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Freshwater Minded Reef Equipment Questions


Teebo

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I have been doing research forever now about saltwater aquariums, and I currently have several high tech freshwater planted aquariums. Funny how I can never get enough nutrients into my tanks and saltwater is the opposite where you struggle to maintain all 0ppm. If I could only desalt the water, run it through my freshwater tanks, then add the salt back and put it back into my reef lol.

 

So it seems like all the specialized equipment needed in reef tanks all achieves the same goal just in various different ways, those 2 goals are reducing nitrates/phosphates and maintaining a level of calcium and alkalinity (magnesium seems to be manually added during water changes).

 

Unlike dosing ferts in freshwater in high concentrations and allowing them to drop over the course of a week it seems like the calcium and alkalinity need to be done in finer windows where they can fluctuate within 24 hours? I see this is why people run slow release media in reactors.

 

The reduction of nitrates/phosphates is also what additional media rectors are about if you are using a chemical approach. Then the protein skimmer is another method of removing sources of nitrates/phosphates because I see some people not even using one if they bump up other methods of nutrient export and personally it seems like the grossest thing to clean in the entire maintenance process is that catch cup. Filter socks or rollers are also reducing the physical waste before it has a chance to break down into nutrients in the water column aka nitrates/phosphates. Mangroves and refugiums are also doing the same thing.

 

From a lot of pico/nano tank research it seems like the way people get away without using ANY of this equipment is for one only keeping simple coral as not to require steady and high levels of calcium. The second is religious large water changes that export nutrients along with very frequent floss pad replacement? I see so many good looking established 5 gallon reefs with nothing more than a HOB with filter floss that gets changed weekly with the water change along with the bio-sponge being replaced with a nutrient exporting chemical such as ChemiPure.

 

Am I getting the right idea here with requirements and how to achieve them? I have SUCH clean, balanced and well maintained tanks that I feel I could make a nano reef thrive at the cost of my time however I am thinking about just being patient so I can achieve all my saltwater goals in a single larger tank someday.

 

I really like the idea of an aquascaped refugium using a variety of colorful and effective algaes, this is something I can appreciate from a high tech planted side. I would like to use this as my main source of nutrient uptake so I can save money in the long term on chemical costs. I could run minimal reactors and potentially no skimmer if the refugium was large enough which is kind of the only way they are effective anyway. I was thinking of something like a 15 gallon refugium on a 20 gallon display or something within that ratio so the refugium was more than half the size of the display, with of course really good bright lighting which is one of the most underestimated factors in good nutrient exporting. Not only is the large refugium a natural method but it also stabilizes the pH if I run the lights opposite of my display to continue the photosynthesis as well as pump out pods so I can successfully stock a Mandarin.

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I'm also coming from a freshwater background, heavily planted tanks with fert setups will always have a soft spot in my heart. From what I have been reading on other forum sites and on here, a nice refugium with a really nice skimmer should help maintain proper nutrient levels in the tank. From my understanding, the ChemiPure bags for the HOB filters are like gold.

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Thanks for your response, I will never leave the high tech planted tank hobby I will continue both. I am really tempted to start a nano, and just keep it real simple for a while. No fish, just a cleanup crew and experimenting with some simple corals.

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It seems like you have a pretty good grasp on the subject. Just a few comments and clarifications to help those following this topic.

Funny how I can never get enough nutrients into my tanks and saltwater is the opposite where you struggle to maintain all 0ppm.

Actually nutrients are important to corals as well. They provide energy to coral (for energy/growth) and help prevent alkalinity burn. However, you don't want them to get too high or your tank could experience accelerated algae growth, cyano, dinos, or other problems. For example, you might target phosphate at 0.03ppm.

Of course there are ways to run an ultra low nutrient system (ULNS), by keeping alkalinity near natural seawater levels, feeding, and supplementing amino acids. However, this is a more advanced topic (carbon dosing).

With a large/dense enough refugium, you might actually experience conditions which remind you of your freshwater planted tanks.

So it seems like all the specialized equipment needed in reef tanks all achieves the same goal just in various different ways, those 2 goals are reducing nitrates/phosphates and maintaining a level of calcium and alkalinity (magnesium seems to be manually added during water changes).

Because people do tend to struggle with high nutrient levels; you're right, there are lots of additives, reactors, skimmers, algae turf scrubbers, etc. which are intended to help reduce them.

Maintaining calcium, alkalinity, and calcium levels is a different animal. And normally, if you have to replenish one of these elements, you have to replenish the others as well. Water changes are often enough to replenish a soft coral reef, or lightly stocked stony coral mixed reef; however, consumption often surpasses the ability for water changes to keep up. In these cases, you might have to dose two part solution.

