A Flexible Bucket Transfer QT/Hospital System

[jahnje]

So it was suggested by  @Christopher Marks that I do a tank journal for my QT system, since it's a little bit different than most. So here it is... This system is based of of an article in Coral magazine by Joseph Szczebak, of the Roger Williams University marine breeding lab, which can be found here: http://www.reef2rainforest.com/2017/02/10/bucket-transfer-qt-method/

 

In his article he outlines a method for QT and hospitalization of marine fishes.  I've been working on adapting it for home use for freshwater fish, plants, marine inverts and corals. What's really cool about it that it can expand and shrink as needed. The other really nice aspect of this system is the huge reduction in medicine and additive use.  I rarely deal with anything over 1 ml. Most of the time I'm dealing with less than half.  So from that point it's a really nice cost savings.  

 

In a nutshell the system consists of some shallow 4'x2' storage Hefty containers, and a number of Cambro acrylic food containers. 4 and 6 qt.   The large container is filled halfway(ish) with water and has a heater and small powerhead put in it.  The individual containers are filled with whatever kind of water your livestock needs.     The livestock is then moved to a subsequent container with matching parameters when needed.  Fish daily, Corals weekly etc. For all intents and purposes, it's like running a bunch of simultaneous pico tanks at the same time, just a little more "Clinical."

 

I'm basically going to try and journal all of the trials and tribulations that happen in this system. Not all of them reef related. I'm also going to try and put my protocols and recipes here so people trying this out don't have to deal with many of the subtle issues that arise.  

 

Right now, I've got a 5L container with Coral in it that I'm using in the Pico Reef Contest;  while at the same time I've been running a number of new cichlids through.  

 

 

Nothing like a picture of a freshwater fish swimming around by some coral frags. 

 

 

[Pjanssen]

Tell you if you're wrong? Ha! I'm not even sure I understand what you are doing 

[jahnje]

1 hour ago, Pjanssen said:

Tell you if you're wrong? Ha! I'm not even sure I understand what you are doing 

It'll make more sense when I add more entries. This was just a rough start. 

[Christopher Marks]

I love that you use one shallow tray of water to simply maintain the temperature of all the containers submerged inside. Multiple quarantine tanks kept at temp with only 1 heater, it's super versatile. Are you using just a single adjustable air pump with a bunch of splitters for each quarantine container?

[Tom@HaslettMI]

Very cool. I’ve used an even smaller version of this set up to hatch brine shrimp in my cold basement. 

 

Looking forward to more pics and info. 

 

Tom

[sublunary]

Following. This is a very cool idea I'd love to adapt when I eventually have the space

[Lypto]

This looks very much like a jellyfish culturing water table. I'm interested!

[HarryPotter]

Following! Awesome! 

[jahnje]

13 hours ago, Christopher Marks said:

I love that you use one shallow tray of water to simply maintain the temperature of all the containers submerged inside. Multiple quarantine tanks kept at temp with only 1 heater, it's super versatile.

It's great, I can move things from one container to another and they never really notice. Except that maybe the water's cleaner...

 

Here's a video of how I do a 100% water change on my pico reef:

 

13 hours ago, Christopher Marks said:

Are you using just a single adjustable air pump with a bunch of splitters for each quarantine container?

Yes, I got the biggest tetra quiet air pump I could find and hooked up 4 sets of quad splitters on it. So this gives the ability to do 16 containers at once. It doesn't really take much air, so I could probably add another 8 to the system before it started to really effect things.  

[jahnje]

12 hours ago, sublunary said:

Following. This is a very cool idea I'd love to adapt when I eventually have the space

One of the coolest things about this, is you can pack it all away when you're not using it.  That's really why I started doing it. I just don't have enough room to fill with another small tank much less the number needed to do QT right.  So being able to pretty much pack it all up in itself in really nice.  It'll even fit under a bed when not in use. 

