New Fluval 13.5

[MrJoel]

Hello people of the Nano-reef community.  I have made the plunge back into reef keeping this past weekend after 20 years away from it and was looking for a little advice based on the many differed opinions I have been seeing online. I have tried searching first before posting anything. =)

I picked up a Fluval Evo 13.5 system. To this I have added live sand 14 pounds of "Real Reef" rock and 6 MarinePure bio-media balls in the center chamber that are pre seeded from the local shop. 

Would you think that between the pre-seeded bio media and the live sand the tank should be able to safely support 1-2 small fish like a goby to dig through the sand and keep the existing bacterial fed with amonia? I have my test kit arriving today so I can check the levels and actually have the Reef Mature Pro Kit on the way tomorrow.

I am unsure if I would "need" the reef mature pro kit with the sand and bio-media in place already. Part of me is inclined to run the kit anyway.  Also If I do not add bio-load I would expect the existing bacteria would begin to die off If not fed. Which I could take care of by feeding the tank food even without any livestock.

Would the Reef mature potentially harm fish? My understanding is it is just adding the bacterial cultures to the tank and should not be really be harmful to livestock. But again I have been out of this hobby for 20+years and any advice would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance.=)

[MrJoel]

So I ran the tests Last night.

Ammonia: 0 ppm

Nitrate: ~1 ppm (Tested twice since margin of error was apparently 1-2ppm)  Is this considered fine now? I see people saying nitrate does not really matter anymore and other s saying  it should be under .025ppm which My red sea test kit would not even be able to show.

Nitrite: .05 ppm

PH: 8.2

ALK: 9.5 -10 dkH

 

To follow up on the first post since it was a rambling mess. With my 20 years away from the hobby I am not terribly confident on making judgments on if my system should be ready for limited livestock additions. And I am unsure if using the Reef Mature kit would be potentially harmful If I did add a few fish  and then ran the 21 day program of the reef mature kit.

 

Thanks again.

[ninjamyst]

best way to see if you are cycled is to add pure ammonia to 2ppm and then confirm it is converted to nitrite then nitrate within 24 hours.  

[MrJoel]

I may have to swing by ace then.

[SeaFurn]

To save you the trip to Ace, if you now have the Reef Mature Pro Kit you could dose some of the Bacto-Start, that should spike the ammonia and then you can confirm it is converted to nitrite then nitrate within 24 hours.  If it isn't then you could then start the 21 day program but with the live sand and pre-seeded materials I doubt it will take 21 days. The program has you introduce a fish on day 14 so the program isn't harmful it just takes that amount of time with that program (which assumes zero nitrifying and de-nitrifying bacteria from the start) for there to be enough bacteria to safely support livestock.   

 

 

 

 

 

[MrJoel]

Thanks for the input. I started the Reef Mature last night, we will see how the tests go tonight and tomorrow. 

I am still adjusting the rock. Not sure if I am getting the top part too close to the surface and lights. I think I may adjust it a little at least to get the top shelf tilting down a little more in the front to improve visibility. 

 

 

[SeaFurn]

I think it looks great - lots of great spots for coral!  And I like the "Real Reef" rock - instant coralline color! 

[MrJoel]

The heater in the Pump chamber is a tight fit. The end of the Fluval M 50w is pushing against the side of the return pump.  Is this anything to be concerned over. I do not think it should be problematic since it should not be hot enough to melt plastic.   

Does anyone with this same tank have this issue?  If needed I could buy a Neo-Therm 50w that would not be long enough to be an issue. But if the existing one is fine I would probably stay with it and spend that $50 on livestock instead. 

[Weetabix7]

Might not hurt to pull the rock forward just a bit so it's not right up against the back, but other than that it's looking good!

[Clown79]

I like the rockwork. Looks great.

 

As for the back chambers. I'd make a media basket for the middle chamber, run floss and a good carbon. I wouldn't use the stock media.

Put your heater in there with the media basket next to it.

[TheBig053]

1 hour ago, MrJoel said:

The heater in the Pump chamber is a tight fit. The end of the Fluval M 50w is pushing against the side of the return pump.  Is this anything to be concerned over. I do not think it should be problematic since it should not be hot enough to melt plastic.   

Does anyone with this same tank have this issue?  If needed I could buy a Neo-Therm 50w that would not be long enough to be an issue. But if the existing one is fine I would probably stay with it and spend that $50 on livestock instead. 

Yes, I have the same problem with my heater and pump. So far not a problem, but I keep checking daily to make sure its not melting the pump casing. 

38 minutes ago, Weetabix7 said:

Might not hurt to pull the rock forward just a bit so it's not right up against the back, but other than that it's looking good!

