Jebao has done it again...

[ReeferReefer]

What are your suggestions for Maxspect to increase their quality or ways to decrease their price?

While I don't feel qualified in material science to say how they can make the product more durable (although the propellers seem to be the biggest reported problem so that would be a good start) I would say that bringing the price down would be the way to be much more competitive. Side by side for the price I would not even consider the Gyre against Ecotech's offerings. While I understand producing a 1st generation product can be expensive its not like they invented this type of pump and I personally believe the cost is too high for the quality. That being said I have never bought one because of this belief but I do have local reefer friends who have used them. He has they Gyre on one side of the tank and a Jebao on the other of his 200 gallon. The Gyre has many more problems. Now that is obviously antidoctal (like many things in this hobby) I can not justify the price difference in these products. If it works for you and you are happy with the price:performance than more power to you. I'm just saying that I would strongly consider the Gyre at $100-$150 range.

[jedimasterben]

While I don't feel qualified in material science to say how they can make the product more durable (although the propellers seem to be the biggest reported problem so that would be a good start) I would say that bringing the price down would be the way to be much more competitive. Side by side for the price I would not even consider the Gyre against Ecotech's offerings. While I understand producing a 1st generation product can be expensive its not like they invented this type of pump and I personally believe the cost is too high for the quality. That being said I have never bought one because of this belief but I do have local reefer friends who have used them. He has they Gyre on one side of the tank and a Jebao on the other of his 200 gallon. The Gyre has many more problems. Now that is obviously antidoctal (like many things in this hobby) I can not justify the price difference in these products. If it works for you and you are happy with the price:performance than more power to you. I'm just saying that I would strongly consider the Gyre at $100-$150 range.

Do you have a link to this same style pump (since Maxspect wasn't the first)?

 

What would the Gyre need to do differently to compete with Ecotech in your mind? Each Gyre model replaces two similarly priced Ecotech pumps, at minimum. I would consider that pretty competitive.

[ReeferReefer]

Do you have a link to this same style pump (since Maxspect wasn't the first)?

 

What would the Gyre need to do differently to compete with Ecotech in your mind? Each Gyre model replaces two similarly priced Ecotech pumps, at minimum. I would consider that pretty competitive.

Perhaps I what I said was misleading or confusing. I readily acknowledge Maxspect bringing this pump into consumer aquarium powerheads. They did not invent the squirrel cage propeller system though, they adapted it. This did take an undeniable amount of creativity that should be recognized.

Im not trying to argue here and I have not personally owned Ecotech products as they are out of my price range so again I feel a bit unqualified. All I am trying to say is that they seem expensive for the amount of problems they have. So much so that I would not feel comfortable buying their product. While Jebao products do feel cheap in comparison (most notably the controllers) I feel they provide a better value with equal if not better reliability. Stories of Gyre propellers failing may be blown out of proportion but Ecotech seems to be better.

 

I think Ecotechs popularity speaks for itself. From what I can tell they have a much better reputation around here than Maxspect.

 

All I know is that I don't feel confident buying the Gyre for the price while saving up for Ecotech products seems much more apealing to me. Until I can afford Ecotech powerheads my RW-8s are doing great.

 

I am sure you have more experience here but this is the information and opinions I have gathered by hanging out here on Nano-Reef.

[jack1978]

I'm running both at the same time.

Do I like the MP, absolutely.

Do I like the Gyre, absolutely.

 

Do the MPs have flaws, yes.

Has mine had issues, no.

Is it loud.....when it ramps up, yes.

 

Have the Gyres had issues, yes.

Has mine, no.

Is it loud......can't hear a thing.

Down side, if any....it has a damn cord in the tank.

 

Are they both worth the money to me, yes.

[bob115]

Jebao vortechs when?

 

But in all seriousness, I think that there's something to be said about higher price = better product. While this is largely true, it very quickly gets hit by the law of diminishing returns. For example yeah product B is superior to product A by a factor of 1.3, but it costs 3 times as much.

 

As far as the vortechs go, I picked up an older mp10 for peanuts and am in the process of fixing a bunch of stuff. After tearing it down I'm far and away nit impressed at all with the construction and attention to detail. Fot instance, not using A4 stainless fastners in a non sealed housing that's always next to a big tub of salt water? No excuse at this price point. Then not putting any form of thread compound? Are you kidding? And the rotor shatfs, why are they stainless sheathed with ceramic? Why not just go solid ceramic (even if at a little larger size if it was too weak alone) or solid titanium? Better yet why is it a permanent part of the housing? How about the cheap bearings?

