Red Sea Max and Clams?

[rgrav]

Hi all,

 

I am new to salt water tanks, so I decided to go out and get a RSM it looks awsome and I am excited. I understand I have alot to do before I can add livestock, but after looking at some of the pic's of clams I think they are beautiful. My question is does the RSM have the right amount of lighting to keep a clam? Thanks for helping a noob.

[StevieT]

It seems to have the correct amount. I know other poeple that are running the RSM with clams. They will do better towards the top closer to the light but i have seen them in the sand and they look fine. I wish my clams would actually show up so I could give you first hand knowldge (i have been waiting since october!)

 

I am running SPS and other higher light demanding corals in my RSM, all with new growth and I have no issues. The RSM has very bright T5 lighting, i am satisifed with their choice.

 

Check out my signature which will lead you to my thread for ideas and problem solutions.

[spanko]

Ah yes grasshopper, time to start your learning adventure. First tell me what kind of lighting does it have? This is a test.

[StevieT]

Ah yes grasshopper, time to start your learning adventure. First tell me what kind of lighting does it have? This is a test.

 

looks like I gave him the answer, haha

[spanko]

Damn!

[Urchinhead]

I have a clam in my RSM. I will post pictures most likely Monday as I am a bit concerned that he is hyperextending but from all I have talked to IRL they say he is doing fine. He hasn't shifted, his color is good, and he responds quickly to movement and shadows then re-extends. So I think it can be done if they are high up. Mine is in the top 1/3 of the tank.

 

FH2

[shiveley]

I've had a Derasa clam in my RSM for about 4 months and he's pretty much doubled in size, so I think he's doing very well. They only issue with him is that he will eventually outgrow this tank...

[Jaybugg13]

Do a search you will find less optimistic responses.

 

http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=114475 See here for answers.

[stan-o]

I've had a Derasa clam in my RSM for about 4 months and he's pretty much doubled in size, so I think he's doing very well. They only issue with him is that he will eventually outgrow this tank...

 

I have a derasa as well, he's been in mine for about 3 months, seems to be fine, color looks good, but he does move himself around a bit.....what does that tell you?

 

I'm probably going to upgrade my lights for christmas to 150Watt HQI ( 20k ) so I can keep maximas and higher end sps's.

 

Stan-O

[basser1]

While I don't own a RSM, I do have a 29 gallon BioCube. What type of lighting you have will determine what type of clam you can keep. The general consensus is T5 isn't strong enough, except for less light demanding clams, like deresas. If you're looking at croceas or maximas you'll most likely need MH lighting.

 

I upgraded my hood and retro-fitted a 150 watt 14k MH, from nanotuners, in it. I have a 3 1/2" maxima placed on the rocks, and it is doing great!

 

Here is a link for a good source of info on clams and their requirements:

 

http://www.clamsdirect.com/

[masterbuilder]

I say no, with the stock lights. You may have short term sucess...but in the long term?

[Urchinhead]

Do a search you will find less optimistic responses.

 

http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=114475 See here for answers.

 

Yeah. I read this. To me it was ultimately inconclusive. It had a strong anecdotal bias towards MH lighting as the author seemed to only have experience with them under MH. I also saw quite a few posts that had anecdotal evidence contraindicating the need for MH.

 

Same deal on a general web search. I saw the gambit ranging from definitely needs strong MH to only needing stock PC lighting. Pretty much every one came down to something along the lines of "I had a clam for X time under Y lights and they only do well under that kind of lighting and you are a fool for doing otherwise!" or "No! You are wrong! I had a clam X time under Z lights and it did fine!" Regardless they were all anecdotal statements based on personal experience.

 

No where did I see anything even remotely close to a unbiased study of lighting in artificial reef systems as it related to husbandry of clams. I did run across several government funded articles on clam husbandry from a commercial perspective, a whole lot of "I have one and it did fine under X" crap, and the following from Wetwebmedia which seems to be one of the sources considered "reliable" in terms of information.

 

Taken from: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ca/volume_4/V4I...GotTridacna.htm

 

Quote:

"What I think happened to clams in the public mind set is that the light requirements of certain clams became generalized to be ‘common knowledge’ for the husbandry of all clams.

 

This can’t be farther from the truth because clams exist along a rather wide continuum regarding their needs for light. Derasa, squamosa, and gigas clams have the wonderful perk of being much less light needy and can be successfully kept in tanks 12-14 inches in depth or so under power compact lighting that is also capable of sustaining compatible coral life. T5 high output lights are also proving to be viable and less expensive options than metal halide for the successful husbandry of these beautiful creatures...

