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This is like the perfect 10 gallon set up. Minus the anemone.

 

 

 

I wonder how many back n forths in a 10gal make 25 miles in a day? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

Thanks, and i dont know, 10 gals are 20 inches long, thats almost 2 feet minus 4 inches, so you do the math, one mile is 5280 feet, 63,360 inches.. 3,168 times of walking from one side to the other. if i did that right :P

 

Live sand is technically the same as live rock - it has some bacteria already living on it when you buy it. Your tank will be no more stable than if you bought regular sand and once your cycle is complete, you will have live sand. Your wallet will thank you, as well.

 

Live rock = $6-12 per pound

Live sand = $2-3 per pound

 

Dry rock = $1.50-2.50 per pound

Sand = $.25-1 per pound

 

You'll want to do a 1" layer of live sand in your tank (maybe 10-15 pounds or so, just try it and see), and you'll want 10 pounds of rock. I would recommend rock that looks like this:

reef-saver-eco-rock-2.jpg

 

It is porous all the way through it and will have lots of what are called anaerobic/anoxic areas, basically means without oxygen or low oxygen, that let bacteria colonate and convert nitrate into N2 and O2. Your LFS should have dry rock that looks like that, grab a few small pieces of that and maybe a small (like palm-sized) hunk of "live" rock (make sure they keep it submerged at all times or it will not be "live" rock anymore, have them put it into a little baggie with water in it like they do with fish), and then put them in the tank arranged how you like. The possibilities of scapes are endless, this is where most people spend hours of time, just figuring out where they want the rocks to go! :)

 

True percula clowns, like I mentioned above, are smaller than the ocellaris clowns (only slightly, though, a 1/2" smaller) and are more vibrantly colored, especially if they are wild caught. They are both very hardy - my pair survived a full cycle (I would NOT recommend that, though).

 

As for snails, you can order a quick crew from John at Reefcleaners.org . He is a nice guy, has amazing prices, and always gives extras (especially dwarf cerith snails, I was supposed to get 45x, I stopped counting at 315!). http://reefcleaners.org/index.php?page=sho...t&Itemid=34

 

I would put in the cleaner shrimp last - that way you already have your tank stocked with your clowns and you know your routine - feeding, water changes, parameters, etc. As long as your nitrate keeps on the lower side, a shrimpie should be fine. :)

 

So you said regular sand is cheaper, but you want me to do live sand? I'm confused. lol. And I should do one small peice of live rock and the rest of base rock, am I understanding you correctly there?

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littlelactose

I hope you don't get deterred from the hobby because of know-it-all hobbyists making you feel like a noob : /

 

I work at a pet store and I can tell you- do NOT take the associates' opinions as fact. If they tell you something, they should have empirical evidence to back it up. There is a science to this hobby, after all. There are good biology books out there that can teach you wonders.

 

That being said, not everyone on this forum knows what he/she is talking about 100% of the time. Don't get me wrong, this is a dope website and I like it alot, but of course the internet is accessible to all types of people... : /

 

I'm new to the hobby as well, and I've gotten into verbal qualms with many an 'experience' reefer. But anyways, here's my two cents:

 

Look up algae scrubers (sometimes referred to as turf scrubbers) for filtration. I swear by them- they work wonders. I'm super cereal. After all, do you think there's activated carbon in the ocean? Bio balls?

 

Don't let people get you down because you haven't learned the answers to all the questions (yet)! I bet you'll have a kick-ass tank someday : )

 

Oh yeah, and think about choosing captive bred or tank raised clowns over wild caught. Clowns need something to host, too...

 

Girl Power!

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Deleted User 3
I hope you don't get deterred from the hobby because of know-it-all hobbyists making you feel like a noob : /

 

I work at a pet store and I can tell you- do NOT take the associates' opinions as fact. If they tell you something, they should have empirical evidence to back it up. There is a science to this hobby, after all. There are good biology books out there that can teach you wonders.

 

That being said, not everyone on this forum knows what he/she is talking about 100% of the time. Don't get me wrong, this is a dope website and I like it alot, but of course the internet is accessible to all types of people... : /

 

I'm new to the hobby as well, and I've gotten into verbal qualms with many an 'experience' reefer. But anyways, here's my two cents:

 

Look up algae scrubers (sometimes referred to as turf scrubbers) for filtration. I swear by them- they work wonders. I'm super cereal. After all, do you think there's activated carbon in the ocean? Bio balls?

 

Don't let people get you down because you haven't learned the answers to all the questions (yet)! I bet you'll have a kick-ass tank someday : )

 

Oh yeah, and think about choosing captive bred or tank raised clowns over wild caught. Clowns need something to host, too...

 

Girl Power!

 

Thank you girlfrannn! Haha your post made me feel better! Lol. After all, do you think there's activated carbon in the ocean? Bio balls? <---- really tickled me ! lol. I will have a kick ass tank! Its all still in the box, im waiting until i know everything or mostly everything. lol some i might learn along the way. Its hard when your a newbie though to figure out what you need, what you don't. everyone tells me something different and my heads spinning! There are some nice people on here though!

