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Korallen-Zucht ZEOvit Nano Thread


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Great idea making this thread. I have actually been researching the Zeovit Nano package for the past couple days and have a couple questions.

 

1) It seems that package is geared more towards a nano tank that is not necessarily a full Zeo system. What requirements do you feel are necessary, though, before starting to dose the products in the nano package? ULNS? Tank established for X amount of months?

 

2) Does it matter if you are running any kind of chemical filtration? Is the Zeovit additives more effective if you use a certain type of chemical filtration? I currently am running Purigen and ChemiPure Elite, but have thought about switching to GFO and/or plain carbon. Any thoughts?

 

3) The reason I am thinking about starting the nano package is for overall coral health, growth, and color. I have a Nuvo 8, mixed reef. No SPS yet, but plan to add some in a couple months once the tank is more established. Is it worth it for me to start the zeovit nano package, or would it just be a waste?

 

Oh and my plan is to use Zeobak plus all 4 products in the zeovit nano package. Something along the lines of the following dosing schedule. I found this on a post in the zeovit forum:

Monday:

* 1 drop Coral Vitalizer

Tuesday:

* 1 drop Sponge Power

Wednesday:

* 6 drops (0.3ml) Xtra

Thursday:

* 6 drops (0.3ml) AA LPS

Friday:

* 1 drop Sponge Power

Saturday:

* 6 drops (0.3ml) Xtra

Sunday:

* Water Change

* 6 drops (0.3ml) AA LPS

* 1 drop Zeobak

4) Are there any other products that you would feel would be necessary to add to this regimen that would be beneficial?

 

1) Nano pack is IMO not well thought out by Korallen-Zucht. However, it contains some of the more popular "coloration" additives the company produces. You are right, the additives are not what is necessary to run ZEOvit but that can really enhance corals if used sparingly in a low nutrient system.

 

2) Any coloration additives, ZEOvit or other, work best when nutrients are low and corals are slightly pale. Regardless of filtration method, if your nutrients are ultra low, you should see results within a couple of days of dosing. GFO has always been problematic in the past for me, I am not a fan, but I know it is effective at removing PO4 so if you need it, use it. I run my 7 gallon system on a filter sock, skimmer, and GAC. I dose 1 drop twice a week of ZEObak with Coral Snow, and that's it. I dump 1 cube of frozen mysis total per day along with various other additives including AALPS, no need for chemical filtration.

 

3) If used sparingly I think the nano pack will improve health and colour of corals. They will not lighten corals or magically transform your tank into full ZEOvit tank. Nutrients have to be under control first, stable and low, for the products to be effective.

 

Your dosing basically looks okay, I would do SP three time a week and AALPS once a week however.

 

4) If you are skimming I would add Coral Snow, dosed after your water change (1 mL mixed with 1 drop ZEObak), turn your skimmer off for 2 hours after dosing.

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1) Nano pack is IMO not well thought out by Korallen-Zucht. However, it contains some of the more popular "coloration" additives the company produces. You are right, the additives are not what is necessary to run ZEOvit but that can really enhance corals if used sparingly in a low nutrient system.

 

2) Any coloration additives, ZEOvit or other, work best when nutrients are low and corals are slightly pale. Regardless of filtration method, if your nutrients are ultra low, you should see results within a couple of days of dosing. GFO has always been problematic in the past for me, I am not a fan, but I know it is effective at removing PO4 so if you need it, use it. I run my 7 gallon system on a filter sock, skimmer, and GAC. I dose 1 drop twice a week of ZEObak with Coral Snow, and that's it. I dump 1 cube of frozen mysis total per day along with various other additives including AALPS, no need for chemical filtration.

 

3) If used sparingly I think the nano pack will improve health and colour of corals. They will not lighten corals or magically transform your tank into full ZEOvit tank. Nutrients have to be under control first, stable and low, for the products to be effective.

 

Your dosing basically looks okay, I would do SP three time a week and AALPS once a week however.

 

4) If you are skimming I would add Coral Snow, dosed after your water change (1 mL mixed with 1 drop ZEObak), turn your skimmer off for 2 hours after dosing.

What would you define parameters to be for ULNS. As of last night, my phosphates are 0 and Nitrates are under 1 ppm. Would you feel that is sufficient? Are there any other nutrients to test for? My tank has only been running for about 2.5 months. Does that even matter?

 

I do not run a skimmer. I have thought about adding a Tunze 9004, but it would be a tight fit and I still am not quite sure it is necessary for such a small tank, without a sump. I think I might take your advice and switch my chemipure to SeaChem Matrix Carbon. Still undecided on whether to stick with the Purigen or not. I'm thinking I'll stick with it, and if I decide to add the skimmer, then I will remove it as the skimmer would make Purigen unnecessary. Any thoughts?

