LPS-Crazy Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 Ok so I ordered a MP40w ES from Foster and Smith about 2 weeks ago. Pulled the pump out of the box all happy, read the instructions, set it up and plugged it in. Everything went great, stood in awe of what it was doing. Went to finish something up came back and the pump wasnt running. Unplugged it, played with the cords, nothing....Hmmm Well I called Ecotech Marine and told them what was going on. They said we will send you out a new power supply. Well I got the new power supply hooked it up.....Nothing, but the LED light on the power supply was on atleast so I called them back and told them my pump still wasnt running. Well they told me we can send you out a new pump right away, when you get it send back the old one with the prepaid lable. Im like awesome, great customer service ! Well we get to the end of the call and he finished verifing my shipping info. He then was like all we need now is your credit card number to authorize before we ship it out. I was like what is that needed for ? He was like, just incase you dont send the old pump back. I was like WTF ? This is how you treat you customers who just saved up for 3 months to buy a fricken pump form you only to get a reject ? Well cut a long story short, I dont use credit cards. I only have a visa debit card for my bank and I, sad to say dont have $400 in their right now so even if I gave you the number and all you do is authorize the card not charge it, it isnt going to go through. He was like sorry then we cant help you. First off they treated me like some criminal assuming right off the bat I wasnt going to send it back. Ok, Im sure they dont receive all of them back, but most folks are honost enough to send it back right ? That part of doing business. If the pump is broke it doesnt have much value anyways !!!! So why the need to charge me the full retail again ? Especially with something that has a markup like a Vortech. Im sure they dont pay some little chinese kid $400 to make the thing. Total cost is probably $100 or less. I just dont think highly of companies that dont stand behind their product. Especially one so hyped up as the Vortech line. I told him that I was just going to take the pump back to foster and smith and exchange it and I would also let the purchasing director have a peice of my mind about Ecotech Marine's crappy customer service . The Ecotech rep basically told me that that was fine and asked if there was anything else ? Kinda gave me the impression that he was like "HAHA WE ARE ECOTECH, MAKERS OF THE MIGHTY VORTECH PUMPS WE NEED NOT FEAR THE CONSUMER...THEY WILL BUY THESE ANYWAY" Basically any other company I have every had a problem with their equipment has stood behind their product 100% All I needed to do was show them my receipt and typically a new product was on its way. Most usually dont want the old product back...Unless it is some weird problem they want to look into more. Thats another thing, if Ecotech is demanding the return of all defective pumps, I would assume they are remanufacturing them and selling them again as new. Food for thought when your purchasing a $400 pump that you think is new, it may have been someone elses problem. So thats what I did, I returned the pump, requested to speak to someone at Foster and Smith about Ecotechs policies and was sent over to the purchasing directors office where we had a nice talk and he knocked 25% off the Vortech purchase. He also stated he would talk with the Sales department at Ecotech next order. Link to comment
skimmerdude Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 Ok so I ordered a MP40w ES from Foster and Smith about 2 weeks ago. Pulled the pump out of the box all happy, read the instructions, set it up and plugged it in. Everything went great, stood in awe of what it was doing. Went to finish something up came back and the pump wasnt running. Unplugged it, played with the cords, nothing....Hmmm Well I called Ecotech Marine and told them what was going on. They said we will send you out a new power supply. Well I got the new power supply hooked it up.....Nothing, but the LED light on the power supply was on atleast so I called them back and told them my pump still wasnt running. Well they told me we can send you out a new pump right away, when you get it send back the old one with the prepaid lable. Im like awesome, great customer service ! Well we get to the end of the call and he finished verifing my shipping info. He then was like all we need now is your credit card number to authorize before we ship it out. I was like what is that needed for ? He was like, just incase you dont send the old pump back. I was like WTF ? This is how you treat you customers who just saved up for 3 months to buy a fricken pump form you only to get a reject ? Well cut a long story short, I dont use credit cards. I only have a visa debit card for my bank and I, sad to say dont have $400 in their right now so even if I gave you the number and all you do is authorize the card not charge it, it isnt going to go through. He was like sorry then we cant help you. First off they treated me like some criminal assuming right off the bat I wasnt going to send it back. Ok, Im sure they dont receive all of them back, but most folks are honost enough to send it back right ? That part of doing business. If the pump is broke it doesnt have much value anyways !!!! So why the need to charge me the full retail again ? Especially with something that has a markup like a Vortech. Im sure they dont pay some little chinese kid $400 to make