 

Right now i'm working on figuring out the best, cheap aq. salt (i was thinking petco?, i dont know). and whether to do live sand and live rock, or if i can do reg sand and live rock and then when it cycles it'll be all live.. or whatever. I'm so lost. haha! and I found out by what someone told me im doing a FOWLR tank. Basically all i need is a refrac, heater, salts, sand&live rock & more testing eqpt. (before fish etc). Trying to keep costs down as i'm low-income but i loooove fishies, and determined to make this work. Littler the tank, the harder though, haha! Got any advice?

 

I hope you don't get deterred from the hobby because of know-it-all hobbyists making you feel like a noob : /

 

I work at a pet store and I can tell you- do NOT take the associates' opinions as fact. If they tell you something, they should have empirical evidence to back it up. There is a science to this hobby, after all. There are good biology books out there that can teach you wonders.

 

That being said, not everyone on this forum knows what he/she is talking about 100% of the time. Don't get me wrong, this is a dope website and I like it alot, but of course the internet is accessible to all types of people... : /

 

I'm new to the hobby as well, and I've gotten into verbal qualms with many an 'experience' reefer. But anyways, here's my two cents:

 

Look up algae scrubers (sometimes referred to as turf scrubbers) for filtration. I swear by them- they work wonders. I'm super cereal. After all, do you think there's activated carbon in the ocean? Bio balls?

 

Don't let people get you down because you haven't learned the answers to all the questions (yet)! I bet you'll have a kick-ass tank someday : )

 

Oh yeah, and think about choosing captive bred or tank raised clowns over wild caught. Clowns need something to host, too...

 

Girl Power!

 

Oh, a couple people told me that clowns don't all the time host an anemone. Also with one it'll be more complicated. So..?

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When I first started researching about a salt water tank I was so confused! There is so much information out there.

 

Sounds like you are headed in the right direction for the initial set up. If it were me I would do dry sand, with live rock. I started my first tank like this and it went really well. I got all my live rock for cheap from a reefer that was tearing down his tank. Be on the look out for things like this when you are ready to set up :)

 

Also as far as salt I recommend Instant ocean. It's available pretty much everywhere, mixes well and is affordable.

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Deleted User 3
When I first started researching about a salt water tank I was so confused! There is so much information out there.

 

Sounds like you are headed in the right direction for the initial set up. If it were me I would do dry sand, with live rock. I started my first tank like this and it went really well. I got all my live rock for cheap from a reefer that was tearing down his tank. Be on the look out for things like this when you are ready to set up :)

 

Also as far as salt I recommend Instant ocean. It's available pretty much everywhere, mixes well and is affordable.

 

The live rock makes the dead sand live, correct? And vice versa? I think i'll do a mix of live rock and dry base rock, and probably non-live sand. Yeah my friend is hopefully gonna give me a peice of his live rock. Just gotta get some base rock. I want it to make sort of a upside down U shape in my tank (the rock).

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littlelactose

Given time, yes live rock will liven up your 'dead' sand. The bacteria will leave the rock and enter the sand : ) This is great because live sand is more expensive than dry sand- at least at petco.

 

Petcos that are 'aquatic superstores' have pre-mixed salt that they use for their tanks in a big tower-thingy that they sell for 89cents per gallon. If you start your tank off with this water, you'll probably have a cyanobacteria (red algae) problem because this water is not distilled. It has particulates in it : / I made this mistake; but thanks to my algae scrubber, it only lasted less than a week. They sell pre-mixed salt water in boxes for lie $11- which is a good way to get started if you dont want to worry about mixing the salt and water at first.

 

Never use tap water- even if you condition it. Don't trust all RO water. Reverse Osmosis water is only as good as its filter. If the filter hasn't been cleaned/changed, the water is tainted. TAINTED, I tell you!!

 

As for the clowns hosting- It's true, not all clowns host. The problem is, what if you get a clown who wants to host and you never get him a friend? On the other hand, what if you get a clown who doesn't want to host and you do get him a friend? Well, you can just sell his rejected friend if you don't want to worry about the upkeep : )

 

Oh and don't forget that anemones aren't the only thing clowns host! My boyfriend's clown hosts feather duster worms :P $10.99 at petco! He also hosts torch corals...

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jedimasterben
So you said regular sand is cheaper, but you want me to do live sand? I'm confused. lol. And I should do one small peice of live rock and the rest of base rock, am I understanding you correctly there?

Yes, regular sand is cheaper and will become live sand, same as base rock will become live rock. :)

 

Look up algae scrubers (sometimes referred to as turf scrubbers) for filtration. I swear by them- they work wonders. I'm super cereal. After all, do you think there's activated carbon in the ocean? Bio balls?

What is with everyone and algae scrubbers? They aren't feasible in small tanks that don't have a sump - exactly what the OP's system is. I inadvertently made on in my sump (I have a piece of mesh separating my chaeto from my skimmer so it doesn't get caught in the impeller), and it's freakin covered in GHA/bubble algae/anything you can think of, it has it. Does it help with nitrate and phosphate? Not at all. It's huge, too, about 250 sq in of surface area, much, much larger than what normal scrubbers are, and it does nothing for the tank. Algae will still grow anywhere, as nitrate and phosphate are still in the water.

 

That's for another thread, though. I'd rather not clog the OP's thread any more than necessary.

