Jump to content
inTank Media Baskets

Elos vs Solana vs Cadlights


sammyman

Recommended Posts

martiniReef

i know what you mean Urchinhead and i totally agree with you on that. the point i was trying to make was that the water splits in 2 surface skimmers and only one of them (bio chamber) will reach the UV and will only be impacted by half of the full force of the (450GPH) pump and since the water moves slowly, there is more contact time and increases kill rate much more. thats why i feel that the UV will do the job. and if you use it for 365 days a year you should change it once a year but like me i turn it on one week and turn it off one week then it can last longer. or you can even turn it on only when you see traces of Cyano or parasites, then it will last even longer. one other advantage of the drop-in UV is that when you shut it off, you dont have to drain out the "dead water" in the UV case that creates harmful anaerobics. since it is designed to be drop-in and disposable, buying a replacement ($55) is about the same cost as buying a replacment bulb for most conventional UVs but of course you get a whole new unit.

 

master-builder: it is my obsessive nature to detail, that is the symptom of my job. but i tend to look at all the best features of each tank and find one unit that has the most of them wrapped in one. then that is my choice. in NYC there are lots of aquarium stores and since being a hobbyist, i went to many stores. some of the custom-made aquarium stores needed me to represent them on their behalf, thats why i knew alot about the way tanks, systems and plumbing needed to be built according to specific standards. i am still learning so i cant say i am any expert, but just not as dumb as Phixion arrogantly thinks i or any other lower post count ppl am.

 

yes the price is high for the Elos but why i love it is that it has many unique features that most cubes and nano systems dont have. both the CAD and Elos systems are top of the line and both have unique features that had me thinking for quite a long time between the 2. so deciding to get both of the best systems on the market i am sure i cant go wrong. especially when my partner is paying for half of the Elos lol.

Link to comment
  • Replies 95
  • Created
  • Last Reply
Phixon,

This is a common misconception about tempered glass. What most do not realize about tempered glass is it actually weakens the pane at a point that cannot be determined. So while the pane may be stronger as a whole, there is a point on the glass that is weaker and that point if hit will easily break. Beyond that tempering will introduce the inevitable distortion associated with this process. In the past and currently we manufacture aquariums that will be in public areas and for liability reasons, we use laminated glass ( i.e bulletproof glass) instead of tempered glass for this very reason. The bulletproof option will sadly not be available on the System Mini. That was a joke;)

 

Elos, that makes sense from the standpoint of why it'll break when attempted to be drilled. But I honestly can't recall of hearing of a temprered tank that broke from how you describe it would take to break it. Really any glass can do this if hit hard enough at the right spot. But still tempered saves weight along with the cost benefit, and that alone cane be worth the package. Not to say tempered IS the way to go, but it's why the AIOs that use it can benefit. What's this distortion you speak of though? My tank which is tempered is crystal clear, I see more distortion in acrylic than my tank, and acrylic is supposedly clearer than your average aquarium glass. Thank you for the enlightenment and keep up the great products! :)

Link to comment
Sammy, you've been considering the CAD and Elos for months now I've seen, just get the Elos and don't look back! :)

 

I have my order placed, but it sounds like it will be September before it will show up.

 

sammyman, do you realize the price of the elos? Its $1,600 for a 20 gal tank. I'd say that's a bit steep no matter how nice it is.

 

If it were me I'd go with the CAD 39, its a great looking tank IMHO (but I'm a fan of the curved front glass).

 

$1600 is a lot, but if you look at the Elos minus the price of the light, you get the price of the CAD or Solana... Only difference is the Elos tank looks absolutely amazing, while the other tanks look "good". I would rather pay more for a tank I can show off, then a crappy tank I am embarrassed to show in my living room. Plus there is NOTHING that looks half as nice as that LED. Nothing. There are only a handful of good lights that look nice, and they cost about the same as an LED light.

 

Last benefit is I can pick the tank up directly from Jesse without paying for shipping.

Link to comment
FYI: all of the Cubes JBJ, Bio-cube, Aqua-Pod, Solana, CAD, Elos etc. are not made of tempered glass because of safety hazards of potentially having the whole panel or tank completely exploding. i read up on the Finnex being tempered glass all around and was always wondering why they would build it that way, but hopefully nothing like that would happen to anyone.

