1/4 Gallon Open Top SPS Cube

[ulver982]

A before and after:

 

 

Edited January 30, 2010 by ulver982

[ulver982]

Ahh I just deleted my post! Lets see if I can remember what I wrote.

 

My coraline was doing well in my 2.5 at first when I had 36 watts of PC lighting with no SPS. I then added LEDs and added a couple SPS (birdnest and some unknown). Since then my coraline on my glass and intake tubes have disappeared. I've read that the change to LEDs can affect coraline growth. So not sure if it's my lights or the addition of my SPS that could affect my coraline growth. I've recently tested my pH and KH and my pH can get as low as 7.8 and KH 5-6. I've been using seachem's marine buffer to increase my pH and alk. Hopefully I'll see some coraline growth now, but my SPS are growing really well though.

Edited January 30, 2010 by ulver982

[brandon429]

nice growth!

how old is it man/ able to retain that pink color the whole time is sharp

Edited January 30, 2010 by brandon429

[thesmallerthebetter]

what are you guys dosing for calcium and alk in these tiny systems?

 

the published experts I read on other forums recommend not dosing. However, what they won't be able to show you is a pico with coralline and sps plating growth all around. They'll show you a pristinely-clean reef, no benthic growth whatsoever on the glass or sand but the baddest excrusted live rock you have ever seen. Aged rock, sterile glass and substrate...always sounded to me like the rock didn't mature in this *undosed* tank?

 

 

To me, relying on water changes only makes the slowest possible calcification rates for a system, the baseline in growth, and doesn't outcompete for algae very well imo. I am a doser so Im predjudiced lol. If anyone has pics of an aged, undosed pico with sps growth then that will show an alternate means. If you dose, it'll quadruple your calcification rate Im sure, and anytime you have coralline you can have SPS growth. PC's work well, I feel it's your dosing honestly.

 

not saying it's impossible to have sps pico success without dosing, Im just saying I have never seen it done in ten years so I keep looking for a successful long term sps pico that is not dosed. JustDave had some on this site from about 4 years ago, he dosed, and look how purple his azoo 1/2 g tanks were! The rarest thing you can find regarding marine tanks on the entire internet is a pico reef with coralline. To me that says the experts are about 5+ years behind the learning curve lol

B

 

Hey brandon! big fan here

 

Ive never dose, and that very well may be the issue i was having. however, towards the end of that 1/2 Gallon pico i was running, i did have ENOURMOUS calcified growth, just not purple. i had massive green coraline ALL over the glass. It got to the point where i couldnt keep up with cleaning it off. i dont know if green coraline algea differs from the purple everyone is so fond of tho...

 

ive long been aware that you dose your micro systems, and ive considered it before.i just never got into it.

 

you run pcs, and have had HUGE success with them, but ive always had hard times keeping the colors i love in the tanks with PCs, for this tank im giving LEDs a shot. Hoping that the increased PAR and Lack of heat will help me along the way.

 

 

 

I would also add that just because a tank is this small doesn't mean dosing will kill it, spike the pH etc. You simply scale down the additive and make sure to only dose before lights on. Dosing a 1/4 gallon tank is no more harmful than dosing a 1/2, with C-Balance or ESV two part. salinity control will be more of a long term threat to this tank imo. if you do choose to dose, it will have to be in the mornings strictly, afternoon dosings will spike your pH above 9. Of course I think water changes only would be easier, but how much cooler would it be for this palmtank to get purple instead of just look the same month after month!

 

this sure is small, but you can do it fo sho man

 

Im going to start testing my levels daily once i get this up and running, and see if i can keep the calc where i want it with daily or bidaily water changes, or if not, ill dose. Id love to get some serious purple in here since im painting out all but the front veiwing window

 

HA!!!!!!!!!!!!! that is way smart I never think of the simple stuff.

 

Yes, that's better for your system via easy introduction of chems id think but I have one ponderance-> I don't know how the chemistry might work in the container that's separate from the reef. it will sit idle in the change water, where in an active reef it's taken out rather quickly due to calcification/acid binding from detritus breakdown etc, if the water is heated and circulated that may not matter, its just a dynamics change worth considering.

 

in my change water I keep it unheated until ready to use and I don't see fluctuating temps keeping those ions in suspension. Just to illustrate another variable between change vessels and the actual reef--I always get a cream flake buildup at the bottom of my change container, like a little slime or chemical sludge mass that sticks to the bottom of the container after it sits for a week or so. This does not ever happen in a pico,

 

I would notice them immediately looking like white cereal flakes, so that's another physical difference between the two containers and that may be insignificant, just brainstorming on how that may or may not affect ion dissolution. I would bet temp and water movement in the change water would solve the issue tho

 

 

 

 

What a smart idea though Im sure there's some way of doing it.

