2 Gallon “Cookie Jar” Pico Reef by ReefJar

[ReefJar]

RJ I hope jar reef is trucking along smoothly

 

My vase is good I don't pack it with corals like I used to, want it easy stacked so there's less work and it will run stand alone for a long time. On vacations to the mountains im getting four days no topoff easy five could be done with a much lower air input

Thanks so much!

 

Haha, yeah things are getting pretty cramped now, especially with the birdsnest taking off in all directions.

 

I've played with air flow as well, just so that my jar isn't vibrating my entire desk and to help reduce the noise. It's been going pretty good, but I noticed that salt eventually builds up inside the airline (the other day I woke up and realized it was plugged... not sure when it stopped during the night).

 

So when I do water changes now:

1. I turn off the air and pull the line out of the jar.
2. I have a small pipe cleaner that i dip in fresh R/O and ram inside the line a few times.
3. Then I turn the air on while pointed towards a tea towel on my desk and run the pipe cleaner in there some more.

Seems to do the trick. Oh, I have a piece of hard tubing from a bubble wall that I've glued to the side of my heater so that I can slide the airline back in to the jar and leave it there without curling and bubbling other areas (keeps it in the exact same location every time).

 

Here is a pic of it:

 

 

Here is a random picture of some Palys that have grown on to the glass (Almost everything will take to glass):

 

This is on the back side of the jar so I don't mind that they are doing this (it happens fast!).

 

Peace!

[FlowerMama]

Palys adjusting to their environment, gotta love it.

[brandon429]

I've never seen that before in palythoa nice job that's probably the smallest total vol mixed sps reef running right now that I know of. There are likely some others assembled similar but not as matured.

[ReefJar]

Here is a quick update with a bit of Acan action! You can see the palys growing on the glass, everything is growing and growing!

 

 

Not much to report. I have a Red Planet Acropora... which was dark green in the middle of the jar. I moved it up higher 2 weeks ago. It started changing gray and a little red... but the polyps are now MIA... going to leave it and see what happens. Might have been a bad move.

 

Algae is under control as usual. Things have stabilized quite well and take care of themselves. I do really heavy feedings with no issues. Lots of worms and critters come out when they smell food!

 

I'm not dosing at all. I was for a little bit but got lazy. Regardless, things are still growing rapidly. I have a rock that's starting to cover with dark red/purple coraline. I'm sure it would speed up with dosing.

 

Still keeping an eye out for other corals that I might be able to squeeze in somewhere. I'd like to get something orange or purple... perhaps some sort of branching montipora (forest fire and a purple variety). Also would like some Rastas! But I'm not paying $15pp.

 

Welp, that's about it for now

[ReefJar]

Here are a couple photos that were edited by Maritza Vase Reef to help bring out the colours! Thanks so much! As many of you know, pictures are hard with reef lights! haha

 

 

[FlowerMama]

This is just the cutest little mini reef. Have you had to cut back the monti at all yet?

[brandon429]

This is tank of the month material just like MVR

[Sherman]

This is real colorful jar reef.

[brandon429]

a major important aspect of this build are the detail steps then the outcome all in one, its gold for jar reefers.

 

the tank was guided into this above... there were work times, algae removal times, which are less now since its all coral flesh and algae doesn't grow there. There was a starting busier mode which now lends a cruise control mode obviously per pics and its as nice as a ten thous sps system only by smaller scale.

 

-most assemblers leave early algae in the tank, hoping it goes away, adding animals which can work in some tanks and not others. Those animals are topical mowers, they never remove the algae actually they just mow it, and the holdfasts remain, so they w likely need animals regularly for this mode of control and at each interval those animals can vary, or coral growth can make gaps for hosting they cant get into...look at the results of your force guiding...its all corals now.

 

 

 

after controlling the substrate like that and preparing for coral growth, being able to pack it with plating colorful sps like that and have healthy coral flesh coverage everywhere is the art form/that is not guaranteed to replicate among aquarists so that's amazing to see in a small jar like that all packed and vigor

[brandon429]

This thread is now linked back to HolyCarps algae thread, HC this technique shown here simply works. add a little rasp/dig/scrape to yours if that powerful 35% doesn't already nail the holdfasts, which its likely to.

 

 

Both of these threads are on 35%, that's a real party right there.

[holy carp]

Hey, that last video was awesome. The music was priceless, and that tentacle grabbing the mysis at the end was priceless.