 

Right now i'm working on figuring out the best, cheap aq. salt (i was thinking petco?, i dont know). and whether to do live sand and live rock, or if i can do reg sand and live rock and then when it cycles it'll be all live.. or whatever. I'm so lost. haha! and I found out by what someone told me im doing a FOWLR tank. Basically all i need is a refrac, heater, salts, sand&live rock & more testing eqpt. (before fish etc). Trying to keep costs down as i'm low-income but i loooove fishies, and determined to make this work. Littler the tank, the harder though, haha! Got any advice?

 

Oh, a couple people told me that clowns don't all the time host an anemone. Also with one it'll be more complicated. So..?

I would order "Instant Ocean" from Drsfostersmith.com it is inexpensive and is good for what you need, and if you ever decide to add any corals, it provides plenty of calcium, magnesium, etc.

 

I would just do regular sand and base rock, with a small hunk of live rock.

 

Definitely get as much equipment as you can during setup, will make things go more smoothly for you later.

 

Not all clowns will host. Different species of clowns will host different anemones (some exceptions) in the wild, but some clowns in captivity will not host anything, you're always taking that chance if you get an anemone, which leads me to my next point...

 

If you decide to get a hosting anemone, you will not be able to keep FOWLR parameters, you will need to keep your water at full reef quality and stability, and need very high lighting. Anemones require extremely stable conditions and will deteriorate quickly if conditions swing. I don't recommend them to beginners or in small tanks, as these anemones also grow large - bubble tip anemones (the most common hosting anemone in captivity) grow to around 18" across, so you'd eventually need to remove the anemone or upgrade to a larger tank.

 

When I first started researching about a salt water tank I was so confused! There is so much information out there.

 

Sounds like you are headed in the right direction for the initial set up. If it were me I would do dry sand, with live rock. I started my first tank like this and it went really well. I got all my live rock for cheap from a reefer that was tearing down his tank. Be on the look out for things like this when you are ready to set up :)

 

Also as far as salt I recommend Instant ocean. It's available pretty much everywhere, mixes well and is affordable.

Instant ocean FTW.

 

The live rock makes the dead sand live, correct? And vice versa? I think i'll do a mix of live rock and dry base rock, and probably non-live sand. Yeah my friend is hopefully gonna give me a peice of his live rock. Just gotta get some base rock. I want it to make sort of a upside down U shape in my tank (the rock).

Rock arches are awesome! Do it!!! :D

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Deleted User 3
Given time, yes live rock will liven up your 'dead' sand. The bacteria will leave the rock and enter the sand : ) This is great because live sand is more expensive than dry sand- at least at petco.

 

Petcos that are 'aquatic superstores' have pre-mixed salt that they use for their tanks in a big tower-thingy that they sell for 89cents per gallon. If you start your tank off with this water, you'll probably have a cyanobacteria (red algae) problem because this water is not distilled. It has particulates in it : / I made this mistake; but thanks to my algae scrubber, it only lasted less than a week. They sell pre-mixed salt water in boxes for lie $11- which is a good way to get started if you dont want to worry about mixing the salt and water at first.

 

Never use tap water- even if you condition it. Don't trust all RO water. Reverse Osmosis water is only as good as its filter. If the filter hasn't been cleaned/changed, the water is tainted. TAINTED, I tell you!!

 

As for the clowns hosting- It's true, not all clowns host. The problem is, what if you get a clown who wants to host and you never get him a friend? On the other hand, what if you get a clown who doesn't want to host and you do get him a friend? Well, you can just sell his rejected friend if you don't want to worry about the upkeep : )

 

Oh and don't forget that anemones aren't the only thing clowns host! My boyfriend's clown hosts feather duster worms :P $10.99 at petco! He also hosts torch corals...

 

Okay so regular sand, base rock and couple live rocks. Good plan. Also.. my filter was previously used, how do I untaint it?!?!

 

I'm going to have two clowns, I think. So he has a friend. Haha @ the fish hosting a feather duster worm! Would it host my cleaner shrimp? haha.

 

 

Yes, regular sand is cheaper and will become live sand, same as base rock will become live rock. :)

 

 

What is with everyone and algae scrubbers? They aren't feasible in small tanks that don't have a sump - exactly what the OP's system is. I inadvertently made on in my sump (I have a piece of mesh separating my chaeto from my skimmer so it doesn't get caught in the impeller), and it's freakin covered in GHA/bubble algae/anything you can think of, it has it. Does it help with nitrate and phosphate? Not at all. It's huge, too, about 250 sq in of surface area, much, much larger than what normal scrubbers are, and it does nothing for the tank. Algae will still grow anywhere, as nitrate and phosphate are still in the water.

 

That's for another thread, though. I'd rather not clog the OP's thread any more than necessary.

 

 

I would order "Instant Ocean" from Drsfostersmith.com it is inexpensive and is good for what you need, and if you ever decide to add any corals, it provides plenty of calcium, magnesium, etc.

 

I would just do regular sand and base rock, with a small hunk of live rock.

 

Definitely get as much equipment as you can during setup, will make things go more smoothly for you later.