 

i can't explain why the entire tank is tempered, I'm sure it has to do with the whole cost/weight thing. Only Finnex (and Ron there?) knows. =/ I'm not complaining though. I have never heard of a Finnex glass tank that broke after being setup. They had many issues with tanks arring broken due to horrible shipping. CAD experienced this too, though not as badly I do belive. I would hold half the fault in Finnex for possibly not packing the tanks right, the other half with the shippers of course. Shippers all the way in CADs defense. I know if I got like a way long 90g+ tank, I'd only temper the bottom. Honestly I heard of more mishaps with the Cube AIOs having glass issues thank others, that mainly due to the original NCs being 2mm glass or something rediculous like that. Aquapods were always 3mm, at least the 12g model was and that still is almost paper thin. Factor in imbalanced unlevel stands (user error, not manufactoring error), and it's a recipe for disaster.

 

In any event, with a good tank, UV is not needed. Most farm systems and experienced reefer systems I know of don't use it, nor have they ever. I've always read up that UV is only needed once you have a problem, no use to have it when one isn't present. Of any local reefers I know, I'm the only one that even employs one, that being I got it for purpose to clean up my water. If one can keep a tank clean without needing UV, than all the better. The less you need to intervene, is always the better. It's good to have when you need it though.

Link to comment
i am still learning so i cant say i am any expert, but just not as dumb as Phixion arrogantly thinks i or any other lower post count ppl am.

 

Any huh? PLEASE show me where I have said that, if you can do ONE thing, please prove me where I have said this. I know you can't because it's never been said. Talk like this will yield you more comments like MasterBuilder's, and yield you less respect by people like UrchinHead whom probably doesn't have terrible much respect for you off the bat anyways. He has a fraction of my amount of posts, but he's a far superior reefer than I am. So you are INCORRECT as I greatly value most other member's presence on here, and most have lower counts than me. I welcome eager newbies, just not trolls like yourself. ;) Don't hate me because you messed up stating blatant lies and ludicris opinions and I called you out and others are now as well. Someone that shuns members with a lesser post count? That's the dumbest thing I've heard of, and conveniently it came out of your words, LMFAO!

 

I have my order placed, but it sounds like it will be September before it will show up.

 

 

Last benefit is I can pick the tank up directly from Jesse without paying for shipping.

 

Gives you good time to start planning it out! :) Good luck with it, Sammy!

Link to comment
masterbuilder

Hey...what I said has nothing with post count...gezzzzzz. If the greatest reefer in the world joined up today and had just one post I would listen as I am sure other would. It’s quite obvious to even an intermediate reefer like me, when these so called experts are full of hot air or actually know what they are talking about. I have made many wrong statements here and I am sure I will make more...but...when someone corrects my mistakes I TRY to either shut up or say...you may be right (I am not always successful doing this). NOT spend 3 pages attempting to prove myself right and launching personal attacks. Like I said earlier....in my short time here, quite a few have come in like this and very shortly are gone. Good luck Martini, hope your new tank makes you as happy as some of ours have.

Link to comment

A question:

 

Does the $1600.00 price tag some here have mentioned include the LED light and stand? That price was for the 20g system, correct?

 

I am not truly in the market for an ELOS yet, but I will be. I decorate with prints, but someday, i'll start collecting original paintings ;)

 

As for the design of the UV unit pictured above... OMG that is the crappiest and most hazardous piece of reefing gear I have seen in awhile. Does that thing "work" the way it looks like it does? Do you just plop that thing in your sump/AIO?

 

Lawsuit...

waiting...

to happen!

Link to comment
A question:

 

Does the $1600.00 price tag some here have mentioned include the LED light and stand? That price was for the 20g system, correct?

 

I am not truly in the market for an ELOS yet, but I will be. I decorate with prints, but someday, i'll start collecting original paintings ;)

 

Yes it comes with the LED and stand, but the price is going up on August 7th around $200! I collect art too btw. Both are fun hobbies.

