Help! White mix at surface - no idea what this might be.

[cju84]

Hey all - I've been away from the forums for quite some time but over the past month or two, there has been white gunk accumulating at the surface of my tank.  It almost looks like salt particles just nestling up there.  I've been doing 50% water changes the past few weeks and it's not going away.  I wonder if perhaps my powerhead was too far below the surface and therefore it's been collecting?  Has my salt mix gone bad?  Does this look like anything else anyone has seen?  

 

This is a 5g pico with a koralia 240 pump.  I have one clown, 3 peppermint shrimp, and a few other cleanup crew dudes.

 

Also, the tank is about 3 years old now if that means anything.  Not really any other issues to report.

 

I apologize if this should have been sent to the pest forum.

 

Thanks guys!

 

 

[cju84]

(tried to delete this post -  added another pic to top post)

 

 

[Mariaface]

You need adequate surface skimming. It's a surface scum layer where gunk just sort of... builds up. If I let my 'fish saver' overflow guards get too clogged, the water level will rise up enough that the surface isn't skimmed anymore and I'll get this. 

 

I'm not sure if pointing the powerhead up will resolve the issue at this point, but next water change you may want to remove water from the surface instead of from the bottom of the tank. Skim the top with a container, for example.

[cju84]

11 minutes ago, Mariaface said:

You need adequate surface skimming. It's a surface scum layer where gunk just sort of... builds up. If I let my 'fish saver' overflow guards get too clogged, the water level will rise up enough that the surface isn't skimmed anymore and I'll get this. 

 

I'm not sure if pointing the powerhead up will resolve the issue at this point, but next water change you may want to remove water from the surface instead of from the bottom of the tank. Skim the top with a container, for example.

Thanks Maria.  Any idea why after 3 years this would happen?  

[Mariaface]

3 minutes ago, cju84 said:

Thanks Maria.  Any idea why after 3 years this would happen?  

 

All of a sudden? Maybe additional organic content in the water, maybe something being sprayed around the house (or dust or other contaminants). Maybe the pump is running slower (calcium buildup, the impeller?), and can't agitate the surface as well? 

[pal]

Are you dosing 2 part? Maybe check your magnesium levels.

[cju84]

21 minutes ago, pal said:

Are you dosing 2 part? Maybe check your magnesium levels.

Not dosing with anything   I'll have to check levels.  

[pal]

38 minutes ago, cju84 said:

Not dosing with anything   I'll have to check levels.  

Hmm. I  have no idea then. Really looks strange , following along .

[WV Reefer]

Yeah, that's weird. It looks crusty........ can you scoop it out? Or is it more foamy?

[MainelyReefer]

How have you been managing surface scum previously? No surface skimmer into a filtration area? No protien skimmer ever either? Do you use a gravel vacuum for water changes and keep the nozzle below the surface therefore never removing the built up proteins? When I first started I had the fish guards similar to the other poster and no protien skimmer and my water surface got cloudy and white and bubbly, as soon as I removed the fish guards and added a skimmer the issue never reccured.  Get a wet vac and surface skim the top that way next WC, it works great!

[cju84]

1 hour ago, GraniteReefer said:

How have you been managing surface scum previously? No surface skimmer into a filtration area? No protien skimmer ever either? Do you use a gravel vacuum for water changes and keep the nozzle below the surface therefore never removing the built up proteins? When I first started I had the fish guards similar to the other poster and no protien skimmer and my water surface got cloudy and white and bubbly, as soon as I removed the fish guards and added a skimmer the issue never reccured.  Get a wet vac and surface skim the top that way next WC, it works great!

 

In almost 3 years, I've never had any scum/issue with this tank.  Never had a skimmer as this is only a 5 gallon tank and the live rock has handled all filtration just fine (with regular water changes).  Hence, I'm freaking out about why all of a sudden this happened.

 

The other thing I have noticed is that there seems to be hundreds of 'tube worms' or something similar that have made their way across all of my corals and rock.  My frogspawn stem/branch recently broke into several pieces and am not sure why this happened either.  If it's a result of these worms/vermitids (?), I'm not sure what happened to cause their growth/multiplication.  Separate issue I guess   

 

Here's a pic of what I believe to be tube worms - anyone have an idea of what these are?  

 

 

 

 

[Clown79]

Hard to tell in the pic but it almost looks like salt creep.

 

1. Is the buildup oily looking,  crusty, foamy?

 

2. How old is your salt and what salt are you using?

 

3. Filtration method (hob, aio, sump)

 

4. What media do you use and how often  is it changed?

 

5. Do you vacuum sand and turkey bast the rocks?

 

6. How often do you test the water?

 

7. What is the water source? Tap, ro/di, distilled, or ro 

 

Sorry for all the questions but it will help us help you with this situation.

 

The tubes are spionid worms. You can snap them off with tweezers or put a dab of crazy glue on the opening.

 

For the time being I would attempt using some paper towel on the surface to remove the scum physically

 

Do more smaller water changes through the week.

Instead of 1 -50% maybe do 2 or 3-  20% weekly waterchanges. 