 

My point is even at the vortechs ridiculous price point there's still numerous things that could have been done but corners were cut. Were these things on a jebao or similar priced item I'd have no real problem, but when your paying hundreds of dollars for a freakin aquarium pump I expect a hell of a lot more.

[Benny314]

Jebao vortechs when?

 

But in all seriousness, I think that there's something to be said about higher price = better product. While this is largely true, it very quickly gets hit by the law of diminishing returns. For example yeah product B is superior to product A by a factor of 1.3, but it costs 3 times as much.

 

As far as the vortechs go, I picked up an older mp10 for peanuts and am in the process of fixing a bunch of stuff. After tearing it down I'm far and away nit impressed at all with the construction and attention to detail. Fot instance, not using A4 stainless fastners in a non sealed housing that's always next to a big tub of salt water? No excuse at this price point. Then not putting any form of thread compound? Are you kidding? And the rotor shatfs, why are they stainless sheathed with ceramic? Why not just go solid ceramic (even if at a little larger size if it was too weak alone) or solid titanium? Better yet why is it a permanent part of the housing? How about the cheap bearings?

 

My point is even at the vortechs ridiculous price point there's still numerous things that could have been done but corners were cut. Were these things on a jebao or similar priced item I'd have no real problem, but when your paying hundreds of dollars for a freakin aquarium pump I expect a hell of a lot more.

 

This was exactly my point when I mentioned Vortech on back on page one.

If I'm paying alot I expect good quality in fit and finish with high quality componets. If I've paid peanuts I don't mind so much as you get what you pay for.

I have always been impressed with jebao quality for the money I have paid for their products. Everyone is always complaining about the low quality of in my opinon the over priced vortech and gyre products.

 

I am not in the habbit of paying lots of money for crap..............

[gus6464]

No one is arguing that the Gyre is a performer. What is being argued is the price paid for the unit vs the amount of flaws it has.

 

I find it ludicrous that after Maxspect found out the propellers were a problem and redesigned them, every one who bought an XF130 or XF150 with the crap ones now has to pay extra for the new ones. My Gyre isn't even a year old and still under warranty but yet I still have to fork $25 on top of the $300 that I already paid to get a new propeller that won't break by looking at it wrong. Everyone who is still under warranty should be sent a pair.

 

And that's where the difference with Ecotech lies. I am 90% certain Ecotech would send everyone who called CS a new pair of propellers if their product was less than a year old.

[bob115]

 

This was exactly my point when I mentioned Vortech on back on page one.

If I'm paying alot I expect good quality in fit and finish with high quality componets. If I've paid peanuts I don't mind so much as you get what you pay for.

I have always been impressed with jebao quality for the money I have paid for their products. Everyone is always complaining about the low quality of in my opinon the over priced vortech and gyre products.

 

I am not in the habbit of paying lots of money for crap..............

 

Don't get me wrong, I wasn't saying the vortechs were built like crap, because they really aren't. But by the same token they're not as great as everyone makes them out to be. And for me, at the retail price they're asking (especially for the 40 and 60) and given quality combined with the fact that their patent strangles any magnetically coupled pumps from entering the market for another decade or so really leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I've heard their support is top notch if you're in warranty, however.

[jedimasterben]

For anyone wondering about Maxspect's patents: http://blog.coralvue.com/jebao-cross-flow-pump-jecod-cp-25-cp-45-infringes-maxspects-pending-patent-application/

[Horerczy]

Google docs on said patent.

 

http://www.google.com/patents/US20150292507

[StinkyBunny]

 

Not really. And this is the thing I hate about MaxSpect. They claim to have "Invented" and new pump design. No, that's the same damned concept every one of us has in our furnaces. The only thing you did was build a squirrel cage fan for underwater purposes. Get over yourselves.

Maxspect is going to have an uphill battle fighting Jebao because of this. Maxspect wouldn't want me to sit on that jury, I'd hand them their nuts on a platter with mustard and horseradish.

 

Korallia pumps are shite, I mean a big steaming pile of it. I've gotten stray voltage in 2 different tanks from their pumps and with THEIR controller the god damn things run backwards!?!?? WTFMAN.jpeg My Jebao WP series have been running trouble free now for over a year. Paying premium price for Chinese quality? Never gonna happen in this house. Maybe this is the kick in the ass Maxspect needs to get their quality issues sorted out.

 

I'm replacing all my powerheads with Sun Sun's.

