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Hello! And yet another "help me pick a tank" thread....


Detritus

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I'm just starting the tank, see my second link below.  Rock and sand will arrive Wednesday so hoping to get it wet this weekend once the aquascape is done.  Hope over to my link and discuss more, don't want to steal your thunder here :)

 

 

 

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With a rimless that's not aio most use a sump for the clean look.

 

Others may use an hob with the heater in it but then the hob is seen unless the back of the tank is black, in that case, the filter blends better. 

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13 hours ago, clamstamp said:

Take a look at Ultum Nature Systems rimless aquariums. Search it and you should find them for sale at BucePlant. And I would recommend not to drill, instead use a lifereef nano overflow box. Or a Cpr hang on back refugium. Something to consider....

Morning! Thanks for the tip about the tanks! I actually saw (some of?) their 4 gallon and under tanks listed on Amazon, but I don't believe they had anything larger than about 4 gallons. I have never heard of Buceplant.com though, have you personally ordered from them?

 

Thanks!

 

-Detritus

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9 hours ago, Clown79 said:

With a rimless that's not aio most use a sump for the clean look.

 

Others may use an hob with the heater in it but then the hob is seen unless the back of the tank is black, in that case, the filter blends better. 

Hi! Yes, a clean look is what I'm hoping for. Do you have any info or links on how tanks are being drilled, as far as the number of holes and plumbing setups? I have drilled tanks before, that part is not a big deal. But I've come across mention of specific "style", if you will, of drilling the tanks, there was a name for it, and it involved drilling multiple holes for outflow and return lines. Any idea what I'm talking about? Sorry to be such a noob about these things! I'm really just looking to learn about efficient, and quiet plumping setups from the tank to the sump and back again. 

 

Thanks very much!

 

-D

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3 hours ago, Detritus said:

Hi! Yes, a clean look is what I'm hoping for. Do you have any info or links on how tanks are being drilled, as far as the number of holes and plumbing setups? I have drilled tanks before, that part is not a big deal. But I've come across mention of specific "style", if you will, of drilling the tanks, there was a name for it, and it involved drilling multiple holes for outflow and return lines. Any idea what I'm talking about? Sorry to be such a noob about these things! I'm really just looking to learn about efficient, and quiet plumping setups from the tank to the sump and back again. 

 

Thanks very much!

 

-D

I wish I could help, I have always run sumpless tanks. 

I'm a complete noob when it comes to the plumbing of a sump.

 

 

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Well thank you anyway! I'm sure someone will be able to help me figure this out, or I'll find what I saw previously. Before I make a final decision on a tank, I want to look into plumbing one of these rimless tanks for a sump.

 

Thanks again!

 

-D

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you can go out the bottom or side.  i can take a picture of what mine looks like out the bottom.  

 

there are a few holes in the plumbing at the top.  on the outflow to the sump there is a hole to break suction if the water gets low in the tank.  there is another on the return to break suction if your pump turns off the water will not backflow into the sump.  my tank came with a kit for this but they sell them seperatly.  you may want a partition to hide the pipes in the tank.

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1 hour ago, Flexin said:

you can go out the bottom or side.  i can take a picture of what mine looks like out the bottom.  

 

there are a few holes in the plumbing at the top.  on the outflow to the sump there is a hole to break suction if the water gets low in the tank.  there is another on the return to break suction if your pump turns off the water will not backflow into the sump.  my tank came with a kit for this but they sell them seperatly.  you may want a partition to hide the pipes in the tank.

Hello again! Are you talking about a regular reef ready tank, and what I think is called a Durso overflow system? Turns out what I was thinking of before is called a BeanAnimal system, which I'm going to look into further tonight. I picked that up from a video by the good folks at Bulk Reef Supply, so thanks BRS guys!

 

-D

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WooHoo, ladies and gentleman! I now have officially exceeded 15 posts, so I believe I can begin to avail myself of the hot deals that are sure to be found on nr.com's classified section! And if that sounded like a guy who wants to sell you something, I'm not at all that guy ;-) I'm just thinking if I can get a great nano LED light in like-new condition, I'd jump on it.

 

I also know this thread is kind of rambling, but if I have anyone's attentions still...... 

 

After much deliberation, I now feel that the best "bang for my buck" will be with the largest tank I can successfully light using one of what I, with my limited current knowledge, would call a "serious" light. I know lighting suggestions are very hotly debated, but is there a maximum tank size or dimensions that an AI Prime HD will light, without producing shaded areas, and while still capable of supporting higher-end SPS (let's just assume I'm the most talented reefer going, and all I want to do is SPS)? I have FOR YEARS read about Kessil's, and pretty much decided that they are far over my budget and needs, but now I'm seeing that a Kessil A160we isn't that expensive (for science's sake, please don't let my wife see this!