Link to comment
martiniReef
i can't explain why the entire tank is tempered, I'm sure it has to do with the whole cost/weight thing. Only Finnex (and Ron there?) knows. =/ I'm not complaining though. I have never heard of a Finnex glass tank that broke after being setup. They had many issues with tanks arring broken due to horrible shipping. CAD experienced this too, though not as badly I do belive. I would hold half the fault in Finnex for possibly not packing the tanks right, the other half with the shippers of course. Shippers all the way in CADs defense. I know if I got like a way long 90g+ tank, I'd only temper the bottom. Honestly I heard of more mishaps with the Cube AIOs having glass issues thank others, that mainly due to the original NCs being 2mm glass or something rediculous like that. Aquapods were always 3mm, at least the 12g model was and that still is almost paper thin. Factor in imbalanced unlevel stands (user error, not manufactoring error), and it's a recipe for disaster.

 

In any event, with a good tank, UV is not needed. Most farm systems and experienced reefer systems I know of don't use it, nor have they ever. I've always read up that UV is only needed once you have a problem, no use to have it when one isn't present. Of any local reefers I know, I'm the only one that even employs one, that being I got it for purpose to clean up my water. If one can keep a tank clean without needing UV, than all the better. The less you need to intervene, is always the better. It's good to have when you need it though.

 

i am not sure why Finnex would do that either. but if it was because of shipping then it would make sense because tempered glass when supported all around will be stronger when the whole panel is impacted. but by doing that it makes the tank stronger as a whole panel but weaker upon impact of individual spots. it makes it more dangerous especially if you have it in high traffic areas. i read up of the shipping too and they have packed those things super tight now and much less damage.

 

UVs are great to kill off pathogens and parasites but a very well kept reef tank will actually build up its own resistance to many diseases and parasites. the only thing that the UVs do is mainly to provide prevention and peace of mind especially when you have invested thousands of dollars into livestock or a novice. natural of course is the best but its also the most difficult. so that why i prefer to run the UVs no matter if you are a novice or experienced reefer. in NY every tank "fish only" or "full reef" use UV systems.

 

SPS20: the UV is placed under the skimmer which has flap to completely cover up the UV rays with a background. so its totally safe if you use it the way it is intended. so unless you take it out of the tank and turn it on, its going to be fine. conventional closed UVs can have the same problems when turned on out of water, they can tend to heat up and melt some of the internal components.

Link to comment
martiniReef

oh my mistake "almost" every reef or fish only system.

 

hey Sammy what kind of art are you into?

 

i love anything contemporary!

Link to comment
SPS20: the UV is placed under the skimmer which has flap to completely cover up the UV rays with a background. so its totally safe if you use it the way it is intended. so unless you take it out of the tank and turn it on, its going to be fine. conventional closed UVs can have the same problems when turned on out of water, they can tend to heat up and melt some of the internal components.

 

How is contact time controlled?

 

What measures are taken to ensure no direct exposure to UV rays?

 

What measures are taken to protect the silicone seals, and any exposed arylic?

 

Just dropping a UV bulb into the sump/reservoir is piss-poor design, and not shielding it at all is borderline criminally negligent.

 

As for the contention that "most" reefs use UV, that is just flat-out untrue. UV has its place for certain types of problems, but it a widely depricated technology, and generally considered in the hobby to be a band-aid fix to underlying problems. Proper quarantine practices and nutrient control make such measures unnecessary.

 

Sorry for the argumentative tone, but there are some rather unfounded assertions being tossed around here.

Link to comment
martiniReef

nah u dont have to apologize SPS. well from what i have seen in person you really cant see the UV at all until you totally take out the skimmer which has 2 flaps that cover up the whole UV unit. it is all the way on the bottom and also it is surrounded by black acrylic from the front and back also. i have also PMed other members here and their own forum about it and nobody ever had a problem with any of the light escaping out of the sump area. there is also an external shut-off switch so that you can shut it off before taking it out. but also some people chose not to use it at all since they have had reef tanks for many years without it. i have had outbreaks in the past where i first lose the fish due to parasites and then the ammonia jumps up, then i lose almost everything else. its sad and after that just at least as a preventative, i keep a UV.

