24 gallon Atlantis

[plyr58]

As far as Algone goes, I don't know how it clarifies water, only that it does. It can be used with activated carbon for aquarium maintenance (for Algae removal and water clarification), and I can only tell you that I did a little experiment by removing the Algone for 3 weeks, and my water was significantly more cloudy. I put an Algone packet back in the first chamber of my Nano Cube and in about 36 hours it was basically crystal clear. Just an FYI.

 

Also, as far as Poly-Filters go, check out the fabric section at Wal-Mart or another fabric store. You can get polyester batting for about $4.00 a roll for a 45"x60"x1/4" thick. You can cut this to any shape, stack it, whatever and throw it away when it gets dirty (and it is a whole lot cheaper then Poly-Filters.)

[tinyreef]

Also, as far as Poly-Filters go, check out the fabric section at Wal-Mart or another fabric store. You can get polyester batting for about $4.00 a roll for a 45"x60"x1/4" thick. You can cut this to any shape, stack it, whatever and throw it away when it gets dirty (and it is a whole lot cheaper then Poly-Filters.)

you're thinking of polyester fiber/floss. good for particulate/mechanical filtering but different than Poly-Filters (bland sounding name, i know). for instance, Pura pads sounds better and more distinctive.

 

Poly-Filters is an ionic media. it's basically a medium (supposedly) already bonded to nsw levels so anything above that is adsorbed. that's just what i was told. not sure how it works either but i know it can filter out certain metals and reflect that buildup as color changes.

 

the manufacturer (Poly-Bio-Marine) actually uses the media in their alternative to RO filters (Kold Stiril or something like that). supposedly it works on par with RO but i'm not 100% convinced on that.

 

Poly-Filters is just their uber-expensive per-piece retail screw-us pricing/packaging. *sigh*

[plyr58]

I understand what you are saying about Poly-Filters. Never used them myself, but if they work as advertized I can see the benefit.

 

On another note, I did not mention this in my earlier post about activated charcoal out of fear of being flamed, but here we go. You can actually recycle activated charcoal with nothing more than tap water and Prime and a some RO water. My local water is chlorinated, and I use it to THOROUGHLY rinse the charcoal when I remove it from my tank to remove all sediment. Then, I normally soak the Charcoal in the filter bag for 24-48 hours in a solution of Prime and Tap water at double the Recommended dosage of Prime. Finally, immerse in RO water for several hours and then rinse throughly with RO water in the sink, which restores the ionic charge of the carbon. I know it is alot of work to save a few dollars of media, but for the cost conscious I have found it to be effective.

[tinyreef]

hmm, i've never heard of that for re-charging carbon.

 

heating it with low O2 present should also burn off all the crud and return it to "virgin" state. but again, i agree that's a lot of work for a very cheap medium. easier to toss and just refill.

 

Purigen is another wide-spectrum chemical media. not my preferred choice for a couple of reasons but definitely rechargeable (via bleach). yeah, sounds scary and i've frankly never had the balls to do it. there's a number of threads around on it though if anyone's inclined to try.

[megan]

See now, you guys are in it for the love of the game. I'd just toss that sh*t.

[tinyreef]

See now, you guys are in it for the love of the game. I'd just toss that sh*t.

carbon/floss ~ the toilet paper of reefing

[firstimereefer]

Filtering:

I run 3 chambers of filtering in my nanocube. My first chamber as a polyfill from walmart cheap and works good and trapping particles and detrius. I change it out once a week. In chamber to I run live rock rubble, it acts like a "mini fuge" in essence and ever since I started that I have seen my pod population increase + a good thing. In my third chamber I run a mix of carbon and phosban in a media bag. I have found these three methods to work preatty solidly for over 4 monthes now.

I don't think you need to go out and buy all this expenisve filter stuff for your tank. I did that at one point and I found my cheap and easy method to work the best. As for the polyfil from walmart I put it in a media bag (not overly stuffed) and let it collect all that stuff in the tank. I change out the carbon and phosban every 2-4 weeks as needed (or as I remember).

