Water Changes = Higher Parameters!?

[JonathanDillio]

So I am on week 4 of my cycle and things have been going ok and I guess as expected.

 

I say "i guess" because I used the Red Sea Reef Mature Pro Kit to help with my cycle and it did not do any of the things it says it was supposed to. Says its a 21 days cycle but here we are at week 4 and we are still not finished with the cycle. 

 

I have a Red Sea Max Nano tank and I did a 6 gallon water change yesterday. Amy Ammonia, Nitrite, and Nitrate all tested higher then the day before. Is that normal? My pH has been a joke. Everything I try to do to get that number higher doesnt work. The day of my water changes it jumps up to 8.0 but the rest of the days of the week it stays at 7.6. 

 

Right now my parameters are as follows

Temp = 79.9

Salinity = 1.025

ph = 8.0 (because of water change)

Alkalinity = 9.0 dKH 

Ammonia = 0.3ppm

Nitrite = 0.4ppm

Nitrate = 30-40ppm

 

Before the water change my Ammonia was at 0.1ppm , my Nitrite was at 0.2ppm, and my Nitrate was at 30ppm.

 

I only dose the tank with NO3:PO4-X on a daily basis and I use Red Sea Coral Pro Salt. 

 

Any suggestions would help. I know that Im still in the midst of my cycle and that some cycles take longer (especially since I used cured dry rock and live sand). Im more wondering if the numbers look "good" and if its normal to see a light spike in parameters after a water change. It seems weird to me because I always see people talking about doing water changes to get nutrients lower. PS, this is my first ever saltwater tank. 

[Clown79]

During cycling you shouldn't do a waterchange.

 

The waterchange occurs once the cycle is complete. A large water change reduces the nitrates.

 

I wouldn't dose anything during the cycle like n03:p04x.

 

As for ph, don't chase it. It fluctuates all day long and is effected by photosynthesis.

 

Do you have good water movement, especially on the surface?

[JonathanDillio]

30 minutes ago, Clown79 said:

During cycling you shouldn't do a waterchange.

 

The waterchange occurs once the cycle is complete. A large water change reduces the nitrates.

 

I wouldn't dose anything during the cycle like n03:p04x.

 

As for ph, don't chase it. It fluctuates all day long and is effected by photosynthesis.

 

Do you have good water movement, especially on the surface?

The Mature Reef Pro Kit has specifics intructions on doing water changes and dosing with chemicals that are in the kit. The NOPOX was one of the things in the kit and it said to conitinue to dose if your nitrates are higher then 10ppm. 

 

I have read multiple different opinions on water changes during cycles and I don't know what to follow/believe. It's all quite mind knumbing. 

[Clown79]

That kit seems to be very complicated, you're not the only one who has had difficulties.

 

I am not certain how to help because I've always cycled with just liverock or dry rock/liverock mix.

 

The easiest cycling would have been

 

1. Using liverock 

2. Using dry rock with ammonia and bacteria dosing.

 

A

[JonathanDillio]

Lol, lesson learned 

[WV Reefer]

26 minutes ago, JonathanDillio said:

Lol, lesson learned 

 

Here's my 2¢:

 

know your own tank. 

 

I know it's hard to be patient when it's your first tank (or the third) but let the tank sit. No more water changes, no more additives.  Do not chase numbers. 

 

I like to get a feel feel for my tanks....test it often during this time for the basics but mostly: temp, sg, and ph.  Note how these fluctuate during different times of the day.  Get an idea of how much you are topping off each week, etc.

 

Your numbers may never be "perfect" but by doing this you will know what is normal for your tank.

 

The cycle will happen. . 

[brandon429]

Our cycling thread at r2r says all cycles behave the same way and that this tank falls into category of mixed substrates cycle version

 

What kind of live sand was used here

 

What ammonia test kit is reading .3 can you post a pic of the actual test reading this is critical

 

 

 

The thread reveals you cannot base your cycle completion assessment on the metabolic mix of water at the tail end of a cycle. it must be assessed by a digestion test ran on fully changed water, since we're testing -substrate- cycling ability by that method and not a bunch of partially degraded once spiked metabolites.

 

You can wait for natural systems to run fully in the unbalanced mix. Nanos can simply speed things up with a rip change.

 

All digestion tests are the same

 

Make the water free of ammonia

 

Add using specific online calculators the amount of pure liquid ammonia it takes so your water column is 1 ppm

 

Test ammonia in 24 hrs. Have a completely different name brand ammonia kit run the same sample post pics

 

It's possible to absolutely wrangle a noncompliant cycle into direct compliance.

 

In our cycling thread everything revolves around key terms, look how many apply from your thread:

 

At least 30 days underwater before evaluation

 

Measures ammonia only the other two parameters do not matter in cycling, we measure one parameter. 

 

Verification of tests. Never accepting the non verified reading from a different brand and type, ideally.

 

Uses some form of pre- seeding or boosting of cycle inclusions- in this case live sand and the dosers although no pox has no place in cycling.

 

Your issue is that you're evaluating the messwater 

 

Make it new water, then digest test, that tells only what your substrates are doing. Pretty much all Reef aquariums fall into three types of cycles and they're all the same always

Lastly, if your substrates cannot pass a standard digestion test at 30 days submersion, then simply take two more weeks and this time use simply dr Tim's.