 

 

I think it might be best to include a small powerhead in the bucket if not a heater as well. treat the bucket like a second aquarium, only devoid of life and dark. thats how i kept my water change reservoir for the 1/2G i ran.

 

thanks for the ideas brandon. you really are an insipiration when it comes to sub gallon reefs. im just hoping that this little sucker works out the way i imagine it.....

 

 

in other news....

 

i think i figured out water movement, but so far its still classified information.... i have to build it from scratch

[brandon429]

hey thanks i have a lot of green calcareous algae mixed in too

as long as it was the crusty kind thats an indication of calcium matrix building, perhaps your water change habits kept the measures well enough

 

a very good friend of mine keeps a large tank undosed although thats a challenge to repeat imo you guys are building cool tanks enjoy reading your threads

Edited January 31, 2010 by brandon429

[thesmallerthebetter]

So, finished the MR16 pendant today. Also painted out the sides and back of the tank. so i figured now that theres something to take pictures of, id upload a few

 

pardon the quality, just cell phone pics...

 

 

[Weetabix7]

Evilc66 has commented a couple of times that dosing is actually even more important in aquariums lit with LED, seems to make a big difference in good coral coloration.

[brandon429]

Weet that is really neat I hadn't heard that, good to get all this info from people who specialize in LED mastery all in one place. SmallerTB this tank looks *sturdy* with the wall thickness compared to overall size that's solid it's all great, light is strong too I can see.

 

wonder how that works with the led's weetabix. Im so interested in zeovit dosing, calcium dosing seems elementary compared to that line of work. normally I try for simple stuff that doesn't need a lot of adjusting but like was mentioned earlier PC's and a mostly brown color get boring after a while, need new ground so it's fun to watch this contest.

[thesmallerthebetter]

Evilc66 has commented a couple of times that dosing is actually even more important in aquariums lit with LED, seems to make a big difference in good coral coloration.

 

interesting to hear. thanks for the info

 

Weet that is really neat I hadn't heard that, good to get all this info from people who specialize in LED mastery all in one place. SmallerTB this tank looks *sturdy* with the wall thickness compared to overall size that's solid it's all great, light is strong too I can see.

 

wonder how that works with the led's weetabix. Im so interested in zeovit dosing, calcium dosing seems elementary compared to that line of work. normally I try for simple stuff that doesn't need a lot of adjusting but like was mentioned earlier PC's and a mostly brown color get boring after a while, need new ground so it's fun to watch this contest.

 

thanks

 

i too wonder why exactly LEDs make dosing more critical, it probably has to do with increased PAR and thus increased growth rates consuming more nutrients? just my $.02.

[reef2.5]

What kind of ato system do you use I'm having a little trouble with my ato I made

[thesmallerthebetter]

What kind of ato system do you use I'm having a little trouble with my ato I made

 

i use a hamster bottle ATO set up, mounted above the tank. what system are you using?

[reef2.5]

i use a hamster bottle ATO set up, mounted above the tank. what system are you using?

so this is what i came up with. got a pic of yours? does it hold your s.g. ok?

[thesmallerthebetter]

so this is what i came up with. got a pic of yours? does it hold your s.g. ok?

 

urs looks a hundred times better than mine haha. i just hide mine behind the bookshelf this tank is on. its actually the same one i ran on my half gallon. i have some pics but id have to dredge them up....theres some in this forum somewhere tho...

 

in other news, tearing down and cleaning out an old 75 and 100 gallon today, hoping to use that money to get the ball moving again on this build....

[chefcody86]

Sounds freakin cool

 

Where u getting this heat tape?

 

could use it on my project im doin .5

 

look if you dare

 

http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=226036

[rickjg]

So, got some parts in the mail today, the aqualifter and heat tape came. the heat tape looks like its gonna be kickarse, cant wait to get that all rigged up and make a few test runs.

 

the aqualifter however was a HUGE disappointment...the thing barely moves any water.....i dont know if my pump it defective or what, but at the most, at ZERO head, i get a very slow trickle....i suppose if the online retailer wont take the pump back im gonna try chopping it up and fiddling with it.....

 

looks like i have to come up with a new idea for water movement....id kill for someone to invent a 10gph external pump right now.....hmmm....

 

Your aqualifter is normal as far as I can tell on flow. I have an aqualifter powered filter on my FW pico and it would be lucky to flow 1/2 GPH. Works OK for a low flow FW pico, but no way would it work on a pico reef.

