Diatom Issue in Established Tank

[Jwendt15]

Hey all. I am nearly at my wits end with this tank and considering closing it up. I've had this 14g biocube setup for two plus years now and have fought this diatom problem since the very beginning. Here is what I have done as an attempt to remedy the issue:

-first and foremost, religious weekly water changes of at least 10 to 15 percent using water solely provided by LFS

-upgraded lights to LED's 3 months ago to see if it was an old light issue

-changed powerhead to adjust flow in affected areas

-weekly dose of 8.4 and balance to keep pH stable

-media basket includes chemipure elite and purigen. Recently added phosguard to the media which seemed to shock corals overnight, mainly xenia

-light cycle is 7 hours a day, no direct sunlight to the tank

-cautious feeding schedule and tank is not overstocked - only two small clowns

-have tried manual removal and lights out method. That of course is the sure fire way to rid the issue, but does not resolve the source. Slowly comes back and spreads to this level within weeks. 

 

I am sorry as I know this issue has been discussed heavily, I have actively followed posts and have had no luck oh my end. Hoping that maybe a pic and a list of what has been attempted will spur some ideas of what the cause could be. Love this hobby, but this has lately been more of a stres and frustration than enjoyment. 

[uwdanno]

Microbacter 7 + Coral snow. It'll be gone in a week or two. Do a search on the right mixture and dosage. 

[brandon429]

you can also just do a rip cleaning where you tank the tank apart and flush out all the 24 mos detritus in the rocks, there is some as current constants in the tank always leave some catch spots. we'd clean out the growths, and be done with them, apparently on 24 mo cycles based on your tank and variables

[Nano sapiens]

I have no experience with commercial products that can be used for this, but I can relate what I've had to do to beat it naturally (I don't use any chemical or continuous mechanical filtration).

 

In the near 10 years I've had my 12g running, I've had this pop up twice.  Debatable if they are actually diatoms, cyano, dinoflagellates...or a mixture.  At any rate, I've found the issue directly tied to my overfeeding and the resulting excess waste that accumulates in the sand bed and under the live rock.  I could go a few weeks adding lots of food without any symptoms, then one day 'Bam' it would start up.  I've beaten it both times (including this last month) by being careful with feedings (only feed what the fish can consume in a minute or two and remove any excess, if present) and most importantly a weekly schedule of removing detritus wherever it resides.

 

Be forewarned that it can be a long process to eradicate.  The first time when I had two adult Ocellaris Clownfish, it took me ~8 months to completely get rid of it,  This time with six smaller fish in the aquarium, it has taken ~2 months.  My theory for why it persists so long is that when one starts to feed properly and remove detritus/excess food from the system, the sponges and other organisms that have naturally flourished due to the excess feeding start to gradually die off and they continue to feed the pest organism even when the tank has been cleaned well.  Persistence is the key and when it finally does subside it'll do so rather quickly (within a few days) and the sand bed will be back to it's former pest-free glory 

 

Good luck!

[Nano sapiens]

Or you can 'Rip-Clean', as Brandon suggests.

 

So now you have (3) options to consider 

[FISHnChix]

Maybe lack of flow . I know you have enough gpm for your tank but do you have any flow towards the problem area?. I'm no expert and deal with algae too but the only way I got my sand clean was to add another wave maker (i also have one placed just like you have).. I have one the aims down and against the wall .takes some time to adjust it right where you have enough flow but not so much it blows sand every where. After I added that most of the alage on the sand went away. Also i run cheato, rox carbon, and phosguard.. 

 

Anyways don't give up.. worse case hit the reset button and rip clean it. Within a couple hours your tank will look like new!!! Good luck 

[markalot]

-first and foremost, religious weekly water changes of at least 10 to 15 percent using water solely provided by LFS

 

So how is that working out for you    Sorry, just being snarky.  Can you try mixing up your own using distilled just to see what happens?   

 

IMO you have too much stuff going on, lots of media, lots of adjustments, and the PH adjustment scares me the most.  In the picture, though, your corals look super healthy and that's the only important indicator.  I would try a different water source and see what happens.  Something is adding silicates and water can usually be blamed.  If your local tap water is high in silicates and your LFS is not properly filtering their water (probably a 98% chance they aren't) then the resulting saltwater will be high in silicates and continue to feed the diatoms.  

[Tamberav]

I am having the same issue but mine is not nearly as bad as yours. My Nitrates are 0.25 and my phosphates are 0.018. My rocks are very clean (can hardly get anything to baste off). Acro's look fine... maybe need a little more Nitrate imo! I decided to check my RODI and I am getting 1 TDS out now when it was always 0 before (2 TDS before DI). This means my DI can't even get rid of that full 2 TDS, yikes! It has been 1.5 years since I have changed the DI part of my RODI unit, the RO filters were changed maybe 3 months ago. So I believe my issue is probably source water, I ordered new DI/Silicabuster and it will be here tomorrow. 

 

I probably shouldn't have let it go so long but I checked my RODI when I changed the other cartridges a few months ago and was still getting 0 out. Thats what I get for being a cheap ass!

[Clown79]

The first thing that stands out is exactly what @markalot noticed.

 

LFS water. This is so unreliable. You have no idea how often their filters are changed in their system, if it's ro or rodi water..could be tap even (sorry I don't trust businesses easily, their bottom line is making money not friends)

 

Have you ever tested the tds, nitrates, phos in their water?

 

First thing I'd do. Start using distilled water for everything and mix it yourself if you can't or don't want an rodi system.