 

Not all clowns will host. Different species of clowns will host different anemones (some exceptions) in the wild, but some clowns in captivity will not host anything, you're always taking that chance if you get an anemone, which leads me to my next point...

 

If you decide to get a hosting anemone, you will not be able to keep FOWLR parameters, you will need to keep your water at full reef quality and stability, and need very high lighting. Anemones require extremely stable conditions and will deteriorate quickly if conditions swing. I don't recommend them to beginners or in small tanks, as these anemones also grow large - bubble tip anemones (the most common hosting anemone in captivity) grow to around 18" across, so you'd eventually need to remove the anemone or upgrade to a larger tank.

 

 

Instant ocean FTW.

 

 

Rock arches are awesome! Do it!!! :D

 

Never having an anemone until i am rich and can provide amazing life for more marine life. Lol. Also, thanks on the rock arch, I need that special puddy crap to hold them together though, right? DUCT-TAPE! Kidding, kidding... IM KIDDING. don't bash the newbie lol.

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jedimasterben
Okay so regular sand, base rock and couple live rocks. Good plan. Also.. my filter was previously used, how do I untaint it?!?!

 

I'm going to have two clowns, I think. So he has a friend. Haha @ the fish hosting a feather duster worm! Would it host my cleaner shrimp? haha.

 

Never having an anemone until i am rich and can provide amazing life for more marine life. Lol. Also, thanks on the rock arch, I need that special puddy crap to hold them together though, right? DUCT-TAPE! Kidding, kidding... IM KIDDING. don't bash the newbie lol.

Clownfish are a many strange thing. Some will try and be hosted by odd things... dead chunks of coral, powerheads, magnetic algae scrapers, etc. Some will try and host different corals that are "flowy", and usually having tentacles, but a lot of corals can't withstand the clowns' constant rubbing and scraping and will recede and die if the clown or coral isn't pulled out.

 

Again, I would recommend getting a better filter that you can turn into a refugium, but if you are dead set on using the one you have, you can clean it by running a mixture of water and vinegar, and rinsing a few times before putting it on the tank. The vinegar won't actually hurt anything in the tank, some people dose it in their tanks as a carbon source to help lower nitrate and phosphate, but that absolutely requires a skimmer.

 

If the rocks fit together well, you probably won't need to attach them with anything. If you feel you need to, you can use gel superglue or zip ties to hold it all together.

 

You don't need to be rich to have an anemone, it just takes work. :)

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littlelactose

"What is with everyone and algae scrubbers? They aren't feasible in small tanks that don't have a sump - exactly what the OP's system is. I inadvertently made on in my sump (I have a piece of mesh separating my chaeto from my skimmer so it doesn't get caught in the impeller), and it's freakin covered in GHA/bubble algae/anything you can think of, it has it. Does it help with nitrate and phosphate? Not at all. It's huge, too, about 250 sq in of surface area, much, much larger than what normal scrubbers are, and it does nothing for the tank. Algae will still grow anywhere, as nitrate and phosphate are still in the water."

 

Well, ser, what you have is not an algae scrubber... But like you said, for another post. I guess I was just pointing her in the direction of a sump/refugium in addition to her ten gallon, since scrubbers pretty much require one... These can be cheap, too. : ) Eh! Eh! Sump=Fun!

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Deleted User 3
Clownfish are a many strange thing. Some will try and be hosted by odd things... dead chunks of coral, powerheads, magnetic algae scrapers, etc. Some will try and host different corals that are "flowy", and usually having tentacles, but a lot of corals can't withstand the clowns' constant rubbing and scraping and will recede and die if the clown or coral isn't pulled out.

 

Again, I would recommend getting a better filter that you can turn into a refugium, but if you are dead set on using the one you have, you can clean it by running a mixture of water and vinegar, and rinsing a few times before putting it on the tank. The vinegar won't actually hurt anything in the tank, some people dose it in their tanks as a carbon source to help lower nitrate and phosphate, but that absolutely requires a skimmer.

 

If the rocks fit together well, you probably won't need to attach them with anything. If you feel you need to, you can use gel superglue or zip ties to hold it all together.

 

You don't need to be rich to have an anemone, it just takes work. :)

 

Im set on the one i have for now. I don't have a lot of extra $$, and am getting certain things from others to help so i don't have to buy so much right away. and hmm hopefully mine fit.

 

Question... so if i have a couple peices of live rock, and base rock, and use just aragonite sand (not live), where do i position everything so it becomes all live? Also, can i put fish and such in before everything is live or what? I'm confused on that part.

 

Also, how much salt should I get, and how do I do that part, just run the water & salt thats recommended on the package until it's at the level i need? Do i have the regular sand and live rock in at this time or after my salt level is where it should be.

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jedimasterben
Im set on the one i have for now. I don't have a lot of extra $$, and am getting certain things from others to help so i don't have to buy so much right away. and hmm hopefully mine fit.

 

Question... so if i have a couple peices of live rock, and base rock, and use just aragonite sand (not live), where do i position everything so it becomes all live? Also, can i put fish and such in before everything is live or what? I'm confused on that part.

 

Also, how much salt should I get, and how do I do that part, just run the water & salt thats recommended on the package until it's at the level i need? Do i have the regular sand and live rock in at this time or after my salt level is where it should be.