 

So I want to ask, what would be the the most budget friendly (i.e. under $300) light that I can purchase that supports an SPS tank of about 20-40 gallons? Is there any single light that can light an SPS tank that's 24 inches long? 

 

Thanks ladies and gents!

 

-Detritus

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I had a AI prime HD over a 20 gallon tank had a few monti's and birds nest that steadily grew no shaded spots. But it was about 15-18 inches of the top of the tank.

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24x24 is the max spread of the prime. 

Ppl have used them on larger but you will get shadowing on longer than 24". 

 

The prime is an excellent light. Very strong but after 24" any single pendant light will have shadowing.

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4 hours ago, Clown79 said:

24x24 is the max spread of the prime. 

Ppl have used them on larger but you will get shadowing on longer than 24". 

 

The prime is an excellent light. Very strong but after 24" any single pendant light will have shadowing.

I have read about the 24"x24" spread if the AI Prime, but is that true for SPS and other higher-light inverts? And, if my proposed tank is only say 12 or 16 inches from front to back, will I have a lot of light spill over to deal with?

 

Thank you for your help!

 

-Detritus

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7 hours ago, 1967type1 said:

I had a AI prime HD over a 20 gallon tank had a few monti's and birds nest that steadily grew no shaded spots. But it was about 15-18 inches of the top of the tank.

Thank you, that's great to know! So do you mean you had the light placed 15-18 inches above the tank's water surface?

 

Thanks for the help!

 

-Detritus

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There is always spill over with led unless you build a canopy for it.

 

I have sps under a prime, my tank is 24x13x13.

 

The shape of the tank, height and depth will all effect how well the light will spread and the par. 

Coral placement is another factor.

 

Ex. A 32g biocube will be able to use 1 prime much better than a standard or long 30g.

 

If you plan on anything longer than 24", you will need multiple pendants. 

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7 hours ago, Clown79 said:

There is always spill over with led unless you build a canopy for it.

 

I have sps under a prime, my tank is 24x13x13.

 

The shape of the tank, height and depth will all effect how well the light will spread and the par. 

Coral placement is another factor.

 

Ex. A 32g biocube will be able to use 1 prime much better than a standard or long 30g.

 

If you plan on anything longer than 24", you will need multiple pendants. 

Hey buddy! I understand aquascapping and corral placement will affect par. But I'm asking just to try to understand the capabilities of the light, would you say you could grow a higher-light demanding corral on the bottom of the tank, right up near the sides? Clearly, in the real world you position higher-light needing corrals right under the light, and those that don't need as much light can live on those outermost part of the rockscape. And you feel that if I get a Prime HD and stay inside that 24x24 inch range, I'll be happy? Do you think it's worth looking into any other lights? Thank you for your help, I really appreciate it!

 

-D

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Yes.

 

Many use the prime and have sps. If using multiple units you can place sps anywhere as long as the height of the tank is within the limits of the light.

 

If you use only one unit and the tank is beyond 24" you will have a lot of shadowing on the sides. As the tank gets longer the light will need to be placed higher for better spread but then the par depth is also effected.

 

The prime hd is 24x24.

The standard prime's strongest light level is 18x18. 

 

So with using only 1 unit, you would need to keep sps within theses ranges and mid to top placement.

 

If you want a full sps tank, then the budget on your lighting needs to be upped. It's the most expensive aspect of the tank budget.

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1 hour ago, Clown79 said:

The standard prime's strongest light level is 18x18. 

Perfect! Thank you sir, this is EXACTLY what I was trying to figure out. So if I stuck to a tank that has a display area of no more than 24" in either direction, and my rock and corrals were somewhere in that 18" sweet zone (plus strategic placement), I should be able to grow almost anything I want with one AI Prime HD, right? is there any other light I should be considering? I admit I like the price point (well, kind of)  of the AI Prime, and it's wifi features/setup interface. Is the benefit of the Kessils really just that shimmer, which looks COOL to my noob eyes, but some say causes distress, headaches, and possibly seizures (OK, I might have made up that last one, lol!)?

