel more confident in suggesting taking him out and treating him. Hopefully someone with more knowledge can chime in  with some guidance. 

Fingers crossed Lily stays healthy through this. 

 

Adding some pods and phyto to build the microfauna couldn’t hurt. 

 

Battle on and keep the updates coming. 

 

[Tamberav]

Most likely a bacterial infection as gobies are not particularly prone to urenoma.

 

The best treatment for infections is NFG powder (can't be used in DT):

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/NFP-Nitrofuracin-Green-Powder-for-Wide-Spectrum-Fish-Diseases-25-grams-/283357026298

 

For in the DT...you could try a food soak of kanaplex..metroplex...furan 2 and focus to bind it to food and target feed. If he is not eating...this is no help ofc. It also may be harder on his kidneys since he is taking it orally.

 

Sadly even with treatment he may not make it since it sounds advanced but I would personally try and treat him either in a QT or orally if he is eating. Worst case he dies and you now have antibiotics to store in a cool dry place in case another fish gets an infection.

 

[lizzyann]

4 hours ago, Tamberav said:

Most likely a bacterial infection as gobies are not particularly prone to urenoma.

 

The best treatment for infections is NFG powder (can't be used in DT):

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/NFP-Nitrofuracin-Green-Powder-for-Wide-Spectrum-Fish-Diseases-25-grams-/283357026298

 

For in the DT...you could try a food soak of kanaplex..metroplex...furan 2 and focus to bind it to food and target feed. If he is not eating...this is no help ofc. It also may be harder on his kidneys since he is taking it orally.

Thanks for the info.

 

Unfortunately he died last night. Previously, after researching it more, I was thinking I would try to QT and treat as I read several cases of fish that healed up even after having huge sores/holes on their body but it was just too late. Also most of the fish in the examples were still eating, and Graygrumps stopped eating before I realized something was really wrong, so I wouldn't have been able to give him medicated food and he was probably already pretty weak.

 

It sounds like most of the meds for freshwater fish are the same for marine, so that's useful as I've treated bacterial infections in fw before. Of course I wasn't stocked up with any of the meds right now but I definitely will buy some to have on hand.

 

I also learned that it's worth it to look into the smallest signs of change in behavior. Graygrumps seemed slightly less interested in food (though still eating some) and a little less active for like a week before he stopped eating completely and I bothered him enough to get him out of the cave and examine him closer. I did get a picture finally. It's pretty gruesome but could possibly be useful.

 

 

It was just like that on the other side as well. 

 

I've read I'm not supposed to do water changes when there's dinoflagellate blooms, or do anything to lower nutrients further, but I think they are mostly being held off by the UV and though I don't have any measurable nitrates or phosphates there's plenty of algae and cyanobacteria in there, so I'm thinking doing extra water changes (manually removing cyano if I can) is probably a good idea right now if there's anything icky in the water. Lily is still acting normal but I'm so worried the tank still has toxins from cyano and dinos or bacterial disease or something.

[pricewayne]

On 4/1/2019 at 4:49 PM, billygoat said:

I've recently read the journals of several other reefers who are battling dinos, and I believe one at least was able to beat them definitively. Unfortunately I can't quite remember who it was though >< I will dig around in the archives and see if I can come up with the thread.

You'd better believe you've got our support! Dinos are the worst possible thing you could have growing in your system, and any aquarist worth her salt will tell you that beating them is one of the most satisfying things on Earth. It sounds like you have already taken some decisive steps with the purchase of a UV sterilizer and all the research you've done, so I'm sure they will be on the run in no time.

 

@lizzyann this tank is beautiful!! And your pictures are awesome.

 

@billygoat I believe it was @Clown79 — know she at least was battling them and think she beat them.

[lizzyann]

The Long Night has begun...

 

 

😭 It's so depressing!

 

Going to try for 3 days with the UV running then turn the lights on and UV off, probably do a small water change, and add more pods, phyto, dr. tim's one and only and maybe waste away too, and some macro algae and hope for the best. Gotta get some normal, healthy, balanced micro fauna/flora going in here.

[lizzyann]

The blackout has ended! I turned the lights back on Wednesday and was welcomed to beautiful reef bliss.

 

 

 

Feels amazing seeing white sand, clean rocks, and everything so fluffy and happy after being meh for so long. Most of the squishy, cottony algae is gone, just with some tufts of that easier to tweeze hair algae. Parameters are at a more normal level with 2 nitrate and .02 phosphate. The doser is keeping the cal & alk perfect! I added One and Only and Waste Away, as well as started adding phyto for the pods again (didn't add any more pods but it seems like there's definitely some in there so I decided not to place a new order yet).

 

The yellow fiji leather stopped stretching and looks magnificent

 

My gorgonian finally has it's polyps extended again. No more pesky dinos around gunking it up, just the normal good ol dog hair getting caught in it's branches. Come to think of it... maybe it's all the dog hair that's providing all these trace elements the cyano and dinos seem to be thriving on 😂.

 

The critters are happy too!

 

Of course this bliss just couldn't last for long, and after a day or two patches of red cyano started to pop back up. It was small enough that I've been able to keep it at bay by sucking up the patches every day with a turkey baster. Then it gets worse, after about two days the sand starts to get a light brown dusting again. Bubbles start to form all over the sand again. 😭

 

 

Haven't put this under the microscope yet but I'm guessing it'll be that same combo of diatoms and dinos and such as before. WTF?!?!? I have no idea what to do next. Definitely not giving up but I can see how the feeling could wedge it's way in eventually. It's been about two months since the tank transfer and these problems began, so I guess that's not too long in the scheme of things, but I'm still just surprised this much trouble could come from moving an established, year old tank into a bigger space. Where did I go wrong? I'd really love to know what the source problem is so I never repeat it. I guess my only true loss has been Graygrumps, all the corals have been fine, just miserable, so I should be grateful. But it's definitely made me spend 5x more time and money on the tank than I would be otherwise.

 

My water change is tomorrow so I'm going to try to get out all the brown then, but it removes way too much water to get everything out. Also removes tons of sand, and I'm afraid to just replace it with clean as I assume that's going to add a bunch more silicates which might be what's causing the problem to begin with. I did get a small order of macroalgae in that I just added a minute ago, so maybe that will do something as well, though I don't know what really. I feel like next steps are trying Vibrant, DinoX, or Chemiclean, but I don't want to! HEEEELP!

[billygoat]

Poor lizzyann! Everything looks so lovely, it's really a shame that the slime keeps coming back. What is there to do that you haven't already tried? 🤔 Short of extremely dramatic steps like replacing your entire sandbed, I mean. I don't blame you about being scared of chemical "cures"; I'd sooner break down my tank and start over than resort to something like that.

 

I've heard that Florida fighting conchs are a good biological control for slime on the sandbed, and it looks like your tank has enough sand to keep one happy. If the bulk of your problem is cyanobacteria then that could be an answer, but if you've got some of the bad kind of dinos mixed in there I imagine the conch would just get poisoned and die. 😢