Completely lost...

[paulojbsilva]

Hi all

I recently got tired of not being able to lower my phosphates and no3...and so I did something really crazy. I took out all the sand, went barebottom, gave my rocks a quick scrub with RO water, and did a 70% water change...all seemed fine for a week or two. Green algae are slowly returning, and I got a TDM meter that went of the chart when testing tank water. Water from RO is totally fine, so I'm kind of lost out here, since phosphates and no3 and rising again. I run a Tunze 9004 24/7 skimming just fine, one circulation pump and LED during 7 hours. Weekly water changes. The live stock is one Xenia (seems happy as hell), one ocellaris, one blue damsel, 3 hermit crabs, 1 ceryth snail and 1 peppermint shrimp. I only have about 15 kg's live rock (that I start to wonder if it was so live as the guy who sold it said), and barebottom tank.

Any ideas? Should I get a small amount of real good live rock and try so seed the rock I have?

Completely lost out here guys...

[Clown79]

Is your tank an aio? If so how often do you clean the back chambers?

 

Do you clean your pumps?

 

Do you use a turkey baster on the rocks?

 

 

What filter media is used?

 

What do you feed and how often/much.

[dandelion]

Using a TDS meter on tank water will certainly give you a number that's through the roof. Don't forget you dissolved a ton of SALT in that water!

[paulojbsilva]

Is your tank an aio? If so how often do you clean the back chambers?

 

Do you clean your pumps?

 

Do you use a turkey baster on the rocks?

 

 

What filter media is used?

 

What do you feed and how often/much.

My tank is not an aio, I do have a sump with a jebao dc 2000 at full speed making the best as she can, eheh.

I do clean my pumps once a month or less. If they look to algae populated, I take them out, disassemble them and clean it thoroughly.

I do not use a turkey baster on the rocks...won't the thing it will blow just stay floating in the water colum?

I have no filter other than the supposed live rock and the skimmer.

I feed the tank once a day with pellets from Sera, and make sure no to overfeed the fish...I honestly get worried they don't get enough. Once a week they get a frozen mix.

Using a TDS meter on tank water will certainly give you a number that's through the roof. Don't forget you dissolved a ton of SALT in that water!

Whow...now I'm feeling pretty dumb...how come I haven't thought of that. So the tds meter will only help to check the RO water, right?

[dandelion]

Yea unfortunately TDS meter can only be used to check if your distilled water or RO/DI is really free of dissolved solids. I sometimes wonder if it can be modded to become a salinity probe.

 

Blasting the rocks can release detritus that are lodged in the rocks. It can then be filled out with filter floss. Consider putting some filter socks in your sump and clean it daily after blasting at the rocks. Consider getting some chemipure elite or purigen too. Phosguard or GFO can also help adsorb phosphate.

 

My tank is not an aio, I do have a sump with a jebao dc 2000 at full speed making the best as she can, eheh.

I do clean my pumps once a month or less. If they look to algae populated, I take them out, disassemble them and clean it thoroughly.

I do not use a turkey baster on the rocks...won't the thing it will blow just stay floating in the water colum?

I have no filter other than the supposed live rock and the skimmer.

I feed the tank once a day with pellets from Sera, and make sure no to overfeed the fish...I honestly get worried they don't get enough. Once a week they get a frozen mix.

Whow...now I'm feeling pretty dumb...how come I haven't thought of that. So the tds meter will only help to check the RO water, right?

[Clown79]

I blast the rocks with a turkey baster before syphoning my waterchange water so that i catch the detritus. The rest is caught by the filter floss.

 

You can add a filter sock or even filter floss to the sump which will collect any particles and detritus in the water. If you use floss it should be changed when it goes brown. Adding some media like purigen, phosguard, or phosban will help.

 

Do you vacuum up any detritus off the barebottom?

[paulojbsilva]

Well...the filter sock is going in today. Tomorrow is water change day, let's see if I can get a turkey baster today. How do you guys run you filter media? You have an external filter or something just for that? Do you use a reactor?

[Clown79]

I know ppl put their media in media bags and throw it in the sump.

[paulojbsilva]

I know ppl put their media in media bags and throw it in the sump.

