Feeling a failure..

[DefStatic]

So things were going good for so long. Then I got a purple fire fish that we found had a parasite I guess is common to them. It was fine for two months and then one morning was dead.

 

Then we lost our beautiful torch coral. It was fine for 5 months and then fell apart.

 

Now I am struggling with a frogspawn and I noticed my zoa seems smaller. I have now not seen my Hector goby for 14 hours either.

 

I get my water tested weekly. 1.024 salinity. 450 calcium. 0 ammonia and 0 nitrites. 8 or 9 alkalinity. PH 8.

 

I just do not know what I am doing wrong. Is it just part of owning a tank? I guess I have just not struggled with my freshwater tanks in so long because they have been well established for years. So maybe I am forgetting it can be tough at first and this 29g brochure is really only 4 or 5 months old.

[Neebles]

What are you using as your water supply? Rodi? Tap?

 

Don't beat yourself up either. Those to ably won't be your last losses in the hobby. Sometimes it just happens with no explanation. It's good that you are concerned and searching for the root problem.

[nanolutionary]

I have had plenty of problems along the way too so to a certain extent you're right it is having a new tank which yours still is. I wouldn't consider a tank mature/stable until a year.

 

I would advise you to start testing for magnesium and most importantly nitrate. You must have some knowledge of cycling a tank as you mention experience with freshwater before this tank therefore it appears you have tested Nitrite in which case the final step of the cycle is to check nitrate.

 

How often have you been doing water changes if any as this could also be a cause for concern/high nitrate levels.

[DefStatic]

I get ro/di water premixed from a LFS. My last nitrate test was 10. The highest it hit was 50 which was at the end of the cycle I did for 4 weeks.

 

I perform 5 gallon water changes every two weeks. Top off with ro/di water every other day.

 

The frogspawn is recovering well. I feel really stupid though having it in higher flow. The part dangling on the head is still opening up. The torch coral was a really sad loss, it was really gorgeous and thrived and then one day just started to fall apart.

 

I can't confirm when the last time the Hector was seen. I was gone for a week and the person watching said the never saw a dead fish. It is just really rare for me not to see it for 24 hours.

 

I do not think I am going to replace anything until I can confirm things are stable.

[Hammerstone]

Don't feel too bad or be too hard on yourself. When I first started out with freshwater I must have killed not intentionally who knows how many fish. Press on. Things will get better. I don't like people to feel bad.

[ndrobey]

I suspect the "person watching" was the babysitter for the tank. These people aren't going to tell you the truth about what happens when you are gone because they don't want to get into trouble. Try getting someone more reliable for when you are gone.

[Gooburz]

I get ro/di water premixed from a LFS. My last nitrate test was 10. The highest it hit was 50 which was at the end of the cycle I did for 4 weeks.

 

I perform 5 gallon water changes every two weeks. Top off with ro/di water every other day.

 

The frogspawn is recovering well. I feel really stupid though having it in higher flow. The part dangling on the head is still opening up. The torch coral was a really sad loss, it was really gorgeous and thrived and then one day just started to fall apart.

 

I can't confirm when the last time the Hector was seen. I was gone for a week and the person watching said the never saw a dead fish. It is just really rare for me not to see it for 24 hours.

 

I do not think I am going to replace anything until I can confirm things are stable.

 

Be VERY careful on who you let watch your tank which you probably know that by now. Also another thing to have in your tank is a BEEFY Clean Up Crew (CUC), look into one from reef cleaners they will hook you up and not break your wallet, you could also add a skunk shrimp to the CUC as well. So if for some reason you do have a fish die or something die in the tank your CUC will devour it before it has time to rot away and jack up your system. I had a Cardinal fish die and within a couple hours after it my wife noticed and the CUC had half of it eaten and nothing had changed on my system.

 

I've noticed that Torch corals are a lot more sensitive than their other counterpart Frogspawn, I have both in my tank and I've lost 2 torch corals and my frogspawn goes unharmed. I keep several other species of corals as well but for some reason Torch coral doesn't like my tank no matter who I get it from and where I place it. 2 of them have melted now and I have 1 left that had 3 heads but is down to 1 and that 1 head has not grown in about 5 months now, where my frogspawn grows 1-2 heads every month.

 

Trial and error in this hobby.

[CJJon]

See my comments below:

 

So things were going good for so long.

 

For so long? For only 5 months as you mentioned? That's a baby tank. Slow down.

 

Then I got a purple fire fish that we found had a parasite I guess is common to them. It was fine for two months and then one morning was dead.

