Sick Clownfish...please advise!

[Felicia]

I got a YCG 10 days ago that has not been eating and developed these spots all over his body. They looked too large for ich and they were also not really white in color like ich is. I googled about bumps on YCG and came up with a lot of info saying this is something that happens in malnourished YCG's (which made sense because I'm having a hard time getting mine to eat) and that it goes away once they start eating healthily. Therefore, I assumed it wasn't contagious and have been focusing on getting the YCG to eat properly.

 

All the other fish (two clownfish, one firefish, and one YWG) had been perfectly healthy up until today. I test pH, ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate myself and have been getting a steady 8.2 for pH and zero for everything else (sometimes 5 ppm nitrate), but yesterday I also had the water tested at my LFS to confirm my readings and also measure dKH and calcium. Everything looked good. In addition I had my salinity checked with a refractometer and it was 1.025. The last water change I did was this past Tuesday and other than that nothing had changed up until today.

 

This morning I fed the fish and watched them eat and the bigger clownfish seemed fine and was eating like the pig she normall is. Then this evening when I fed them I noticed that there were maybe a few little white speckles on the bigger clownfish. They were barely visible and the YWG had kicked up a bunch of sand darting in and out of his burrow, so I figured it might just be some sand grains that had stuck to her. She was eating fine and behaving normally, so I decided to just watch the spots.

 

Then when the lights went off for the night, the white spots basically glow under the moon LEDs and there are a LOT more than I could see under the regular lights. Here's the best picture I could get:

 

I'm pretty sure its marine ich and its pretty much covering the clownfish, so I decided I needed to take the fish out and treat if I wanted to cure it. I took water out of the tank and filled up a 1.5 gallon set-up I had sitting dry. I have the filter running with no media just for water circulation and aeration, and I added a heater and thermometer. I left the QT tank completely bare and added one drop of AP Pro QuICK Cure (directions say one drop per gallon in a bare aquarium for marine fish), which has formalin as the active ingredient. I then added the sick clownfish.

 

Here's the QT tank:

 

The YCG is impossible to catch because he's so small and is always down in little crevices, so I left him in the main tank. All the other fish seem fine as of now, so my plan of action for the main tank is to do 25% water changes every day for a week or so to hopefully remove most of the ich. I'm worried about the firefish or YWG getting it as well because I'll have to tear up the tank to get them out for treatment. Also, my little QT set-up is not big enough for more than one fish.

 

Any suggestions or advice for this process would be helpful. I don't know if I'm doing the right thing to treat the ich, so please chime in if you have ideas. Also, my clownfish are paired, so is it going to create problems having them separated for a while? If I get the one cured and add her back into the tank will they just resume being a pair or could there be issues?

 

P.S. - I realize this is a bit wordy, but I wanted to provide all the info that might help in successfully solving this crisis.

[Gundad68]

Is it Brooklynella ?An let me say I am very new to reefing,but my Clown has been sick an I just now got em better.I read an studied on it ,an it really dont look like ich(Kept freshwater for years an saw my share of it).Some of these pros an veterans on here will know a lot more an help you out.

[Felicia]

Is it Brooklynella ?An let me say I am very new to reefing,but my Clown has been sick an I just now got em better.I read an studied on it ,an it really dont look like ich(Kept freshwater for years an saw my share of it).Some of these pros an veterans on here will know a lot more an help you out.

 

Brooklynella (as far as I know from researching, I haven't actually seen it in person) is supposed to involve a thick coating of slime/mucus and I don't see anything like that. I've kept freshwater for a long time too and it looks a lot like ich to me. The picture is blurry because the fish was moving and its under the moon lights which makes the white spots glow, so that might make it look a bit different. Either way brooklynella is treated with formalin as well, so the medication I'm using in the QT tank would cover both diseases. Thanks for the input! I really want to save this clown because I get way too attached to fish and its paired with my other clown.

[Felicia]

Here's a picture of the sick YCG:

[Gundad68]

Brooklynella (as far as I know from researching, I haven't actually seen it in person) is supposed to involve a thick coating of slime/mucus and I don't see anything like that. I've kept freshwater for a long time too and it looks a lot like ich to me. The picture is blurry because the fish was moving and its under the moon lights which makes the white spots glow, so that might make it look a bit different. Either way brooklynella is treated with formalin as well, so the medication I'm using in the QT tank would cover both diseases. Thanks for the input! I really want to save this clown because I get way too attached to fish and its paired with my other clown.