Unlike dosing ferts in freshwater in high concentrations and allowing them to drop over the course of a week it seems like the calcium and alkalinity need to be done in finer windows where they can fluctuate within 24 hours? I see this is why people run slow release media in reactors

Marine livestock is accustomed to the stability of the ocean. If consumption of these major elements is high, there can be large fluctuations within the small environments of our tanks. So you are right, it might eventually be necessary to perform daily dosing (or utilize a calcium reactor like you suggest).

... a nutrient exporting chemical such as ChemiPure.

ChemiPure Elite does have some granular ferric oxide (GFO), however, it doesn't export large amounts of phosphate. It acts more like activated carbon, adsorbing dissolved organics from the water.

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You actually don't want 0 nutrients in reef tanks. You want low level nutrients.

 

2-5 nitrates is good. As it goes up it can cause algae or for some corals(sps) issues.

Phosphates 0.03 is good.

 

Many 0 nutrient tanks will often affect the corals as negatively as high nutrients do.

 

There are many pieces of equipment that aid in controlling/reducing nutrients as well as products that can be added.

The best method is low bioload, controlled feedings, and very good maintenance.

 

Not everyone uses reactors, dosers, chemicals. Sometimes less is more, especially when starting out.

 

As for parameters in the tank. Stability is important. Alk, ca, and mag is very important. All 3 effect eachother. Low magnesium will often cause issues with alk/ca balance.

As alk drops, ca rises. Vice versa.

 

They key is using a salt that provides consistent numbers. The worst is using a salt that offers low numbers, because if you have to dose all week to get the correct levels, when you do a waterchange, it all gets reduced again. This fluctuation can be stressful to the livestock.

 

Many of us dose according to what our tanks uses up. Each tank is different and its uses are different.

The key is having consistent waterchange water and maintaining those levels through the week. In the beginning dosing isn't necessary nor advised. Once you start housing corals and see things like alk/ca dropping due to coral consumption, often 2 part dosing is needed.

 

Chemipure elite is good but its expensive. Its often more beneficial to purchase a good carbon like matrix and phosban seperately and use them in media bags. This way you can control how much you use according to need. And switching it out as your tank needs it.

 

Phosguard reduces phosphates quickly. Using less fre5quentky with monitoring is better than using large portions infrequently.

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I will take it slow, that is never a problem for me. Thanks for all your advice, I dug out an 8.5 gallon cornerless bowfront glass tank I had around but I have no lid for it. That tank had come with a submersible filter @ 105gph so I am going to start with that as a powerhead after I remove the media extension trays. I can at least experiment without the cost this way. I am thinking about letting my freshwater tanks go borderline Walstad so that I can put the attention into heavy weekly maintenance with a small saltwater tank...I think I have been over-maintaining my freshwater tanks.

 

 

 

:lol: I can build something 5x as nice for $1,200 lmfao! Like a 55 gallon tank with a 40 breeder underneath as a sump and refugium. I would still have enough money left for all the pumps and hardware too.

 

 

@ Seabass -

Oh wow so maintaining 0ppm is an exaggeration but it is very close to 0? Seems like all these tanks need are "traces" of nutrients.

 

 

I am confused what you mean about water changes replenishing, I thought RODI/distilled water has none of these elements? Do they come from the salt mix? From watching a lot of BRS-TV it seemed like people dose calcium and alkalinity daily but magnesium was a once weekly thing? Can anyone elaborate on ratios to one another?

 

 

Thanks for your input on ChemiPure, so should I run Purigen instead since it can be recharged and also removes dissolved organics? I guess nano tank owners run the ChemiPure as their source of NO3 export since they typically do not run skimmers? If it removes NO3 but not PO4 then between their weekly water changes it sounds like phosphates are their #1 enemy since they have no uptake method between water changes??

 

@ Clown79 -

Is there a nitrate:phosphate ratio? I thought it was something like 10ppm:1ppm?

 

Touching on your salt quality, RedSea/CoralPro is typically the standard right?

 

Your reply was very helpful! I will start looking into separate media bags of a good carbon and phosban to use in a HOB!

 

When choosing a HOB for a small reef tank, I was going to go right for my trusty Marineland Penguin Bio-Wheel series filter that I run on a lot of my freshwater tanks but...with all this live rock is the oxygen rich bio-wheel even going to do 1% of what my live rock will?! lol

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Oh wow so maintaining 0ppm is an exaggeration but it is very close to 0? Seems like all these tanks need are "traces" of nutrients.

Yeah, relatively small amounts. Phosphate between 0.01 and 0.03ppm and Nitrate between 2 and 10ppm. Some people might target lower or even higher values (or a tighter range), but these targets are fairly common.