 

And thank you for your input. I greatly appreciate it. Your aquariums are amazing....very inspirational!

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I've had good results with using the coloration additives for Zeo for a 35g. I do vinegar dosing + GFO + microbacter7 in place of Zeobak/Zeostart to drive to near-ULNS (as in close to STN'ing my SPS), and then add the additives + oyster-feast. I've continued my regimen with my new 90g and I have to say I'm very satisfied with the results. I'm still dosing for 35g levels though as I've added in more fish and feed them more.

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What would you define parameters to be for ULNS. As of last night, my phosphates are 0 and Nitrates are under 1 ppm. Would you feel that is sufficient? Are there any other nutrients to test for? My tank has only been running for about 2.5 months. Does that even matter?

 

I do not run a skimmer. I have thought about adding a Tunze 9004, but it would be a tight fit and I still am not quite sure it is necessary for such a small tank, without a sump. I think I might take your advice and switch my chemipure to SeaChem Matrix Carbon. Still undecided on whether to stick with the Purigen or not. I'm thinking I'll stick with it, and if I decide to add the skimmer, then I will remove it as the skimmer would make Purigen unnecessary. Any thoughts?

 

And thank you for your input. I greatly appreciate it. Your aquariums are amazing....very inspirational!

I would say you are running ULNS if those parameters are stable.

 

The reason for the skimmer in this case is for export of Coral Snow and unused suspended bacteria (and of course detritus or other proteins). I think any probiotic system should have a skimmer running at least 50% of the time. A skimmer and Purigen perform two very different functions, I prefer using a skimmer over chemical filtration personally.

 

Thank you for your comments and your welcome :)

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I've had good results with using the coloration additives for Zeo for a 35g. I do vinegar dosing + GFO + microbacter7 in place of Zeobak/Zeostart to drive to near-ULNS (as in close to STN'ing my SPS), and then add the additives + oyster-feast. I've continued my regimen with my new 90g and I have to say I'm very satisfied with the results. I'm still dosing for 35g levels though as I've added in more fish and feed them more.

 

It has always scared me to mix nutrient export methods like vinegar and GFO. What KZ additives are you using now?

 

 

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

 

 

Here's my guide for diluting ZeoStart3 if anyone is interested :)

 

 

 

 

 

By diluting ZeoStart3 solution you can more accurately dose smaller amounts of Zeostart3 in an automated way via peristaltic doser. This prevents possible missed doses and improves consistency and delivery of the carbon source to sustain balanced amounts in the system.

 

I have been using this method for a year with good results.

 

Consider the following mixing ratios first.

 

1:19, ZeoStart3/RODI water. 1 part ZeoStart3 (say 100mL) to 19 parts RODI water (say 1900mL) will yield you 2000mL of solution. Each 1mL of solution will contain 0.05mL of ZeoStart3.

 

e.g.

If you wanted to dose a total of 0.5mL per day of ZeoStart3 divided into 2 doses (0.25mL x 2), you would set your doser to deliver 5mL twice a day (5mL x 2 = 10mL of solution) = 0.5mL of ZeoStart3.

 

1:9, ZeoStart3/RODI water. 1 part ZeoStart3 (say 100mL) to 9 parts RODI water (say 900mL) will yield you 1000mL of solution. Each 1mL ofsolution will contain 0.1mL of ZeoStart3.

 

e.g.

If you wanted to dose a total of 0.5mL per day of ZeoStart3 divided into 2 doses (0.25mL x 2), you would would not be able to do it because most dosers deliver only 1mL minimum and 1 mL of solution contains 0.1mL of ZeoStart3. So this Ratio only works if you are dosing even numbers daily (like 0.2/0.4/0.6/0.8 mL and so on), get it? The 1:9 ratio is better when dosing larger amounts of ZeoStart3 with even numbers. You could dose more than 2 times daily to try and equal the total amount dosed per day but that just makes thing more difficult.

 

As long as you stick to the ratio, any amount of solution can be created. I recommend only making the amount that will fit in your dosing container at a time. Prolonged storage of the solution only increases the risk of contamination over time.

 

To dilute ZeoStart3 properly, follow this:

 

Depending on the accuracy of your doser (most are not that accurate) I recommend 1:19 ratio for dilution. A 1:9 ratio can also be used but I would only consider this ratio if your dose amounts will be over 5mL per dose.