Place them anywhere in the tank. As long as it stays wet, it will soon be colonated by bacteria.

 

And no. No fish, no shrimp, no snails, no crabs, NOTHING until it is cycled or what you put in will most likely die. You will need a basic test kit to be sure that the cycle is progressing and to know when it is over.

 

Get as much salt as you can afford. You're going to be doing water changes, so you will eventually use all the salt, and salt is cheaper the more you buy.

 

You need roughly 3 measuring cups worth of salt to make five gallons of saltwater at ~1.025 specific gravity (this is your measure of salinity). You will need at the very least a hydrometer, and I would very, very, very highly recommend a refractometer. You can get them cheap, $35 on eBay for a refractometer unit and calibration fluid. Hydrometers are incredibly inaccurate, and get more inaccurate as salt builds up on them, so you have to rinse them very, very well in RO water after each use.

 

You need to mix your salt and water and get it to ~1.025 before adding anything. You will need to mix it using a pump or powerhead in a bucket (never, ever, EVER add unmixed salt to your tank, it will burn and kill anything and everything alive), and you'll need to mix it for at least 12 hours, as much as 24 hours, making sure that there is no salt left undissolved and that the water is crystal, crystal clear, this means that it is safe to add to the tank now.

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What is with everyone and algae scrubbers? They aren't feasible in small tanks that don't have a sump - exactly what the OP's system is. I inadvertently made on in my sump (I have a piece of mesh separating my chaeto from my skimmer so it doesn't get caught in the impeller), and it's freakin covered in GHA/bubble algae/anything you can think of, it has it. Does it help with nitrate and phosphate? Not at all. It's huge, too, about 250 sq in of surface area, much, much larger than what normal scrubbers are, and it does nothing for the tank. Algae will still grow anywhere, as nitrate and phosphate are still in the water.

 

You must clean it regularly my friend (once a week or so) or else algae will find a better place to grow if that area is covered to the point where light is not reaching the bottom layer which in turn creates die off = more nitrates.

 

Never had a strand of algae in my display other than the chaeto i stuff under some rocks in the back. Check out my sump pics, absolutely disgustingly covered in algae. But I clean the scrubber weekly and remove a lot of the excess algae that grows on the rocks/side/wires.

 

 

Sorry to jack the thread, don't want to turn this into an algae scrubber contest.... (little lactose AS chest bump) skimmers and carbon all work well. Just make sure you are actively removing waste from your tank, more often that a lot of other people because its such a small, sumpless tank (even if you stock it moderately).. whether it be in the form of algae, skimmate, floss, carbon, water changes + siphoning etc etc.

 

 

mix the salt with fresh water with 1/2 cup of salt per gallon of fresh water. I would definitely use ro/di if available at LFS or distilled water from the grocery/ drug store. For such a small tank, obtaining water this way is relatively easy, but believe me.. and everyone will say this.. having bought a ro/di system and the ability to make pure water in the convenience of my home has made this hobby A LOT easier. Not to mention you will notice a lot less algae growth. I used to make late night runs to the store when I realized my salinity was off (before I had an auto top off system too) and I was out of freshwater.. not fun doing this often, especially in the neighborhood I live in, LOL.

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jedimasterben
mix the salt with fresh water with 1/2 cup of salt per gallon of fresh water. I would definitely use ro/di if available at LFS or distilled water from the grocery/ drug store. For such a small tank, obtaining water this way is relatively easy, but believe me.. and everyone will say this.. having bought a ro/di system and the ability to make pure water in the convenience of my home has made this hobby A LOT easier. Not to mention you will notice a lot less algae growth. I used to make late night runs to the store when I realized my salinity was off (before I had an auto top off system too) and I was out of freshwater.. not fun doing this often, especially in the neighborhood I live in, LOL.

1/2 cup per gallon for pretty much every commercial salt will only get you 1.020 sg. Everything else +1 :)

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Deleted User 3
Place them anywhere in the tank. As long as it stays wet, it will soon be colonated by bacteria.

 

And no. No fish, no shrimp, no snails, no crabs, NOTHING until it is cycled or what you put in will most likely die. You will need a basic test kit to be sure that the cycle is progressing and to know when it is over.

 

Get as much salt as you can afford. You're going to be doing water changes, so you will eventually use all the salt, and salt is cheaper the more you buy.

 

You need roughly 3 measuring cups worth of salt to make five gallons of saltwater at ~1.025 specific gravity (this is your measure of salinity). You will need at the very least a hydrometer, and I would very, very, very highly recommend a refractometer. You can get them cheap, $35 on eBay for a refractometer unit and calibration fluid. Hydrometers are incredibly inaccurate, and get more inaccurate as salt builds up on them, so you have to rinse them very, very well in RO water after each use.

 

You need to mix your salt and water and get it to ~1.025 before adding anything. You will need to mix it using a pump or powerhead in a bucket (never, ever, EVER add unmixed salt to your tank, it will burn and kill anything and everything alive), and you'll need to mix it for at least 12 hours, as much as 24 hours, making sure that there is no salt left undissolved and that the water is crystal, crystal clear, this means that it is safe to add to the tank now.

 

I can't afford a refractometer right now, but maybe my lab class i took in college has a spare one.