 

Otherwise, the AI Prime HD sounds perfect, and I'm now strongly considering the IM Nuvo Black 40 gallon, which measures roughly 24"Lx20"Wx19"H. I'm going to have to give some real thought to where this tank will be located in the house, where my water change water will be stored, plus the cost of rock, livestock, saltwater and filter media over time, etc, but I could really see this as my next tank. For tanks above about 30 gallons, I think, from my humble experience and knowledge, that having a sump, and going more of a "traditional" filter system route, is advantageous. So rather than pay for the IM Nuvo *Fussion* 40, with the All-In-One filter system, I'm now thinking it would be better to go for the IM Nuvo *Black* 40 gallon, which is their non-AIO tank with a smoked black back panel. I am also a long time ReefCentral member, and I found a thread there where a guy drilled an IM Nuvo Black 40 for an Eshopps overflow (available through Doctor's Foster Smith, I believe) that looks like it's that BeanAnimal system I was talking about before. This overflow system, from what I've read, is supposed to be reasonably fail-safe, quiet, and, most importantly for me personally, idiot proof. I'm an amateur to semiprofessional woodworker, and for this tank I'd definitely want to build a stand, but I could plan and build it to accommodate a really decent sump, thereby gaining extra volume, and I personally think better, more efficient filtration (i.e. a "real" skimmer, media reactor, refugium, etc.). Does this sound like a decent plan?

 

Is a 40 gallon still considered a nano? Will you guys still help me here, or boot me back to RC?

 

Thank very much to everyone who stops by and considers my questions!

 

-Detritus

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2 minutes ago, Flexin said:

There are a few tanks over 30 gallons here and everyone is helpful.  Some of the folks here are also on other forums regardless of tank size.

Awesome! I figured that, I just wanted to ask ;-) Thanks, Flexin, I appreciate your help here!

 

Yeah, if I can do ONE AI Prime or a similar light over a 30 or 40 gallon, AND I can find room for it in our modest home and meeker budget, I think I'd be crazy for not going big, right? Plus, the money I'd save on the AIO system I can put towards the bigger tank and overflow system. And though I've read about many people who run these AIO tanks stock, the first thing I'd do - I mean, the day I place the order for the tank - would be to upgrade the pump on any AIO I got. Add to that the potential to pay for lights you don't really want/need in the end, to be more constricted with the filtration and refugium options, and  I think it might be best to try a more traditional, larger system with a sump.

 

I want to ask, and I want to remind everyone that for this tank the inverts are far more important to me than the fish, but at 40 gallons can I safely house something like a Corral Beauty Angel Fish, or a small Flame Angel Fish?  Could I have a tang that's not a yellow tang? I know tang fish need A LOT of real estate. Could I have an anemone and clown fish symbiosis? THAT would be AWESOME to me! I have been thinking all along these kind of fish and fish/invert relationships would not be possible in a super small tank, and that's totally alright, but at 40 gallons, could I do any of this?

 

Thanks very much everyone, I really appreciate all the help!!

 

-Detritus

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Oh, and clearly if I get fully enthralled in the hobby yet again, and really *need* a larger tank than 40 gallons, I could consider upgrading to my 65 or another larger tank, and then adding extra AI Prime's, right? To me, upgrading tanks and adding the additional light of the same model seems to make more sense, and seems to be more cost effective, than buying lights "just to get started", and then replacing them on the same tank. And one thing I'm certainly going to avoid just because I doesn't appeal to me is hanging more than one type of light over the tank (without a canopy, which I don't want). I just want this tank to look as good from the outside as the inside, and not that we have some amazing house like I've seen in the journals, but I want this tank to *look* like it *could* fit in to one of those houses ;-)

 

Thanks all!!

 

-D

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Angels can pick at corals. Some have lucked out with angels and others not so much.

 

No tangs under 70g and that's even small for them. 

 

Other than Ai, the one light I would pay more money for is a Radion. 

Kessil are nice but you need to buy a controller for them, that for me was a deal breaker. I feel that it should be part of the light not something you need to pay for. 

 

Lighting is one of the most important pieces of equipment. Personally for me my light was the important factor. All other upgrades came later on.

 

Pump upgrade isn't necessary but a good light is.

 

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^^Yes, a great light is paramount, so that's why I'm hoping to get some real-life suggestions by you guys. I did see the Radion, but didn't know much about it. The Kessil shimmer I saw in some videos and things looks really, really great to me, but I'm not sure if I would like it all the time. Yes, the controller should included with the cost of the light, I couldn't agree more, but the controller is an extra $100, which I'd gladly pay if it was truly worth it. But everything keeps coming back to that AI Prime, and I'm thinking that might be the way to go for me. Is the only difference between a Prime and a Prime HD the fact that you can set some channels to zero, and push others to greater than 100% with the Prime HD? Any other suggestions on lighting?

 

And thank you for the livestock advice too! I didn't think a tang was really possible in a 40 gallon, but I was hoping for the Corral Beauty. No matter, a larger tank is still room for more inverts, and I'm perfectly fine with that. 

 

Thanks for your help!

