el fabuloso Posted December 27, 2016 Share Posted December 27, 2016 THE STORY You know when you meet up with a fellow reefer and you chat over fish tacos and talk reef and hit it off and all of a sudden you guys get the crazy idea to build a tank together? So that happened. Ive been wanting to get back into the hobby for some time but havent been able to find the right time to do it. Not to mention since relocating to NYC Ive had limited time and space to really jump back in. Bonese on the other hand is ready to go but in need of some direction and motivation to get things rolling. So when he proposed to partner up on this project, it just felt like a natural fit. So in short, Bonese is the keeper of the tank and I get to play and have fun with it. And hopefully together we can create something fun, interesting and fulfilling. THE TANK Red Sea Reefer 350. 73 gallons of possibilities. THE GEAR NYOS Quantum 120 Protein Skimmer Vectra M1 EcoTech Marine (2000 gph) Aquamaxx Reactors Light: TBD Heater: TBD Pumps: TBD Preciousss! The plumbing, as with most of the technical details of the setup, are Bonese's domain. He can elaborate on those things a lot better than I can. THE PLAN Our plan is to put together a good mix of SPS, LPS and soft corals for a nice mixed-reef tank. Maybe a red bubble tip anemone to host a pair of clowns. We really like the symbiosis aspect of the project so we might carry that theme throughout the tank. In any case a lot of things are going to happen organically and it should be interesting to see what comes out of this partnership. Stay tuned! 10 Quote Link to comment
el fabuloso Posted December 27, 2016 Author Share Posted December 27, 2016 Bonese is a man of few words which is why I'm running this thread. 2 Quote Link to comment
uwharrie Posted December 27, 2016 Share Posted December 27, 2016 Following. Especially since that is the tank I keep looking to add 2 Quote Link to comment
Weetabix7 Posted December 27, 2016 Share Posted December 27, 2016 This is so cool, I love that you're doing this!!!!!! 2 Quote Link to comment
el fabuloso Posted December 28, 2016 Author Share Posted December 28, 2016 This is so cool, I love that you're doing this!!!!!! Thanks, L! Glad you're tagging along. 1 Quote Link to comment
bonese Posted December 31, 2016 Share Posted December 31, 2016 Some updates from my end: Installed the Locline Y return in the stock return outlet. We were both really excited about this since we wanted to diversify the flow pattern this will do just that for us. I also am going to put together a formal write up tomorrow regarding the manifolds to document my progress for personal records. Fab should be coming over so we can lay the sand down and scape and fill it all in one swoop once our schedules permit it. 3 Quote Link to comment
el fabuloso Posted December 31, 2016 Author Share Posted December 31, 2016 Pictures! We need PICTURES!! Quote Link to comment
RayWhisperer Posted December 31, 2016 Share Posted December 31, 2016 Get back where you belong, Fab. 1 Quote Link to comment
el fabuloso Posted December 31, 2016 Author Share Posted December 31, 2016 Get back where you belong, Fab. You don't own me, Ray! Quote Link to comment
BulkRate Posted December 31, 2016 Share Posted December 31, 2016 So many ways you can have fun with this. So many mutualistic pairings - goby/shrimp, clownfish/anemones, porcelain crabs/rock flowers, pocillopora & acropora corals/ trapezia crabs and more. In that tank you have room for many of them, but still small enough to actually see them. Neat! 1 Quote Link to comment
bonese Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 Alright, I have been meaning to do this but just have been swamped by work. For the sump area I really didn't want to have the ugly (to me) green vinyl hose and also wanted to incorporate reactors. With the reactors dictating plumbing because I also really don't like hang on back anything. I believe we have/will achieve a very clean sump area making maintainence easier. Also I wanted to keep with the Red Sea quality so figured I might as well do it proper. After talking with good friends over at r2r we decided that it would in fact be possible to do all of these things on a reefer 350 as they all have reefer 450. I had to adjust dimensions and this still isn't the FINAL manifold as I have found an imperfection with the reactors leaning slightly. This is the "Get me up and running" with a rebuild coming soon. The plan is to run GFO, Biopellets and Carbon within the reactors. This hopefully will satisfy the system as I also am hesitant on a huge with no real reasoning behind it other than aesthetics. I am a bit annoying when it comes to that. I am totally not including a BUNCH of information and will get better pictures up once Fab comes back over. I will revise if I think of anything I missed out on. 2 Quote Link to comment
Rehype Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 Wow I look forward to seeing this to seeing this joint venture develop. Great job on what you've done so far! Really great to see you back Fab! 2 Quote Link to comment
DaveFason Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 Great to see you back in action! 2 Quote Link to comment
RayWhisperer Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 Alright, I have been meaning to do this but just have been swamped by work. For the sump area I really didn't want to have the ugly (to me) green vinyl hose and also wanted to incorporate reactors. With the reactors dictating plumbing because I also really don't like hang on back anything. I believe we have/will achieve a very clean sump area making maintainence easier. Also I wanted to keep with the Red Sea quality so figured I might as well do it proper. After talking with good friends over at r2r we decided that it would in fact be possible to do all of these things on a reefer 350 as they all have reefer 450. I had to adjust dimensions and this still isn't the FINAL manifold as I have found an imperfection with the reactors leaning slightly. This is the "Get me up and running" with a rebuild coming soon. The plan is to run GFO, Biopellets and Carbon within the reactors. This hopefully will satisfy the system as I also am hesitant on a huge with no real reasoning behind it other than aesthetics. I am a bit annoying when it comes to that. I am totally not including a BUNCH of information and will get better pictures up once Fab comes back over. I will revise if I think of anything I missed out on. I'm kinda not liking where this is going. Not trying to be an ass, so just really research this stuff before you go all in. This isn't a large system. Running GFO alone is touchy enough. Now combining that with bio pellets and carbon. If you were planning a pure sps tank with a calcium reactor, then maybe you'd be ok. As a mixed reef, it's my opinion you're going way overboard. 3 Quote Link to comment