the thing. Total cost is probably $100 or less. I just dont think highly of companies that dont stand behind their product. Especially one so hyped up as the Vortech line. I told him that I was just going to take the pump back to foster and smith and exchange it and I would also let the purchasing director have a peice of my mind about Ecotech Marine's crappy customer service . The Ecotech rep basically told me that that was fine and asked if there was anything else ? Kinda gave me the impression that he was like "HAHA WE ARE ECOTECH, MAKERS OF THE MIGHTY VORTECH PUMPS WE NEED NOT FEAR THE CONSUMER...THEY WILL BUY THESE ANYWAY" Basically any other company I have every had a problem with their equipment has stood behind their product 100% All I needed to do was show them my receipt and typically a new product was on its way. Most usually dont want the old product back...Unless it is some weird problem they want to look into more. Thats another thing, if Ecotech is demanding the return of all defective pumps, I would assume they are remanufacturing them and selling them again as new. Food for thought when your purchasing a $400 pump that you think is new, it may have been someone elses problem. So thats what I did, I returned the pump, requested to speak to someone at Foster and Smith about Ecotechs policies and was sent over to the purchasing directors office where we had a nice talk and he knocked 25% off the Vortech purchase. He also stated he would talk with the Sales department at Ecotech next order. Ummm. . . . . . the credit card thing is pretty standard across ALL businesses if you want a new product before the company receives the damaged/defective item. Foster and Smith did the same thing when I returned a chiller that sounded like a jackhammer. Sorry, but Ecotech is right on this one. Link to comment
jgoldwood Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 Sorry, but Echtech is right on this one. Agreed Link to comment
burtbollinger Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 you might want to take a deep breath and think about it from their point of view... Frankly, I wouldn't have sent you anything either. By choosing not to have a credit card, you are going to have to deal with these sorts of injustices from time to time...and if you simply can't afford a credit card, then there's the unspoken fact that one might correctly or incorrectly assume you might be in dire economic straits...just the kind of person who lies, says something is broken so they can get another one sent to them... Will you be posting a similar post on a travel/vacation forum when Avis or Enterprise won't let you drive off the lot with a rental car and no credit card? No...that would be sillier. Unfortunately....its almost an equivalent situation. Link to comment
msujeff Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 How does the company know that you're not trying to scam them? I think it's completely fair to ask for a credit card in case you don't return the defective one. The reason for this policy is that people rip off companies all the time and when they're selling $200+ products, they don't want to get screwed. I don't see the problem with their policy. Link to comment
LPS-Crazy Posted February 12, 2011 Author Share Posted February 12, 2011 Not sure about that, foster and smith has sent me out replacements on many products free of charge that have either arrived damaged or had shipping errors. Actually the MP40 was one of them. The original one didnt show up and they send me out a new one strait away. No charge no nothing. The only company besides this one that has ever given me any greif about correcting a defective product was Eheim which refused to do anything at all. Marineland, Current USA, eshoppes, just to name a few have great customer service departments. Basically Ecotech thinks it product is gold and knows it is unique so people are going to buy it either way. Link to comment
gulfsurfer101 Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 Why didn't you just return the defective pump, being under warranty they would have paid shipping both ways and fixed the problem for you. Ecotech rocks, my pump was sticking on reefcrest mode two months after my warranty was up and they fixed it for me for cost of shipping. Saved me about 70 bucks that I still ended spending on upgrades because their products and customer service are top notch. Link to comment
jgoldwood Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 The Ecotech products aren't gold? Link to comment
LPS-Crazy Posted February 12, 2011 Author Share Posted February 12, 2011 How does the company know that you're not trying to scam them? I think it's completely fair to ask for a credit card in case you don't return the defective one. The reason for this policy is that people rip off companies all the time and when they're selling $200+ products, they don't want to get screwed. I don't see the problem with their policy. The problem is that most people have to save up to purchase a $200+ item. Meaning that why should they have to pay twice for a product that should have been right the first time. In my case I dont use credit card, just my debit card. I dont have $400 to be tied up any given day of the week. Kinda like Microsoft, everyone hates them but at the same time are dependant on them. Link to comment
jgoldwood Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 You aren't charged twice, rather they hold your number in the event you don't send the defective product back. Link to comment
