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yungKitten

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yungKitten

So I have had a Nano Koralia for god knows how long. I have two in a tank I that has been cycling for a little over two weeks. I went to reposition one of them and noticed it was not working. When I pulled it out I observed that the rear part was not sitting flush with the front part. I opened it up and some blue stuff fell out out of it. It looks like it's some kind of water proofing for the motor. It looks like it deteriorated in a way that it's definitely not supposed to. I'm worried about what kind of effect it could have had on the tank. I'm also kinda pissed that the powerhead broke. Any one else had this experience? Any advice would be super. Thanks!
 

Messedup240.jpg

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yungKitten

I should be a little worried, right?

I'm gonna contact Hydor and see what they say. I'll update this thread when I hear back from them.

Again, any input would be super.

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Weetabix7
1 minute ago, yungKitten said:

I should be a little worried, right?

I'm gonna contact Hydor and see what they say. I'll update this thread when I hear back from them.

Again, any input would be super.

 

Not sure what to tell you other than yeah, you should def contact Hydor. 

  • Like 2
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I have no input but much interest since that is the same unit I put in my Evo 13.5 tank. Hopefully the manufactured can help.

It looks like some sort of poured silicone sealant that has thermally degraded. It could be many causes from insufficient degassing allowing bubbles in the silicone which could expand and contract with temp changes allowing mechanical breakdown until it allowed salt water into the unit.  Seems like a resin would have been a better bet for long term reliability.

I would love to know the cause for curiosity sake and to determine if I need to replace mine  to avoid a similar failure.

  • Like 2
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yungKitten

@MrJoel I'm hoping that this is just some kind of manufacturing defect in this particular powerhead. My last tank (which was about a decade ago) I had two 240's and they operated without issue for about 2 years. (I went to college and tore the tank down. They were still working then.) I'm not sure how long I've had this particular one (definitely less than a year) I've heard only good things about 240s, so this comes as a bit of a surprise to me. I've left a voice message and written message for Hydor. I'll let y'all know what's up when they get back to me.

Side note: Is there a comparable powerhead that y'all would recommend in case I get shafted by Hydor? (an MP10 is definitely out of my price range) I've hear good things about Tunze

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I've never had issue with the hydors but not a single company has gone without issues. Even the mp's have had ppl complain of rusting.

 

Jebao sw-2 is tiny and a fantastic price

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  • 3 weeks later...
yungKitten

Update: Now both of my 240's have shit the bed. I've tried contacting Hydor four times now and I still haven't heard back from them. Very disappointed.  

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I have a Jebao RW4 that's decent and cheap, looks like that now the PP series... I don't know how it's different form the SW series.

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yungKitten
12 minutes ago, MrJoel said:

Same kind of failure?

No visible damage. I haven't checked the insides yet.

Edit: Actually yeah, it looks like the same kind of failure. I'll post pictures in a minute.

Thanks for the suggestions. I was hesitant to use what appears to be a direct from china product, but it sounds like people have had good experiences with Jebao.

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Not as bad as the first, but not good either way. Jebao pumps have been around and working long enough that I would recommend them and a nice cheaper pump.

I would have recommended Aqamai KPS, but that is a Hydor company.

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That looks awful!
Gotta say its the first I've seen this happen to any hydor products. Crazy though... maybe a bad batch? I've probably owned at least 20 of these pumps over the years and never had any blow up like that. Way to make us reefers feel uneasy! Yeesh.

Let us know what Hydor says.

  • Like 1
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yungKitten
1 minute ago, TJ_Burton said:

That looks awful!
Gotta say its the first I've seen this happen to any hydor products. Crazy though... maybe a bad batch? I've probably owned at least 20 of these pumps over the years and never had any blow up like that. Way to make us reefers feel uneasy! Yeesh.

Let us know what Hydor says.

I actually had two 240's about nine years ago that ran without issue for just under two years. Unfortunately these particular pumps were purchased about a year apart from one another which would make for an awfully large "bad batch".