 

It had a parasite when you bought it. Probably had it when it was caught. You should quarantine all new fish and treat them as needed. That's how some fish die, they seem fine and then you notice it dead sucked into an intake or being munched on my your CUC.

Then we lost our beautiful torch coral. It was fine for 5 months and then fell apart.

 

Again, it sounds like you added this to the tank right at the start since you said the tank is only 5 months old. That is way too soon. Torch corals can be hard to keep and should be added to a well established tank.

Now I am struggling with a frogspawn and I noticed my zoa seems smaller. I have now not seen my Hector goby for 14 hours either.

 

Ditto frogspawn, they can be tricky especially in a new tank.

I get my water tested weekly. 1.024 salinity. 450 calcium. 0 ammonia and 0 nitrites. 8 or 9 alkalinity. PH 8.

 

You need to be testing your own water and more frequently perhaps. Also should test for Mg and Alk. Get a good reef test kit and get some data on your tank. Tank of the Month winners do not have the LFS test their water every now and then. Also might want to boost salinity up a bit. I like 1.026. Stop using the LFS for your water. You have no idea what they are giving you. We all make mistakes and maybe the kid they had make the water that day forgot to use RODI and used regular tap like he does for all those freshwater tanks they have in the store. Really, the most important thing in this hobby is water and YOU need to be the master of it, not some monkey at the LFS. No excuses here.

I just do not know what I am doing wrong. Is it just part of owning a tank? I guess I have just not struggled with my freshwater tanks in so long because they have been well established for years. So maybe I am forgetting it can be tough at first and this 29g brochure is really only 4 or 5 months old.

 

Well, you are doing some things wrong and need to change up your approach. It doesn't have to be part of owning a tank. Freshwater is easier and far more forgiving. Your tank is brand new and you need to tweak your thoughts on what it takes to run a successful tank. Slow down a bit and get your water issues figured out. At the very least you need a TDS meter to test your top off water, test kits to test for nitrate, Mg, Ca, Alk, Phos. Also, if you insist on playing Russian roulette with the pre-made LFS saltwater, get an ammonia kit and test it for that too. LFS often sell used water from water changes instead of fresh mixed stuff. Some even claim it is pre-cycled and charge a premium. Do not trust them.

 

It would help if you post a current FTS and a stock list. Oh, and filtration set up too.

 

Also, do more frequent water changes instead of every two weeks. That is too long. I do one gallon every day on my 34g and it keeps things nice and stable.

 

For top off you should not be doing it every other day! Get an ATO. If you manually top off, you need to do it much more frequently than every other day. Like AM and PM. Really, just get an ATO. Do you have a refractometer? You should.

 

Hang in there, you will get it figured out and it will become routine and be easier.

 

 

[metrokat]

So things were going good for so long. Then I got a purple fire fish that we found had a parasite I guess is common to them. It was fine for two months and then one morning was dead.

 

Then we lost our beautiful torch coral. It was fine for 5 months and then fell apart.

 

Now I am struggling with a frogspawn and I noticed my zoa seems smaller. I have now not seen my Hector goby for 14 hours either.

 

I get my water tested weekly. 1.024 salinity. 450 calcium. 0 ammonia and 0 nitrites. 8 or 9 alkalinity. PH 8.

 

I just do not know what I am doing wrong. Is it just part of owning a tank? I guess I have just not struggled with my freshwater tanks in so long because they have been well established for years. So maybe I am forgetting it can be tough at first and this 29g brochure is really only 4 or 5 months old.

I wonder if you had a temperature spike, corals don't respond well to that.

Also the salinity could be changing due to not having an ATO, top off everyday instead of every 2 days.

 

It seems euphyllia might have issues, perhaps the flow is too much. You can try to find a lower flow area in the tank for them or turn down or re-position powerheads to help.

 

5 months into the tank there shouldn't be any ammonia or nitrite, these don't need testing beyond the first few months or when you add a significant bioload. Decaying matter is processed as that is what a biological filter's job is.

 

I think you're fine, a few problems are to be expected no matter how old or young a tank is.

[aviator300]

See my comments below:

 

+1 to everything Cjjon said. Especially about mixing your own water and top off AM and PM every day. I don't own an ATO (yet) but I top off religiously twice a day and do 25% water changes weekly.

 

One more thing on top offs. Stability is the one most important thing in this hobby. Coral and fish can survive (but not thrive) from a spgr of 1.018 to above 1.027 and water temps between 68 and 85 degrees +, as long as they are consistent but keep changing the numbers by a few point every day (even if they are in an otherwise good range), and things start dying over time.