LPS-Crazy Posted February 12, 2011 Author Share Posted February 12, 2011 Long story short, I expressed my opinion to the vendor that I purchase from. I receieved a discount for my troubles and know in the future to just not purchase their products. Link to comment
jonny roks Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 Listen your wrong to bash the company, they definitely offer some of the best customer service in the industry. I constantly read great things about them. but i understand that your upset. I just went through something similar with a real life buddy of mind with a light fixture, i understand not all people have credit cards. he was furious just like you... His fixture was having problems...and the company wanted to put a 400 dollar hold on his card. He didn't have a credit card only a bank debit card.[ which he used to buy the fixture less than 5 months ago] He couldn't afford to have 400 dollars tied up on his card which is understandable. He was furious, I told him to tell the company that his reef would die without a light and they sent out a new one to him without the 400 dollar hold. Now understand a company does not need to do this but they did because it would have killed his reef. If you don't have a credit card or a debit card then the pump should just be sent back to them and sent back to you. your reef was fine before you got it and i believe it will be fine while its repaired. Electronics have defects no matter what, things fail. they warranty it. just send it back. Link to comment
LPS-Crazy Posted February 12, 2011 Author Share Posted February 12, 2011 You aren't charged twice, rather they hold your number in the event you don't send the defective product back. No, they authorize your card for the $400. If they just hold your card, any yo yo could go buy a pre-paid $10 visa card and use that. When you authorize a bank card it puts those funds on hold. I couldnt afford to have $400 tied up. Link to comment
gulfsurfer101 Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 I hear you on that but they have always been willing to help out. I even had a rep walk me through a stall mode fix I couldn't figure out over the phone. No matter what I would do the thing would stall about ten seconds after restarting so I called the customer service line and the rep talked me right through a simple fix right over the phone. Link to comment
LPS-Crazy Posted February 12, 2011 Author Share Posted February 12, 2011 I hear you on that but they have always been willing to help out. I even had a rep walk me through a stall mode fix I couldn\\\\\\\'t figure out over the phone. No matter what I would do the thing would stall about ten seconds after restarting so I called the customer service line and the rep talked me right through a simple fix right over the phone. Well that should be expected from a company shouldnt it ? To know their product well enough to walk you through a problem ? I certainly expect that, especially in a $200+ product. I never did say their technical support was horrible, just their custromer service IN MY CASE. Basically I could have called Fosters and Smith and they would probably have sent me out another one. I probably would have done this but like I said above they already had send me out a replacement due to a shipping error and I didnt want to push my luck. My point is this, A multi-million dollar company selling a product with as large of a markup as a Vortech should be a little more proactive on their RMA. You know if I had the pump plugged in for 6 months and something went wrong I could probably live with that and send it back in and all that jazz, but I had the thing plugged in for less than a hour the same day fedex dropped it off before it failed. This was just out of the box guys !! Also to, I had my reciept scanned to PDF along with pics of the unit with the serial number ready to e-mail them...Standard for any RMA. They never asked for any of that just my $400. I mean isnt that the point of putting a serial number on these things to trace where they were sent to and stuff ? Like a lot number kinda deal. Bottom line I admit I was upset because this $450 item I just purchased didnt work out of the box and noone at the company really gave a crap. That is my deal.... Also, what is the deal with the full retail replacment cost, Ecotech is the wholesaler, cant they give you the RMA at cost or something ? If they wanted $200 to secure that I would have sent it back that would have been fine, but $450 is a bit steep. Link to comment
LPS-Crazy Posted February 12, 2011 Author Share Posted February 12, 2011 I had the same experience with Canon. They told me that they would just put my debit card number on file in case I did not send them the defective one. the next day I go to get gas and my card is rejected. I check with the bank and then charged my card $1500 for a whole new camera/lens/etc.... I called them up and they did not acknowledge that they had charged me. Log story short I never got the new camera. I was stuck with the $1500 charge and ended up filing a dispute with the bank. I ended up winning, but to this day I will NEVER buy a Canon product again. I even attempted many times to let them correct their mistake, but to no avail. Some companies forget who they work for - the consumer. They forget that you are actually their boss and all you have to do to fire them is to buy a product from someone else. I couldnt have said it better myself. It is the people who gives these companies the power they have. Most people are willing to give up a little customer service to have the hot item. I has gotten out of control in this country. Its pretty bad when people make excuses for shotty business practices. Back in the 50's they would have driven here and picked the pump up. Wow, way to pull your post. Link to comment