 

Hands in the tank:

I to was like you in the beginning always putzing around with the tank. I was never happy with it and started losing fish and I could never figure out why. Then I stoppd messing with the tank but once a week to clean it i.e. syphoning and cleaning the algae off. Besides that I just sit back and enjoy my little piece of ocean next to my couch. I do take that back I have to pick up my clam every once in awhile because my nassarius snails are infamous for knocking it over, but thats it.

[megan]

Yeah, it is hard to ballance how often to get in there. B/C of the red algae, I want to remove all waste, and a new mushroom and torch keep moving around on me. I just cleaned the floor a little while ago and don't plan to go in there again until I do a water change at the end of the week. I do want to go to the store today though and get some LR rubble and maybe a carbon pack or the algone pack.

 

Do you think I should be doing more or less than 1 water change per week? I am doing about 6g per change weekly, but I'm thinking maybe I need to let it go a little longer for some stability.

[firstimereefer]

Megan,

I was going back in the thread for some refresfing and I saw you tank is a 24G AC (what brand is AC?) The maximum water change I would do per week at one time is 3 gallons. You only want to do about a 10% water change per any one time. I do about a gallon and a half a week in my 12G. I think 6 gallons at a time is too much and at the early stages of your tank you might be taking too much good stuff out of your tank.

 

p.s THIS IS MY 500TH POST

[megan]

That is crazy!!! I am so flattered!!! Is Kill Switch a band? It sounds familiar.

 

Anyway, that was a typo when I initially gave my equip breakdown. It is a 24g Aqua Pod, not a cube. Yeah, I will back down on the water changes too. I didn't make it to the store today to get the algone pad or charcoal or anything.

 

I did however, find a nudi in my tank! I am totally freaked. I was feelling so lucky that there were no predators or diseases in my tank and now this. I got my first zoas this weekend and well, here we go. Everyone keeps telling me to dip my zoas, but I fail to see what good that will do if there are eggs somewhere. Heck if I'm going to do it myself anyway. That is way too advanced for me. I'll take it back to the store and make them do it!

 

Thanks for checking in on me though! I really appreciate it!

[plyr58]

On my 12 gal. NC I do 2, 1.5 gallon water changes a week, one on Monday and one on Thursday. Firstime is right. That is too much of a water change at once.

[firstimereefer]

Killswitch is a band (heavey metal), I have never dipped my zoas and I probably should have but I have been lucky so far. The dip should kill any eggs as well.

[megan]

So I have added some carbon and had all of my parameters tested. They even looked at my water under a scope and said everything is perfect. If anything, it is a little too clean, b/c my xenia isn't really opening up and filtering. I don't think it is very happy.

 

My new purchases include a blue chalace, a pretty new ricordea, green eggs and ham zoos, a cool yellow/green brain and the store gave me a neon trumpet frag and another giant torch for free. They are always hooking me up! I love that place! On Thurs. they gave me a bunch of snails b/c I was complaining about cyano. I swear this hobby is like crack. Marcye is my dealer!

 

It is looking really good, I'll post some pictures later.

 

BTW, what do you guys think about restructuring my aquascape? I don't love it and I'm starting to get enough stuff that if I'm gonna do it, I should do it now.

 

Has anyone done a major rearrange before and what was the outcome?

[firstimereefer]

I did one major rescaping in my tank. What I did was I took everything out of the tank and drained all the water into a seperate tub where I put all my live stock into with the power head and heater running. Then i did the rescaping and put everything back in. Remember that you and break rocks to get the look you desire, coraline algae will grow over it eventually.

[tinyreef]

My new purchases include a blue chalace, a pretty new ricordea, green eggs and ham zoos, a cool yellow/green brain and the store gave me a neon trumpet frag and another giant torch for free. They are always hooking me up! I love that place!

hmmm, 6 new corals? i'm beginning to sidle over to the side that you're adding/stocking a bit too fast. coral can add bioload, especially when introduced, via their mucus/slime. it's one of the reasons i dislike those 9 for $99 deals out there.

 

i would seriously consider slowing down and letting things settle in, especially since you're also thinking of doing a major re-aquascaping soon. now all these things (livestock additions and re-aquascaping) could go off without a hitch or they could trigger something bad. just voicing an opinion of caution to proceed slowly. good things happen slowly, bad things happen fast.

