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Sexy Breeding -- Live nudes!


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I can't wait to see pictures of your kreisel in action. Congratulations on a well-executed design, and I'm pleased to hear that your life beyond reef keeping is so satisfying as well. All things in balance...

Indeed. :)


I recently purchased a 2.5g glass tank for the breeder, from a national chain that I will not name. While there, I picked up a couple things I want to share with you.





I thought it might be handy to have a smaller tube of silicon for gluing in the screen. I have seen this tube before and assumed it was clear. It's BLACK. Interestingly, it says no where on the tube that it is black. Perhaps it mentioned it on the blister pack it came in. I do not know.



While collecting my supplies, I took a look in their saltwater aquariums. One tank contained a Chocolate Chip Sea Star. It was on it's back, lying on the sand, all arms curled back, and contents spilling from its mouth. I informed the attendant that unless they were feeding it to a Harlequin Shrimp, then it was a casualty that needed removing. The attendant thanked me for noticing, proceeded to flip it over, then said "It fine, it just fell off the glass." While these sort of stories are not new for that chain, I can only hope Hitler and those like him have been continuously reincarnated as the spineless inverts in their tanks.


Just so you know. :]


Also, here's some help when cutting nylon mesh.




You can't mark it with pencil and you probably shouldn't mark it with marker. So draw the lines you need on a sheet of card stock, tape it down, then lay your mesh over your outline and tape down the corners. Now you can cut your pattern with a box knife. Note: do not use any portion of the mesh that came into contact with the tape; adhesives can be toxic.



Congratulations on getting it working! If you are going to have this on a broodstock system, I would at least filter the water before it gets to the kreisel. There'll be tons of detritus in the broodstock water (if not initially then eventually) and you don't want to clog the kreisel. The planktonic forms of some hydroids are _tiny_ though. (I have a video around somewhere that's probably a hydroid medusa if you'd like to see it.) From what I recall, much smaller than a rotifer, so you won't be stopping those with any screen that doesn't need to be changed very, very often.


I have no clue what size BVN are. They have veliger larvae, though, just like snails. If they feed in the planktonic stage (if they _have_ a planktonic stage), I would assume that it'll be on phytoplankton of some type. So, I would assume that you are going to need to fill (and retain) a lot of phyto in that kreisel while they are planktonic. On the other hand, slugs like Berghia don't feed while planktonic so you might luck out there. But I would plan for the ability to isolate the kreisel tank from the rest of the system so that you can just turn that tank dark green (or brown) with phyto when necessary. You wouldn't want to include your broodstock tank in that.


Again, I'd like to urge you to consider keeping your two systems separate. In the ocean, all these larvae are way up near the top of the water column, far away from any solid surfaces where filter predators would live. You can't replicate that. You are designing the perfect home for small filter feeders and larvae count as good food for them.

I knew you've been holding out on me. Thank you! :)




I know the photos above probably aren't the ones (note: now there's a funny word.) you were hoping for. So allow me to reiterate. This is not a battle for a one man army. What success in this endeavor will require is ample experimentation. That means I need you.


It is entirely possible that someone before me has in fact discovered the proper BVN cue, but never knew it, because their kreisel sucked bilge. While I have a great deal of confidence in my design, there is really no reason short of divine inspiration to believe my design is somehow the "right" one.


If you need an incentive beyond discovery, then here it is. Breeding BVN can't be patented, but a kreisel most certainly can. When FWE stops working, the right design could be worth a fortune $$$.


That said, I'm not going to show you my loc-line and screen design just yet. To put it simply...


I'll show you mine if you show me yours! ;)

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Ur title is very misleading... :D


Leading, yes. Misleading is something different. :)


Some of you are probably scratching your heads wondering, what the heck am I doing that I can't just cut my screen with a pair of scissors? I'll give you a hint. I just finished gluing it in. Yep! I've been working on it for the last 5 days. :]


It's crazy-awesome. This kreisel is the best model rocket I've ever worked on. I could make this drum 100 different ways and have a lot of fun with each and every one.