 

That is why I make a mark on the glass where I want to keep the water level at, keep a jug of water handy, and top off whenever I pass by and notice it a little low (sometimes 3 X daily). It sounds kind of OCDish but it works. Whenever I test my spgr, it's dead on 1.025 every time.

[DefStatic]

I am going to give this thread another once over, but one thing I saw mentioned was a ATO. I have actually been thinking this myself, as the last time I was gone for a week, the level indicator on the side went down 3 inches or 4 inches. I did not leave instructions for how to top off as I did not think it was that off.

I am going to make better instructions so people watching can get me more info.

Anyone have any thoughts on this?

http://www.marinedepot.com/Buy_a_JBJ_Automatic_Top_Off_System_and_Get_an_Acella_Powerhead_Free_Electric_Powered_Dosing_Pumps_Top_Off_Plug_In_Units-JBJ_Lighting-JB51111-FIDPETPU-vi.html

 

I might even need to get one for my 30 gallon fresh. It was down an whole inch across to top. But I can make water and show people how to top that off.

I have been interested in a TDS meter for a long time, but have been afraid to pull the trigger on one. ANy suggestions on a decent yet reasonalby priced one?

I trust the place I get my water from. I know it is new water. They test my water with Red Sea kits. Usually I just test for Ammonia, Nitrite, and Nitrate. This time they did a bunch more. Here are the results:

 

SAL: 1.024

pH: 8

kH: 6.5 (this was 8 two weeks ago)
NO3: 2

NO2: .02
NH3: .05
CA: 400
Mg: 1260
PO4: .4

I only change the every two weeks, and 5 gallons at a time because it seemed to be doing just fine. I have had the water tested after two weeks and the numbers seem on par. The numbers above are after 15 days.

I have 3 Cardinals, 1 Cleaner Shrimp, 1 6 Line wrasse, 1 Clownfish, 5 o 6 crabs, 3 or 4 smaller snails, 1 turbo snail. 1 small thing of some sort of zoa that was thriving and is now strugling, a now two head frogspawn, a small thing of pipe organ, a disintegrating mushroom, a shrinking thing of ricordea, a large thing of GSP which seems to be thriving. I had a hectors goby which was doing just fine but must be dead in the rocks somewhere. I check the back, although with the DIY splash shield there is almost no room for a fish to jump back there.

In my tank I have about 18 lbs of LR. You can see pictures in my sig. In the back, I have a 100w heater and a coralife skimmer in chamber one. I try to change the skimmer every day. In chamber two I have a DIY media basket with three levels although I only use two. First a sponge, then purigen. Next to it I have another DIY rack with some chaeto. Under it I have some LR I had left over. Then onto my third chamber. I have a thing of Chemipure Elite I was told to put in the back for a month to get another out anything that may have caused an issue.

Also, on a side note, before I did a water change two weeks ago, my chaeto mysteriously fell apart. I swear before it it was fine. Then I noticed 90% died. I got all of it out and the little that was left over, and now it is fine again. But thought it was worth mentioning.

[CJJon]

You keep saying that what you are doing should be OK to continue as everything was going just fine for so long--but that was only a few months. You can't say things were thriving as you didn't have them all that long. What you actually have is a slow decline. You can keep trying it your way, but to be successful you really need to be the master of your water. 8 weeks since you tested kH? Often you will need to test daily, especially if you want to start keeping corals. IMO, your Ca, Alk, and Mg are a little low. More frequent water changes would help that. You really are not going to be able to do that with relying on an every couple a weeks check by the LFS staff. This is especially true if you plan to add more corals and to start dosing.

 

Never trust the LFS. Sorry, they may be nice people and all, but everyone makes mistakes. Trust but verify. At the very least, get in the habit of testing your own water.

 

A drop from evaporation of several inches is very bad. Get an ATO or pay more attention to your tank.

 

Ammonia and nitrite should be undetectable.

 

You need to change your water more than every two weeks, especially if you don't want to test and dose.

 

Running chemipure and purigen is probably overkill and not needed. Might want to replace the sponge with polyfill and replace it every 3 days.

 

Most refracts are the same--get the BRS one with calibration fluid.

[Hammerstone]

You're not topping off with salt water are you? You said you could make water and show them how to top the water off. Just caught my eye.

[DefStatic]

You're not topping off with salt water are you? You said you could make water and show them how to top the water off. Just caught my eye.

No, I mean for my freshwater tanks, I do not mind making my own water and showing someone how to top off.

