Odyssey's 40 Breeder

[Odyssey350kc]

Ok so A summary of the past month

 

9-12-17 - Lowered my light output to a maximum of 40% for a few hours during the day 

9-12-17 - Turned flow all the way up on my mp10 pump and added another small powerhead for more flow

16 gallon or roughly -20% water changes once a week using reef crystals. Blast all rocks out with a turkey baster before siphoning out water.
Lowered my alk to 9.5 as of today (see pics)

Raised my calcium to 440 as of today (see pics)

Added poly-filter 3 days ago - turning a slight brownish green color - package says that means it is removing organic material 

Broadcast feeding roughly half a cube of mysis and maybe a teaspoon of dry coral food per day.

Turned offf my gfo / carbon reactor

 

I have seen no improvement in any of my corals, in fact most still seem to be getting worse. Any other ideas?

 

 

[Tamberav]

This is what I found online for reef crystals but I don't know how accurate it is... I feel when I buy a salt and actually test it, it is different. I would think doing water changes with a high CA/ALK salt but lowering the alk at same time would cause swings? Maybe cause of the 10.5 to 11.5 back to 10.5?

 

Calcium, 490 ppm
Alkalinity, 13 dKH
Magnesium, 1440 ppm.

 

 

[Orangutran]

On 9/13/2017 at 9:01 PM, Tamberav said:

If you do not have significant algae that is sucking up your nutrients giving a false reading. I would say your chemistry is out of wack. Having low nutrients, and HIGH alk is generally considered a bad thing. I tried to look up the reason briefly but couldn't find the exact reason, just that it seems to cause issues.

 

Why are you running your alk at 10.5? Corals are adaptive but evolved to be in natural sea levels parameters.

I found out recently too that low/zero nutrients are bad, unless you are dosing. Tamberav is correct, if there is no algae growth, then your nitrates/phos have bottomed out and your corals are starving. I recently added phosphates of all things, and my corals are improving. I even stopped GFO.

 

On 9/21/2017 at 10:59 PM, Odyssey350kc said:

Another thing I have noticed about my tank is that I have no coraline algae after 3 years you would think some. But no.

Funny I have the same "problem"! My tank is over 2 years old, and no coraline growth! Our systems are imbalanced, or missing something! 

[Weetabix7]

Maybe try adding LIVE Phytoplankton. 

The live phyto I get from www.mikesphyto.com always produces positive results in my tank. 

[Odyssey350kc]

1 hour ago, Weetabix7 said:

Maybe try adding LIVE Phytoplankton. 

The live phyto I get from www.mikesphyto.com always produces positive results in my tank. 

Did that for about a month after I ordered pods, didn't see much of a change.

2 hours ago, Orangutran said:

I found out recently too that low/zero nutrients are bad, unless you are dosing. Tamberav is correct, if there is no algae growth, then your nitrates/phos have bottomed out and your corals are starving. I recently added phosphates of all things, and my corals are improving. I even stopped GFO.

 

Funny I have the same "problem"! My tank is over 2 years old, and no coraline growth! Our systems are imbalanced, or missing something! 

I wouldn't say I have no algae, it grows on the glass and there is always little bits around but it newer gets out of hand. I did turn off my GFO and carbon hoping that will help. Also feeding pretty heavily .

[IowaDiver]

Have you verified your instrumentation is accurate? Have you tried testing salinity with another instrument? Is it an open top aquarium? Could there be contamination from any nearby aerosols?

[Odyssey350kc]

On 9/29/2017 at 11:17 AM, IowaDiver said:

Have you verified your instrumentation is accurate? Have you tried testing salinity with another instrument? Is it an open top aquarium? Could there be contamination from any nearby aerosols?

Yes I calibrated my refractometer. It is an open top aquarium, but we do not use many chemicals or air freshners in the house. I am very careful what i use near the tank.

[Odyssey350kc]

Its time to bring my tank back from failure!

 I am going to try and document the majority of what I do on this page, Hopefully this will serve as a sort of visual reference as to what seems to be working and what doesn't.

 

To recap the past 4 years or so.

 

- Febuary of 2015 I fill my 40 breeder with the contents of my very successful 20 long I had in operation since august of 2012

The tank does ok but the coral never really grows like it did with the 20 Long.

By July of 2017 I have finally conceded that there is something wrong with my tank, many of the corals have died off and I am not getting any new growth.

 

I believe by the end of 2017 more than 75% of my corals and my clam I kept for over 4 years have died off. It is at this point I decided not to try finding the problem anymore and just enjoy the few corals I have that survive. My friend is dismantling his tank he hasn't done a water change in over 6 months and his coral is still doing great behind a wall of algae glass. It doesnt make sense.