As it turns out, the black silicon glue not only cures in 5 minutes, but it's rather stylish on my write drum. I might need to put a flame paint job on this puppy. :D


Seriously persons, get involved; have fun with me. I've shown you all the basic materials you need and where to get them. They aren't expensive.


Probably the single most significant element of my design is the PVC overflow with micron sock. Just with that and this drum, I promise you, any design you make will likely be superior to those $400 dollar pieces of detritus sold on the internet.


So if you've ever had fun building a model rocket, or something similar, and you're into saltwater, then this hobby is for you.


I've created a forum for collaboration. If any of you have the guts to join me in discovery, we can work out an intellectual-property sharing agreement, whereby we all share and profit in common. We can hire a lawyer and have a contract drafted, once we determine as a group the nature of that contract. Why? Because working as a team will allow for 'control groups' and 'experimental groups'. Then we can knock down the variables one at a time, until we reach our goal.


This is about working together, not about stealing ideas.


Join me. :)

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Suddenly this seems shady! :D


I'll get involved when you start the BVN project. I'm currently very very very angry at my sexy shrimp and want nothing to do wit their species at the moment. :D

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Suddenly this seems shady! :D


I'll get involved when you start the BVN project. I'm currently very very very angry at my sexy shrimp and want nothing to do wit their species at the moment. :D


I'm just a guy with opinions...


guy_with_opinions.gif{whistling innocently}


I've finished gluing in my loc-line outlets. They do intersect the jug, but maintain a very low profile. It really is coming together very nicely.


I've taken a black sharpie marker to the outside of the glass, having measured then marked the precise placement of my overflow and jug. Now with these outlines in place, gluing in the overflow will be easy, but the hardest part of all still remains.


My screen design required I glue it in first and my jug design means I now have no means for reaching inside the jug. So the question is, how do I glue the two circular seams bonding the jug to the two sides of the tank? I've been proceeding forward with the assumption that I would figure something out. Fortunately, I believe I have. It will require two new tools of my own making and a combination of solutions. But I have no shortage of determination; I'm itching for an unveiling. :)


It will be another week or so before I have any video. In the mean time, check out my unstoppable ally. They have the unique power and privilege to speak of me when and where... I can't speak back!


...Most can only dream of it. :D

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I see no live nudes! Lies! :P


Setup looks cool though.


Patience. First there is the tease. Then we all get nudi's, eventualese.



I don't know what you mean. I'm not trying to hold anything back. I just don't know what I know that you might want to know. I don't know _anything_ about velvets except that they look cool in photographs. I've never even seen one in person. I do know a little about Berghias and a little about invert reproduction. (If you can ever talk Ron Shimek into giving his invertebrate reproduction for hobbyists course again--I think it was called Invertebrate Larval Embryology--I'd encourage you to take it. I've taken it twice now and learn more each time.) Ask your questions. If I know anything I'll try to answer. :)


I appreciate all of your information immensely. :)


Just wanted to make a quick update. I was planning on being clever and removing one pane of the tank glass to gain access to the inside of the jug for gluing the first seam. While cutting away the top and bottom bracing was little trouble, it seems Nick -- assembler of my tank, according to the label -- was much more clever. The sheets of glass are so perfectly bonded at the seam, there is simply no fitting a razor blade between them. All attempts to do so only chip the glass.


I had read once that this could be done to replace a broken pane. I can only assume tank assembly standards have markedly improved since the writing of that article. Don't bother trying this. It isn't even a maybe.


Instead, I will focus all my effort on building the best possible tools, to glue both seams via nothing more than a 2 inch hole on top. I've already started on a promising design, but silicon glue dries slowly.... :P

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These are my servants: Jetsam & Lagan.


Jetsam: (applicator)



Lagan: (smoother)



Their motions, effortless and precise. Their master, electromagnetism.




Their résumé includes weaseling their way thru any 2 inch hole. However, an online background check revealed that Jetsam is a power hungry neocon and Lagan was once convicted of lying under oath. But private lives made public are still private, and oath said it was consensual. :D


I refuse to discriminate; together we can build great things. :)

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This is Wanda... by day:



This is Wanda... under cover:



I know she ain't pretty to look at, but I'll tell you what... You sit in the same room with her and you say it first. D:


She gets the job done!