 

for any tank that is larger than 75G that i have seen, they all have UV sterilizers and at least 90% of the stores that i go to recommend them too. for a nano i guess it isnt as necessary because it is much easier to "over-filter" the tank, but it definitely wont hurt to have one anyway.

Link to comment
nah u dont have to apologize SPS. well from what i have seen in person you really cant see the UV at all until you totally take out the skimmer which has 2 flaps that cover up the whole UV unit. it is all the way on the bottom and also it is surrounded by black acrylic from the front and back also.

 

for any tank that is larger than 75G that i have seen, they all have UV sterilizers and at least 90% of the stores that i go to recommend them too. for a nano i guess it isnt as necessary because it is much easier to "over-filter" the tank, but it definitely wont hurt to have one anyway.

 

That is exactly what gets damaged on the CADs from the UV exposure. Plastic flaps will NOT survive constant 24/7 UV exposure for more than year. This is proven fact just from a common sense standpoint. Think about anything plastic that sits out in the sun day after day after day...

 

I can count on one hand (maybe two) how many tanks I know of that run UV, and 95% of the farm systems I know of locally (we're talking 1000+ gallon systems) DO NOT employ UV in their arsenol. SP20 is correct, UV is ultimately only a band-aid to a deeper underlaying problem. If you need UV, then you have a problem that needs to be addressed. It's like cyano, sure Chemi-Clean will fix it right quick, but if the root cause of it isn't fixed, it'll return. The biggest con to using UV is the heat issue. No one wants to add extra unwanted heat into a tank, plus in some cases beneficial bacteria can be wiped out along with the bad stuff.

Link to comment
martiniReef

hey Phixion its another common misconception. the UV sterilizer is lined with quartz first and then its Acrylic flaps not soft plastic that is exposed to UV. Acrylic does not fail under sunlight. it discolors and can warp from both the heat and UV, but it wont fail. the acrylic they use also looks like about 1/4 thick so thats plenty of protection. also and 6W is not an awfully high amount of UV lighting.

 

the UV is lined with 4 sides of glass with black covering and then the skimmer sits on top of the UV with 2 Acrylic flaps that cover any light that can escape. the Drop-in UV has been widely used in Europe and Asia for many years.

 

maybe its us here in NY but the most commonly used system is biological, skimming and UV (3-step filtration). farm systems typically use UVs based on what they are captively keeping so some have it and some dont. also outdoor farms usually keep hardier fish and since it is outdoors there are some UV rays that contacts the livestock. not to mention commercial UVs are very high priced and most farms will rather avoid the use of it because of that not because they totally dont need it. if UVs are cheaper then i am sure alot more will have them hooked up.

 

you should do periodic maintenance on the aquarium regardless if you have or dont have a UV. like i said before, UVs are preventative and avoidance of disease outbreaks NOT the only solution. you should know that in this hobby there is at least 100 ways to do the same thing.

Link to comment
i love anything contemporary!

 

Well since we are already way off topic ;) I collect street artists like Shepard Fairey, Banksy, Faile etc. Those are my top 3 right now.

Link to comment
martiniReef

street art is awesome! they have it here in NYC on some Sundays here artists display their art pieces openly. its really cool.

 

i really LOVE the new Asian contemporary art scene recently, definitely one of the rage going on here in the city. there is superb Asian art here in Williamsburg many Japanese artists have settled and work there.

 

there are many but one that sticks in my mind is Midori Umemura.

Link to comment

Plastic does fail under continuous exposure, I've experienced it with stuff exposed to day in and day out sunlight. It might be cheap plastic, but it'll crack and break over time. The quartz sleeve doesn't deture from this, as it's purpose is to shield the bulb itself from the water and salt, it's not by ANY means a UV blocker, that would defeat the purpose of the sterilizer to begin with, now wouldn't it. ;) You really need to think your answers through before submitting them. There is no getting around the fact that ANYTHING in the chamber the CAD UV tube is in, is going to suffer from it's powerful rays and exposure. I guarantee you none of the CAD tank itself is UV shielded from it's light, that would just up the tanks price even further if so. You ever leave a rubber band or ANY rubber out in the sun? I gets brittle, then it'll start cracking and eventually dissinegrate all together. Yes plastic will discolor in sun, but so will about almost anything, including metal. That's just the first indication that the UV is attacking it, but after discoloration comes physical damage. Even the plastic inside cars can take the UV beatdown for so long. But the UV blocking windows most cars now come with can only block out so much of it for so long.