bonese Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 I'm kinda not liking where this is going. Not trying to be an ass, so just really research this stuff before you go all in. This isn't a large system. Running GFO alone is touchy enough. Now combining that with bio pellets and carbon. If you were planning a pure sps tank with a calcium reactor, then maybe you'd be ok. As a mixed reef, it's my opinion you're going way overboard. Thanks for your input Ray! Highly valued! The initial plan was for me to have a SPS system since I love them. This being a relationship tank and that Fab enjoys LPS I figured why not incorporate both with a heavy focus on SPS. I Did also plan on running the DOS reactor from Apex once I get the controller set up and squared away. Do you think this would justify itself? As for the reactors you are 100% correct on the GFO being iffy. I was planning on just running the biopellets from the start and then slowly put the other reactors online once I know that I do in fact need them for export. Do you think this would just completely negate stability? I do know this is overkill - I just "enjoy" this part of the process so I may have lost sight/focus on the actual end goal. Again, I really appreciate your input and opinion! 1 Quote Link to comment
Nano sapiens Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 Ray has a good point. While tanks can be run sucessfully with all of what you've mentioned (GFO, Biopellets and Carbon within the reactors), the complications/challenges of keeping optimal balance consistently in such a small system as this can be quite difficult/tiresome, especially over the long haul. Allowing the system to develop more naturally, along with a good maintenance scheudule, is often the better approach IMO. 2 Quote Link to comment
RayWhisperer Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 I lost a giant block of text. ####ing iPad swiped back. I'm not typing all that again. Simple plan. Id stick to carbon, protein skimming and water changes to keep the water "clean". Since you like sticks, id say use a kalk stirrer with an ATO. not only do you get the cal and alk from it. You also get a pretty solid ph of 8.3 as well as precipitating phosphates. Keep up with water changes and you won't need to worry about it stripping out too many of the other minor and trace elements. You won't outgrow that setup for at least 2 years. At which point, you could incorporate a calcium reactor, start dosing, or just go bigger. I'll do a quickie on the other stuff. All 3 reactors = stripping the water Carbon good, but removes good as well as bad. Just not too much of either. GFO good. However, if you don't know what you are doing, you'll probably end up binding most of the calcium in your system. Bio pellet Idunno. I've never run them, but I know how they operate.i have seen several setups suffer from their use, as well as some benefit. I'd say lose the GFO or the bio pellets, or both. That's just my thoughts. All 3 is too much on such a small system. 2 Quote Link to comment
RayWhisperer Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 Rereading your post I forgot a few things. DON'T run the bio pellets from the start. Don't run anything but the water from the start. You need to give the bacteria and microfauna something to establish themselves with. As for the apex stuff.... idunno. I never use any gadgets for anything more than a glorified timer and temp controller. All those probes need constant calibration in order to be of any use. Too much shit to screw with, imo. 1 Quote Link to comment
bonese Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 Thanks so much guys! This really helps us. I hope you join in with us in this tank. Ray - I originally planned that I was going to be stripping the water and was worried. I was reassured as it would be ok but I totally am just going to go back to my original plan. I built a two chamber manifold for Carbon as well as one for Biopellets as the GFO can be finicky. The two chamber goes straight up with no 45 so I was worried about pump pressure but think I'll be fine I think I'm going to swap out the three chamber for the two for starters based upon your suggestion. It seems like I was right in he beginning. It needed the guidance. Really appreciate it. Other than a kalk stirrer would you say that manual dosing would be the knee route? I don't mind the actual dosing but figured like you said I wouldn't need it for quite some time. Let me know what you think! 1 Quote Link to comment
RayWhisperer Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 Sure. You can start out by dosing. I only suggested the stirrer as it will basically do 2 jobs in one. It will give you the 2 major elements in NSW, as well as taking away the need for GFO. Its my understanding bio pellet reactors are great at nitrate removal, but not so good at phosphate removal. I was just giving you another option to think about. As far as dosing nothing to start, that's fine, too. Just be aware. Partial water changes aren't a great way to replace major elements (cal/alk). Once you get too many corals, or your existing ones start growing, you'd need to change more and more water. With corals like sps, you'll quickly outgrow the water changes as a means of replacing cal and alk. 1 Quote Link to comment
el fabuloso Posted January 2, 2017 Author Share Posted January 2, 2017 I'm reading through these comments like: Like I mentioned earlier, this part of the project is all Bonese. Anyone who's familiar with my old setups can probably remember that I try to keep things simple. If it were entirely up to me I would throw a skimmer, chemi pure and a ball of chaeto in the sump and call it a day. On the other hand it's interesting to go through a different process than what I'm used to and it's always good to learn something new. 3 Quote Link to comment
RayWhisperer Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 Isn't it time for you to change the color of your fauxhawk, or something, Fab? 2 Quote Link to comment
bonese Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 You are 100% correct. That's why I was adding the GFO reactor so it's almost as if all reactors are co-existing making up for the others flaws. I gate valved then also to have complete flow control as well as being able to have the option to go offline or online with them. Only turning them on when needed/when an issue arises. Also you are 100% correct again regarding the ever changing Fabhawk. What do you suggest on that front? Quote Link to comment
el fabuloso Posted January 2, 2017 Author Share Posted January 2, 2017 Isn't it time for you to change the color of your fauxhawk, or something, Fab? It's yellow and green, atm. Quote Link to comment
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