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Here's the job...


Lagan will go first, descending into the tank upon a ferrous chain.




Wanda will give the necessary down link...




...and provide the rendezvous position so Lagan can make his contact without any "unfortunate incidents".




Jetsam can get in and out on his own, and will have a gun.




Once we're in position, Jetsam will unload, Lagan will try to smooth things out, and if it all gets too messy, well... Wanda will clean up.


The team will have to hit both sides of the tank and there's no plan 'B' if things go wrong. So we'll do a practice run on the seam I cut out while trying to penetrate the perimeter.


With team work, we will succeed. ;)

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Sneaky sneaky :happy:




Practice run complete. Team performed admirably. Included a couple obsticales not expected on the job. Team performed well when faced with the unexpected.


Main concern, now relieved, was that Lagan would prove too soft and crumple under pressure. Instead, he showed Jetsam what a little finesse can really do. An excellent pair.


As for Wanda, she has several pair. :D


The mission is a go! I said...


Go Go Go...!

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The job is done... almost. :)


I couldn't have picked a better day. First real sun and warmth we've had in weeks. I wanted to do this outside so I would have plenty of light to work by, and my skin could use some color. :]


Opened up a window, blasted the techno, and everything went according to plan. A joyful mission, is a successful mission. ;)


A few pointers if you want to attempt this...


Patience and practice really makes the difference here. My second seam went much smoother than the first, but still made a real mess on the glass on both sides. Wanda can't really do much more than spread it thin. I'm hoping it's thin enough that I can scrub it off with a mag float once dry. The best advice for the sides of the jug is to not get any on there. I managed that for the most part.


You want to get the seam right on the first pass. Going back over a second time makes the mess because Lagan can't lift his nose, so it just smears everywhere it goes. Also, only go one direction. Reversing direction isn't helpful. So take your time with Jetsam, the silicon is going to be slow and difficult to come out due to the length of tubing. So move the nozzel 1 or 2 16ths of an inch at a time and wait until you see the bead contact the glass, then repeat. About every quarter distance around the circumference of the jug, follow up with Lagan, draging his nose behind him at a low angle, no more than 45 degrees. Leave Lagan where he is until ready to continue.


Important note: Jetsam's tube should not be any longer than 18 inches. At that point the back pressure forces the silicone out the back of the caulking gun instead.




We won't actually know success until I do a water test. That will require 48 hours to dry. In the mean time, Jetsam told me I should declare "Mission Accomplished". But Lagan let it be known that Jetsam has given that advice before and said he isn't going to take the fall for him again. So we'll wait to see. :D

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Today the mission was a long, hard slog. ;)


Tho Wanda is an indispensable part of the team, I finally had to tell her today that she doesn't apply the necessary pressure. She got pretty bent out of shape over it...




...said she didn't join this chicken-#### outfit to be a damn maid. To be honest, I bare part of the blame. Wanda has a steel butt that she struts proudly for a reason. I could have better utilized it to retrieve Lagan with less mess. It simply required practice, but instead, I arrogantly assumed Wanda could clean up anything. She can't. Paper towels don't soak-up silicone, they spread it around, and once hardned, a wand tool just doesn't have any leverage.


I tried the mag float to clean the dried silicon off the glass. In principle, it worked, but didn't have the strength to cut through the tough spots. Fortunately, my display tank uses a Tunze Nano skimmer with a magnetic clip. The pump died a few months ago and due to motor design changes I had to buy a whole new unit. The advantage being the salvagable magnetic clip OF DOOM!


Together, these magnetic halves apply 55 pounds of pressure. When I purchased the first unit, the written warning appeared on page 9. I lost flesh from my finger on page 7. Today, the warning appears on page 1. Or page 0.97, if I'm counting with my fingers. :D




I added self-adhesive velcro to the two halves, creating an industrial strength magnetic scrapper to be feared.