 

Tridacna crocea:

 

Middle to high up in your rockwork depending on color intensity of mantle

Stable footing

Moderate to higher flow

Live Rock if possible

Away from any potentially shading corals

T-5s, Metal Halide

10k bulbs fine

Relatively easy to keep though needs more light than bottom dwellers

Look for clams greater than 2 inches

Loves live plankton if possible

 

Tridacna maxima:

 

Middle to high up in your rockwork depending on color intensity of mantle

Stable footing

Moderate to higher flow

T-5s, Metal Halide

10k bulbs fine

Live Rock if possible

Away from any potentially shading corals

Relatively difficult to keep, hardest to keep of all the clams, imo

Look for clams greater than 2 inches

Loves live plankton if possible

 

Tridacna derasa:

 

Place on small piece of rock for ease of movement if needed

Do not place directly in sand- clam will blow away sand and attach to glass on bottom

Moderate flow

Power compacts, T-5s, Metal Halide

10k bulbs fine

Relatively easy to keep, actually harder to kill

Look for clams greater than 2 inches

Loves live plankton if possible

Leave room around the corals for lots of growth!!

 

Tridacna squamosa:

 

Place on small piece of rock for ease of movement if needed

Do not place directly in sand- clam will blow away sand and attach to glass on bottom

Moderate flow

Relatively easy to keep

Power compacts, T-5s, Metal Halide

10k bulbs fine

Look for clams greater than 2 inches

Loves live plankton if possible

Leave room around the clam for lots of growth!!

 

Tridacna gigas:

 

Place on small piece of rock for ease of movement if needed

Do not place directly in sand- clam will blow away sand and attach to glass on bottom

Moderate flow

Power compacts, T-5s, Metal Halide

10k bulbs fine

Relatively easy to keep

Look for clams greater than 2 inches

Loves live plankton if possible

Leave LOTS of room around the clam for lots of growth!

" End Quote.

 

From Natural Marine Aquarium - Reef Invertebrates by Anthony Calfo, Robert Fenner, Steven Pro:

 

Quote:

"Lighting requirements for Tridacnids is rather akin to lighting necessary for popular species of shallow water so-called SPS corals. Their needs may be regarded as moderate to bright... Under illuminated clams will change color: often darkening at fist in an attempt to cultivate more zooxanthellae with the purpose of trying to capture more of the diminished available light energy. In advanced states, such clam's color will pale as zooxanthellae are expelled under duress by the starving animal. Supplemental feeding of dissolved nutrients may stave off or delay the inevitable. Under-illuminated clams may survive in captivity for many months or even more than a year before perishing 'mysteriously' (a mystery only to the aquarist that does not realize that illumination was waning or inadequate).

 

Most clams are best kept under high intensity bulbs like metal halide lighting... A 175 watt lamp per for square feet will serve the purpose nicely in a water 20"-30" deep. Fluorescent lighting of various formats (PC, VHO) is fine and aesthetically attractive for shallow water environments less than 24" deep. When fluorescent lighting is utilized, clam/s should usually be placed in the top 18" of water."

End Quote

 

So with all that said it seems that it is possible to keep a clam(s) including T. Crocea under PC lighting if the clam is above 19" in the tank. For deeper than 19" it seems that one needs to look at MH.

 

Let the arguments begin and the fur fly!

[Phixion]

FishHead, good info. Please add it to the Clam thread that's linked.

 

First things first, Stan-O, a moving clam generally means an UNhappy clam. They only move when they aren't happy has ben my general experience with clams. I had one once (A "4 crocea) that kept detaching itself from the rock it was given to me on, and kept FALLING onto the sand below, about a good "6 drop... Not good when it lands top down first. After relocating it, it firmly attached itself never to fall again. I currently have 4 clams in my tank, 2 croceas firmly mounted on the rocks, and a maxima and derasa, both currently in the sand. Both of those are also on the move almost daily. Not sure if it's light or flow that they aren't happy with... Lighting in my tank is 4x24w T5HO with individual reflectors on the daylights, plenty lighting many have told me for the clams I have. I've read articles in Tropical Reef Hobbiest magazine recently about both crocea clams and derasa clams and care and other info on them(seperate articles each...)

 

To the RSM owners, is the 110w T5 lighting TRUE T5 lighting, or is it PC lighting? Remember that T5 ONLY corallates to bulb diameter size, not an actual type of bulb. PC is a bit differant from straight T5 bulbs...

[spanko]

So many variables to these creatures and their husbandry. Distance from light, spectrum loss from age of bulb, size of creature and feeding necessity, water condition, species selection kelvin rating etc.etc.etc.

Sometimes we read and learn as much as we can about a creature and at some point decide we have enough information to make a move. However in the end the variables listed above and the fact that we are trying to do it in a closed system and the variables that go along with that are either with us or against us.