 

http://www.amazon.com/SunSun-JVP-110-528-GPH-Wavemaker-Pumps/dp/B00CFW82PG/ref=sr_1_3?s=pet-supplies&ie=UTF8&qid=1450855795&sr=1-3&keywords=powerhead#customerReviews

 

4.5/5 stars at $8.25 prime shipping or $14.86 for two.. omg!

I'll tell you this, their internal aquarium filtres are solid performers, I have 4 of them doing odd jobs in the fish room and they've been problem free. These look decent enough for a rock cooking tank.

 

I can't wait till the Jebao Gyres come out, I will be buying 3 of them right out of the gate for testing. Reefbuilders fear mongering really annoyed me too. Jebao too, I wonder if there's a conflict of interest there because they advertise? as a friend of mine says, follow the money trail.

[jedimasterben]

Maybe this is the kick in the ass Maxspect needs to get their quality issues sorted out.

Like what?

[Newtybar]

My two RW8s worked great for me. I actually felt the build quality on those were WAY better than the Gyre 130 I briefly had.

 

I eventually moved to two Tunze 6040s since they were smaller and had similar flow, but would have been happy with the RW8s had I not gotten a great deal on the 6040s.

[StinkyBunny]

Like what?

Lets see, impellers, bushings and magnets to start. Their QC issues are what steered me away from them and I almost bought a few when they came out for my runs. This is supposed to be a hobby and relaxing, not worrying about equipment not performing as it should. I have no issues spending money for a QUALITY item, but when it's not, I'm going to go with the cheaper alternative if there's one available. I have a lot more riding on this than most, I import, not as much as some and I can't afford a failure or having to constantly repair equipment. All I use are Jebao pumps, the only thing that's failed with those are the cheap ass power supplys, that's their Achilles heel.

[ReeferReefer]

Competition is always good for the consumer <3

[Steensj2004]

Vortechs are the benchmark by which all this other stuff is measured. You never hear about," new pump vs Jebao." Every new pump is always compared to the Vortech, which tells me all I need to know. Even people who hate them compare the pumps they like to Ecotech pumps.

 

Doesn't make them the best option ever, but they are clearly the benchmark for quality/performance.

[tautog83]

google reviews on vortechs, they have had their share of problems as well. My mp10 was faulty and for $235 i should never had a problem with it . Its the standard because its a marketing ploy, but the most expensive thing its always the best . just like buying a skimmer thats rated for 2347238692346 times your water volume means your water will be the cleanest . lol . besides the smaller size and the little wire thats exposed in the tank what does the mp10 offer you that the rw's dont? remember years ago people had thriving tanks with just koralias as water movement .

[braaap]

I'm replacing all my powerheads with Sun Sun's.

 

http://www.amazon.com/SunSun-JVP-110-528-GPH-Wavemaker-Pumps/dp/B00CFW82PG/ref=sr_1_3?s=pet-supplies&ie=UTF8&qid=1450855795&sr=1-3&keywords=powerhead#customerReviews

 

4.5/5 stars at $8.25 prime shipping or $14.86 for two.. omg!

 

 

Cant tell if your kidding. For the price if they work that is fantastic. I put a Gyre in my 34 when it first came out. Could never get it dialed in it was just too much pump for my tank. And I could not get it to work without making a sandstorm in my tank or just putting water over the sides. I gave it to a buddy and it recently crapped out. His tank was BB and thought it would work well for him. They sent him a new unit which is something Jecod/Jebao wont do. (unless you buy from someone offering a warranty) The Gyre felt and looked cheap, I expected a bit more from Maxspect. I have also had MP's in the tank. they were sweet but.........noisy. Plus they had that unsightly dry side and cost a butt ton of cash. Jebao's have worked great for me they are cheap and work well if you keep them clean. All this bullshit over patents is just stupid. Especially since they are laying claim to a pump. It makes sense if you actually manufactured the stuff but lets face it Maxspect has made their money paying companies in China to make their stuff. Maxpsect should put some people to work here then I might stand behind them until then f/u and your intellectual property. You gave that up when you contracted with Chinese companies to build your shit. Just look at Apple and Samsung. I believe it makes for competition in the marketplace.

 

I bought the 2 pack of those pumps a few weeks ago for $10 haha. They work really well. I just use them for mixing water but they are powerful and very quiet. Build quality seems pretty good too.

 

google reviews on vortechs, they have had their share of problems as well. My mp10 was faulty and for $235 i should never had a problem with it . Its the standard because its a marketing ploy, but the most expensive thing its always the best . just like buying a skimmer thats rated for 2347238692346 times your water volume means your water will be the cleanest . lol . besides the smaller size and the little wire thats exposed in the tank what does the mp10 offer you that the rw's dont? remember years ago people had thriving tanks with just koralias as water movement .