It was a bit like polishing stone by hand, but after a lot of scrubbing, it ultimately cut thru what I needed it to. Unfortunately, finely ground dried silicon is not unlike silicon grease, requiring I then wrap the magnet in a paper towel, over and over again. In the end, the glass is in reasonably clean shape. Certainly sufficient for viewing. If I wanted it to be perfect, I'd probably adapt the magnet to look something like this.




Wanda can bark, but this thing can bite!


Given that I bought 3 more jugs, there's a real chance I'll be adding this one to the team at some point. Only god knows it's name. :]




Fortunately Unfortunate


While cleaning out the jug, I unintentionally subjected my unique screen design to significant force. It was the result of impatience on my part, but properly demonstrated that it lacked the necessary robustness to behave as needed. This was in fact a very low moment. While a fix was possible, it would not only be painstaking to implement, but would entirely defeat the point of my special screen design.


When choosing to experiment, one has to be prepared for these kinds of setbacks. I accepted it for what it was and was mostly grateful the fix wouldn't require ripping apart the entire kreisel. Such things happen. :P


Then it hit me! It wasn't that I had a bad idea or that it's implementation was flawed, but rather, it was merely incomplete. A simple and elegant solution that completely solved the problem while retaining all the advantages was hanging nearby.


3 feet of fishing line and a magnetic clip. I kid you not. :)


At this point, I honestly feel I have to apologize for not showing it to you. This thing just went from crazy-awesome, to insanely-awesome.


This is why I experiment. For these are the private moments of wimsy frought with worry, transformed into an elation that only those who discover, can ever hope to hold.


I rather like it this way. :)

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wow!!! I will do this experiment of yours some time on the future


wow!!! I will do this experiment of yours some time on the future.

this is awesome omgomgomg

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wow!!! I will do this experiment of yours some time on the future


wow!!! I will do this experiment of yours some time on the future.

this is awesome omgomgomg



Mission Accomplished.



While the team and I celebrated our success, it came out that before accepting the job, Jetsam had done an online background check of me as well. I couldn't help but ask what compelled him to work with an outspoken, liberal leaning, perpetually incorrigible dissenter, like myself. He said he really wasn't sure about me at first, but that over the years his faith has taught him, "The Sum is greater than the Hole of its parts."






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Now I'm looking at filtration options and I have a couple of questions. Umm_fish?, I'm looking at you here. :) I'm taking your advice to keep the kreisel isolated, but I still want to give it all the filtration it can stand.


1.) If my water is green with phyto and I turn on a skimmer, what happens?


2.) If I dip chaeto in coralRX, will it be safe to add to the kreisel's system?


I want to use a HOB refugium with DSB and chaeto. The DSB would keep the system cycled and the chaeto would supress film algae in the kreisel. If possible, the filtration circuit would start with an overpowered skimmer.



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1. The phyto goes away.

2. I have no idea.

3. Use dead sand and take the long, slow road cycling the first time and that should be fine. I've been toying with the idea of trying out probiotics on the larval tanks, just to speed up the cycle for them.


Another option might be just to have one extra ten gallon tank. Cycle it with a bunch of sponge filters and when you start breaking in a new larval tank just pop one of those in there for a couple of days ahead of time. Larval tanks don't need to be technologically crazy like a reef tank. They need to be clean. Remember that the environment they are trying to mimic is just clean, open ocean. Not a lot of water movement (actually, a lot of water movement but it all moves together, so pretty calm).


1.) I was afraid of that. Thank you for this vital information. :)


I ran some flow control tests with my Fluval 105 canister. I found an arrangement that didn't disrupt the movement inside the kreisel and then measured the flow rate. It measured close to 120 gph. I consider this good results but am uncertain I want to use the canister itself. It was originally purchased to be used with sponges on my QT, but my QT has never gotten any real use. I was thinking of using the Fluval to feed the HOB refugium, but my LFS asked why I would want to use a canister in a marine environment. I didn't have a good answer at the time, but if a skimmer is out of the question, then running a canister with sponges might make sense, so long as I change the sponges daily? Or would it be better just to move all the gunk straight to the fuge? There won't be anything but bacteria in there tho, so I'm unsure what would be best.