 

I am confused what you mean about water changes replenishing, I thought RODI/distilled water has none of these elements? Do they come from the salt mix? From watching a lot of BRS-TV it seemed like people dose calcium and alkalinity daily but magnesium was a once weekly thing? Can anyone elaborate on ratios to one another?

Yes, a good reef salt mix should contain proper alkalinity, calcium, and magnesium levels. By replacing water that has lower levels with water with proper levels, you can replenish these elements (keeping in mind that even a 50% water change can only split the difference between the two). As consumption increases, it becomes necessary to make up this difference via dosing.

 

IMO, ratios aren't as important as the target value. But consumption of these elements doesn't vary that much. Here is a good video on dosing:

 

Thanks for your input on ChemiPure, so should I run Purigen instead since it can be recharged and also removes dissolved organics? I guess nano tank owners run the ChemiPure as their source of NO3 export since they typically do not run skimmers? If it removes NO3 but not PO4 then between their weekly water changes it sounds like phosphates are their #1 enemy since they have no uptake method between water changes??

IMO, ChemiPure should be considered a premium activated carbon (although many regard it more highly than I do). It will not remove all of your nitrate either. Water changes might be the most common method for exporting nitrate (since a 50% water change can cut it in half). I'd recommend starting with 15% water changes every week and monitor your levels. If necessary, you can always increase the volume or frequency of your water changes.

 

Purigen is fine. In fact, ChemiPure Blue contains Purigen. I just happen to prefer a mix of good activated carbon and Phosguard.

 

Phosphate is added whenever you feed anything (whether it is consumed or not). It is utilized by corals, algae, etc. If you let it get too high, growth of algae (and other unwanted blooms) will accelerate.

 

Touching on your salt quality, RedSea/CoralPro is typically the standard right?

Some like it, others don't. You'll get a lot of opinions on which is best. Most can be used for a typical reef tank, although some are not suitable for specific methods (for example, Red Sea Coral Pro has high alkalinity and isn't suitable for ultra low nutrient systems).

 

When choosing a HOB for a small reef tank, I was going to go right for my trusty Marineland Penguin Bio-Wheel series filter that I run on a lot of my freshwater tanks but...with all this live rock is the oxygen rich bio-wheel even going to do 1% of what my live rock will?! lol

Those filters are good. I just remove the bio-wheel when using them on a reef tank with live rock as the biofilter.

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To elaborate on what Seabass was discussing. The elements get replenished during your weekly waterchanges. The salt has everything you need in it. You top up evaporation water with plain ro/di daily to maintain salinity. Salt doesn't evaporate.

 

There is no rule to how much one has to dose and when. You start dosing when your tank uses up the elements.

 

Example. You do waterchange on a Friday, your alk is 9, ca 420, mag 1300. Depending on the corals you have, you may need to dose all 3 the next day, or in 2 days, or in 3 days. Dosing requires proper monitoring to determine what your tank uses, how quickly, and how much/often one needs to dose. New tanks won't need this as it won't have much in it to use the elements.

 

Proper levels for nitrate is 2-5 is optimal, up to 10 before you start seeing issues like algae. Phosphate is 0.03

 

The key is to try to keep them within those numbers.

 

As for filters. The marinelands aren't great for SW. Its hard to use your own media in them and the biowheels are nutrient collectors.

 

Two good options:

 

Aquaclear- you can use media bags with various media and filter floss, adjustable flow.

 

Api superclean- same as above but it has a surface skimmer and completely adjustable flow.

 

Phosguard can be used to reduce phosphates when you start having higher than you want levels

Phosguard helps maintain them but not necessary at the beginning. It doesn't reduce phos quickly

Carbon keeps water clean and helps reduce toxins from corals.

 

Chemipure elite is no different than phosban and carbon in a media bag. Its just 1 bag you plop in. They don't have nano size bags and per the maker, using a larger bag in small aquariums can strip the water too much of nutrients.

 

Buying a container of matrix carbon, a container of phosban and putting them in media bags allows you to save money and control amounts you use and when you use it.

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0.01-0.03 are not even detectable with my API test kit, I think everything is measured in 1.0ppm so maybe I need a special phosphate test kit? Funny you say 2-10ppm of nitrates that is my freshwater target range and I usually stay on the lower side.

 

Ahh that makes sense with the salt mix containing all three elements I am so used to thinking about a freshwater change where everything useful is stripped from the water basically. That video you posted is exactly where I got the info about dosing magnesium much less than alkalinity and calcium or at least it can be done in a larger amount and allowed to fall over a wider range. Sounds like with this 8 gallon I am trying to setup I can get away with just doing water changes. I can see as you scale your system up in water volume, with better nutrient control it becomes much cheaper to dose what is needed rather than replace large quantities of water and salt mix. This is all starting to make sense to me very quickly!