I have the same tank with my rock against the back glass. Is there a benefit to centering it in the tank, off the glass? Thanks!

[MrJoel]

For the center I removed all of the foam except one layer to keep the MarinePure bio-media balls from falling to the bottom chamber. I plan to exchange it with egg crate grids below and above with carbon at least and possibly some mechanical layer. But I do have the PS2 skimmer in the first chamber performing some level of mechanical once the tank is mature enough to produce real foam.

 

Also I have a few inches behind the rock. I will probably be adding a 240gph circulation pump back there to help flow since the stock pump seem a bit low for a reef setup.

[Clown79]

4 hours ago, TheBig053 said:

Yes, I have the same problem with my heater and pump. So far not a problem, but I keep checking daily to make sure its not melting the pump casing. 

I have the same tank with my rock against the back glass. Is there a benefit to centering it in the tank, off the glass? Thanks!

Yes. Its best to have room in between for better flow and less dead zones

[MrJoel]

Ammonia still testing zero and nitrates are slowly building. So it looks like my cycle is up and running.

[MrJoel]

I added The Fluval Sea PS2 Mini Skimmer last week.  After a few days of break in it started to produce foam, but now the unit seems to be producing such wet foam that the cup need to be emptied 2 times a day. I have tried using the water level adjust knob to no apparent effect. I adjusted one direction  and waited since I read the adjustments on the knob could take hours to show. I tried turning the other way and still saw no change in water level.  Has any one else used this unit? Do you know which direction is supposed to be to lower the water. The instructions simply saw to turn the know to adjust but fail to list the direction to turn for the desired effect.

Hopefully somebody else has experience with this model. My only prior skimmers were the type where your would raise or lower the collection cup to change the dryness of the skim.

Thanks again for all your help. 

[TheBig053]

6 minutes ago, MrJoel said:

I added The Fluval Sea PS2 Mini Skimmer last week.  After a few days of break in it started to produce foam, but now the unit seems to be producing such wet foam that the cup need to be emptied 2 times a day. I have tried using the water level adjust knob to no apparent effect. I adjusted one direction  and waited since I read the adjustments on the knob could take hours to show. I tried turning the other way and still saw no change in water level.  Has any one else used this unit? Do you know which direction is supposed to be to lower the water. The instructions simply saw to turn the know to adjust but fail to list the direction to turn for the desired effect.

Hopefully somebody else has experience with this model. My only prior skimmers were the type where your would raise or lower the collection cup to change the dryness of the skim.

Thanks again for all your help. 

I have this skimmer also for my EVO and it takes some tinkering to get it down.  This is also the first skimmer I have ever used, so I really do not have much frame of reference either. I did find that if you keep it bubbling just at the top of the skimmer, but not into the neck of the skim receptacle, it doesn't fill up with water as quickly.  Changing the air intake seems to have a more profound affect then toying with the water flow knob.  I do not have any livestock in the tank so it is not producing a whole lot at the moment, but when I stirred up the sand and released a lot of particulate into the water, it did start skimming the fine particles out.  It left a dry white film in the skim receptacle.  I'll try to post a picture this evening of where I keep the bubble level so it does not fill the cup with water quickly. 

 

Sorry I am not much help! I am sure someone more knowledgeable can correct any gaffes in my overly technical explanation of how the skimmer functions  

[MrJoel]

2 hours ago, TheBig053 said:

I have this skimmer also for my EVO and it takes some tinkering to get it down.  This is also the first skimmer I have ever used, so I really do not have much frame of reference either. I did find that if you keep it bubbling just at the top of the skimmer, but not into the neck of the skim receptacle, it doesn't fill up with water as quickly.  Changing the air intake seems to have a more profound affect then toying with the water flow knob.  I do not have any livestock in the tank so it is not producing a whole lot at the moment, but when I stirred up the sand and released a lot of particulate into the water, it did start skimming the fine particles out.  It left a dry white film in the skim receptacle.  I'll try to post a picture this evening of where I keep the bubble level so it does not fill the cup with water quickly. 

 

Sorry I am not much help! I am sure someone more knowledgeable can correct any gaffes in my overly technical explanation of how the skimmer functions  

Initially the Skimmer body had about 2-4mm of space at the top of the main chamber.  Now I cannot keep the water below that and it is a few mm above the top  about to the top where the collar and cup join. I can try posting pics too when I am back home. I have even entered a ticket with Fluval asking them about their product. I would think they should know is clockwise of counterclockwise is intended to lower the water level. =P 

20 years ago it was easy I moved the o-ring higher or lower around the collection cup to dial in the foam collection and left it alone from then on. 