I also have a 5w UV sterilizer that I've never used. Would it be useful to sterilize the system water before adding inhabitants? On that note, how should I sterilize the system itself? I was thinking of running 20% vinegar thru it.


I have a backup QuiteOne-1200 pump, incase the one that feeds my DT chiller dies. It has a maximum flow close to 300 gph. I'm going to use it to perform another flow control test and see how the kreisel responds.

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I think it's good to leave the skimmer off. Save it for your growout tanks.


my LFS asked why I would want to use a canister in a marine environment


Water movement? I personally find canisters a pain because it's hard to get into them. That said, if that's what you have and it works, no reason not to use it. Sponge filters are great. You do have to squeeze them out every day or the bacteria cakes on them. Your goal is to change ammonia to nitrate as quickly as possible. Then you can worry about getting the nitrate out. But it's really growout where you see lots of nitrate issues, not so much on the larval rearing. I'm fairly sure that most people who see water quality issues in a larval rearing tank see them because they plop the larva into a sterile tank with no biofilter at all.


Speaking of sterile, vinegar will work. I use bleach because I have it and because I can test for it and neutralize it. If you use bleach, find some with no perfumes or other additives.


I think their point was it would be better to skim and they simply didn't have phytotrophes in mind. As most everyone knows, canisters are typically a nitrate factory and a pain to get into. But they weren't arguing with me, just offering an accurate observation. That said, I think the Fluval is the way to go. This setup doesn't offer the opportunity for a micron sock, so sponges changed daily sound like the best way to remove detritus before it becomes ammonia. When kept in a bucket, opening and closing the Fluval really isn't so bad, and it would also provide the opportunity for carbon. Plus the gph just seems right. At worst, I get tired of it and swap it out for an equivalent pump.


On that note, I tried the QO-1200, but due to the kinky nature of vinyl and resulting head pressure, the pump said it couldn't concentrate and wasn't getting much more than 200 gph. Honestly, if someone would sell vinyl from a spool that didn't collapse the tubing, I'm certain I'd pay more for it. It neither forgives nor forgets. :P Good news is the kreisel weathered 200 gph just fine. As luck would have it, my QO pump had a small leak that was sucking in some air, chopping it into fine bubbles, and giving me a great view of the currents and eddies. Based on that, I got the sense anything more than 200 gph would be pushing it. However, my screen opening extends rather low on the jug. A screen opening that ends 3 or 4 inches above the bottom of the tank could easily accommodate an even higher flow. In any event, I think the 120 gph provided by the Fluval is plenty and I'm pleased the kreisel's interior is so well isolated when arranged this way.


Now I have to decide on my brood system and figure out how I'm going to fit everything in the area I have available. I'd like to use a 5g glass as sump for the 2.5g breeder. It would be connected by a nano overflow and require I drill the glass. I've never done that before but have always wanted to try it. Unfortunately, I don't think my drill is up to the task. I'll probably ask the local glass shop to do it. Then I'll need to put a couple shelves on the wall and I'll finally be ready to go.



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CPR Aquafuge 2 Hang-On Refugium: (with standard 3/4" threaded bulkhead)




The factory outlet fitting looks like PVC, but it's not. It's a proprietary plastic part, but it uses the same sized hole as a standard 3/4" bulkhead. I've replaced it with a 3/4" threaded for use with a 3/4" male-threaded loc-line adapter with 3/4" to 1/2" loc-line reducer.




I had hoped the inlet fitting used the same sized hole as a standard 1/2" bulkhead, but the hole is too small for that. As luck would have it, a simple 90 degree twist of the factory fitting is the answer. I need only remove the Fluval's spout and then the rubber Fluval fitting slides snuggly into place. It's like it was made for it. :)




The initial compartment fits my 150w titanium heater perfectly.




The lower baffle separating the sand bed from the initial compartment allows for a maximum depth of 3 and a half inches. So I want a sugar-fine sand grade to ensure a functional DSB. I found the following substrate at Petco and I like both it's color and composition.


