TheKleinReef Posted July 1, 2014 Author Share Posted July 1, 2014 when i had low alk, i ran into problems, in both tanks. i've kept the alk at 9.0-9.5 the last 3-4 months and haven't ran into any. (except limited PE). will do about the BB. Quote Link to comment
NanoTopia Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 when i had low alk, i ran into problems, in both tanks. i've kept the alk at 9.0-9.5 the last 3-4 months and haven't ran into any. (except limited PE). will do about the BB. I have run 7.5 dKH for quite a while now with good PE, colour and growth. What are you using for ALK supplementation? Quote Link to comment
TheKleinReef Posted July 1, 2014 Author Share Posted July 1, 2014 I have run 7.5 dKH for quite a while now with good PE, colour and growth. What are you using for ALK supplementation? BRS soda ash mixed by hand. 1 Quote Link to comment
NanoTopia Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 BRS soda ash mixed by hand. Just Soda Ash? Your tank might be lacking Boron, makes up ~23% of total alkalinity. Also bicarbonate. I prefer a better mix of carbonate, bicarbonate, and boron for total alkalinity. I think I just found your issue with SPS corals Roger. Your chemistry is off, this is why you have issues with NSW alkalinity maybe. Over time your alkalinity gets skewed and water changes cannot keep up with bicarbonate and boron. I would switch to a more balanced alkalinity supplement, I use Brightwell's Akalin-P and mix it with RO, used if for 3+ years, quite happy with it. Or start dosing a better mix of the BRS additives. Just my opinion Roger, SPS in particular need a better balance of total alkalinity, LPS can get by without a perfect balance, this might explain why you always had luck with LPS but not SPS. Quote Link to comment
TheKleinReef Posted July 1, 2014 Author Share Posted July 1, 2014 Just Soda Ash? Your tank might be lacking Boron, makes up ~23% of total alkalinity. Also bicarbonate. I prefer a better mix of carbonate, bicarbonate, and boron for total alkalinity. I think I just found your issue with SPS corals Roger. Your chemistry is off, this is why you have issues with NSW alkalinity maybe. Over time your alkalinity gets skewed and water changes cannot keep up with bicarbonate and boron. I would switch to a more balanced alkalinity supplement, I use Brightwell's Alkalin-P and mix it with RO, used if for 3+ years, quite happy with it. Or start dosing a better mix of the BRS additives. Just my opinion Roger, SPS in particular need a better balance of total alkalinity, LPS can get by without a perfect balance, this might explain why you always had luck with LPS but not SPS. well that certainly makes sense. maybe it's time to switch dosing products again.. or would buying BRS's bicarbonate mix allow me to keep using what i have? how exactly would i mix those two together? i definitely need to read more up on this though. i bought the complete ca/alk/mag dosing package from BRS thinking it was the right choice, but i guess it wasn't. 1 Quote Link to comment
NanoTopia Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 well that certainly makes sense. maybe it's time to switch dosing products again.. or would buying BRS's bicarbonate mix allow me to keep using what i have? how exactly would i mix those two together? i definitely need to read more up on this though. i bought the complete ca/alk/mag dosing package from BRS thinking it was the right choice, but i guess it wasn't. So you would need sodium bicarbonate and boron, not sure how you would mix but this article may help. Quote Link to comment
TheKleinReef Posted July 1, 2014 Author Share Posted July 1, 2014 So you would need sodium bicarbonate and boron, not sure how you would mix but this article may help. are you using solely Alkalin-P? i might just go that route, since its working for you, and it's relatively cheap. any other zeovit/supplements you recommend while i'm ordering? thinking about getting the KZ amino acid LPS, since i have a lot of LPS. thanks for the article! 1 Quote Link to comment
metrokat Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 I have some reading to do too. 2 Quote Link to comment
metrokat Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 Also, Christine always makes me run out and do things. I just ordered a complete analysis of my water including Boron. 2 Quote Link to comment
TheKleinReef Posted July 1, 2014 Author Share Posted July 1, 2014 welp, i just ordered some Alkalin-P and some Amino Acids. hopefully this will help! Also, Christine always makes me run out and do things. I just ordered a complete analysis of my water including Boron. where do you send your water to do that? Quote Link to comment