 

If you are running an hob, maybe add a surface skimmer (not the same as a protein skimmer) or buy an hob with a built in one. The seachem tidal 55 is great and there is the Api Superclean

Both have built in surface skimmers.

 

Try putting your powerhead on the back glass wall 1-2" below the surface. This may help break it up better

[cju84]

On 8/12/2017 at 0:17 AM, Clown79 said:

Hard to tell in the pic but it almost looks like salt creep.

 

1. Is the buildup oily looking,  crusty, foamy?

 

2. How old is your salt and what salt are you using?

 

3. Filtration method (hob, aio, sump)

 

4. What media do you use and how often  is it changed?

 

5. Do you vacuum sand and turkey bast the rocks?

 

6. How often do you test the water?

 

7. What is the water source? Tap, ro/di, distilled, or ro 

 

Sorry for all the questions but it will help us help you with this situation.

 

The tubes are spionid worms. You can snap them off with tweezers or put a dab of crazy glue on the opening.

 

For the time being I would attempt using some paper towel on the surface to remove the scum physically

 

Do more smaller water changes through the week.

Instead of 1 -50% maybe do 2 or 3-  20% weekly waterchanges. 

 

If you are running an hob, maybe add a surface skimmer (not the same as a protein skimmer) or buy an hob with a built in one. The seachem tidal 55 is great and there is the Api Superclean

Both have built in surface skimmers.

 

Try putting your powerhead on the back glass wall 1-2" below the surface. This may help break it up better

Thanks for the reply and questions - I realized I left a lot of info out.  It looks like a build up of salt (assume salt creep?) but I hadn't heard of salt creep before.  

 

The salt is about 3 years old and I use Red Sea Coral Pro Salt mix.  Do you think it's time for new salt?

 

I don't have any filtration other than the live rock (it's a 5g tank).

 

I vacuum sand every water change, but do NOT turkey bast the rocks.

 

I haven't tested the water in a couple years due to not having issues, but I can definitely see the need for that now

 

Water source has always been distilled.

 

Regarding the spionid worms, can they kill/hurt LPS corals - specifically frogspawn and candy canes?  

 

Should I be thinking about a surface skimmer given this is only a 5g pico tank?  

 

Thanks again for all your suggestions!

[pal]

Could it be this happening in your tank?

 

[Clown79]

The lack of filtration is a possible cause for the buildup.

 

Other than waterchanges, there's nothing removing particles out of the water.

 

I would add an hob filter, preferably with a surface skimmer.

Use filter floss and carbon in it. 

Filter floss is removed and replaced twice a week. This collects particles in water, poop, access detritus.

Carbon will help polish the water. It's replaced every 3 weeks but the bag is rinsed weekly 

 

Start turkey basting the rocks before your water changes 

 

Testing is important.

 

The salt being 3 yrs old could be an issue.

Precipitation could be an issue.

[cju84]

13 hours ago, pal said:

Could it be this happening in your tank?

I don't think so.  I've always mixed my salt exactly as directed (which is inline with the video).  Thanks!

 

[cju84]

10 hours ago, Clown79 said:

The lack of filtration is a possible cause for the buildup.

 

Other than waterchanges, there's nothing removing particles out of the water.

 

I would add an hob filter, preferably with a surface skimmer.

Use filter floss and carbon in it. 

Filter floss is removed and replaced twice a week. This collects particles in water, poop, access detritus.

Carbon will help polish the water. It's replaced every 3 weeks but the bag is rinsed weekly 

 

Start turkey basting the rocks before your water changes 

 

Testing is important.

 

The salt being 3 yrs old could be an issue.

Precipitation could be an issue.

Thanks again for the suggestions, Clown79.

 

I do agree that an HOB filter is not a bad idea at this point.  Through these forums and elsewhere though it seems the consensus is that a filter is absolutely not needed for a tank as small as mine and that there is no need for additional filtration outside of weekly water changes.  I think if I was having this problem in the first several months/year of the tank's life, I probably would have gone the external filter route.

 

The fact that this is 3 years old without any prior issues (and substantial growth) suggests/confirms (to me) that the water changes were enough.

 

I hope I'm not coming off as dismissive as I know you're trying to help!  It just doesn't make sense to me that more filtration would all of a suddenly be needed.

 

Regardless, I'll check out the API Superclean filter that you suggested.  What worries me is that I need to have a lid on my tank due to the never ending cat hair that is around my condo.  Perhaps it's time to make a DIY lid that can accommodate one.

 

[pal]

31 minutes ago, cju84 said:

.  I've always mixed my salt exactly as directed

I meant it was happening in your tank , your temp normal?

[cju84]

1 minute ago, pal said:

I meant it was happening in your tank , your temp normal?

Temp is always 78-80, closer to 80 degrees.  There hasn't been any cloudyness in the actual tank (nor when the salt is mixed), just the surface layer which looks like salt particles.

 

When I did last week's water change, I removed only the surface water (using a cup) which basically removed all of the white stuff.  However, as the days go on it slowly builds back up.

 

I think I'm going to buy new salt and give that a whirl.