Umm_fish?, tho the attendant said it just fell off the glass, I'm pretty sure it's dead. :D




mndfreeze, from the kreisel's outer compartment, to a canister with sponges and carbon, to a DSB and Chaeto, then thru 100 micron sock, before anything enters the kreisel's inner compartment. Am I missing anything? :)



I should mention, as with all things acrylic, this refugium is overpriced. As Umm_fish? mentioned, a simple air driven sponge filter would probably suffice. They are much more affordable, but I do have my reasons for choosing this device.


Now I need shelves!

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I had a large plastic pipe fitting laying around and glued it to the bottom of a bucket to act as a stand for my Fluval. I then glued some eggcrate over the opening to hold the canister in place. It also holds a flathead screwdriver for easy opening and provides a shelf for the lid when open. This should make the daily sponge rinse a clean and easy process. :)


Now I know what you're thinking...




...just buy some damn shrimp already!


Well I would... but the breeder is getting drilled right now, and she told me not to pick her up 'til Tuesday. :D


In the mean time, my partner has some updates.

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yarrr.... scalawags, it be a see voyage we're taken. We be look'n fer sum sunken treasure....




Lumber isn't my favorite material to work with, but I manage. These shelves are both sturdy and level. Also, I only trust a DSB I can see, so I've cut a window into the dry wall for a 'behind the scenes' view. :)


While the Aquafuge can technically hang on the back of my kreisel, I really want the fuge to stand on its own. Not only does this allow me to easily swap out the kreisel if needed, but the weight of the sand in this size of a fuge could prove too much for a 10 gallon tank.


The shelf on the left is for the breeder and I've set the top of the tank level with the top of the fuge. This allows them to conveniently share the same 24" T5 x2 light fixture.




I really wanted to show all of you a completed workstation this weekend, but I've run into a delay. 2.5g All-Glass aquariums are made with 1/16th" glass. The shop called me Tuesday to warn that drilling glass that thin would crack. I told them to give it a shot anyway.


It cracked.


I had already built the shelf to accommodate this size and dimension of tank, so I considered my options and realized, while it is no longer possible to remove a single pane of glass intact, it is still possible to remove a single pane that is first busted out from the middle. So I ordered a replacement pane at 3/16th", but it won't be done until Tuesday. :P


In the mean time, here is the 5g sump for the 2.5g brood.




I'll be running it bare bottom with liverock and I've put in eggcrate to protect the glass. The thing that always astounds me about most who run bare bottom (besides the obvious draft), is how easy it is for a small tumble to end all the fun.


The return pump is a Mini-Jet 404.




The skimmer is a AquaticLife Mini 115.




And the reactor is a Fluval U1. It's intended as a sponge filter, mostly for freshwater tanks, but I've removed the sponge and replaced it with a media bag for carbon.




So here it is! Such as it is.






You'll notice the back of the kreisel makes for an excellent spill tray. :)


I'll need to replace the 1/2" with 3/4" loc-line tho. Currently, I can only run the canister at half power or the fuge will overflow.


As for the brackets up top, they hold the light fixture when I need into the brood or the fuge.


Today I started the cycle!




I've sprinkled some frozen mysis on the sand and added bacteria.


Interestingly, when I bought the sand, I assumed it was oolite, but upon opening the bag, I realized it was entirely sugar-fine quartz. I had heard quartz sand can be bad, but I didn't know as to why other than it can scratch the glass, which of course, doesn't matter in this situation. So I did a quick search and turned up this rather interesting article. It serves as a reminder not only of the many voodoo myths that tend to crop up in this hobby, but also just how much more 'Mr. Wizard' this hobby is getting each year.


Blessed is the free exchange of information, for it enriches us all.


After reading that article, I came to the conclusion that quartz might actually be the preferable substrate for this application.


Now I just need to keep an eye on this guy. I really love these Ammonia Alert badges. I'm not sure why anyone would buy an actual test kit anymore.




With luck, Tuesday will be the final assembly and by Thursday all the glue should be dry. I'll fill the 7.5g breeder system with tank water from my display tank, as well as using liverock from its refugium, so it won't need to be cycled. I should have Sexies doing the nasty in no time.


Complex research science, or prurient voyeurism cleverly disguised? I'm guessing false duality! :D

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