NanoTopia Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 are you using solely Alkalin-P? i might just go that route, since its working for you, and it's relatively cheap. any other zeovit/supplements you recommend while i'm ordering? thinking about getting the KZ amino acid LPS, since i have a lot of LPS. thanks for the article! I dose Alkalin-P for alkalinity and Calcion-P for calcium, also Magnesion-P for Mg. I mix/dose each separately with RO water and dose appropriately based on my usage. There are some who believe that it doesn't matter the ratio of carbonate vs bicarbonate since in time the chemistry of the tank will convert them, this may be true but I think they refer to NSW in the ocean where everything is perfectly balanced and chemical reactions occur as they should. Whether or not this always happens perfectly in our artificial reef is left to question. In any case it may not make a big difference with some calcifying corals but some of the more sensitive SPS this imbalance may be making some difference. I have had no issues with the Brightwell's powder forms of major elements etc. There is always another way to do it but I'm sticking to what is proven to work for me I dose AALPS in my 7 gallon since it is 90% LPS, seems to help as most corals are showing good colour and health, along with reasonable growth. I would dose 1mL twice a week in your tank and see how it goes. 1 Quote Link to comment
jedimasterben Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 There are some who believe that it doesn't matter the ratio of carbonate vs bicarbonate since in time the chemistry of the tank will convert them, this may be true but I think they refer to NSW in the ocean where everything is perfectly balanced and chemical reactions occur as they should. Whether or not this always happens perfectly in our artificial reef is left to question. In any case it may not make a big difference with some calcifying corals but some of the more sensitive SPS this imbalance may be making some difference. I believe that it has to do with the amount of CO2 that is in the water to determine the carbonate/bicarbonate ratio. Don't quote me on that, though lol 2 Quote Link to comment
metrokat Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 where do you send your water to do that? Colorado. aquariumwatertesting.com I've used them before. My water at the time tested high for Strontium. And then I started KALK+2 product. This is what it did: They also tested my calcium as ultra low and gave me another heart attack. They now offer 2 calcium tests, free calcium (which is immediately available for use by corals) and total calcium (which our home tests read) 1 Quote Link to comment
NanoTopia Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 Also, Christine always makes me run out and do things. I just ordered a complete analysis of my water including Boron. Have you heard or Triton System? They base all additives on a comprehensive and accurate analysis of your tank water. seems to take the guess work and trial and error out of it all. Only in Europe as far as I know. Keep in mind levels fluctuate weekly in your tank Kat, so the results you get back are only a guideline, in order to emulate a Triton system you would have to get extensive testing done monthly. I think your on the right track assuming the testing process is accurate I believe that it has to do with the amount of CO2 that is in the water to determine the carbonate/bicarbonate ratio. Don't quote me on that, though lol Im quoting you and your right So the CO2 level is different in our reefs and less stable compared to NSW, the chemistry hold true in both but one is more stable than the other. 1 Quote Link to comment
NanoTopia Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 Colorado. aquariumwatertesting.com I've used them before. My water at the time tested high for Strontium. And then I started KALK+2 product. This is what it did: They also tested my calcium as ultra low and gave me another heart attack. They now offer 2 calcium tests, free calcium (which is immediately available for use by corals) and total calcium (which our home tests read) So Kat, were you dosing a separate Sr additive or were your levels high from your salt mix and salinity level? Did the testing service suggest you dose Kalk instead? BTW, I like the first photo better Quote Link to comment
metrokat Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 So Kat, were you dosing a separate Sr additive or were your levels high from your salt mix and salinity level? Did the testing service suggest you dose Kalk instead? BTW, I like the first photo better Yes they suggest Kalk. My Sr was high from my RSCP salt. It is possible that I was dosing trace elements in addition to make it even higher. Then the Kalk+2 strontium product put me over the top. I started K+2 to stabilize the alk/cal swings I was getting. 1 Quote Link to comment
jedimasterben Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 Im quoting you and your right So the CO2 level is different in our reefs and less stable compared to NSW, the chemistry hold true in both but one is more stable than the other. I don't think that the ocean is necessarily more stable - overall yes, but even temperature fluctuates wildly on a short-term basis, I'd have to imagine that everything else does, as well. 1 Quote Link to comment