 

 the media.

Adding phosguard while using chemipure is going to strip your tank- both reduce phos, except phosguard works better as chemipure has very little media in it which exhausts faster than stated.

Phosguard is potent, needs small quantities and monitoring of numbers.

 

Do you use floss to trap particles?

 

Adding products to stabalize ph- known to be nothing but a headache.

 

I've had similar issues in my eastablished tanks. It may not be diatoms. There is cyano that's golden, even green.

 

going through and accessing everything, you can usually pinpoint the culprit.

[ReefingRelapse]

I vote bad water. Is it only on the sand bed?

 

Maybe try different water source, clean it out during a wc and run a uv sterilizer for a week. I'd bet money that solves it

[NanoRox]

echoing others.  I don't trust any LFS water. 

[markalot]

I don't live in an area with high silicates but based on what I've read there are those folks who need extra filtration in their RODI to rid themselves of the problem.  SpectraPure even has a special SilicaBuster DI cartridge to address the issue so I assume in some places it's a big problem. 

[Clown79]

1 hour ago, markalot said:

I don't live in an area with high silicates but based on what I've read there are those folks who need extra filtration in their RODI to rid themselves of the problem.  SpectraPure even has a special SilicaBuster DI cartridge to address the issue so I assume in some places it's a big problem. 

Very true.

 

The water where I live is not good. The first time I saw the tds level going in, I was stunned! 400+. 

 

All the region's around me are between 150-250. It's all about where the water is coming from and the contaminants in the area.

[Nano sapiens]

If this were a high TDS makeup water issue and/or the LFS was making their salt water with high TDS, one might expect to see green algae proliferate on the glass and on the rocks.  But definitely worth investigating as a possible contributor to the current issue...and for general piece of mind.

 

As a collective, we tend to assume diatoms whenever we see this light brown/coca-cola color and spread.  But there are a number of other types of organisms that look very similar and are often mistaken for diatoms.  In a young immature system, diatoms are a good guess.  But in a well established system, certainly possible but less likely IMO.

 

 

[Jwendt15]

Thanks for all of the tips. Seems the "theme" is the water source could be suspicious. I just always assumed a reputable LFS would not be the source of a potential issue. I'll invested in an RODI system and see how that changes. It's a pain dragging buckets to the LFS every month or so anyway!

[mcarroll]

Personally I would ID what you're seeing BEFORE you take action and save yourself and your tank a lot of angst.  

 

It's a lot less effort than ripping a tank apart and putting it back together.  

 

It's probably even less money to ID what you have even if you have to buy a microscope.  (I've been happy enough using a $10 toy scope while I decide what "real" scope I want and save the money for it.  Pics with a cellphone.)

 

Cyano and dino's each have pretty discrete tests you can do....diatoms are what's left over after ruling those two out.

 

Cyano will bubble like crazy in peroxide, but others won't.

 

If you take a sample of dino's and shake it up into bits and then let it sit under a light, they will be able to regroup into a mass....others will just sit there.

 

If you try it, post your results!

[mcarroll]

BTW, you can find this scope for as low as $10 if you shop around (pay no mind to the brand....it's the same scope) or wait for a sale...it's the one I mentioned that I'm using "so far" and I think I paid <$15. 

 

It comes with everyting you need, but a small set of glass slides and coverslips would be advisable if you have some extra dollars.  Much better than what it comes with....which is OK.

 

M28-KT1-W

 

[xthunt]

I had some brown stringy stuff soon after setting up my Evo 5. It went away after a week or two. Then one water change I decided to clean the rocks, pump, heater, and filtration chamber with a toothbrush and pipe brush. I mean really getting detailed and even getting the bacteria slime off. Well, it came back. It's starting to go away now on the second week, but from now on I think I'm going to leave the slime coat alone and just blow the loose stuff off equipment, and use the toothbrush sparingly on the rocks. It could've been something else, though. 

[Tamberav]

2 hours ago, mcarroll said:

BTW, you can find this scope for as low as $10 if you shop around (pay no mind to the brand....it's the same scope) or wait for a sale...it's the one I mentioned that I'm using "so far" and I think I paid <$15. 

 

It comes with everyting you need, but a small set of glass slides and coverslips would be advisable if you have some extra dollars.  Much better than what it comes with....which is OK.

 

M28-KT1-W

 

 

I may have to try one of these. I had a kids microscope growing up, it actually worked well and STILL works and we are talking about something that must be 20 years old by now.... but it worked so well my mom used it as much as me and still has it. lol 

[mcarroll]

The obvious problem with the toy scope (mine at least) is that it's wobbly.  The focus knob isn't too precise either.  You can definitely make it work, but you can get a much better scope for not a lot more... ≥$50 will get something heavy, maybe even all-metal and maybe even with an added fine focus knob.  

 

I just can't decide how much more to spend...

 

≥$200 get's you a pretty bad... microscope like this....

 

 

40X-2500X Binocular Biological Microscope with Extensive Slide Preparation Kit

SKU: B100C-SP14-CLS-50P100S

$459.88 

 

$209.98

...and even I can save $200.   

 

But there are sweet features every hundred dollars or so after that too....different lighting techniques, better lenses...stronger lenses; 2500x seems like it might be useful to me..etc.   Still learning about all that.

[mcarroll]

Saw some scary-good deals on scopes when I was shopping ebay last night....

[Tamberav]

My husband is in school so that's what I use for now. The last school had one that was worth more than my salary