I felt your pain the last week,keep us posted,an good luck.

[iDream]

IMO put all infected fish in QT with ich meds

[Trogdor447]

+1 to the last post here.. take no chances - I unfortunatly am needing a reset on my tank - I think my Angel got something nasty - he survived for a while after but.. it eventually took him

[Felicia]

IMO put all infected fish in QT with ich meds

 

I don't have a big enough QT tank for all of them right now and I'm going to have to absolutely tear everything up to catch the YWG and the firefish. From my experience from freshwater, not all the fish always get ich even if the tank has it. Is this not the case for saltwater? I was hoping if I could do water changes constantly I could keep the ich population low enough that the other fish may not get it before I wipe it out.

[Gundad68]

Hows your fish an tank?

[FlCandy]

From what I have read stressing the fish can make Ick worse/breakout, but if you can't get your DT free of parasites (and BTW they do have eggs that drop off into the rock and corals and sand and hatch from there so WC is not going to get them) by running it empty for 6-8 weeks and keep all fish in QT until then, can you guarantee that nothing in that tank will get Ick again. Also if you plan to add anything new in the future you are risking giving them ick and reinfecting your other fish.

 

I would set up another small QT and put the other two fish in there. Tear the tank apart, your going to have to if the YCG dies, as he looks like he has it now too. Everyone who is showing signs needs to be treated, and the others need to be placed in a tank where you can watch them.

 

Good Luck

 

By empty I mean fishless

[Felicia]

Hows your fish an tank?

 

The clownfish looks about the same today. He is eating normally, but the white spots are still really visible all over his body. Its takes 2-3 days for the formalin to work though (past experience from treating freshwater fish with the same medication), so I should see improvement in him soon. I'll be adding another dose of the medication this evening.

 

The tank is fine so far. I haven't seen the sick YCG today, but the other clownfish, the firefish, and the YWG show absolutely no signs of ich and are out and about eating and acting normal.

[Gundad68]

The clownfish looks about the same today. He is eating normally, but the white spots are still really visible all over his body. Its takes 2-3 days for the formalin to work though (past experience from treating freshwater fish with the same medication), so I should see improvement in him soon. I'll be adding another dose of the medication this evening.

 

The tank is fine so far. I haven't seen the sick YCG today, but the other clownfish, the firefish, and the YWG show absolutely no signs of ich and are out and about eating and acting normal.

Good luck again an hang in there ,it seems as soon as on thing is cured or fixed another shows its head.

[Felicia]

From what I have read stressing the fish can make Ick worse/breakout, but if you can't get your DT free of parasites (and BTW they do have eggs that drop off into the rock and corals and sand and hatch from there so WC is not going to get them) by running it empty for 6-8 weeks and keep all fish in QT until then, can you guarantee that nothing in that tank will get Ick again. Also if you plan to add anything new in the future you are risking giving them ick and reinfecting your other fish.

 

I would set up another small QT and put the other two fish in there. Tear the tank apart, your going to have to if the YCG dies, as he looks like he has it now too. Everyone who is showing signs needs to be treated, and the others need to be placed in a tank where you can watch them.

 

Good Luck

 

By empty I mean fishless

 

I guess I'll run out today and pick up a 10-15 gallon glass tank to use as a quarantine tank, so they'll all fit. Since the display tank would only be running with coral and inverts (crabs and snails) could I pull the filter off the main tank and use it in quarantine tank in the meantime? I'll just leave the powerhead in the display for the corals and let my live rocks and sand handle biological filtration. I know the quarantine tank needs to be bare, but what should I put in there as hiding spots? The YWG and the firefish have to have a place to hide.

 

Also, if I'm going to catch the remaining fish without destroying all my coral I'm going to need to pull all the liverock out of my tank. The problem is I'm not going to have enough water from the tank to fill several buckets to put them in while I'm catching the fish (I've only got 10 gallons of current water to work with). Also, I need to put water in the new quarantine tank. Should that be completely new water? And then I just acclimate the fish for an hour or so like I would if I had just bought them from the store? Basically I need a plan for how to set up the new tank and then how to remove all the live rock and have it sit while I catch the fish and move them over to quarantine.

 

Thanks!

 

 

Good luck again an hang in there ,it seems as soon as on thing is cured or fixed another shows its head.

 

Thanks! Agreed!