[rickjg]

looks like i have to come up with a new idea for water movement....id kill for someone to invent a 10gph external pump right now.....hmmm....

 

how about using a canister filter? I

http://www.fosterandsmithaquatics.com/prod...mp;pcatid=16742

if it has too much flow you can tee-in a crossover tube between the supply & return with a ball-valve and lower the water flow as low as you want to go.

might be a good place to run Chemi-Pure or PhosBan

you could even drill your tank, install mini bulkheads and hide the canister filter under your stand or table . . .

Edited February 14, 2010 by rickjg

[c_k_kuehne]

Aqualifters aren't really make for system pumps -- good for ATO systems but that is about it.

[thesmallerthebetter]

Sounds freakin cool

 

Where u getting this heat tape?

 

could use it on my project im doin .5

 

look if you dare

 

http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=226036

 

i got the heat tape on ebay, your tank looks wicked. what kinda LEDs are you using? crees?

 

 

Your aqualifter is normal as far as I can tell on flow. I have an aqualifter powered filter on my FW pico and it would be lucky to flow 1/2 GPH. Works OK for a low flow FW pico, but no way would it work on a pico reef.

 

i saw your tank when i went looking around to see if anyone had aqualifter troubles. awsome planted tank btw

 

i came to the conclusion that the aqualifter does indeed provide 3.5gph of volumetric flow, but does so at a lower velocity than i find useful. thus, it gets boxed up and packed away for the next little project

 

how about using a canister filter? I

http://www.fosterandsmithaquatics.com/prod...mp;pcatid=16742

if it has too much flow you can tee-in a crossover tube between the supply & return with a ball-valve and lower the water flow as low as you want to go.

might be a good place to run Chemi-Pure or PhosBan

you could even drill your tank, install mini bulkheads and hide the canister filter under your stand or table . . .

 

i thought about the canister route, but didnt want to add any water volume to the system. that canister would like double my volume (had one lyring around that i used on my mantis' old 2.5 lagoon before he kicked it. i did actually come up with an idea for flow, that shouldnt take up more than 17mms of tank space

 

just have to bite the bullet and order my parts...or see if i have them in the garage.....

 

also toying the idea of designing a TINY self-shaking ZEOvit reactor and running a 1/4Gallon ZEOpico the parts are easy enough to come by, and a tiny skimmer should be incredibly easy to DIY....idk, just a thought

[rickjg]

Look'n forward 2 U'r solitions 4 flow & heating & reactor & skimmer

Edited February 20, 2010 by rickjg

[c_k_kuehne]

why not just an air line tube in the tank. When my 1 gallon goes into standby mode the battery powered air pump kick on and I still get good circulation and surface agitation. No air stone just an air line or two properly placed.

 

When you can't make it work go back to low tech -- there was something like that in a movie talking about phones not being taped -- but I think it applies.

[thesmallerthebetter]

why not just an air line tube in the tank. When my 1 gallon goes into standby mode the battery powered air pump kick on and I still get good circulation and surface agitation. No air stone just an air line or two properly placed.

 

When you can't make it work go back to low tech -- there was something like that in a movie talking about phones not being taped -- but I think it applies.

 

air lifts are loud, make ###### like crazy, and then theres bubbles in the tank....

 

i thought about it tho, but low tech doesnt fit with the theme

[chefcody86]

did you buy your cube or make it yourself?

 

My pico i made with arclic wont hold water its wack.

[c_k_kuehne]

did you buy your cube or make it yourself?

 

My pico i made with arclic wont hold water its wack.

 

What did you use to adhere the panes of acrylic ???

[reef2.5]

hows it going any thing new going on

[thesmallerthebetter]

Hey, took a major leave of absence, school started kicking my arse pretty bad....freaking english major bullpuckeys. but anyways, i started gathering parts for my pump build about a week ago, hoping everything arrives in time for the april 30th deadline.

 

in other news, so far i have my heater and thermostat built, the MR11 LEDs all wired and ready to go (still debating whether pendant or acrylic arch as far as mounting), and i have most of the mechanical components of the pump build lined up on my counter.

 

i actually started working on prepping the magnets tonight, filled the rings with epoxy and began coating in sealant (theyre nickle plated and i dont wanna risk it). Turns out magnets are a major pain to paint. i had to design a little paint jig to hold them while i spray them down.

 

hopefully the brushless motor and esc will arrive in the next few days so i can start playing with them and getting everything configured.

 

so yes. i am still in this contest, just hit a few road bumps is all