 

It is also a good idea to calibrate your doser before beginning with RODI water. This will avoid wasting ZeoStart3 solution and risking overdosing the tank. Dosers should be calibrated and tested frequently for accuracy of dose.

 

The goal is not to introduce bacteria to your solution, this will cause contamination as the bacteria feed off the solution and multiply over time. This will generally cause the solution to become cloudy. To avoid this I recommend following the below steps as best as possible.

 

You will need a container to hold the solution that seals and can withstand temperature sterilization, usually glass works well.

 

Boil some RODI water and wash the inside of the container, lid, and all tubing (used for drawing the solution to the doser and tank.) Discard this water, do not dry with a cloth, do not touch any of the surfaces that will have contact with the solution. Place the items on a clean or sterilized surface to cool naturally.

 

Boil the required amount of RODI water to be used for your solution. Once at the boiling point remove from heat and allow to cool naturally. This may take some time so you can speed up the process by placing the boiling container in a ice bath (be sure not to contaminate your boiled water in this process). You should also cover the water to avoid what is called "bacterial rain", this is bacteria in the air that will fall to the surface of the water and contaminate it. It is best if you can complete the cooling within 30 minutes time to lower the chance of contamination.

 

Pour the cooled and measured amount of RODI water into your dosing container.

 

Add the measured amount of ZeoStart3 to the RODI water.

 

Place the lid and tube on the dosing container and swirl the solution for 60 seconds to mix it. You are now ready to connect the solution bottle to the dosing pump. Adjust the dosing pump to deliver the desired amount of ZeoStart3 solution twice a day. You can also dose 4 times a day but consider with a smaller dose delivery amount, the accuracy of the dose will also decrease. Most dosers will dose a minimum of 1mL, consider this when planning your dose amounts and frequency.

 

The solution will stay mixed without future or continual mixing. You could swirl it once a week if you are in doubt.

 

I recommend you check the actual amount of solution being delivered as the hose is normally positioned. This should be done on a regular basis just to make sure your doser is working properly. This can be done effectively by catching the solution as it is being delivered in a graduated cylinder. If you don't have a graduated cylinder, you could also use a syringe, remove the plunger and plug the hole where the needle would attach.

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If anyone wants to figure out your ZeoStart3 daily dosage (Minimum and Maximum recommended by KZ) here is an easy way how.

 

 

 

  • First, figure out your *NET system water volume in Litres (L).
  • On your calculator, enter your NET volume, divide by 950 and you have the **minimum recommended amount in mL.
  • On your calculator, enter your NET volume, divide by 475 and your have your ***maximum recommended amount in mL.

 

 

*This is the actual amount of water in your total system.

**Minimums are what are recommended by Korallen-Zucht but less or more can be used at your discretion.

***Maximums are what are recommended by Korallen-Zucht but less can be used at your discretion. I do not recommend more personally.

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Aj,

 

I was told that when ZeoStart3 replaced ZeoStart2 a few years ago that it would allow for higher doses without the side effects. I am not sure if this is true or not since I have never used ZS2. I do suspect the improvements were minimal at best and the maximum dosage of ZS3 is often still problematic in most systems. I think you will see a gradual improvement in time as you lower your ZS3 dosing. Also, I suggest dosing your daily dose divided onto 2 or 3 throughout the day. This should also help keep the biology more stable and decrease algae films.

I dose it two times currently 12-10 hours apart. Could maybe switch to dividing it by 3x. I have been noticing improvements already in the past 4-5 days, plan is to give it two weeks and then try and drop to 0.2.

 

My corals are light but still could use some lightening. I have never seen such drastic colour changes, encrusting and polyp "densening" in such a short period of time since restarting this system a few months ago.

 

I posted this a few days ago in my build thread, but thought it would be helpful here:

 

These are several frags that were added within a month. The colour change and "thickening" on most of the pieces is drastic. For those on the fence or curious about this system, this is some pretty solid evidence to its effectiveness. Mind you I employ very stringent overall husbandry in all aspects of this reef not just ZeoVit, so all of that comes into play.

 

 

28 ish days of development or less on these shots:

 

7.jpeg

 

6.jpeg

 

3.jpeg

 

4.jpeg

 

5.jpeg

 

1.jpeg

 

2.jpeg

 

 

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Here's my guide for diluting ZeoStart3 if anyone is interested :)

In addition to this I have also recommended people dilute some of the "single drop products" for smaller a nano systems in a fixed amount of RODI. Eg if you want to dose a half drop of CV x2 a week, it is possible to take a half cup of RODI water in a sealable container add the drop mix it in and dose 1/4 cup each time.