 

Nice work on the jar! Brandon directed me here to take a look at your accomplishments in the War on Algae using peroxide. I'm going through a similar battle but on a slightly larger scale. It's reassuring to see some real results. Algae can be discouraging.

[ReefJar]

This is just the cutest little mini reef. Have you had to cut back the monti at all yet?

 

I haven't had to cut the monti back! Originally the red one was a small sliver (piece that busted off another piece that is hiding in the shadows), but it's growing quite fast now. The green one is growing quickly as well, but it's okay for now. I may have to trim it back in a couple of months. I'll probably just snap off a big piece and add it to another project I started

 

Hey, that last video was awesome. The music was priceless, and that tentacle grabbing the mysis at the end was priceless.

 

Nice work on the jar! Brandon directed me here to take a look at your accomplishments in the War on Algae using peroxide. I'm going through a similar battle but on a slightly larger scale. It's reassuring to see some real results. Algae can be discouraging.

 

Thank you so much! I I wasn't going to upload this video just yet, I had more footage I wanted to add... but Maritza The Vase Reef was eagerly waiting for an update and thought that there might be others .... I need to work on my site a lot more. Just trying to find some time to do so.

 

Brandon is awesome and I'm so thankful for his advice. The jar really is in cruise control! A lot of my friends want their own mini-reefs now haha... unfortunately they don't want to put the time in, in the beginning to get things rolling.

 

35% H202 is awesome, just be careful as it's incredibly dangerous. I'm not sure if you've checked it out but I did a bigger write up on the h202 here http://www.reefjar.com/how-to-kill-algae-with-h202/

[gaspipe1]

This thread along with a few others have me seriously considering a pico jar tank. I have a question regarding the sand. Yourself along with Fab (who has his tread as a sticky) both mention the sand and the downside ( you mentioned about going bare bottom).

 

I was wondering, since you mentioned better to have 3-4 decent size rocks rather than 12 small rocks. What about having those larger rocks individually on egg crates? Perhaps make it so each rock is on an egg crate which could then easily be lifted out of the jar occasionally to stir the sand.

 

I was thinking to have the egg crate sit on top of the sand. Perhaps spray the egg crate with that sand colored spray paint to blend better. This way perhaps once a month you can easily lift the rocks in sections, stir the sand up and rinse it out during WC. Perhaps twice a year replace a portion of the sand?

 

Mind you I have zero experience, I'm just trying to see what people complain about and see if there is a solution.

 

Wonderful knowledge that you are sharing wit us, thank you!

[gaspipe1]

Have another question that I would like to pick your brain with, CUC! You really don't have. I know Brandon posted something (perhaps I misread or misunderstood, still new to this) but something in the lines of a preferred method of treating algae is to use H2O2 and allowing the corals to get to a large size that they don't give the algae a chance to survive. Something to the effect that snails will mow the algae down but not eliminate them. Also you have to deal with the cons of having them in a tank: knocking frags, waste and the toxins if they die.

 

I personally would rather have an efficient CUC that was effective apposed to using H2O2. My first reason is my goal is to create a natural ecosystem. And the second reason is (and I'm not ashamed) I have no dam idea what is good or what is bad. I would be bleaching anything and everything that I didn't place in the tank. I saw some of your pictures with them little shells and the eggs. I have to be honest, I may have not noticed that.

 

I understand your preferred method is using H2O2 early on before the issue escalates. But I wanted to know what options are there for CUC? In the end it really comes down to a thriving reef, so if I must use H2O2 then so be it. But I THINK a CUC would be my first choice (perhaps I am wrong and with further knowledge I come to the realization that this method is the most effective).

 

Thanks again,

 

Gaspare

[ReefJar]

Hey, thanks so much for the kind words!

I was wondering, since you mentioned better to have 3-4 decent size rocks rather than 12 small rocks. What about having those larger rocks individually on egg crates? Perhaps make it so each rock is on an egg crate which could then easily be lifted out of the jar occasionally to stir the sand.

 

 

Well the problem is, once things starting growing they will literally glue themselves together. So removing rock work from a narrow hole isn't going to work very well. If you only had 1 or 2 rocks in the center, perhaps you could do as you described.

To be honest, I think adding egg crate is just going to create more problems than it's worth. After all, it's a very small space.

I'm not worried about stirring up the sand anymore, every time I do a water change I end up mixing it up because I'm pretty reckless when doing water changes. Something like a hurricane / snow globe effect (I do a turkey baster blast- drain-rinse (fill it up again forcefully)-drain-fill each week). But maybe at Christmas I'll do a forced flush in the sink, just for the sake of it.