If I am ever able to reach Hydor I'll let y'all know. As stated before, I've reached out to Hydor via phone and email and I have not heard back from them (It's been about 20 days since I first contacted them). I've enlisted the help of Marine Depot (whom I purchased the pumps from) and they got back to me within minutes both on this forum and via phone. (Kudos! @Marine Depot)

 

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I popped open an older Evo 850 I had laying about. The same blue/green resin as your units. 

 

20170523_155709.thumb.jpg.7448f2062bfa2d1d50bf74029c10d6f2.jpg

 

20170523_155718.thumb.jpg.ddd753d1edafc2d29f84323d2b1c462e.jpg

 

I will have to inspect my KPS pumps as well. They are different motors / technology from the current Hydor products, so I am not sure if they are built using the same material or in the same plant for that matter.

  • Like 1
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So the KPS like the Gen 3 pumps are made differently. The resin is actually exposed on the face of the pump rather than behind an aesthetic plastic cap at the back of the pump. The resin is also grey rather than blue/green.

 

hy-kor07_05.jpg

201703-aqamai-kps-pompa-di-movimento-04-

 

Highly doubt they have the same potential for the issue you've experienced.

 

Hopefully you hear back from Hydor soon!

 

  • Like 2
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With that design they have essentially reversed the setup.  Hard so say if the new material will be more resilient, but 
I do like that it is not hidden. I could inspect it every time I clean the impeller and cage. The new power cable routing on both models offers stress relief so the cable will not be getting tugged and twisted in the sealant. This should eliminate any failures due to mechanical stress from cable movement. 

I would consider either when replacing my nano. The only trick would be getting one with low enough flow for my small tank. 

 

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25 minutes ago, MrJoel said:

With that design they have essentially reversed the setup.  Hard so say if the new material will be more resilient, but 
I do like that it is not hidden. I could inspect it every time I clean the impeller and cage. The new power cable routing on both models offers stress relief so the cable will not be getting tugged and twisted in the sealant. This should eliminate any failures due to mechanical stress from cable movement. 

I would consider either when replacing my nano. The only trick would be getting one with low enough flow for my small tank. 

 


Aqamai KPS is 340-1050 gph controllable and the size of an egg, so definitely a good option for nano tanks.

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@yungKitten

Were both of these pumps on the same power bar / outlet? Were they surge protected? 

I had a pretty in-depth conversation with a good friend of mine that is very much into general and electric engineering, and he suggested both pumps look to have overheated critically, and the resin ended up melting because of it. It takes some pretty ridiculously high temperatures to melt epoxy resin, and from the first photo you posted, he noted the exposed motor and the two dark spots where it looks like the terminals where the wires may have attached to the motor. If there was a power surge for instance, it is possible those points of contact were compromised and essentially started to arch which could create temps high enough to melt the resin. Alternatively the winding could have failed and essentially turned the motor into a heater which could also reach ridiculous temps and melted the resin.

In either case, he is suggesting the resin is not the point of failure, but rather, a casualty of another failure that caused excessive heat.

  • Like 1
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I wouldn't worry too much about the tank.  The epoxy resin that seals this pump, like many other pumps, is already wet in the water all the time.  It's obviously not supposed to degrade as your pictures show but it's sort of like a bag of chemi pure exploding and some freak out and forget it was all underwater to start with.

 

If you still don't receive contact from hydor try our regional sales manage Brian - bshavlik at hydor.com

916-920-5222

  • Like 3
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yungKitten

Wow! Thanks for the truly in depth analysis @TJ_Burton ! Yes, both of these power heads were on the same surge protector. Along with an AC110, a Cobalt Neotherm 50watt, and an AI Prime. I have experienced no issues with the filter, heater, or light. I can definitely envision what you are describing, but I am unsure of how it would have occurred.

Thanks @StevieT I've continued cycling the tank and I feel a bit more confident about that decision now. I really appreciate you sharing that contact with me. This is part of the reason why Nano-Reef is such a wonderful community.

I still have not heard anything, but I will be sure to update this thread when I do.

Thanks again y'all!

  • Like 2
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yungKitten

I was able to talk to a Hydor rep today. It was a very pleasant experience. Apparently the pumps have a two year warranty. They're going to replace both and provide a return shipping label so that I can send the defective pumps back. Thanks for the help everybody!

  • Like 7
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