 

This can be useful for the "Nano Power Pack" users as this stuff can be very powerful, and starting with half doses for smaller systems is probably advisable especially if you are just starting out.

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I dose it two times currently 12-10 hours apart. Could maybe switch to dividing it by 3x. I have been noticing improvements already in the past 4-5 days, plan is to give it two weeks and then try and drop to 0.2.

 

My corals are light but still could use some lightening. I have never seen such drastic colour changes, encrusting and polyp "densening" in such a short period of time since restarting this system a few months ago.

 

I posted this a few days ago in my build thread, but thought it would be helpful here:

 

These are several frags that were added within a month. The colour change and "thickening" on most of the pieces is drastic. For those on the fence or curious about this system, this is some pretty solid evidence to its effectiveness. Mind you I employ very stringent overall husbandry in all aspects of this reef not just ZeoVit, so all of that comes into play.

 

 

28 ish days of development or less on these shots:

These shots are a good example of how corals can transform in the right conditions, especially in a short period of time. I would say you have things dialled in pretty good Aj.

 

Interesting about coral tissue thickness, this is something I have been interested in for some time. The shots you attached show more than just growth, they show increased vitality and tissue. I am interested to hear what you think are the important factors in tissue development on SPS corals from your experience?

 

In addition to this I have also recommended people dilute some of the "single drop products" for smaller a nano systems in a fixed amount of RODI. Eg if you want to dose a half drop of CV x2 a week, it is possible to take a half cup of RODI water in a sealable container add the drop mix it in and dose 1/4 cup each time.

 

This can be useful for the "Nano Power Pack" users as this stuff can be very powerful, and starting with half doses for smaller systems is probably advisable especially if you are just starting out.

This has been discussed on the Zeovit forum and I believe it is not a good idea. The reason is stability of the product cannot be guaranteed. I suggest using a syringe with a 22 gauge needle, this will produce a smaller drop, roughly half the size produced by the supplied dropper. Drop volume is dependant on the viscosity of the solution and the gauge of the dispenser. In most cases the "KZ dropper drop" will work for most of the additives, just dose them less often.

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These shots are a good example of how corals can transform in the right conditions, especially in a short period of time. I would say you have things dialled in pretty good Aj.

 

Interesting about coral tissue thickness, this is something I have been interested in for some time. The shots you attached show more than just growth, they show increased vitality and tissue. I am interested to hear what you think are the important factors in tissue development on SPS corals from your experience?

Well I am not 100% certain as this system is only in its 5th month so its too early to tell any long term effects or what specifically is impacting the coral "density", however I assume lighting has a big effect on this. I have a shallow reef with a massive 8 bulb ATI overhead many of these corals are only 4-6 inches below the water level with the light about 9" above the surface. So rather than elongate or expand upward it seems like these frags are expanding outwards first.

 

It could be akin to zoas flattening out and staying short under bright light and extending upwards in lower lights. I assume the bright T5 lighting is allowing the frags to grow outward instead of reaching up for light.

 

This is pure speculation and I have no evidence, time will tell as these twigs start forming into colonies and I really get to see the growth patterns.

 

 

This has been discussed on the Zeovit forum and I believe it is not a good idea. The reason is stability of the product cannot be guaranteed. I suggest using a syringe with a 22 gauge needle, this will produce a smaller drop, roughly half the size produced by the supplied dropper. Drop volume is dependant on the viscosity of the solution and the gauge of the dispenser. In most cases the "KZ dropper drop" will work for most of the additives, just dose them less often.

 

Hmm good to know.

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I never bought this pack before but I think it is a great idea. Vertex has some of the sexiest packaging in the industry and both companies are located in Germany :)

 

I just think they are connected somehow, obviously.

 

Even if its just a handshake and a nod.

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It has always scared me to mix nutrient export methods like vinegar and GFO. What KZ additives are you using now?

I think the key for me has always been to overfeed - I haven't encountered any problems with it since the first time I STN'd my corals one aquarium and well over a year ago. The wrasses and tang are hogs so I've felt comfortable feeding mysis 2x a day, and pellets/cyclopeeze 1x a day. No algae problems to talk about, and the wrasses (especially the coris) seems to be keeping new vermetid snail patches from showing up.

 

I am still using the same additives that I asked you about before: Sponge Power, Coral Vitalizer, Amino Acid HC, and Pohl's Xtra. My corals are growing like crazy especially with the higher power ATI Sunpower. My problem now is that I have to almost literally dive into the 90g to prune corals - which is why I haven't done it and I've been letting some corals duke it out for space.