[jahnje]

13 hours ago, Tom@HaslettMI said:

Very cool. I’ve used an even smaller version of this set up to hatch brine shrimp in my cold basement. 

I tried brine shrimp in this, but didn't have a lot of luck. I think fairly bad stock, and didn't have a really decent way to get them out of the container.  I used a fine net, which I then swirled around in the tank I wanted to feed.  Seems like like you really want to be able to all of the shells off of the bottom once they've hatched. I guess I could have used a little air hose to siphon or something. But it just didn't work out for me, and I moved on.  Would be curious in finding a decent way to raise pods in this though.

[vlangel]

O yeah, I would love to adapt it for pod or shrimp culturing!  My seahorses would love that too.  I am gonna ponder that.

[jahnje]

Just now, vlangel said:

O yeah, I would love to adapt it for pod or shrimp culturing!  My seahorses would love that too.  I am gonna ponder that.

I was feeding them with spirulina powder, and that seemed ok. I just had  large amount of floating things, and sunk things. All of which appeared to be casings.  But I really have no idea what success looks like in its various states so I couldn't tell.  I think now that I have a better idea of what marine conditions are good, I can probably give it another shot.  Might be worthwhile to order some pods and see how that would work.  Never messing with those at all, but is on my list to try. Apparently far more sustainable than brine shrimp. 

[MedievalITGuy]

Following, this looks like a really cool concept!

[Lypto]

When I hatch brine I just fill a container 3/4th salt and 1/4 distilled, add a little light,heat and motion, and you've got shrimp. What's really useful is if you have a flashlight, put it near the bottom to the side and almost all the shrimp will congregate around. Use a turkey baste to suck up what you like. If you hatch them first and separate from the shells it's much cleaner and you can feed it to sensitive things. There's also decapsulated, which you can just add straight to the tank. I'm curious, could you keep condensation down by putting another container on top of the tray?

[Tom@HaslettMI]

11 hours ago, jahnje said:

I tried brine shrimp in this, but didn't have a lot of luck. I think fairly bad stock, and didn't have a really decent way to get them out of the container.  I used a fine net, which I then swirled around in the tank I wanted to feed.  Seems like like you really want to be able to all of the shells off of the bottom once they've hatched. I guess I could have used a little air hose to siphon or something. But it just didn't work out for me, and I moved on.  Would be curious in finding a decent way to raise pods in this though.

I decapsulated the eggs prior to hatching.  You get a higher hatch rate and don’t have to deal with the shells. 

[jahnje]

9 hours ago, Lypto said:

When I hatch brine I just fill a container 3/4th salt and 1/4 distilled, add a little light,heat and motion, and you've got shrimp.

I had shrimp, but I also had a bottom full of unhatched shrimp... Made it a little difficult to separate.

 

9 hours ago, Lypto said:

What's really useful is if you have a flashlight, put it near the bottom to the side and almost all the shrimp will congregate around. Use a turkey baster to suck up what you like.

I'll try the turkey baster way. That should work a little easier than the net when dealing with all of the unhatched.  Even when using a flashlight to check I still didn't have a good hatching ratio. 

 

9 hours ago, Lypto said:

I'm curious, could you keep condensation down by putting another container on top of the tray?

I thought about cutting holes in the lid, and setting the containers in them. Or getting a taller container that would just let me put the lid over the top.  Since I've got a bunch of other happily evaporating tanks, I don't really worry about condensation or evaporation from this.  I just top it off with tap water once a week or so.  Basically when the little power head i've got starts sucking air.  The containers only have about 3 to 4 inches of water around them.  I haven't had any temperature issues. 

[jahnje]

8 hours ago, Tom@HaslettMI said:

I decapsulated the eggs prior to hatching.  You get a higher hatch rate and don’t have to deal with the shells. 

Cool, I didn't know you could do this, thanks.