Link to comment
martiniReef

OMG do i really have to explain this again and again Phixion? you just wont quit, is it that you cant sleep at night until someone just gives up and say YES phixion you are right and i am dumb? just read what i wrote already in the past posts. now do you know what i mean when i say you are arrogant? and thanks for enlightening me cause now i know it is not based on mine or your post count.

 

look at conventional UV sterilizers (coralife twist, Current, aqua-ultraviolet etc) all of the UVs are sleeved in a quartz tube which keeps the UV bulbs dry. and then to shield the UV rays from the outside they use PLASTIC or PVC (not even acrylic, which is far superior in material). this is why so many new designs in windows now are made of Acrylic.

 

the ONLY materials that is SHIELDING the UV rays is the GLASS and ACRYLIC (not rubber bands)which are both UV resistant in the CAD tanks. also why do you keep bringing up the sun and sun exposure? thats totally not the same as UV sterilizers. theres much more that make up sunlight than there is making up aquarium UV sterilizers and much more factors that come into play which makes the weathering of most materials under prolonged sun exposure. you make it sound like this 6W drop-in UV is as strong as the Viper or something.

 

i think there are much more important things to worry about like a tank that is made up of 100% tempered glass for (safety?)

 

sorry Sammyman this guy is like those zombies in resident evil that keeps coming.

Link to comment

UV is UV, doesn't matrter if it's a bulb or the sun, did you not pay attention in school or have you not gotten that far yet? :rolleyes:

 

Proof that the tank material in the CAD is UV resistant? You never prove ANY of my questions asked to you as wrong. In fact you never answer them at all, which only concludes one thing, you're answer or the answer you know, is not in your favor. ;)

Link to comment
martiniReef

yeah phixion i never graduated from HS lol

 

the CAD tanks are made of glass and Acrylic. what do you need me to prove? is that too hard for you to understand that glass and Acrylic is UV resistant? what surrounds the UV is Glass and Acrylic. maybe 4X's the charm, the UV is encased in a glass and acrylic that shields the UV from exposure and filters the light within the area under the protein skimmer. oh yeah Glass is the #1 material to stand up against all UV rays and even Gamma from sunlight. Acrylic is second and plastics are fine but its nothing compared to Acrylic and glass. clear enough Bro?

 

if you put it that way then nothing in this world is UV resistant including glass and Acrylic which will hold up for about 150 years until the sun will beat it with enough UV rays for it to fail and Acrylic will break down from the sun exposure after about 105 years. which is way longer than a fish tank will be running.

 

UV is UV? thats definitely not the smartest thing to say. because (take out your textbook kids) UV rays are separated in 3 categories UVa UVb and UVc rays. sunlight also has something called Gamma rays which will really EFF you up if you have too much exposure to it (like the incredible hulk). UV sterilizers in aquariums dont have all that dude nor does it need it to kill parasites and all them goodies. so the materials that the CAD tanks are more than safe to use with the UV.

 

questions? what question you asked was relevant? the rubber band one? or the one that everything will eventually deteriorate with enough sunlight exposure? i provided all answers to your questions, you just have to open your mind and read it.

 

hey Phixion do you wanna start a new thread where we go at it non-stop?

Link to comment

LOL Incredible Hulk..i'm gonna try that and hopefully i can get buffed enough before the summer is over.

 

 

i have had the 39G Signature for about 6 months now and everything is working just fine. never needed to mod anything or had to buy extra filter parts, everything is built very solid. the UV is TOTALLY hidden so theres no worries there and i believe it works because i havent had any Red algaes or Parasites since i started my tank. not even a little bit of slime at all. the only thing i had to do extra was i had to get a few extra sponges to filter out some of the microbubbles from the skimmer which was very easy. the lighting is AWESOME and the tank is a beauty. all in all its a SUPER design and you will definitely love it.