 

edit: just to say since it's not obvious - the additives I use are almost the same as the Nano-power pack KZ sells. In fact, I started from Nano-power and swapped out the AALPS for AAHC.

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I think the key for me has always been to overfeed - I haven't encountered any problems with it since the first time I STN'd my corals one aquarium and well over a year ago. The wrasses and tang are hogs so I've felt comfortable feeding mysis 2x a day, and pellets/cyclopeeze 1x a day. No algae problems to talk about, and the wrasses (especially the coris) seems to be keeping new vermetid snail patches from showing up.

 

I am still using the same additives that I asked you about before: Sponge Power, Coral Vitalizer, Amino Acid HC, and Pohl's Xtra. My corals are growing like crazy especially with the higher power ATI Sunpower. My problem now is that I have to almost literally dive into the 90g to prune corals - which is why I haven't done it and I've been letting some corals duke it out for space.

 

edit: just to say since it's not obvious - the additives I use are almost the same as the Nano-power pack KZ sells. In fact, I started from Nano-power and swapped out the AALPS for AAHC.

 

Good to hear all is going well. Let me know if you need someone to dive in with the pruners for you :P

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Ok I have a question. Skimmer for zeo tanks.

 

Some folks swear that zeo tanks need non needle wheel skimmers. Something to do with trace elements get removed/destroyed by the wheel especially K?

 

If you could share what kind of skimmer you're using in your tank with impressions, its be great.

 

I guess I go first.

Im running Remora C S HOB skimmer. I wanted to try non needle wheel kind for the reason above, but I'm not too impressed by the noise at all, it's very loud. I'm running Bean overflow with a dead silent return (Tunze 1073.05), but the skimmer ruins everything. So I've been thinking about replacing it. With the limited space, and by looking at awesome zeo tanks with needewheel skimmers, I'm thinking CAD Light PLS-100.

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Venturi or Beckett skimmers are much easier on plankton and removing elements. The water is not chopped rather just filled with bubbles so fractionation can take place. Needle wheel skimmers are harsh on water but they still work, even with ZEOvit. I would look into the Beckett skimmers but I believe they are large for a nano. One I have looked at is the Aqua-C EV120 Beckett skimmer, but it is rated for minimum 40 gallons and you need a pretty big pump as well. There are other options out there however nothing I know for nano tanks. Maybe someone can point you in the right direction.

 

I use a Skimz SM121, over rated also for my tank size but it doesn't seem to be taking K or other elements from my system, I skim dry.

 

If I find a good venturi or Beckett rated for smaller tanks that is not over priced, I will likely buy it.

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Currently running the Vertex Omega 130 a needle wheel. Skimming fairly dry. I do weekly water changes and keep on top of potassium doses haven't ever had an issue.

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Bubble Magus Curve 5 currently on the 40.

 

Vertex Omega 150 for the 50, just need to make it fit. It's beastly.

 

 

People make the same dire warnings(complaints) about carbon. That it will strip vital something from the water. Even if true, name one vital something that can't easily be replaced with products available today, or water changes.

 

The BM Curve 5 makes the SCA301 into a toy.

The Vertex does the same to the Curve5. The build quality on the Z1.5 pretty much convinced me that there really is a difference in some products, and that Vertex is at the top.

 

Anyway, I will wait until there is science that shows that foam fractionation can produce water with less of anything than natural sea water.

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Nanotopia, Thank you for your excellent guide on diluting some of the zeo products. Instead of boiling the water for sterilization have you thought to add bleach and allow it to off gas before adding in ZS3? People cultivating photo have been doing it for ages. it seems to be fairly quick and might give you a little more freedom because you can do it right in your dosing container.

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Nanotopia, Thank you for your excellent guide on diluting some of the zeo products. Instead of boiling the water for sterilization have you thought to add bleach and allow it to off gas before adding in ZS3? People cultivating photo have been doing it for ages. it seems to be fairly quick and might give you a little more freedom because you can do it right in your dosing container.

In my opinion boiling water is more effective at killing bacteria, and you don't have to wait as long before using it. There are many ways to kill bacteria but remember you also want to remove all dissolved solids because you don't want to be dosing those in your aquarium. Boiling RODI or distilled water has always worked for me.

 

See? this is why I'm looking into the PLS-100, y'all have nice tanks with needle wheel skimmers!

I am convinced that non-needle wheel (pinwheel) skimmers are are better over all for the water however, how much better is the question, and is the extra cost worth the outcome? I am still undecided about that :)

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Seems like a lot of work(bleach or boil), when one can just buy sterile water on Amazon.

 

How are you going to determine when all of the bleach has gassed off?

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