 

& OK on the salt, i figured it needed to cycle first before I put anything in fish wise, but i was wondering about the sand and live rock?

 

Okay, so add the amount of salt it says for a the tank size, in a bucket, over night sort of, until it's clear. A lot of people do this in their tank though.. why should I do this in a bucket? (don't yell im just curious).

 

Also, besides filling it up when the water level goes down in the tank (same way, in a bucket etc?), what is a sign I need to do the partial? & I do it the same way as you start it right (in the bucket, dissolved, etc, like koolaid!).

 

 

You must clean it regularly my friend (once a week or so) or else algae will find a better place to grow if that area is covered to the point where light is not reaching the bottom layer which in turn creates die off = more nitrates.

 

Never had a strand of algae in my display other than the chaeto i stuff under some rocks in the back. Check out my sump pics, absolutely disgustingly covered in algae. But I clean the scrubber weekly and remove a lot of the excess algae that grows on the rocks/side/wires.

 

 

Sorry to jack the thread, don't want to turn this into an algae scrubber contest.... (little lactose AS chest bump) skimmers and carbon all work well. Just make sure you are actively removing waste from your tank, more often that a lot of other people because its such a small, sumpless tank (even if you stock it moderately).. whether it be in the form of algae, skimmate, floss, carbon, water changes + siphoning etc etc.

 

 

mix the salt with fresh water with 1/2 cup of salt per gallon of fresh water. I would definitely use ro/di if available at LFS or distilled water from the grocery/ drug store. For such a small tank, obtaining water this way is relatively easy, but believe me.. and everyone will say this.. having bought a ro/di system and the ability to make pure water in the convenience of my home has made this hobby A LOT easier. Not to mention you will notice a lot less algae growth. I used to make late night runs to the store when I realized my salinity was off (before I had an auto top off system too) and I was out of freshwater.. not fun doing this often, especially in the neighborhood I live in, LOL.

 

Yes i'm planning on using distilled water. I drink it for me as well. I have one of those magnetic things to clean the walls of the tank but i notice people only do the front.

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jedimasterben
I can't afford a refractometer right now, but maybe my lab class i took in college has a spare one.

 

& OK on the salt, i figured it needed to cycle first before I put anything in fish wise, but i was wondering about the sand and live rock?

 

Okay, so add the amount of salt it says for a the tank size, in a bucket, over night sort of, until it's clear. A lot of people do this in their tank though.. why should I do this in a bucket? (don't yell im just curious).

 

Also, besides filling it up when the water level goes down in the tank (same way, in a bucket etc?), what is a sign I need to do the partial? & I do it the same way as you start it right (in the bucket, dissolved, etc, like koolaid!).

The sand and live rock are what needs to cycle; this will be your biological filter. Mix your water, put the sand and rock in the tank, then fill it with your mixed saltwater. Then add the piece of live rock from your friend (since live rock needs to stay submerged at all times to remain "live"). Then you wait for the rock and sand to have die off from any bacteria and such that once lived in the rock, and this will start your ammonia rising, then nitrite, then nitrate, then you should see all three levels begin to get lower and lower, except for maybe nitrate, that seems to come down much more slowly than ammonia or nitrite, but since nitrate isn't toxic to fish, once ammonia and nitrite are gone you can add a fish to the tank.

 

If a lot of people mixed salt in their tank, a lot of people would have dead fish, coral, shrimp, etc. Salt mixes that are undissolved will burn fish and corals, often to death.

 

Keep the water level constant throughout the week. Depending on where you live, humidity, open top vs lid, etc, your evaporation will be different than mine. I lose about 1/2 to 3/4 gallon of water per day to evaporation, and I live in a very humid region of Florida. Top off will need to be RO water, or distilled works too.

 

Plan on doing a partial change every week, I'd say 2 gallons. If you do decide to get another HOB filter to make into a refugium, you could probably get away with a change every other week. Just test your nitrate levels and make sure that they are ok and you'll learn what your tank does and needs. :)

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Deleted User 3
The sand and live rock are what needs to cycle; this will be your biological filter. Mix your water, put the sand and rock in the tank, then fill it with your mixed saltwater. Then add the piece of live rock from your friend (since live rock needs to stay submerged at all times to remain "live"). Then you wait for the rock and sand to have die off from any bacteria and such that once lived in the rock, and this will start your ammonia rising, then nitrite, then nitrate, then you should see all three levels begin to get lower and lower, except for maybe nitrate, that seems to come down much more slowly than ammonia or nitrite, but since nitrate isn't toxic to fish, once ammonia and nitrite are gone you can add a fish to the tank.

 

If a lot of people mixed salt in their tank, a lot of people would have dead fish, coral, shrimp, etc. Salt mixes that are undissolved will burn fish and corals, often to death.

 

Keep the water level constant throughout the week. Depending on where you live, humidity, open top vs lid, etc, your evaporation will be different than mine. I lose about 1/2 to 3/4 gallon of water per day to evaporation, and I live in a very humid region of Florida. Top off will need to be RO water, or distilled works too.