 

At some point, probably winter of 2018 I call in a local reef tank maintenance guy to try and figure out my tank. He tests my water and finds that there is nothing way out of wack but to be positive I should send my water to germany and have a full labratory grade test done, which we do. Results come back and there is still nothing off with my water. His only idea is that I need to dose trace elements, which I do, but there is no change.

 

Defeated I resign myself to the fact that I will never again enjoy a vibrant reef tank full of color and variety.

 

Fast forward to now - I have stared at this half hearted tank for too many years - It is time to make my reef tank great again!

 

The following are a list of possible problems and solutions I have tried over the course of more than 3 years:

Lighting - I have changed my lighting schedule, I have increased par and decreased par, I have changed between T5's and LEDs, I've run both.

Water changes - I have changed the water weekly, and biweekly for 3 or more months straight. I have tried not changing water for months at a time.

Temperature - I have fluctuated the temperature to almost every different opinion of the best temp online.

Calcium and alk levels - Tried everything under the sun at some point.

Changing salt mixes- tried 4 different brands.

Electrical leakage theory - thought i might be getting stray voltage in my tank, went down a rabbit hole of confusion on this one, never got a clear answer.

Water flow- Tried everything from 1 powerhead on low to upgrading pumps and having 3 powerheads.

Feeding - Have tried feeding hardly anything , Ive tried feeding heavily every day for weeks at a time. Ive added live phytoplankton and copepods

Gfo, carbon, chemipure, poly-filter, I've used them all.

Refugium - ran tank with one , ran tank without one.

 

The last few Ideas I have yet to try:

 

Water changes with nutri seawater - eliminates any possibility of the water i am using for water changes being the issue, but its a pricey experiment, how long do i try it for?

 

Siphoning out all of my sand - I remember hearing that old sand can be a problem.  I really like my sand and am not a fan of bare bottom tanks

 

Starting over - I have a few friends who think I just need to start fresh, Get a new tank, fill it with fresh live rock, and all my problems will be solved. 

I would really hate to start a whole new tank just to realize after investing $500-$1000 that I have the same issues.

 

 

 

[Odyssey350kc]

I decided the only way for me to be 100% sure that there is nothing in my rock or water causing my issues was to start fresh, so here we go.

 

I set up my old 20 long on the tv stand next to my tank, siphoned about half of the water out of the 40 breeder into the 20 long and transferred all of the fish, coral and about half the rock. Luckily I never throw anything away so I didn't have to buy anything to set up the 20 again. 

 

I took the rest of the rock out and placed it in a bucket with bleach and water. Then I used an old cat litter scoop to get all the snails and hermits out of the sand. Turns out i only had 2 snails and 1 hermit crab left. Pretty surprising considering how many I put in there over the years. You can see in the picture how disgustingly filthy the sand was.

 

After the tank and sump were completely drained and emptied the next step was to tear out my old tank stand. I had used a piece of live edge wood braced with steel angle iron, and over the years the wood had warped to the point you could slide a quarter under the tank, and I felt that it would probably crack if given the right tap. The steel bracing had also rusted heavily in spots and I wanted to raise the tank a few more inches to get more clearance in the sump area.

 

My plan is to finish bleaching out my old rock and use that combined with some new dry rock to rescape the tank. When I'm done with that I will be doing a fishless cycle using Brightwell aquatics - microbacter dry rock starter kit.

 

I am undecided on whether or not to get a new LED fixture, my maxspect razor is coming up on 9 years old and I am wondering if I should just go all out and buy a new led to eliminate the light as a potential coral growing problem. If yes, What light would you recommend for a mixed reef, If everything goes right I will be leaning more towards SPS.

 

 

 

 

 

[Odyssey350kc]

Stained the wood for the stand.

 

 

Got the tank filled, Sump lit, reefkeeper wired

 

 

And went to my local reef shop to pick up some live rock and sand. See obligatory cloudy tank pic.

 

 

 

So what next? Its been so long since I've set up a tank. Add a fish in a week or so? Or do something else first?

[Odyssey350kc]

A little video update on the tank.

 

[Odyssey350kc]

Big reef day today. Went to LFS traded in a bunch of frogspawn and green button polyps for some new frags. Picked up a large piece of orange montipora (my favorite coral), a blastomussa, and some bright orange zooanthids.