[MrJoel]

I took the unit out and dissembled it to figure out the knob. The knob has a graduated gate (diagonal from open to closed sides) on the bottom that is on the other side of the black sponge that is supposed to stop bubbles from entering the system. When out I used some of the wife's nail polish to mark the arc on the top  of the knob that is on the correct side  for the opening control.  I also discovered that it is also affected by the total water level of the system. It the level is to high the water has no place to go to lower the level in the skimmer when the knob is set to the open position. 

I should have taken pictures while I had it out. Maybe next time.

[MrJoel]

Skimmer is running much better now.  Now I am seeing some other things. PH has dropped to 7.6 (Tested at 3 times that day to make sure it was not just fluctuation) and alkalinity is high at 12dkH. Ammonia and nitrite are undetected while Nitrate was up to 30ppm a day after a 4 gallon water change. All are being tested with Red Sea test kits. 

The PH and alkalinity  it sounds like I might want to wait a few more weeks to worry about, but that 30ppm nitrate seems crazy high the day after a ~30% water change. Could some of this be because of the additives in the Reef Mature kit? It has me adding 1.5ml NO3-PO4-X daily.  My understanding is NOPOX is supposed to help establish the bacteria that convert the Nitrates to Nitrogen. 

I assume the bubbles that are increasing in my sand bad are actually from nitrate --> nitrogen conversion, but should I be alarmed that the Nitrate level is this high even after that water change?

[fishfreak0114]

What was it at before the waterchange?  Because if nitrate was higher before, then that's totally normal.  If it were at like 50ish before, a 30% waterchange would only lower it to a bit above 30 (my math is a touch of I think). I had loads of bubbles in my sand just after my cycle. 

[MrJoel]

The last test before the change had nitrate at ~3ppm.  A few days after the 30ppm reading it has gone down to 2ppm. Not sure if that is the NoPox doing its thing getting the bacteria converting nitrates to nitrogen.

[MrJoel]

Has anybody else with an Evo 13.5 swapped out the return pump. I was hoping to swap one out for one with a bit more flow But the chamber is a bit of a tight fit.  I have seen one or two posts on misc forums that said somebody was thinking about installing a Lifegard 800 pump but never any report on weather it worked or now. That unit would be ~45% increase in flow if it fit. Any advice would be recommended.

 

Also has anybody tried using the chill solutions CSXC-1 Peltier chiller? I Am looking at it as an option for cooling my tank before the weather changes and It is too late. It seems like I could Dremel out a section of the Hood for the intake and return hoses. It seems to me that putting the return in the chamber in the back would likely cause the cooler and heater to compete to change the temp in that small space. 

 

Also on yet another subject. I received the Hanna HI736  yesterday and ran 2 tests because I assumes I must have done something wrong. Both tests came back with a value of 0ppb for Phosphorus. I am left wondering if the value is accurate or if my tank has somehow used up all the Phosphorus now that the Algae is no longer going crazy. Last week I had a day when the water clouded for a few hours and then went back to normal. I have not has any issues with algae on the glass since then. I may try finding a source to contaminate a sample to see if can get a positive test with my kit. Could be a bad reagent batch in the kit.

 

Levels are as follows:

Ammonia: 0

Nitrite: 0  (though I can occasionally see a uptick to .1 or .2ppm that resolves within the day) Not sure if this should be a concern.

Nitrate: ~10ppm  (Down from 15 a few days prior I am guessing due to the NO3:PO4-X dosing)

Phosphorus: 0 ppb ( if this number can be trusted) (Maybe also due to NO3:PO4-X dosing)

PH: 8.2 -8.4  depending on time. (CO2 scrubber mod helped a ton bringing this up from 7.6)

Salinity:1.0235

Calcium:415ppl

Magnesium: 1400 ppm

Alkalinity:11 dkH

Temp:78

[Goldnlvr]

On 3/22/2017 at 8:06 AM, MrJoel said:

Thanks for the input. I started the Reef Mature last night, we will see how the tests go tonight and tomorrow. 

I am still adjusting the rock. Not sure if I am getting the top part too close to the surface and lights. I think I may adjust it a little at least to get the top shelf tilting down a little more in the front to improve visibility. 

 

 

did you just lay the rocks on top of each other or did you use puddy or something to stabilize them? 

[MrJoel]

 

11 minutes ago, Goldnlvr said:

did you just lay the rocks on top of each other or did you use puddy or something to stabilize them? 

I have not glued them at all. I found stable positions based on the shape of the rocks. I have been thinking about either epoxying some or possibly rodding a few together though.  I worry about knocking a rock into the glass. My prior tanks were always acrylic so worst case I would need to buff out a scratch if a rock hit the glass. Since this photo I did add 1-2 other smaller pieces on the right hand side to better stabilize that end.

[MrJoel]

I may add a little more sand too. The bed seems a little shallow to me.