 

your LFS knows you just started, they should be easing you into livestock. not throwing freebies and such to pump a sale/client.

 

On Thurs. they gave me a bunch of snails b/c I was complaining about cyano.

this really jumped out at me. normally, a cyano problem is dealt with via nutrient limitation, nutrient export, flow dynamics, lighting, etc. the last option (usually) is a snail or other herbivore/bacteriovore (because cyanobacteria is technically a bacteria, not an algae).

 

it could be they steered you to the right snail (only conches feed on cyano on any regular basis afaik) or the snail suggestion was to attack the cyano indirectly via the nutrients before they're processed into snail poop. but again, the waste and potential cyano feedstock (snail poo) is still within the system and even more difficult to breakdown (snail poo is slow to decompose). they've converted the source but not eliminated nor identified it.

 

jmo/hth

[megan]

You are totally right Tiny! Good to see you btw. I think I am good now (how often do I say that?) and I don't think I am going to make any changes to my aquascape. While I think it is terribly boring, my husband says it looks natural like they just fell there. All that work and it looks like they just fell there!

 

Anyway. now I have enough stuff to actually show up when you look in the tank. As you know, I have a 24g, so I needed to spread some stuff out to get any kind of effect at all. I know that I should move slower, and at this point I have to. I am totally out of money!

 

You have raised some good points about the cyano. I know it is just a bacteria, I am surprised by the snail suggestions myself. Maybe b/c they looked at my water under a micro scope the other day and all my perameters were good, they figured this might do the trick. I also syphon out all the poo every week with my water change.

 

Of course I am protective of my store... I am probably driving them (and you) nuts. I can be rather intense, so maybe they have just seen my kind before and know that it is exhausting to argue!

 

Have I seen your tanks? Show me, show me!

[dsoz]

Maybe b/c they looked at my water under a micro scope the other day and all my perameters were good, they figured this might do the trick.

 

Did they explain to you what they were looking for when they put the water under the microscope?

 

I am a biology teacher (and chemistry and physics as well), and I have looked at water under the microscope thousands of times in the course of learning (in college) and teaching high school. Some water has more "life" in it, and some has less. It is NOT an indication of the health of the tank or the water! I even looked at my diatom bloom under a microscope (and posted picks in my tank build thread) What did it tell me? Almost nothing, other than the diatoms are long and pointy.

 

Looking at something under the microscope is not a magical experience. Unless they are experienced in what to look for, most people don't know what all of those things that swim around are, or whether they are good or bad.

 

Some places will use this as a gimmic to make you feel good, like some will test your water before selling you WAY too much stuff. Like Tiny said, too much too fast is BAD! I would not trust an amature microscopist, unless they have had training in microbiology, or as a marine biologist. Furthermore, it is imposible to distinguish bacteria by just "looking" To see them, and tell what they are, they must be fixed and stained.

 

I hope this helps. I too am putting together a tank on a small budget. I almost went with the 24g AP, but I chose to reuse my 15 year old 45g long. It saved me some money to do it this way. I only had to sell one kidney and 5 pints of blood. LOL

 

dsoz

[megan]

Funny that you should call me on that, b/c as I was typing it I was wondering how that could indicate water quality. All in all, she has over 30 years experience and is considered our local marine super hero. She said that the water was clear and there appeared to be ample copepods. They tested all of my parameters and it all looked good.

 

I do think I'm going to stop now and just enjoy watching what I have. I have a problem though, and that is that "moderation" is not a concept I embrace. Yes, this includes drinking, shopping, eating, sleeping, you get the picture.

 

When I decided to give this 24g aquapod to my husband as a gift, I had done no research and expected to pay @ $300 to get going. That was in March and I have spent well over $1200 now. I am also a design freak and very opinionated as to how the decor in the house is set up, so besides the fish obsession (I have had it since I was 5), the design of these new tanks was a total turn on!

[megan]

While my super genius friends are here, what should I do about the cyano? Water changes? I have cut way back on the feedings and I'm running a Maxi 1200. What else can I do?