 

Plan on doing a partial change every week, I'd say 2 gallons. If you do decide to get another HOB filter to make into a refugium, you could probably get away with a change every other week. Just test your nitrate levels and make sure that they are ok and you'll learn what your tank does and needs. :)

 

So, changing the water depends on your levels? Or you just have to no matter what kinna thing? Also I live in Wisconsin, i have a lid on mine, (as i have a dog, so dog hair & dust can't get in). So maybe I wont have as much dissapation. Also, can i use the tap water & do the treatment for it, I have TetraAqua AquaSafe water conditioner for fresh & marine, w/bio extract? that way I can use the tap?

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jedimasterben
So, changing the water depends on your levels? Or you just have to no matter what kinna thing? Also I live in Wisconsin, i have a lid on mine, (as i have a dog, so dog hair & dust can't get in). So maybe I wont have as much dissapation. Also, can i use the tap water & do the treatment for it, I have TetraAqua AquaSafe water conditioner for fresh & marine, w/bio extract? that way I can use the tap?

I would not ever recommend using tap water for a marine system, there are too many variables. I use my tap water for my freshwater shrimp breeding tank, but I have a well and a $5K water system on the other end of the tap, so I know what my water will be like when it comes out.

 

You really need to be in the habit of doing water changes no matter what your levels are, but, if need be, if your nitrate levels are ok and you don't notice anything wrong with any inhabitants, you can skip one.

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Deleted User 3
I would not ever recommend using tap water for a marine system, there are too many variables. I use my tap water for my freshwater shrimp breeding tank, but I have a well and a $5K water system on the other end of the tap, so I know what my water will be like when it comes out.

 

You really need to be in the habit of doing water changes no matter what your levels are, but, if need be, if your nitrate levels are ok and you don't notice anything wrong with any inhabitants, you can skip one.

 

Hmm. I guess i dont fully understand what water changes are for. No biggie to do them really, but i dont know wht the benefit is for! :) Esp since everything could be perfect, then i change it and voila i have an issue..

 

Also, it's not just tap water, i would use the conditioner, it elminates some of the bad things in the water, but still a no?

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Hmm. I guess i dont fully understand what water changes are for. No biggie to do them really, but i dont know wht the benefit is for! :) Esp since everything could be perfect, then i change it and voila i have an issue..

 

Also, it's not just tap water, i would use the conditioner, it elminates some of the bad things in the water, but still a no?

 

The water changes (via the new salt) will replenish minerals in the water, which will be used up by the life in the system. In a FOWLR system the demands won't be as high as with a reef, but they will still need to be replenished. You could do it through dosing, but that would be more costly.

 

I would only use the treated tap water in the event of impending doom, where it is absolutely impossible to get any other water. I started with treated tapwater, and I may very well suffer for it.

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Hmm. I guess i dont fully understand what water changes are for. No biggie to do them really, but i dont know wht the benefit is for! :) Esp since everything could be perfect, then i change it and voila i have an issue..

 

Also, it's not just tap water, i would use the conditioner, it elminates some of the bad things in the water, but still a no?

A cough drop "eliminates" all signs of your emphysema, but I still wouldn't carry on as if nothing was wrong with me. Water changes also will exchange smaller things that while benefitting, can't be dosed. There are chemicals in our 5 gallon bucket of salts that are included, yet only have maybe 5 grains worth of "salt" in that whole bucket. In your case however, with such a small tank and not keeping corals, it's not too necessary for that stuff, but you don't want to worry about dosing for other common things like calc and alk mag, etc. (Idealy, we should ALL mix everything at once, but none of us do)

 

Water changes are also a good time to rearrange rock and such. Whenever you move Rock on a sanded, ( or have you hands in the tank for an extended period of time) you should perform a wc. Soaps, food, smoke, foreign bacteria, lotions, etc; all are harmful to tanks. A slimmer helps a lot with this also.

 

I'm sorry we got off on the wrong foot, I was having a bad day and maybe read your response a little more hastily than it was intended. The people here in nr.com are good people(mostly).

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herranton

Yeah, pretty much listen to everything Obie-wan-BENobie is saying.

 

This stuff isn't rocket science.

 

Things you will need to set up your tank:

 

1. Tank (you have)

2. 50w Heater (walmart)

3. Lights (idk what you have, get compact florescent)

4. Power head or filter

5. Power strip and light timer (walmart)

6. 10 pounds base or live rock and sand (LFS)

7. 10 Gallons of salt water (LFS)

8. 7 or 8 Gallons of either ro or distilled (do not use spring water) one gallon jugs from grocery store.

9. 1 cup clear vinegar, unflavored.

10. Clean towels and sponge

11. Five gallon bucket (Home Depot)

 

Step 1. Clean tank, bucket and all equipment(even new stuff like the heater) with a vinegar/water solution. For the tank and bucket add a gallon or so of tap water and a splash of vinegar, then scrub with the sponge/towels. After you are happy with it, dump out the solution and rinse it under the bath tub faucet for for a few minutes. If you can still smell vinegar, it needs to be rinsed more. Let the stuff dry and give it a final rinse with RO/distilled.

 

Step 2. Rinse sand. Add the sand to the bucket. Add water to the bucket until it covers the sand a good bit and then stir. Let it settle for a bit and dump the murky water out in the toilet/front yard being careful not to let the sand out. Don't dump it down a sink. Repeat this a couple of times.