 

Now, I will fully admit while I was going through my cycle the first month, I was topping off with salt water. Then my salinity went up and someone pointed out I shouldn't LOL

[Gooburz]

Cjjon is spot on with water quality, you can't expect to grow anything or have a healthy tank if your water quality is bad. If you are not going to do water changes more often at least have a beefy skimmer running and keep on top of topping off your water with RO/DI.

Personally I don't test often at all in my tank but the times I do my levels are spot on because I do 10 gallon water changes every week or every other week and I use RO/DI water with Red Sea Coral Pro salt. If you use a good salt and good water you shouldn't have issues. My corals have all grown 5-10 times their size in the 2+ years I've had them. But you can't get any of that unless you have a good water/salt quality, Skimmer/filtration, & light.

No, I mean for my freshwater tanks, I do not mind making my own water and showing someone how to top off.

Now, I will fully admit while I was going through my cycle the first month, I was topping off with salt water. Then my salinity went up and someone pointed out I shouldn't LOL

 

I wouldn't even be attempting corals after only a month, you want an established tank before you start putting corals in. I'd give your tank at least 4-6 months after it's been cycled to add corals. This is why so many new people have issues with corals and fish dying in their new tanks is because they rush it. Spend all that money on a system but don't give it time to mature. So you blow all that money on frags and they all die because the tank is not established to support them so then people dump a bunch of chemicals and what not into the tank and it doesn't help anything either. Just give it time to establish.

[DefStatic]

You keep saying that what you are doing should be OK to continue as everything was going just fine for so long--but that was only a few months. You can't say things were thriving as you didn't have them all that long. What you actually have is a slow decline. You can keep trying it your way, but to be successful you really need to be the master of your water. 8 weeks since you tested kH? Often you will need to test daily, especially if you want to start keeping corals. IMO, your Ca, Alk, and Mg are a little low. More frequent water changes would help that. You really are not going to be able to do that with relying on an every couple a weeks check by the LFS staff. This is especially true if you plan to add more corals and to start dosing.

 

Never trust the LFS. Sorry, they may be nice people and all, but everyone makes mistakes. Trust but verify. At the very least, get in the habit of testing your own water.

 

A drop from evaporation of several inches is very bad. Get an ATO or pay more attention to your tank.

 

Ammonia and nitrite should be undetectable.

 

You need to change your water more than every two weeks, especially if you don't want to test and dose.

 

Running chemipure and purigen is probably overkill and not needed. Might want to replace the sponge with polyfill and replace it every 3 days.

 

Most refracts are the same--get the BRS one with calibration fluid.

I do not think I meant to say I think I am doing fine. I mean to say I was under the impression that nothing was dying and everything was at least opening open and seeming to grow but not spread, so I figured I was doing things right. Now I made this post because I figured I must be doing something wrong.

 

And I do not know what happened to some people here, but I trust my LFS. And I have been told by may people that API kits are not reliable for SW and I did not want to buy the more expensive ones.

 

i have tried the polyfill. It did not seem to do anything better, and my problem became what to do when I am gone for extended times. Any advise if I go back to poly? I still got a giant bag of it LOL.

 

Thanks for the information though. The most difficult thing to deal with in this hobby is there are 1000+ different ways and opinions on everything LOL.

[Gooburz]

I do not think I meant to say I think I am doing fine. I mean to say I was under the impression that nothing was dying and everything was at least opening open and seeming to grow but not spread, so I figured I was doing things right. Now I made this post because I figured I must be doing something wrong.

 

And I do not know what happened to some people here, but I trust my LFS. And I have been told by may people that API kits are not reliable for SW and I did not want to buy the more expensive ones.

 

i have tried the polyfill. It did not seem to do anything better, and my problem became what to do when I am gone for extended times. Any advise if I go back to poly? I still got a giant bag of it LOL.

 

Thanks for the information though. The most difficult thing to deal with in this hobby is there are 1000+ different ways and opinions on everything LOL.

If you are going away for extended periods of time all the time than reef keeping is not going to be a thing for you to do. Once in awhile is fine but all the time you basically need to have someone who knows how to manage your setup which never happens. Going away for periods of time you'll NEED a ATO unit (Auto Top Off), that would be a must!

[HarryPotter]

+1 on ATO

 

It lets me ignore the tank for a week at a time! (Not reccomending it; just saying an ATO lowers maintenance)

 

In fact today it sounded an alarm because the water level was too high. It turns out my HO skinner fell INTO the tank!

 

I reccomens either DIY with a float valve or the Nano Osmulator ($99)

[cindyp]

i really think this is par for the course.

 

don't be too hard on yourself. i've been there

too. now i'm almost 11 months in. have had

my fair share of deaths and mistakes and disasters.