 

-Detritus

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Hey guys! I'm still trying to get a handle on a tank/light combo, and if anyone is still stopping by I'd like to ask if I went with one of the Innovative Marine Nuvo Black 40 gallon, the dimensions of which are roughly 24"Lx20Wx19H, is the AI Prime HD+ still the best way to go? I know in the future I will want to keep SPS corrals, should I be looking at the next step up Hydra from AI? Though seemingly more powerful and more expensive, the reviews for the Hydra were not as great as the Prime, which looks like AI's most popular light. I've seen other tanks here in the 10 to 20 gallon range with the AI Prime, and they are beautiful, but is one enough for the IM Nuvo Black 40 (note: NOT 36" long like a 40 breeder). In this case, I don't mind starting with one AI Prime and if I thought I needed to later I could add another one. I don't mind that because I would be adding a second, high-end light, not replacing an inferior one. 

 

What about Nanobox, which I've come across only fairly recently? Should I be looking at those? Are they really hand made by one guy? It appears to me that the Nanobox has quite the following. And just to be clear, the deal with Kessil is if you can afford the fairly expensive light, and the extra for the controller, and don't mind the non wifi setup, and like the shimmer, THEN they are something to strongly consider? I'm asking again because FOR YEARS I have read or heard about Kessil, and at the beginning of this newest plunge back into the hobby I would have really thought they were the top of the line. I also just want to be careful and really make sure I'm getting the right stuff for my situation right from the start, I don't want to be playing trial and error with $300+ light sets. 

 

I really think if I find a place in the house for the tank itself, and the water change water reservoir, etc, I'm going to try to get the IM Nuvo Black 40 gallon. I think with this size I would go with the Nuvo Black non-AIO version, and drill it for (tentatively) an Eshopps Eclipse BeanAnimal style overflow to a sump in a custom build cabinet stand. This way I feel like I will have more choices and options for things like skimmers (which I would personally want on 40 gallons), reactors, a fuge, ATO, etc. The AIO thing is SO appealing, and I think if I was to change my mind again and do a 20 or less, I'd go AIO. But at 40 gallons, I think I'd be happier with a more traditional sump system. Does anyone disagree with that idea?

 

Thanks a lot guys! I know this is a lot of posting for some basic noob questions, but I really want to plan, plan, plan, and I very much appreciate the help with all this!

 

-Detritus

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You should be fine with 24x20x19. You can always add another down the road.

 

Radion is the cats ass lighting.

 

Ai is very popular and used on various size tanks successfully. It's often under rated by many but it's quite the powerful light

 

Nanobox is gaining in popularity. 

 

 

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7 hours ago, Detritus said:

Hey guys! I'm still trying to get a handle on a tank/light combo, and if anyone is still stopping by I'd like to ask if I went with one of the Innovative Marine Nuvo Black 40 gallon, the dimensions of which are roughly 24"Lx20Wx19H, is the AI Prime HD+ still the best way to go? I know in the future I will want to keep SPS corrals, should I be looking at the next step up Hydra from AI? Though seemingly more powerful and more expensive, the reviews for the Hydra were not as great as the Prime, which looks like AI's most popular light. I've seen other tanks here in the 10 to 20 gallon range with the AI Prime, and they are beautiful, but is one enough for the IM Nuvo Black 40 (note: NOT 36" long like a 40 breeder). In this case, I don't mind starting with one AI Prime and if I thought I needed to later I could add another one. I don't mind that because I would be adding a second, high-end light, not replacing an inferior one. 

 

What about Nanobox, which I've come across only fairly recently? Should I be looking at those? Are they really hand made by one guy? It appears to me that the Nanobox has quite the following. And just to be clear, the deal with Kessil is if you can afford the fairly expensive light, and the extra for the controller, and don't mind the non wifi setup, and like the shimmer, THEN they are something to strongly consider? I'm asking again because FOR YEARS I have read or heard about Kessil, and at the beginning of this newest plunge back into the hobby I would have really thought they were the top of the line. I also just want to be careful and really make sure I'm getting the right stuff for my situation right from the start, I don't want to be playing trial and error with $300+ light sets. 

 

I really think if I find a place in the house for the tank itself, and the water change water reservoir, etc, I'm going to try to get the IM Nuvo Black 40 gallon. I think with this size I would go with the Nuvo Black non-AIO version, and drill it for (tentatively) an Eshopps Eclipse BeanAnimal style overflow to a sump in a custom build cabinet stand. This way I feel like I will have more choices and options for things like skimmers (which I would personally want on 40 gallons), reactors, a fuge, ATO, etc. The AIO thing is SO appealing, and I think if I was to change my mind again and do a 20 or less, I'd go AIO. But at 40 gallons, I think I'd be happier with a more traditional sump system. Does anyone disagree with that idea?

 

Thanks a lot guys! I know this is a lot of posting for some basic noob questions, but I really want to plan, plan, plan, and I very much appreciate the help with all this!

 

-Detritus

Yes, NanoBox lights are really made by @DaveFason by hand.  A lot of people are very happy with them.

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