 

Step 3 Add sand to tank. No more than 1 inch deep. Add rocks to tank. Aquascape how you see fit. Add saltwater to tank. Try to aim for the rocks, it will reduce the sandstorm. Add heater and powerhead or filter to tank. Add lights. Plug everything in being careful to use drip loops. If you don't know what a drip loop is, Google it, You don't want to burn your house down.

 

Step 4. Turn everything on and enjoy your own personal little sandstorm.

 

Step 5. Wait 6 weeks. (no really, at least wait 3-4 weeks) topping off when needed. (I'll discuss in a minute)

 

Step 6. Order a small clean up crew from Reef Cleaners. Yes, I'm telling you where to get it. Just order from them. You will be happy you did. The day you order, do a 20% water change. When you get it, do another 20% water change and then dump the CUC in the tank.

 

Step 7. From this point on, you will be doing 20% water changes every week.

 

Step 8. 2 weeks after you add the CUC, You can add the clowns or the cleaner shrimp. You choose.

 

Step 9. Wait 4 weeks and add the other, clowns or cleaner shrimp.

 

More tips:

 

1. When you first fill the tank, take a sharpie and mark the water level. When you top off, fill to that level.

 

2. Keep the tank and lights free of salt creep.

 

3. When you feed the fish/shrimp, feed by hand. Take a couple pieces of flake or mysis and pinch it between your index finger and thumb. Submerse it a bit in the tank and they will eat out of your hands. This will help control the nutrients going into the tank. Don't freak out when the shrimp jumps on your hand, it won't bite you. The clowns will.

 

4. Get some caulerpa prolifera and plant it in back of your LR. It is a great nutrient export. And it doesn't look to bad. Much better than the plastic plants you want to use, and it serves as a natural filter. You can do this when you add the CUC.

 

5. Remember those 1 gallon jugs you bought. Cut the top off of one so there is about a 3 inch hole in the top. Use this to ladle water out for water changes. It is about a gallon. To do a water change, Make sure the tank is topped up all the way, scoop out about 2 gallons, pour in 2 gallons of fresh-saltwater. You don't need to worry about matching temps.

 

6. Buy saltwater from your lfs. Its a pita to mix small amounts at home. buy distilled from your grocery store for top-offs. Do not use tap, Ever.

 

7. Even with screw in spiral cf lighting, you can keep some corals. After a couple of months, you can try gsp, mushrooms or colt coral. Not ideal, but you won't kill em.

 

8. Get whatever clowns you want. False, true, percs, ocellaris. It doesn't really matter. Just don't get any of the larger species. Don't fret over it. they are basically the same. Yes they are, don't argue with me.

 

9. The shrimp will molt, you will think it is a dead shrimp. It's not. It's his old skeleton.

 

10. Do a friggin 2 gallon water change every week. You will notice I didn't add testing supplies or a hydrometer to the list. You really won't need them. Keep 5 gallons of salt water on hand and do a large water change if snails start kicking off.

 

11. Whatever that weird behavior your clown is doing, its normal, please don't make a thread about it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This #### took me a long time to type, at least read it.

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To see how simple it all can be, check out my sig. The beginning is about as basic as it can be, and yours will be even easier since the lights and power head wot be necessary.

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herranton
The people here in nr.com are good people(mostly).

I'm not.

 

I'm gonna flame the #### out of her the next time she questions using tap or water changes.

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Deleted User 3
The water changes (via the new salt) will replenish minerals in the water, which will be used up by the life in the system. In a FOWLR system the demands won't be as high as with a reef, but they will still need to be replenished. You could do it through dosing, but that would be more costly.

 

I would only use the treated tap water in the event of impending doom, where it is absolutely impossible to get any other water. I started with treated tapwater, and I may very well suffer for it.

 

Alright! Thanks for letting me know, and verrryy thankful for explaining what the changes are for ! lol. I don't know why I couldn't understand it but im 'duh'-ing myself right now :)

 

A cough drop "eliminates" all signs of your emphysema, but I still wouldn't carry on as if nothing was wrong with me. Water changes also will exchange smaller things that while benefitting, can't be dosed. There are chemicals in our 5 gallon bucket of salts that are included, yet only have maybe 5 grains worth of "salt" in that whole bucket. In your case however, with such a small tank and not keeping corals, it's not too necessary for that stuff, but you don't want to worry about dosing for other common things like calc and alk mag, etc. (Idealy, we should ALL mix everything at once, but none of us do)

 

Water changes are also a good time to rearrange rock and such. Whenever you move Rock on a sanded, ( or have you hands in the tank for an extended period of time) you should perform a wc. Soaps, food, smoke, foreign bacteria, lotions, etc; all are harmful to tanks. A slimmer helps a lot with this also.

 

I'm sorry we got off on the wrong foot, I was having a bad day and maybe read your response a little more hastily than it was intended. The people here in nr.com are good people(mostly).

 

thank you! Also i gathered that about the stuff on my hands, Medical Assistant classes helped with that, plus like I was thinking, why would I contaminate the water I try so hard to get perfect? L OL!

 

Also thank you for apologizing that makes me feel so much better, we all have bad days, I do too! :)

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