[Hammerstone]

I've had my share. We had to move a tank after it seemed cycled and had a lot of cool hitch hikers on our live rock. The kitchen counter we had the 30 on couldn't take the weight. The tank nuked itself in the move for some reason, we had to move the rocks and I think the live rock wasn't cured or something whatever but we had nothing but a hermit crab left and had to clean the rocks in fresh and had to start over. That sucked and made me very sad. Glad that's way in the past, about a year ago. My husband bought some kind of hawk fish and it immediately killed our royal gramma. When it went for the clown it went back to the store. It was an impulse buy. That was a lesson. Had a beautiful flame angel, upgraded powerheads, next day it was dead. There's more but I am tired of typing now lol.

[DefStatic]

It is good to know that I am not the only one. Not that it is good to make people relive their experiences though.

Any other thoughts on the water params?That was after two weeks. I figured the ammonia and nitrite was from the dead goby.

There is, I admit, a lot i guess I do not know. I did not know originally not to top off with salt water. Maybe I am doing something else wrong.

I am going to order an ATO this week. I am guessing it is fairly self explanatory.

It is tough in this hobby. I am finding myself running into some of the same issues I ran into with freshwater, which is that there is so much information. And you read one thing and someone says to do it this way. And you read something else that says the opposite. Heck, when choosing my lights there were people who said they were fine and there were people who said it was a really horrible choice.

[HarryPotter]

It is good to know that I am not the only one. Not that it is good to make people relive their experiences though.

 

Any other thoughts on the water params?That was after two weeks. I figured the ammonia and nitrite was from the dead goby.

 

There is, I admit, a lot i guess I do not know. I did not know originally not to top off with salt water. Maybe I am doing something else wrong.

 

I am going to order an ATO this week. I am guessing it is fairly self explanatory.

 

It is tough in this hobby. I am finding myself running into some of the same issues I ran into with freshwater, which is that there is so much information. And you read one thing and someone says to do it this way. And you read something else that says the opposite. Heck, when choosing my lights there were people who said they were fine and there were people who said it was a really horrible choice.

 

Don't worry, thats why forums exist.

 

If you make a new thread with your "build" (Details on tank, lighting, parameters, issues, etc) you can get amazing advice here!

 

Don't beat yourself up- everyone has accidents.

[Partially Submerged]

Don't feel too bad or be too hard on yourself. When I first started out with freshwater I must have killed not intentionally who knows how many fish. Press on. Things will get better. I don't like people to feel bad.

 

Don't feel like a failure. Mistakes are part of the hobby, and sometimes it's important to even take risks and accept losses. However, I somewhat disagree with Hammerstone's statement above. Beating yourself up over lost fish, plants, inverts, etc. is a good thing. That's how you'll get better, and that's how you learn to pay attention. I try to remind myself that whatever my livestock is, I am the only chance it has. That's pretty good motivation because I don't like killing things.

 

Also, you might want to consider going coral only for a while (i.e. corals plus clean-up crew, but no fish or anything else that needs to be fed). It's infinitely easier to create a stable environment when you don't have to add nutrients to the tank by feeding.

[Sancho]

New tank syndrome. Give it some time. What are you using to light it? Stop buying premixed water and ro/di from the LFS....unless you work at the LFS and know exactly what you are getting. Invest in a RO/Di unit. Test your own water. The LFS is probably using cheap test kits that are not that accurate. Most LFS have a vested interest in you loosing stuff. Euphillia are fairly easy to keep as long as they have descent light light and ok water params, although some torches can be hard to keep. They dont like to be in front of your power head but with slow aclimation they will do well in high flow tanks. To me it seems like you added too much too fast.

[DefStatic]

Looking back, I do suppose I moved a hair too quickly.

 

I need to update my build thread in my signature.

 

I went to my LFS and they were out of the tune Nano but had a used jbj with a pump for $40. It was one of the staffs and was supposedly barely used. I said for $40 I will give it a try. Also got a 2.5 gallon tank to hold the water. I also picked up some stuff to improve my wire management. Spent a couple hours last night redoing all my wires. Something I should have done from the beginning. I did not setup the ATO yet. I am going to get everything lined up first and then do it this weekend so I can monitor it. Gotta get pics of the wires now, sort of proud of it. Could be better but world's better than it was.

 

Oh, also picked up a secondary glass thermometer. Something to compare the digital one to.

 

Which begs the next question. Temps. I can't get mine lower than 80, Hut I have read really mixed opinions on this. It seemed the idea was 80 is fine, but most people go 78 so there is some room for error.