NanoTopia Posted July 1, 2014 Share Posted July 1, 2014 Yes they suggest Kalk. My Sr was high from my RSCP salt. It is possible that I was dosing trace elements in addition to make it even higher. Then the Kalk+2 strontium product put me over the top. I started K+2 to stabilize the alk/cal swings I was getting. I see, well I am glad you got it sorted. I have switched to KZ Reefers Best Salt, too early to know it it makes any difference on the reef but it is supposed to be more balanced, who knows but I had to try it There are many products that contain more than what they are marketed as. KZ is one of those but if dosed responsibly you should not run into trouble. Seachem is another one that loves to add stuff to their products but I guess they all kind of do. I don't think it is necessary to dose Sr, especially in a nano reef if weekly WC's are being done with a quality salt. I try to keep dosing major elements (Ca/Mg/k) as simple as possible. I think it is better to be slightly deficient in elements than have them in excess. Use a good salt and do weekly water changes, top up Ca/Alk/Mg/K and you are generally fine. Also makes life easier. I am not dosing anything in my 7 gallon element wise, just larger weekly water changes with DD H2Ocean salt, everything is happy and it's far less to think about. Quote Link to comment
metrokat Posted July 2, 2014 Share Posted July 2, 2014 I see, well I am glad you got it sorted. I have switched to KZ Reefers Best Salt, too early to know it it makes any difference on the reef but it is supposed to be more balanced, who knows but I had to try it There are many products that contain more than what they are marketed as. KZ is one of those but if dosed responsibly you should not run into trouble. Seachem is another one that loves to add stuff to their products but I guess they all kind of do. I don't think it is necessary to dose Sr, especially in a nano reef if weekly WC's are being done with a quality salt. I try to keep dosing major elements (Ca/Mg/k) as simple as possible. I think it is better to be slightly deficient in elements than have them in excess. Use a good salt and do weekly water changes, top up Ca/Alk/Mg/K and you are generally fine. Also makes life easier. I am not dosing anything in my 7 gallon element wise, just larger weekly water changes with DD H2Ocean salt, everything is happy and it's far less to think about. My Brightwell NeoMarine salt is enroute. I'm making a switch from IORC. A face to face round table discussion with Chris Brightwell sold me. We shall see how the tank responds. Randy-Holmes Farley did suggest that Sr dosing is unnecessary if using a good salt mix. I was emailing with him back when STN was giving me sleepless nights. I'm not sure if I should get my water tested with the old salt or the new one. Making the tank switch 100% to the new salt will take a while, I don't like to make big changes all at once. 1 Quote Link to comment
TheKleinReef Posted July 2, 2014 Author Share Posted July 2, 2014 gonna mount my ORA red planet and some other frags to the rock work today. hopefully they will still get enough light. (they're moving from the top 3" of the tank down about 8") also debating running my mp10wes 2 on each side versus one on each wall. thoughts? Quote Link to comment
TheKleinReef Posted July 2, 2014 Author Share Posted July 2, 2014 mounted corals: https://flic.kr/p/obu6jY'>https://flic.kr/p/obu6jY'>RMK_0434.jpg by https://www.flickr.com/people//'>xMrKleinReef, on Flickr i mounted the blue gomezi, ora red planet, formosa. all of which are pictured above. snapped a quick pic of the pink mille (at least i think that's what is is. the growth seems to dense to be a mille though) https://flic.kr/p/obq45N'>https://flic.kr/p/obq45N'>RMK_0435.jpg by https://www.flickr.com/people//'>xMrKleinReef, on Flickr mounted a piece of the pink/gold mille on the overflow. hope this tables out wonderfully https://flic.kr/p/nU4BuS'>https://flic.kr/p/nU4BuS'>RMK_0433.jpg by https://www.flickr.com/people//'>xMrKleinReef, on Flickr https://flic.kr/p/odknaT'>https://flic.kr/p/odknaT'>RMK_0410.jpg by https://www.flickr.com/people//'>xMrKleinReef, on Flickr so hard to get a pic of this bugger: https://flic.kr/p/o9w5h9'>https://flic.kr/p/o9w5h9'>RMK_0409.jpg by https://www.flickr.com/people//'>xMrKleinReef, on Flickr 3 Quote Link to comment
TheKleinReef Posted July 3, 2014 Author Share Posted July 3, 2014 tank actually dropped down to 77 degrees.... looks like it got a little too cold last night. Quote Link to comment
TheKleinReef Posted July 3, 2014 Author Share Posted July 3, 2014 LFS had a Clarion angel for sale.... with a price tag of $2,999.99 i was tempted to jump on that deal. in all seriousness, i had my eye on a yellow hogfish and a flame hawkfish. but i passed and just got a new round of test kits. (ca.alk.mag.) 3 Quote Link to comment
Arkayology Posted July 4, 2014 Share Posted July 4, 2014 LFS had a Clarion angel for sale.... with a price tag of $2,999.99 i was tempted to jump on that deal. in all seriousness, i had my eye on a yellow hogfish and a flame hawkfish. but i passed and just got a new round of test kits. (ca.alk.mag.) Hah! A steal... 1 Quote Link to comment
TheKleinReef Posted July 4, 2014 Author Share Posted July 4, 2014 some setosa progression: June 2013 http://s147.photobucket.com/user/roger_090/media/F5CE29A4-EF7E-47DE-AB3D-9594534DC69D-4410-00000113A5F0B942.jpg.html'> https://flic.kr/p/j8isZs'>https://flic.kr/p/j8isZs'>Newly Mounted SPS 1/11/14 by https://www.flickr.com/people//'>xMrKleinReef, on Flickr https://flic.kr/p/o8JKpP'>https://flic.kr/p/o8JKpP'>acros 6-27-14 by https://www.flickr.com/people//'>xMrKleinReef, on Flickr Quote Link to comment
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