[FlCandy]

You can use water from the DT, when you grab the new QT get some more water so you can do a fill on the DT.

 

I don't see why you couldn't put the filter on the QT just don't run any carbon etc in it as this will strip the meds from the water. You can use PVC for hiding places for your more shy fishes you really dont want LR or corals etc in the QT. Also after you medicate the tank any media you have in the filter will probably need changing before you place it back on the DT (I have never needed to medicate a fish so if this is wrong please correct me) or risk your corals.

 

You can also place the LR into the QT while catching the fish (before medicating the water) so you don't have to make up a ton of extra water, since you'll have 2 (you have the clown in one now right?) it should be good for your to put them in there for a bit, just make sure if you do to use water from the DT.

Or you can drain the tank and , Leave enough for the fish/inverts to swim/breathe and then put the rocks into the buckets of Tank water so you don't hurt the corals.

 

The rocks that don't have corals on them will be fine sitting for a few minutes while you catch the fish.

 

Then once you have beaten the Ick and all the fish are healthy and back in the DT you can empty your QT and clean it well then set it back up as a QT.

 

Good luck hope the fishes are doing well, and good luck catching them.

[Felicia]

You can use water from the DT, when you grab the new QT get some more water so you can do a fill on the DT.

 

I actually decided it would be easier to just use all new water in the QT tank, so I'm just going to match pH, salinity, and temperature as close as I can to the DT. I'm also going to re-acclimate the fish to the QT tank instead of just adding them straight in.

 

You can use PVC for hiding places for your more shy fishes you really dont want LR or corals etc in the QT.

I actually decided to pick up a few cheap decorations since I have to look at this for 6 weeks and the only place I could figure out to stick it is on my bedroom nightstand (one bedroom apartments have limited space for things like this). I'd rather look at some somewhat attractive stuff than PVC pipes for a month and a half. Although, that definitely would have been my choice if I had a spare room or something to stick the QT tank in.

 

The rocks that don't have corals on them will be fine sitting for a few minutes while you catch the fish.

Unfortunately all of my rocks have coral frags epoxied to them

 

Good luck hope the fishes are doing well, and good luck catching them.

Thanks! I've posted my full plan for taking care of this below, so let me know what you think. So far the fish are all ok, so lets hope it stays that way.

 

 

I've set up a full 10 gallon quarantine tank and in a few days I will be moving all of the fish into there for treatment. My plan is to treat all the fish with AP Pro QuICK Cure at the recommended dose for several days until I get them all healthy, then I'm going to leave them in there for 4-6 weeks and let the display tank run fallow. Hopefully by then I will be free of ich and can add all of the fish back into the display tank.

 

Here's the new quarantine tank. I'm going to give it a few days to get stable and I'm still gradually adding salt and waiting for it to dissolve until I get the salinity right. I used all new water, so I'm going to try to match pH, salinity, and temp. as close as possible to the display tank so that I don't shock the fish when I move them. Even so I'm going to go through the acclimation process like I would if I had just purchased them from the store.

 

 

I pulled the filter off the display tank to run in the quarantine tank and I'll just leave the display tank with the powerhead for circulation. Without the fish in the display tank, the bioload will definitely be low enough for the natural filtration from the rocks and sand to be sufficient. I removed the carbon portion from the filter (b/c it will remove the medication) and left in the mechanical and biological filtration components. I also added some live bacteria to help get the filtration going and some stress coat to help the fish heal once I move them over.

 

In a couple days when everything is stable and ready to go, I'm going to drain most of the display tank water into a large styrofoam cooler and then quickly move all the rocks and coral into the cooler full of water. I'll leave a couple of inches of water for the fish to swim around in while I'm doing this. Then I'll catch the fish, acclimate them, and then add them to the QT tank. I'll add the water and rocks/coral back in the display tank and I should be good to go for the 6 week fallow period.

 

Let me know if all of this sounds ok, or if I'm missing something important!

[scoobahSAM]

keep us updated on how your fish are doing in the new qt tank.. hope they are doing well! Im doing some searches on qt's and this thread is starting to help me out

[thurrmac]

oodinium? nothin beats garlic soaked pellets... it makes them strong...

[RobertE]

any updated on your clown? try to use formalin 5-6 days.

[Felicia]

Hi everyone! I just wanted to give you guys an update.