Ain't that insufficient? I thought you had to use some kind of tumbler/reactor...force the flow trough the media.

Can anyone say if it's enough to just trow it in the sump?

[Biggen]

Ain't that insufficient? I thought you had to use some kind of tumbler/reactor...force the flow trough the media.

Can anyone say if it's enough to just trow it in the sump?

A reactor is ideal for GFO, especially in larger thanks but it's not required. I use media bags for both GFO and GAC (Carbon). I change the carbon out weekly. I haven't been running GFO long enough to determine my change out schedule for that yet.

 

You would want to try and place the media bags where there is water movement. So perhaps place them under the overflow pipe going into your sump.

[Clown79]

No, not everyone uses reactors. Think about all the ppl who use media in hob filters.

 

Hob filters does the same thing as a sump, just a much smaller scale.

 

The media just needs to be in a high flow area.

[paulojbsilva]

Well, that's a plan for tomorrow then! Get me some GFO, and bag it!

Thanks guys. I'll post some updates soon

[paulojbsilva]

Hello everybody!

After talking to the LFS guy (a new guy that seems to be reading the foreign forums, like I do) we came to the conclusion that my live rock is not so live after all...I'm waiting for monday for them to receive real nice live rock, and will get a bit to put in my tank. You guys think that with time it will populate the rest of the rock? Not with bacteria, because I think that those would grow by themselves after a few months, but with other small forms of life (copepods and stuff like that). I haven´t seen even one, in 6 months or so of the supposed live rock in the tank. So I think I'm going trough a cycle of not a few weeks, but a few months until I feel confident enough to get some frags, beside my long living Xenia.

Another addition to the system, was some nice amount of chaetomorpha. Maybe in you countries chaeto is easy to get, in Portugal I had a hard time to get some...let's see how it handles the phosphates and nitrates. Will a 6500k light work with chaeto?

 

Thanks and happy new year everybody.

[Clown79]

The pods have nothing to do with a cycle but adding liverock to an established tank can cause a cycle so be aware that adding liverock thats not cured may cause a mini cycle.

 

In the first few mnths you may not see many pods. It takes time for all these forms of life to grow.

 

Then again the livestock in your tank may be eating them as well.

 

Why not just add pods? What are you trying to achieve?

 

Chaeto is easy to get in canada but most other macro algae isn't. The chaeto will help but it will take time.

[Nola Bear]

Ain't that insufficient? I thought you had to use some kind of tumbler/reactor...force the flow trough the media.

Can anyone say if it's enough to just trow it in the sump?

brs has a couple of good youtube vids on the use of reactor versus an idle bag of media. Be sure that whatever you do, there is sufficient flow and export heavy until you get the tank where you want it. +1 on the Turkey Baster, adn baste you rocks each water change. Water changes are imo the most important part of solid husbandry.

[burtbollinger]

 

Why not just add pods? What are you trying to achieve?

 

 

its unclear what you are trying to do exactly.

[paulojbsilva]

The pods have nothing to do with a cycle but adding liverock to an established tank can cause a cycle so be aware that adding liverock thats not cured may cause a mini cycle.

 

In the first few mnths you may not see many pods. It takes time for all these forms of life to grow.

 

Then again the livestock in your tank may be eating them as well.

 

Why not just add pods? What are you trying to achieve?

 

Chaeto is easy to get in canada but most other macro algae isn't. The chaeto will help but it will take time.

I didn't know I could add pods. I'm trying to get a real live tank, full of life. In my old tank, that was full of pods, worm and thing that came out at night, I never had problems with nutrients and lack of food for the cuc. This tank just seems like water with rock...maybe I'm wrong. I don't know if I'm looking at the problem in the wrong way. Or if it is not a problem at all. Anyway, I wont add a large amount of live rock, only 1kg or so...so the die off from that rock will not be a big problem, I hope.

brs has a couple of good youtube vids on the use of reactor versus an idle bag of media. Be sure that whatever you do, there is sufficient flow and export heavy until you get the tank where you want it. +1 on the Turkey Baster, adn baste you rocks each water change. Water changes are imo the most important part of solid husbandry.

