LFS Owner Says YOU ARE ALL WRONG!

[squamptonbc]

Old threads can be interesting, and can bring some new life to it...lol

 

I have had good results with both dry rock and live rock, and now in 2018 live rock is pretty much impossible to find in some countries so dry rock is the next best thing. The so called live rock LFS sell is just dry rock they throw into vats of saltwater and sell for a higher price, or rock brought in by customers closing down their tanks, or man made rock life real reef rock which is still devoid of life.

 

So many different ways to do this hobby.

[Water Dog]

19 hours ago, HarryPotter said:

 

1. I completely disagree with you regarding dry rock vs live rock 

 

2. Do you not see the irony of saying that online is a hodgepodge of right and wrong info, and then giving so many unsupported (and IMO false) statements? 

 

3. You write with a lot of authority for someone with zero topics on the forum. #KeyboardPHD

 

18 hours ago, mcarroll said:

 

Don't be so put off by differing opinions!  Instead, share yours.

 

No irony – that was the point.

 

What a thoughtful post!  Thanks for taking your time!

 

I have no dog in this fight, but if this is the same @mcarroll that I’ve sparred with from time to time, especially over lighting (Hi Matt!  ) on another forum. Then, he actually has a lot of insight to offer based on decades of experience and knowledge about the intricacies of being successful in our beloved reef hobby.

[mcarroll]

I'm him – thanks for the shout out.  It's always nice to see some familiar faces!

 

(sparring ≠ fighting of course; sparring = friendly)

[HarryPotter]

1 minute ago, mcarroll said:

I'm him – thanks for the shout out.  It's always nice to see some familiar faces!

 

(sparring ≠ fighting of course; sparring = friendly)

 

But you really think "...everyone with a [Dino] outbreak has used dead rock." 

 

Is that saying that if you have live rock, you will not get Dinos? That dinos can survive being bleached? 

 

[xiaoxiy]

20 hours ago, mcarroll said:

If you did a google search for "dinos" or "dinoflagellates" and reef tanks, you'd find that almost everyone with an outbreak has used dead rock.  Maybe you want to say they misused it....and I think that's his point.  If you start with nothing but dead skeleton – like they did back in the 1970's – then you get predictably bad results unless you take special care or get lucky.  Live rock is better – plain and simple.

I think that that's a dangerous blanket statement.

 

There are definitely cases of experienced reefers who start with live rock and get dinos. One case I can think of off the top of my head is D2mini from reef central. If you read through his build thread on reef central. He used TBS liverock, which is considered by some to be the highest quality live rock out there, and he still ended up with a pretty nasty dino outbreak.

 

Both live rock and dry rock have their benefits and downsides, and the use of live rocks definitely does not preclude the possibility of dino outbreaks. 

[mcarroll]

It has simply been my experience, and I think I appropriately qualified anything I said. 

 

For what it's worth, I've got a decent sized dino thread going elsewhere and I've been blogging about Dinoflagellates for a while now.  I encourage everyone to read and comment.  (The blog is mostly a collection of useful articles on the subject with a focus on finding full text articles that are available for anyone to read...minimal commentary from me for the most part.)

 

If what I said in raising this zombie thread seems dangerous and "blanket like" in nature, then that's your read of my experience...it's not my characterization.  

 

Not that I would disagree with that characterization.

 

I wish I could say what percent of the overall mass of people starting tanks end up on that dino thread, but I can't.   It feels like a lot of people sometimes though!

 

setup tank > add bleached/treated dead rock > add organic carbon dosing/all available nutrient removers > add livestock > watch dino's bloom

 

Can you do that if you only change the dead rock for live rock?  I'm sure it's possible.  Dino's are too varied for anyone to really speak to "all cases" – but in my experience we're "afflicted" by a pretty narrow set of dino's anyway so that's where the focus has been.  (Check out the first post on that thread link to get the gist.)

 

After the vast number of "treatment failures" of every possible variety on prior threads, I started my thread with a different approach.  System stability has been the main thrust.  

 

Boring and played to some folks, I know – there's no magic there and really nothing we recommend is very exciting.    Folks getting their tanks back is pretty exciting though.  But it has been intriguing – how to do regain system stability while a dino bloom was happening?  Folks had tried everything including total resets! 

 

So it took some reading and some experimenting.  (Okay, a lot.)  But the answer, in a nutshell, is that it depends on how far the bloom has gone.   The thread isn't "over" by any stretch, even with the success rate we have.  There are some really great people on that thread helping it all kinds of ways and it'd be a quiet thread without everyone else who has kicked in their knowledge and experience.  

 

(For my part, I've never had dino's and didn't get my scope until after my only algae outbreak had been resolved. But I thought I had dino's for a minute, I do read a lot and it had to start somewhere. )

 

 

 

What is really interesting and not getting enough attention is how the other folks are succeeding "in spite of" using dead rock.  I don't mean to question that it's possible, but specifically to question how have they made it work in each case?  Just as surely as there was a common thread with most dino outbreaks, there's a common thread with the "dead rock successes" as well.  IMO that's more important info than how to combat X algae.

 

I think we need someone to write "The Dead Rock Success Chronicles."  Had that already been written and become common knowledge, I think there would be nearly nobody with a dino outbreak.

[xiaoxiy]

8 minutes ago, mcarroll said:

What is really interesting and not getting enough attention is how the other folks are succeeding "in spite of" using dead rock.  I don't mean to question that it's possible, but specifically to question how have they made it work in each case?  Just as surely as there was a common thread with most dino outbreaks, there's a common thread with the "dead rock successes" as well.  IMO that's more important info than how to combat X algae.

Agreed!

[RobsNanoLagoon]

I've been in this hobby for about 6-7 years now, and I've come across different people. Some helpful, some not. Some are there to give you advise without judgment, some laugh at you when you say you base your info from a forum. I wouldn't pay mind to the guy, what I have learned tho, is you always want to do your own research and do what works for you. Like everyone has mentioned, there is no right way because there is so many ways to have success in this hobby. It is important we have communities like this to learn from each other, and grasp what we think will work best for us. I try to stay away from store like this, or only go if I truly need to.

[Ibnzmonkey]

I cant believe I remembered the password to this account. Yikes. 

[growsomething]

Got bored of social media?

Is this social media?

[Tamberav]

On 2/25/2023 at 6:50 PM, Ibnzmonkey said:

I cant believe I remembered the password to this account. Yikes. 

 

Does that mean you stayed away from the forums like the LFS said to? 🤔😉

[reefist]

Bump!

[growsomething]