 

I understand your preferred method is using H2O2 early on before the issue escalates. But I wanted to know what options are there for CUC? In the end it really comes down to a thriving reef, so if I must use H2O2 then so be it. But I THINK a CUC would be my first choice (perhaps I am wrong and with further knowledge I come to the realization that this method is the most effective).

 

There is no problem with using a CUC (add whatever you want), some people do and some don't. There are snails in my jar, no idea where they came from. I'm assuming they were hitch hikers on the rock right from the start. There's one large stomatella and possibly a couple small ones, and one unknown snail. All noctural snails.

Here are somethings to consider:

When pest algae starts growing, it grows very very fast in the beginning. So you're going to need a very large CUC... but once things stabilize and the algae/pests are reduced... then your CUC is going to die because they don't have anything to eat. And some will start eating your corals in an effort to survive.

I'm pretty sure my jar would look like a mess right now if I hadn't been so diligent in the beginning. At this point, adding a crab or more snails would be pointless... they would die and attack corals because there's very little for them. I'd have to some how direct feed the CUC hoping to prevent carnage within.

What are you going to do if you get an aiptasia infestation? Shrimp are sketchy and might not take care of the problem. Adding a foxface or other type of fish is not realistic in such a small volume of water and you'll have a lot more issues to deal with. Using something like aiptasia x is probably going to kill everything because of the PH change. Again, small volume of water.

EDIT: H202 works great for them. I was using a paint brush to apply it in the past, but I started to use a cue tip. Not only does it burn them away, I can scrape the physical mess left and remove as much as possible with little drippage. And you can break the cue tip in half and use a pair of tweezers to hold it, to get in very difficult locations inside the reef.

Natural reef? Don't worry about algae then, there's plenty of it in the ocean

 

[gaspipe1]

EDIT: H202 works great for them. I was using a paint brush to apply it in the past, but I started to use a cue tip. Not only does it burn them away, I can scrape the physical mess left and remove as much as possible with little drippage. And you can break the cue tip in half and use a pair of tweezers to hold it, to get in very difficult locations inside the reef.

 

 

The more I'm reading on keeping a pico, the more I am realizing that H2O2 is the way to go. Thank you for taken the time to share this journey

[brandon429]

Gaspipe your preference for a clean up crew is ideal

 

 

Peroxide is a step down system, it down regulates until you don't need it much if ever because hand-guided substrates are free for coral and coralline deposition, which in turn perpetually rejects algae.

 

Use CUC ideally anytime, but don't let algae exist if they don't cure it for you, be willing to lift up rocks, scrape off and clean with peroxide until find the preventative tune...see how we aren't committing to anything permanent but simply refusing the first few rounds of invaders we predict are going to hitchhike in on our original frag and rock purchases? If we get early lucky with CUC, we won't need peroxide. Aim for that ideal CUC, no harm at all. Ours is an incremental tool

 

The key key detail is never ever farming algae on purpose, a clean up crew is a preventive not an algae remover, peroxide and scraping is the remover. This is the most important aspect of the invasion immune reef tank of any size it's just easier to model corrections in fast- responding pico reefs. Like architects models, they do for tank biology and it will upscale for sure

 

Algae free forever in any reef:

 

1. Hand scraping with chemical cheat cleanup guarantees zero algae present. 2. The degree of effectiveness of clean up crews, white and blue light balances, and nutrient controls are not the final say in tank invasion they only affect your work intervals to remain algae free. #1 is the sole determinant of whether nuisance algae exists in a system we can see.. Any sustained reef algae invasion on any board is a set of reasons why rule #1 could not be implemented.

[Anden]

Good read

[ReefJar]

Hey everyone! How's it goin'?

 

Updates

 

Salt Water

 

I was using Coralife Marine salt mix and it has been great! The only downside is that I had to order it online because the store I bought the first bag at was charging more for a bag than I could for a pail (150g mix) online. So I decided to look for something local and found Instant Ocean Reef Crystals. I've heard good things about it and I thought the extra nutrients/minerals would be great.

 

Did my usual thing, poured some water in to a bucket, got the power head going and dumped in some salt and mixed it with a small paddle for a minute and put the heater on. Everything was looking good so far... (following pic is actually from a 2nd smaller batch but looks exactly the same as the 1st one did.)