 

Sorry, but who is brs? feeling dumb right now...

[Nola Bear]

I didn't know I could add pods. I'm trying to get a real live tank, full of life. In my old tank, that was full of pods, worm and thing that came out at night, I never had problems with nutrients and lack of food for the cuc. This tank just seems like water with rock...maybe I'm wrong. I don't know if I'm looking at the problem in the wrong way. Or if it is not a problem at all. Anyway, I wont add a large amount of live rock, only 1kg or so...so the die off from that rock will not be a big problem, I hope.

 

Sorry, but who is brs? feeling dumb right now...

No reason to feel dumb. I should have been more clear. We don't always speak with people in Portugal, so what is common here we should know is not common elsewhere. BRS is an massive online vendor of aquatic supplies and they put out some really nice informative and commercial videos. BRS = Bulk Reef Supply. If you google BRS, it should come right up.

[paulojbsilva]

No reason to feel dumb. I should have been more clear. We don't always speak with people in Portugal, so what is common here we should know is not common elsewhere. BRS is an massive online vendor of aquatic supplies and they put out some really nice informative and commercial videos. BRS = Bulk Reef Supply. If you google BRS, it should come right up.

Whow....bye bye netflix! Got 500 episodes to watch! Thanks.

We don't have such a big brand in Portugal, and honestly, I gave up from learning in some Portuguese forums.

 

Another question...I'm running the lights on my chaeto on the opposite hours of the DT. Is that correct?

[John L]

People recommend running opposite lights for sure. I tried 10 hrs on 2 hrs off to get my chaeto growing faster at first. I now run opposite lights using a simple led light strip. I'm taking some chaeto out every couple of weeks, seems to work well. And I think a great little home for copepods to breed in?

[paulojbsilva]

People recommend running opposite lights for sure. I tried 10 hrs on 2 hrs off to get my chaeto growing faster at first. I now run opposite lights using a simple led light strip. I'm taking some chaeto out every couple of weeks, seems to work well. And I think a great little home for copepods to breed in

Well, copepods is hard to find here...does that small critters at the beach count or are those dangerous to take to the tank?

I'm getting some Fuji Premium LR to help the system get some pods...but is a little more expensive.

[John L]

There's more experienced reefers on this site who could advise you better, but If yr beach is super clean and yr willing to risk it, go for it, you will probably get a range of little critters, Pretty much every living thing in our tanks originally came from the ocean originally right! . If u do a scoop in a rock pool, im sure you'll transfer some little copepods and other critters. Just check for crabs / anything that looks nasty!

 

Your premium live Rock will have some for sure, that may be yr best bet. You can still get some nasties in it also, ( I found a bobbit worm recently in some rock I broke up in my tank.

[paulojbsilva]

There's more experienced reefers on this site who could advise you better, but If yr beach is super clean and yr willing to risk it, go for it, you will probably get a range of little critters, Pretty much every living thing in our tanks originally came from the ocean originally right! . If u do a scoop in a rock pool, im sure you'll transfer some little copepods and other critters. Just check for crabs / anything that looks nasty!

 

 

 

Your premium live Rock will have some for sure, that may be yr best bet. You can still get some nasties in it also, ( I found a bobbit worm recently in some rock I broke up in my tank.

Well just got some Fuji Premium and a batch of natural sea water. A local store sells natural water and I really trust these guys. It's weird to buy natural water, but in Portugal it's necessary to have a permit to collect water. I would risk to collect it anyway but I have a terrible cold...eheh

Hope to boost the life in the tank. I live real close to the Cabo Raso in Lisbon, so if this goes well, will do a lot of rock scooping and water collection very soon.

[John L]

Sounds great, good luck and let us know what you find!

[paulojbsilva]

Hi! Just some more input. Phosphate levels seem to be stable near 0, nitrates around 25. Since I only have a xenya and wanted the algae to start to reduce, I'm maintaining a photoperiod of 4 hours, and increased the light period of chaeto. Seems to be working, starting to see some spots without algae, as the hermits eat them.

So, does it seem that phosphate and nitrates are getting aceptable? Should I maintain this light period one more week?