 

Found an article here that describes it:

http://rlearley.people.ua.edu/uploads/2/5/6/9/25693686/decapsulating_brine_shrimp_eggs.pdf

[jahnje]

On 1/10/2018 at 9:46 AM, vlangel said:

O yeah, I would love to adapt it for pod or shrimp culturing!  My seahorses would love that too.  I am gonna ponder that.

What kind of shrimp and pods do you use? As in what brand of culture?

Edited January 12, 2018 by jahnje
was unclear.

[vlangel]

On 1/11/2018 at 6:30 AM, jahnje said:

What kind of shrimp and pods do you use? As in what brand of culture?

My feeder shrimp (ghosties)come from an ebay dealer, atyour_doorshrimp.  My pods came from an online dealer too but was 3 years ago or so and I can't remember.

[jahnje]

On 1/12/2018 at 2:44 PM, vlangel said:

My feeder shrimp (ghosties)come from an ebay dealer, atyour_doorshrimp.  My pods came from an online dealer too but was 3 years ago or so and I can't remember.

So I think I'm going to try to raise some pods since there seems to be some interest in that, and at the same time I'm curious to see how my pico will act if I put a bunch in there given the amount of algae and what not. Might result in a better cleanup crew.... who knows...  I'm thinking of seeding with the three species mix from algaebarn, and seeing what will grow in the pico, and what will grow in a separate container.  I think all of the water changes will limit the population in the pico though.  I may also see if I can culture some phytoplankton as well. 

 

I was reading an article on breeding ghost shrimp, and and they were saying that really like planted cover. I've had a decent amount of good luck with keeping plants alive in this system for a limited time. Were you pondering keeping a few containers with shrimp & plants in them for breeding purposes? 

 

https://www.algaebarn.com/product-category/premium-live-foods/copepods/

 

https://aquariuminfo.org/ghostshrimp.html

[vlangel]

Yes, it would be awesome if I could breed feeder shrimp instead of buying them and paying shipping.  The problem with mysis and ghost shrimp is that they will cannibalize their young.  Some folks build a raised screened bottom so the larvae shrimp drop through the screen but the adult shrimp do not fit through it.  I may still try that some time.

[jahnje]

9 hours ago, vlangel said:

Yes, it would be awesome if I could breed feeder shrimp instead of buying them and paying shipping.  The problem with mysis and ghost shrimp is that they will cannibalize their young.  Some folks build a raised screened bottom so the larvae shrimp drop through the screen but the adult shrimp do not fit through it.  I may still try that some time.

I guess you might be able to use a container for a growout tank then.  When you see a female fanning her eggs, take her out and place her in a separate container until the eggs hatch, then remove her and put her back in the main 'dating' tank.  That way you don't have to move the fry, just the mom.  

[vlangel]

1 hour ago, jahnje said:

I guess you might be able to use a container for a growout tank then.  When you see a female fanning her eggs, take her out and place her in a separate container until the eggs hatch, then remove her and put her back in the main 'dating' tank.  That way you don't have to move the fry, just the mom.  

That is a good idea since the eggs are plain to see!  Thank you.

[jahnje]

Had some brine shrimp eggs sitting around going stale, so thought I'd see if I could get them to hatch.  Using @Tom@HaslettMI suggestion I attempted to decasulate them. And we'll just have to see what happens. 

 

Soaked and stirred in RO water for an hour:

 

Added an equal amount of bleach and let stir for 5 min:

 

poured RO water through to remove bleach. Didn't have a net small enough catch eggs, so used some coffee filters stuck into a small net. This took longer than expected, so it's possible that they stayed in bleach water too long. 

 

Then put into QT system to see what happens. Tipped bucket up on some tiles to make sure eggs drift towards bottom. and air bubbles do the stirring. Have a second 38 coral bulb to light the container.  SG is at 1.018 using RC. 

  

 

random notes, Should of used far less water, so I could have used far less bleach. 75 or 100 ml would have been enough. Use a bring filter for faster rinsing.