 

All the fish are in the 10 gallon qt tank and have been treated with QuICK Cure (formalin) twice now at the recommended dose (1 drop per gallon daily). Tonight will be the third dose and then tomorrow I will have to do a 25% water change before I can medicate anymore. The small clownfish has stopped showing any signs and the firefish and YWG still look perfectly healthy. I was getting worried about the bigger female clown because her skin was looking horrible, but as of this morning she's showing a marked improvement, so the medicine must be working. She had three treatments in the little 1.5 gallon I set up as soon as I saw how sick she was while I was setting up the 10 gallon QT and figuring out how to move everything, so she's had 5 doses of formalin total.

 

I'll treat again tomorrow and then do a water change on Thursday. I'll probably do one more cycle of 3 treatments and then if all this fish look healthy I'll stop treating and leave them in QT for 6 weeks before putting them back in the display.

 

I'm still not 100% sure what this was (ich, or the one that starts with an o, or brooklynella), but the formalin seems to be working. I had not tried garlic, but even the sick clownfish was still eating fine. Hopefully this helps as a reference to anyone else fighting ich. If you have any questions about something ive done or suggestions, let me know. Thanks!

[Dani3d]

This look more and more like brook...The main tank must be without fish for 8 weeks.

 

ALL the fish will either get ich, or be carrier and keep your tank contaminated. Forget freshwater...marine ich is not the same as freshwater and does not behave the same either. For freshwater raising the temperature help, for marine ich it does not help at all. 2 different beast here.

 

Be sure not to raise the temperature if you are using formaline as both will lower the oxygen in the water.

 

If you don't treat all the fish and let the ich die in the main tank, you will always have problem with ich.

 

You did well to treat immediatly with formaline because brooklynella is a very fast killer!

 

I don't have a big enough QT tank for all of them right now and I'm going to have to absolutely tear everything up to catch the YWG and the firefish. From my experience from freshwater, not all the fish always get ich even if the tank has it. Is this not the case for saltwater? I was hoping if I could do water changes constantly I could keep the ich population low enough that the other fish may not get it before I wipe it out.

[Felicia]

This look more and more like brook...The main tank must be without fish for 8 weeks.

 

ALL the fish will either get ich, or be carrier and keep your tank contaminated. Forget freshwater...marine ich is not the same as freshwater and does not behave the same either. For freshwater raising the temperature help, for marine ich it does not help at all. 2 different beast here.

 

Be sure not to raise the temperature if you are using formaline as both will lower the oxygen in the water.

 

If you don't treat all the fish and let the ich die in the main tank, you will always have problem with ich.

 

You did well to treat immediatly with formaline because brooklynella is a very fast killer!

Thanks for the info! My first reaction of not needing to pull everything out was my freshwater experiend speaking. Luckily everyone on here is very helpful an provided some great info. I also did a bunch of reading and quickly realized how different handling disease outbreaks in a reef tank is. I've got my QT tank now so hopefully there won't be an issue again an if there is I know how to handle it.

 

I'm glad I treated the clownfish immediately. She went from healthy to looking horrible sooo quickly. I'm thinking it's more likely brooklynella too. I haven't upped temperature, I've matched all the parameters to the display tank and I've only been adding the formalize.

[Felicia]

Update

 

The bigger clownfish is almost entirely cleared up and the other three fish are looking completely healthy. Now they just get to hang out in the QT tank for 6 weeks.

[Felicia]

So sad right now...

 

So my clownfish didn't make it. I thought I had gotten the brooklynella (I'm pretty sure that's what it was now) all cleared up and she was looking great with no signs of being sick. Then last night when I was feeding them, I noticed she was acting a bit funny and seemed to have some of the white gunk coming back. I added another dose of formalin immediately, but by this morning when I woke up she had died. It progressed REALLY fast, which is why I'm positive it wasn't ich. I feel so bad for the other clownfish since they were paired and he looks kind of lost now. Also, he's starting to show signs again, so I'm hoping I can get him cleared up. My other two fish still look great, but I'm sad to have lost the clownfish.

 

Now I've got a dilema because I need to replace the clownfish that died ASAP if I want the smaller one to pair back up. If I leave him alone too long he'll turn into a female and then I'll risk any new fish I add also being a female. I should probably get a new one this weekend, but if I do I'd have to put it in the QT tank which obviously has brooklynella in it. I can't believe 5 days of treatment last time didn't clear it up and that it came back. I'm not sure how long to treat this time to be sure it won't come back. Hmmm...If anyone has any input, let me know.