[tinyreef]

the water quality on a tested level can still be great but inputs could still be outweighing outputs. an example of this would be a tank with significant algae grwoth but registering little to no nutrients.

 

how is this possible? the algae is processing the nutrients as fast as they're released into the water column. i.e. you've got a fully functioning algae scrubber at work, albeit not an aesthetically pleasing one. the cyano could be doing the same thing.

 

it's not enough to just read the tests and go with the zeros, you have to also observe the system and see how everything responds/lives. it's kind of like disturbing an ecosystem on a macro-scale by introducing something non-endemic. you have to really observe how it interacts before saying it's good or invasive and then how to proceed to correct the change or help it or nothing at all.

 

but imo the cyano points to something amiss. nothing catastrophic but also not "normal". it could be as simple as low-flow in a certain area where the cyano's growing (no pic) and the local low O2 is smothering something, which in turn is providing the organic fuel for the cyano. it could be a lighting issue where the lighting is more "red/older" and favoring the cyano's photosynthesis versus other types (corals, coralline, etc.) buti doubt that one. or you could have a dead squished worm somewhere, and so on.

 

the nitrogen test kits only check a small spectrum of what can go wrong and only a small process/cycle (i.e. nitrogen cycle) of the whole ecosystem, albeit a critical one.

 

i'm sure the lfs is knowledgeable but it's a different application sometimes and they sometimes don't realize it or just don't want to acknowledge it.

 

a lfs i respect (there's only one or two local that i do) once told me how he kept his tanks in the store. once i learned his process i was like "wow, that's a lot to do if one wants it do it that way!" his reply was that for him, it was "work". he wasn't there to keep the tank for purely an aesthetic and personal reason. it was business and he expected the workload because that's just how he kept it (superb tanks for invert/filter-feeders/all coral types - but with low-tech hardware). re-aquascaping and tearing down/re-building was simply part of the job/business.

 

so what works for them (devices, procedures, livestock, etc.) may not necessarily be applicable to us, as hobbyists, everytime.

 

as for directly addressing the cyano, i would siphon what amounts i could, keep a careful track of your livestock (head-count), watch the flow dynamics to make sure there aren't dead spots (that doesn't necessarily mean significant flow everywhere), and stand pat on what you have right now. it's very difficult to find the optimal balance point for a system. there's a range but going outside the range is where trouble starts.

 

otoh, you can exceed this or undershoot this (which can be just as problematic imo) by exporting (importing) nutrients thru filtration or manually.

 

i doubt it's a lighting issue because your setup is so new. i'd pursue one of the other possibles and wait and see. could be any number or combination or all.

 

sorry for the dissertation and i definitely don't mean to be lecturing so please don't take it as such. just my observations and opinions so far. hth

[tinyreef]

Have I seen your tanks? Show me, show me!

my gallery (here) shows some of the tanks.

 

i think my current display is also in there. although some of the colorations are really wacky. i tend to run my tanks very blue and it shows up even bluer on pics, photoshop (or me) can't seem to fully correct it but the general theme is still there.

 

i'm hoping to do a larger-scale sunlight tank in the future but right now i've scaled down to just one display tank and a bucket o'water on my desk (no pics of that though).

[plyr58]

If it really really really really really bugs you, there are some products you can get to kill it off, but IMO you should just keep doing what you are doing and ride it out for a while. I know it is ugly, but as long as you keep up with water changes, keep your nutrient levels in the proper ranges, and keep any biological debris possible out of the tank, it will probably go away. When you do your water changes you should siphon off all the cyano you can, and combined with what has been said above, it will clear itself up.

 

Or, you can go the route of the cyano killing products, but again IMO you are just treating the symptoms and not the disease and thus it will probably just come right back.

 

And Tiny, you didnt link to your tanks.

 

Plyr58

[alexmurovec]

any update pictures?

[plyr58]

My newest: 12G Nano Cube DX

 

Some of the pics are older so you can see the diatome bloom I went through. The first FTS is today though. Building it up mainly with frags from the local club/ my frag tank. Coming along slow and steady.

[alexmurovec]

nice torch, has your clown tried to host it?