 

 

Came back 4 or 5 hours later to this... (Note: about 2hrs in I moved the power head up to help "aerate" the water)

 

 

I dumped the water because there was no way I was going to put this in my jar. This is some of the scum left over. There were actually like brown/orange globs on the heater and walls, hard to see in this pic.

 

 

Maybe it was a bad batch of salt?

 

Long story short, many people have experienced this with reef crystals and Instant oceans response is either

 

1. You didn't clean the mixing vessel/equipment properly
2. It's normal and will filter out or settle, it's just something that's picked up in their mining process and is okay to use.
3. Mixing the salt wrong (lol)

 

Some have said it's some sort of clay additive and they've used the water in their reefs with no problem for years. Something about the clay acting to draw out metals in the water etc etc... Either way we don't have skimmers or other filtration for this kind of thing, so I wasn't putting it in.

 

* I've seen similar orange/brown complaints with other brands of salt. It's the first time I've seen it. Never had an issue with Coralife or regular IO.

 

So I tried mixing the salt in cold water vigorously as instructed (adding the salt very very slowly over 15 mins), once it was closer to the proper SG, I then heated up the water.

 

Guess what? Same thing. Another person I found said that they mix and add it to their reef right away without issue. I was hesitant on that... but I tried mixing, heating, etc after 3 hours I did a water change. So far all has been okay, the water looks clear in the jar and the corals seem to be liking it.

 

Makes me a bit nervous of not letting the water "stabilize" for a long period of time, but it seems the longer that it mixes the browner it gets. IO say's the water should be ready as soon as it's mixed and SG/Temp are adjusted.

 

I might not use Reef Crystals after this bucket is done. I'll go either regular IO or deal with ordering salt and go back to Coralife.

 

Changing Salts

 

It's a good idea to change salts slowly. So what I did was I did partial water changes over the course of 1 week or so. 1st day 25%, 2 days later 50% 3 days 75% and today I did a 100% change.

 

Pictures

 

Here are a few pictures around water changing time. (Red planet is toasted, it didn't handle the move well and it was too late by the time I noticed it was taking a turn)

 

 

 

Hard to see here, but just above the acans on the bottom right you can see a branch of birdsnest growing to the right and it grow in to a monit and the monti is growing over it. I'll try to get a better pic some time. In the beginning there was a bit of fighting but now it's like they are okay with each other.

[FlowerMama]

I've not seen that in a bucket ever, and 95% of the time since I started reefing I've been using Reef Crystals.

[MedievalITGuy]

 

 

I dumped the water because there was no way I was going to put this in my jar. This is some of the scum left over. There were actually like brown/orange globs on the heater and walls, hard to see in this pic.

 

 

 

 

I have only been using Reef Crystals for a couple weeks now, but I did have to clean out my bucket the last time because it had picked up a scum on the bottom similar to what was left over in ReefJar's post. The water itself looked fine however, and has not caused any ill effects in my tanks, so I thought it was just because I hadn't cleaned the bucket in too long. I guess I'll have to keep my eye on it going forward.

[ReefJar]

Yeah there are many posts on other forums about it as well, even some pictures from Facebook of Instant Ocean's responses. And of course many who say they've never had this issue and others who have.

 

Are you using from a pail, bags, or boxes? I'm using salt from a pail and I rolled it around to mix it before I used it.

 

I'll definitely update if I run in to any problems or changes with this salt. Thanks so much for chiming in on it

 

Cheers!

[MedievalITGuy]

Are you using from a pail, bags, or boxes? I'm using salt from a pail and I rolled it around to mix it before I used it.

 

 

I'm using it out of a (25gal?) box.

 

It's probably worth noting that I did leave a stainless measuring cup in the salt for a couple weeks. It's possible that during that time, some of the iron leached out of the steel and contaminated the mixture. That may possibly explain the color. There was no discoloration to the salt itself though.

[HammerLover]

Ive been using reef crystals too, and my tank that was taken down a few weeks ago was 7 months old and Ive never seen that scum...

 

May I ask on what sps would be the best to start with? My 2 gal jar is done cycling and Ill put a couple of zoa frags and ricordeas this weekend. After afew months I may try some lps or sps. Any suggestions?

[ReefJar]

May I ask on what sps would be the best to start with? My 2 gal jar is done cycling and Ill put a couple of zoa frags and ricordeas this weekend. After afew months I may try some lps or sps. Any suggestions?

Done cycling? What type of lighting are you using? Could you give us a little more information about your setup?

 

Either way, when your system is "ready"... I would stick to something easier like Birdsnest to start and shy away from Acropora.