 

You are just a Ecotech/Vortech hater. We have heard enough of it. We know you hate them.

 

I've had well over 15 of them and I've had ONE with bad bearings. One. Not 2. Not 5. One. I've had them since day one. The one with bad bearings Ecotech overnighted me a new dryside and told me to toss the other after I sent them a video of the noise. This was 2 years out of warranty too. It was also purchased used and I told them that. They were very good to me and I love my 2 MP10QDs I am running now.

[thedon986]

I've had well over 15 of them and I've had ONE with bad bearings. One. Not 2. Not 5. One. I've had them since day one. The one with bad bearings Ecotech overnighted me a new dryside and told me to toss the other after I sent them a video of the noise. This was 2 years out of warranty too. It was also purchased used and I told them that. They were very good to me and I love my 2 MP10QDs I am running now.

 

I have owned ONE Vortech MP-10 and had ONE with noisy bearings. The bearings made noise I could hear across the room at the 4th LED on reef crest. I couldn't believe it was a year old (Aug. 2014 date) just past the warranty and making a noise that audible. Running on an eight gallon tank never past the 5th LED. After I upgraded to the QD though, it has been absolutely silent and only audible with my ear to the dry side. Don't dismiss someone's opinion so easily and insert yours as a fact. In my opinion they have much more than 1 in 15 pumps that performs outside of spec.

[braaap]

 

I have owned ONE Vortech MP-10 and had ONE with noisy bearings. The bearings made noise I could hear across the room at the 4th LED on reef crest. I couldn't believe it was a year old (Aug. 2014 date) just past the warranty and making a noise that audible. Running on an eight gallon tank never past the 5th LED. After I upgraded to the QD though, it has been absolutely silent and only audible with my ear to the dry side. Don't dismiss someone's opinion so easily and insert yours as a fact. In my opinion they have much more than 1 in 15 pumps that performs outside of spec.

 

Never inserted mine as fact. Infact I know a few people who have had bad Vortechs. I also know a few with bad Gyres. But he has bitched about them like 26 times now. We know. He hates them. Get over it.

[Elizabeth94]

 

I have owned ONE Vortech MP-10 and had ONE with noisy bearings ...... Don't dismiss someone's opinion so easily and insert yours as a fact. In my opinion they have much more than 1 in 15 pumps that performs outside of spec.

 

 

Maybe you got the 1/15 that had issues. Just your luck. If you didn't give the "other 14" a chance, you never know. Technically speaking, this is the college analysis brain speaking.

 

I think it can be hit or miss with any pump.

 

Personally, my mp10 lasted 3 years of use on pulse mode until I needed to replace the westside (just recently actually). But I never assume that just because my pump worked great that everyone would have the same experience.

[Ephemeral]

Sooo.....does anyone know where I can score a Jecod Cross Flow (aka Jyre*)? I'm in need of a new wave maker and this looks like it would really suit my need and budget.

 

 

* Jyre is TM by me. Please ask for my permission before using my intellectual property.

[gus6464]

 

Never inserted mine as fact. Infact I know a few people who have had bad Vortechs. I also know a few with bad Gyres. But he has bitched about them like 26 times now. We know. He hates them. Get over it.

 

Hahahaha. Pot calling kettle...

Sooo.....does anyone know where I can score a Jecod Cross Flow (aka Jyre*)? I'm in need of a new wave maker and this looks like it would really suit my need and budget.

 

 

* Jyre is TM by me. Please ask for my permission before using my intellectual property.

 

I started calling it that too. Jebao Jyre does flow through the tongue.

[Newtybar]

Vortech's are just by far the cleanest design. Everyone hates wires in the tank. That is why they stand out.

 

The quality is a secondary issue.

 

Jebao quality is fine, nice and hefty, feel good and have been reliable for me (two RW-8s).

[Newtybar]

No one is arguing that the Gyre is a performer. What is being argued is the price paid for the unit vs the amount of flaws it has.

 

I find it ludicrous that after Maxspect found out the propellers were a problem and redesigned them, every one who bought an XF130 or XF150 with the crap ones now has to pay extra for the new ones. My Gyre isn't even a year old and still under warranty but yet I still have to fork $25 on top of the $300 that I already paid to get a new propeller that won't break by looking at it wrong. Everyone who is still under warranty should be sent a pair.

 

And that's where the difference with Ecotech lies. I am 90% certain Ecotech would send everyone who called CS a new pair of propellers if their product was less than a year old.

 

Just call them and tell them your propellers are bad...they will send you new ones.