I think we all do the best we can and are rewarded for our efforts or shot in the butt.

Tough hobby. But I love it and will keep doing it until I get to a point where my tank gives me and the inhabitants pleasure enough to sit back and enjoy without the worrying that comes and goes along the way.

[StevieT]

The RSM has TRUE T5 lighting. The connections are different then the classic T5 lighting most of us use. PC lighting is T6 while RSM's is PC T5's, the bulb diameter is smaller than PC making it ture T5.

 

Per RSM web site. I have owned PC and now these T5's, they are dead on with their description.

 

 

Q: Why are the Max light tubes called T5 power compacts?

A: Regular power compact lighting has a tube diameter of 6/8”, which is known as T6. T5 tubes haves a smaller diameter (5/8”) and produce a higher intensity output. The T5s used in the MAX are custom made power compacts that enable us to provide 55 watts of light in a smaller footprint than the equivalent (2 x 24 W) regular T5 tubes would provide. Regular power compact are often powered by magnetic ballasts, but the MAX T5 power compacts are powered by an electronic ballast to guarantee consistent high performance.

[Phixion]

I guess it's debatable (or not?) but to me I'd think that PC is PC no matter if T6 or T5 variant...

 

For clam success and happiness, don't forget to factor in water flow/movement, that's another important factor.

[Urchinhead]

So many variables to these creatures and their husbandry. Distance from light, spectrum loss from age of bulb, size of creature and feeding necessity, water condition, species selection kelvin rating etc.etc.etc.

Sometimes we read and learn as much as we can about a creature and at some point decide we have enough information to make a move. However in the end the variables listed above and the fact that we are trying to do it in a closed system and the variables that go along with that are either with us or against us.

I think we all do the best we can and are rewarded for our efforts or shot in the butt.

Tough hobby. But I love it and will keep doing it until I get to a point where my tank gives me and the inhabitants pleasure enough to sit back and enjoy without the worrying that comes and goes along the way.

 

Yep. Spot on.

 

I have a clam.

 

I promised myself that the moment I thought that it was doing poorly I would give it to someone who could give it a good home. So far it isn't 'overmantling'*, bleaching, moving, or darkening its color. It does fully extend its mantle which I am told is a good sign actually and responds quickly to movement and shadow.

 

Attached is a photo. Please tell me if it is a 'sick' clam or not. If viewed from the top down instead of side on like in the photo I include the colors are a electric green to electric blue not just the dark blue to electric blue you will see in the photo. By the way this photo was taken a few hours after my weekly tank maintenance window so the glass hasn't been Windexed yet (got into a bit of a row with my wife and hadn't finished things up properly ) and the particulate matter you see in there is reef chili(?) as well as marine snow as it was feeding time.

 

FH2

 

* I also looked into this concept of overmantling or hyperextending. It again appears to be a 'common wisdom' thing that doesn't actually correlate to a symptom of poor health status of the clam. As a matter of fact it is considered a sign of a healthy clam as it relates to light. If it fully extends its mantle then it is healthy as long as said mantle is not bleached in color or darkening.

[spanko]

It looks nice to me. Here is mine.

[Urchinhead]

I guess it's debatable (or not?) but to me I'd think that PC is PC no matter if T6 or T5 variant...For clam success and happiness, don't forget to factor in water flow/movement, that's another important factor.

Yep. I did the hydor mod to my output and now the clam gets a squirt of water over it every cycle. It seems pretty happy at this. Now a question. In about a month or three I would like to add a few more clams. A few being two to three 3"-4" ones. Specifically to the same general area this one is. Will they go well together or will I need to locate them at different points? The look I am going for is kind of a 'clam cluster' if you will. I say a month or three because I want the tank to be fully stabilized and happy before I do so and that to me means 4 straight consecutive weeks of param. tests that show stability after additions, modifications, and the like. I just added some green finger coral, a red blasto, added a pair of clowns, and moved stuff all over the place so I am expecting some variation in readings for a few weeks while things settle down.FH2

It looks nice to me. Here is mine.

Nice. A bit worried about your urchin... I remember in my reading that long spines can stab the clam by accident...FH2

[spanko]

Hmmmmm.......have to try to watch that. In the pic the urchin is about 2.5" higher than the clam on that rock. Not sayin that the urchin with all it's movement couldn't get it though. Thanx for the heads up.

[shiveley]

all I can say about this is that my clam has been in my RSM for several months, has grown substantially, exhibits very nice coloration, and displays no signs of gaping or pinched mantle...take that however you want, but from my experience I feel that the stock RSM lighting is fine for a Derasa....but I probably wouldn't push my luck with a Crocea or Maxima, as they tend to have much higher light requirements.