I also transferred the remainder of the coral from the temp 20 gallon tank to the 40. This was quite the process however. After trying to get my rock flower anemone off the old live rock for an hour I finally decided to smash the rock with a hammer, it was only after I exposed the underside of the foot of the anemone that I was able to get it to release from the rock. I had to chisel rock to remove a riccordea and an acan as well.

What would you guys expect for growth on the blastomussa and the zooanthids in say a month? If I don't see at least a couple more zoo polyps or some growth then something is off, correct? I'm trying to use these frags to judge if i'm ready for more corals. Hopefully I get some good growth from them.

 

[debbeach13]

Well you have done a lot of hard work rebooting this tank. I looks great. I hope it does well for you. Going with all new rock and sand makes it more like a new tank and should have resolved what ever the problem was. 

[farkwar]

Good going

 

And seems to me, you have room for a LOT more corals

[Odyssey350kc]

21 hours ago, debbeach13 said:

Well you have done a lot of hard work rebooting this tank. I looks great. I hope it does well for you. Going with all new rock and sand makes it more like a new tank and should have resolved what ever the problem was. 

Thank you, That's what I'm hoping. It eliminates alot of variables. I guess if i just keep narrowing it down eventually I will solve my problem.

21 hours ago, farkwar said:

Good going

 

And seems to me, you have room for a LOT more corals

Thanks., I am leaving as much room as I can on the rocks at the top of the tank. If all goes well I would like to have a good amount of sps there.

[Odyssey350kc]

I really dislike my vertex omega 130 protein skimmer. I have never been able to get it tuned in. Thinking of picking up a new one on black Friday. 

Not looking to spend a ton of money. What is the easiest skimmer to dial in?

[Odyssey350kc]

Good news the tank is doing great. The orange zoos have grown from 3 polyps to about 8 and the montipora is encrusting to the rock. Went to my local reef shop and was able to pick up an awesome clam about 3 weeks ago and grabbed a few more corals last weekend. Got a green montipora with red polyps, some pink and blue zoas and a good size acro frag.

 

My wife got me a new reef octopus protein skimmer for christmas, and only thing I can say is, its awesome! Sooooo much easier tune than the vertex skimmer, its already pulling out lots of gunk.

 

The only issue I am having is that I'm battling dinoflanges. Hopefully I can get rid of them with some bottled bacteria, water changes, and planning on doing a 2 day blackout.

 

[debbeach13]

That is some good skimming right there. I hope all the new corals do well for you.

[Odyssey350kc]

Success. I have defeated the dinos with a 2 day blackout and vigorous dosing of microbacter 7.

[Sharbuckle]

Congrats on beating the dinos. Looks like you’re off to a great re-start! Happy Reefing 

[Odyssey350kc]

Got a couple of new additions tonight. The wife picked out the clown. I wasn't going to get another but she really liked the different look. 

 

The clown I had really likes the new one already. I feel a little bad I didn't get him a new friend after my last one jumped out of the temp tank months ago.

 

Also got this good size birdsnest frag. One of my favorite corals, used to be alot more common, but it took me a long time to find a frag locally.

[Odyssey350kc]

Picked up a small red rock flower anenome at the local pet store and an anthia over the weekend. I know I may get some hate on the anthia but I have seen them kept singly and successfully in smaller tanks. It is already eating everything I put in including hanging out by the feeding ring which I have an automatic feeder dumping in 3 types of dry coral food 3 times per day. If anyone has suggestions on a freeze dried food specific for anthias I would love to add it in as well.

 

Tomorrow I am expecting a shipment of corals as well. I will update once I have them all placed and they are out of their shipping funk.

[Odyssey350kc]

A bit of sad news. Roughly a week after adding the anthia and chromis to my tank. Something happened that killed all but 1 clownfish, my cardinalfish and 6 line wrasse. I caught the anthia when I saw white spots appear on it, but I'm sure it was too late and had infected the tank. I set up a 10 gallon tank to try and save the anthia but it was dead the next morning. I guess that's what I get for not quarantining. 

 

It has been roughly 6 weeks so I decided to get a couple new additions. A long nose hawkfish, red dragonette goby, and a duncan coral.

[Odyssey350kc]

Gonna try and get rid of some bryopsis. I removed as much as I could by hand, and added Flux rx. I read good things about it, so hopefully it works. You couldn't even see the zoos before I ripped off most of the bryopsis.

[Odyssey350kc]

Well the reef Flux worked great. Completely removed all the bryopsis from my tank. 

 

I have noticed a few of my sps are loosing color, so I went ahead and ordered a reef breeders led strip to try and get better coverage.