Flicker Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 OK here it is back.... I had the same experience with Canon. They told me that they would just put my debit card number on file in case I did not send them the defective one. the next day I go to get gas and my card is rejected. I check with the bank and then charged my card $1500 for a whole new camera/lens/etc.... I called them up and they did not acknowledge that they had charged me. Log story short I never got the new camera. I was stuck with the $1500 charge and ended up filing a dispute with the bank. I ended up winning, but to this day I will NEVER buy a Canon product again. I even attempted many times to let them correct their mistake, but to no avail. Some companies forget who they work for - the consumer. They forget that you are actually their boss and all you have to do to fire them is to buy a product from someone else. Link to comment
kayl Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 Basically any other company I have every had a problem with their equipment has stood behind their product 100% All I needed to do was show them my receipt and typically a new product was on its way. Most usually dont want the old product back...Unless it is some weird problem they want to look into more. Thats another thing, if Ecotech is demanding the return of all defective pumps, I would assume they are remanufacturing them and selling them again as new. Food for thought when your purchasing a $400 pump that you think is new, it may have been someone elses problem. A ) Ecotech is in the right on this one B ) If they didn't ask for the old pumps back, what would stop an unethical individual from calling them up and saying that the product was defective in order to get 2 vortechs for the price of one? Link to comment
reefbee Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 A ) Ecotech is in the right on this one B ) If they didn't ask for the old pumps back, what would stop an unethical individual from calling them up and saying that the product was defective in order to get 2 vortechs for the price of one? Can't please all the people all the time.... Echotech is a great company with great products. Some people this they are different from everyone else and deserve special consideration. Unbelievable.... Link to comment
GiantBen Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 Why didn't you just have them send you the prepaid box, so you could return the broken one first? No need for cc that way. Link to comment
Neya Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 Why didn't you just have them send you the prepaid box, so you could return the broken one first? No need for cc that way. Exactly, They shouldve offered this as an option. Im in the same boat as OP - debit only and unable to tie up huge funds. I would be angry if they only offered one option of a hold on CC, although I would happily return the product first and wait for a new one. Many reef companies replace items no questions asked, and I know of at least one person who took advantage of this (it makes me terribly angry, as that cost comes to us - the rest who honestly purchase). Link to comment
LPS-Crazy Posted February 12, 2011 Author Share Posted February 12, 2011 Exactly, They shouldve offered this as an option. Im in the same boat as OP - debit only and unable to tie up huge funds. I would be angry if they only offered one option of a hold on CC, although I would happily return the product first and wait for a new one. Many reef companies replace items no questions asked, and I know of at least one person who took advantage of this (it makes me terribly angry, as that cost comes to us - the rest who honestly purchase). Correct. If this option was offered to me right from the get go it probably wouldnt be a issue. Instead I got the " This is our policy GFY, we are elite Ecotech." Again, companies only act this way because the American public bends over a little farther everyday for the big corperate schlong just to get their hands on a hot product. Why do you think most companies have the little tag/card inside that say "Do not return this product to the store ! Call 1-800-xxx-xxxx if you are having problems" Well companies do this because they do not want the retailer to know they make a faulty product, they want you to call them so they can make it right which most companies do. I was not given that impression when I talked to Ecotech Marine. WE ARE IN CHARGE !!! WE KEEP THEM IN BUSINESS BY DOING BUSINESS WITH THEM !!! WE HAVE THE CONTROL!!!! LETS TAKE IT BACK ALREADY. Link to comment
kthehun89 Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 WE ARE IN CHARGE !!! WE KEEP THEM IN BUSINESS BY DOING BUSINESS WITH THEM !!! WE HAVE THE CONTROL!!!! LETS TAKE IT BACK ALREADY. This ain't Egypt... Link to comment
burtbollinger Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 the consensus is you're in the wrong, yet you act like youre in the right. Get over yourself, dude. I just hope you are not over the age of 15...because you present yourself as having the mentality of a pre-teen. Frankly, you're embarrassing yourself in what is easily one of the lamest threads I've seen in YEARS of daily lurking. I'm actually looking how to block your future postings...it's that off-base, whiny and annoying. Link to comment
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