 

hey Martini: Phixion is a pretty cool guy, very knowledgeable and helpful too. i do agree that he tends to have alot of negative things to say about the CADs even though he only has experience with the Finnex.

Link to comment
hey Martini: Phixion is a pretty cool guy, very knowledgeable and helpful too. i do agree that he tends to have alot of negative things to say about the CADs even though he only has experience with the Finnex.

 

X3 understands. We've had our moments, but we've put our differances aside and can converse humbley. :) I never see a Finnex owner that CAD bashes, but there's lots of CAD owners (or supporters) that Finnex bash that I've come across, so why not intorduce something new? :P But seriously, I don't dislike CAD as I keep and will always say. I will bash the Signature aspect however. I can't remember who it was (I want to say Rehype, but I don't think it was him) that had UV related damage to their Cad 34g Sig tank that was caused directly from the POS drop-in UV they give with the kit. Someone on here posted about it, and warned the 39g buyers of this and why not to use it. I don't make this stuff up, it's there but just has to be found. Do you recall reading of it X3?

 

hey Phixion do you wanna start a new thread where we go at it non-stop?

 

Not really, because that be both a waste of NR's and my time. Obviously you have too much time on your hands to even suggest it. :rolleyes:

Link to comment

i honestly dont know. they have been using this UV since the first Signature series 2 years ago. the only change i see is that it used to be blue and now it is black, but same wattage same size and everything. they at least sold 500-600 of these i would guess if only for the Signatures and not even sold separately. if there is a problem, there definitely would be more commotion. mine is running just fine. i change my AquaUltraviolet unit and when you take it out as far as the bulb or the quartz sleeve, there really isnt too much difference aside from size. its a very simple design but it definitely works and is safe.

 

yeah we had our moments mostly because of the price of the Signature, Phixion argues it is too high and i say it is great priced for all the stuff they give. did you see the price of it now? its $700 even with all the previous stuff and the new ATO (which i ordered for 20 bucks). the Finnex 30G is selling for the same price Phixion. thats pretty high dont you think especially when you need to replace that bad skimmer.

 

 

that thing about the tempered glass is very true because i ran into the same concerns when i custom built my 300G tank in the basement. my tank builder decided to go with a full 3/4" non-tempered glass with mitered edges for all the panels rather than tempering it. it was a concern that my tank builder told me about.

 

yeah a cage match on NR is not really a good idea, though imagine all the views LOL. i'll organize and take bets :)

Link to comment

X3, perhaps the owner didn't place it properly, but they reported degration damage to the back walls of their tank (NOT the glass, but the plastic/acrylic parts) which they said was caused from the constant exposure from the sterilizer. As a side note since some here SO technical, the UV sterilizers we use emit UVC rays. Here's a quote from Wiki on UVC:

 

UVC rays are the highest energy, most dangerous type of ultraviolet light. Little attention has been given to UVC rays in the past since they are filtered out by the atmosphere. However, their use in equipment such as pond sterilization units may pose an exposure risk, if the lamp is switched on outside of its enclosed pond sterilization unit.

 

Since the Cad one isn't shielded, I would definitely not want to risk using it merely from the HEALTH risk standpoint. But with your's X3, are you saying you replace the lamp itself, or the whole unit when it expires? You are right that if it was an issue, there would indeed be more commotion. I went through all the CAD threads (of people with them) and I couldn't find the post I saw, but I remember it well because I had commented on it (of course) when it was posted.

 

Where did you price the Finnex tank out at? Because on OceanReelfections, it's $589 for the 250w MH model, which is still $110 less than the current sale price of the 39G CAD Sig. I still feel they should option the fan and UV and the standard tank be without those to better cater it to the masses like, lower it's price and have the best all around bang for buck tank they did when the 34g was available. It would be well worth $500 or even $550 minus the fan and UV. Their price of $40 for the fan alone is rediculous when others of the same size (probably same manufacture) are half the price out there.

 

How's your's doing BTW?

Link to comment

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recommended Discussions


×
×
  • Create New...