 

Sounds like you both prefer carbon over Purigen, the carbon had to be changed too much in my freshwater systems to keep up with the long term performance of Purigen so it was a no brainer for me. If the phosguard does not need to be changed frequently than the Purigen would be the better option granted it removes all the same things as carbon and does not just remove tannins.

 

So working with this nice 8.5 gallon tank I have, I am not sure if I should run it completely hoodless or not due to evaporation and even a slight amount of evaporation in a small tank will cause a greater amount of salinity change. I have never heard of the API SuperClean and that surface skimming may really come in handy without a protein skimmer, it will remove the oil slick on the surface but likely just tumble it back into the water column?

 

I was just thinking about this today after seeing a common AquaClear mod, where people turn them into refugiums for small tanks. At first I thought about running two identical HOBs one for my media and another as a refugium...then I thought about using a mini canister filter for my media and a HOB refugium. Ultimately I do not want to use a canister on such a small tank, and I am between one large HOB or two smaller HOBs. I have seen these HOB refugiums for sale but the pump itself is inside the tank which is a total eyesore compared to the pump being in the HOB unit outside the water.

XSIMQrR.jpg

 

I really want everyone's input on an 8.5 gallon (pretty much the dimensions of a 10 with the front corners rounded down to 8.5) with an API SuperClean 50 which is more than needed but provides the room for both my two media bags plus room to grow enough algae to make a difference worth having a HOB refugium, and I know good refugium lighting makes a difference too. I can idle the HOB flowrate down and just use the volume an oversized HOB provides but I was also thinking maybe I could get away without needing a powerhead if I was to use the flowrate potential of an oversized HOB?! This would make a clean budget nano setup if you think about it, no powerhead and just a huge HOB filter + refugium in one. I would also only light the refugium when the tank lights are off to help pickup the photosynthesis where the tank left off, potentially stabilizing the pH of such a small tank.

 

Thank you

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Carbon doesn't do the same thing as phosguard or phosban. Most use carbon on a regular basis and change it out every 2 weeks to a month. Its for clarity and removing coral toxins.

 

Phosguard helps reduce phosphates quickly, phosban can help reduce nitrates and lower phos but not as rapidly as phosguard.

 

If one doesn't have phosphate issues using phosguard can strip a tank quickly leading to no nutrients at all which poses another problem.

 

You need a low range phosphate kit, salifert is low range, api isn't.

 

Most start out simple, carbon and filter floss. Adding other media when its needed.

 

Filter floss is used to trap particles and needs changing 2-3 times a week. No sponges or filter pads- they are nutrient traps.

 

Canister filters used for sw need to be kept clean or they become nutrient traps. This cleaning is weekly.

 

An hob filter is fine. It needs cleaning monthly.

As for refugium, the aquaclears modded are the best choice for that option. I don't run a refugium so I would do some searches on here for that particular subject if no one else chimes in.

 

Right now waterchanges should be enough to replenish your elements, as for dosing it will all depend on what corals you keep and what they use. The only way of knowing that is when you start keeping corals and test for ca, alk, and mag.

 

The surface skimmer doesn't tumble it back into the water. It has an intake and it goes through the filteration system. All surface skimmers do that.

 

A skimmer on such a small tank is really not needed. Some research shows skimming on small tanks can also deplete the system.

 

The best thing, is keeping it stupid simple.

 

There is a thread called KISS, it has some very good info.

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0.01-0.03 are not even detectable with my API test kit, I think everything is measured in 1.0ppm so maybe I need a special phosphate test kit?

 

Yep, as Clown79 stated, you need a low range test kit for phosphate. Whenever you use phosphate reducing media, you should monitor phosphate levels so it doesn't start to creep up, or get too low. Salifert is a good line of test kits. I use many of their kits, but use a Hanna ULR Phosphorus Checker to monitor phosphate.

 

Sounds like you both prefer carbon over Purigen, the carbon had to be changed too much in my freshwater systems to keep up with the long term performance of Purigen so it was a no brainer for me. If the phosguard does not need to be changed frequently than the Purigen would be the better option granted it removes all the same things as carbon and does not just remove tannins.

I wouldn't want to steer you away from other media. There are probably more reefers which use ChemiPure Elite and Purigen, or other media, than use activated carbon. You just need to find what you like, and what works best for your particular setup.

 

Yes activated carbon removes dissolved organics, toxins, and meds, as well as discoloration of the water (improving clarity and light penetration). I use small amounts and replace it weekly. Since activated carbon doesn't remove phosphate, I just mix some Phosguard in the same media bag as the activated carbon whenever phosphate starts to creep up. Again, using smaller amounts and replacing more frequently.

 

So working with this nice 8.5 gallon tank I have, I am not sure if I should run it completely hoodless or not due to evaporation and even a slight amount of evaporation in a small tank will cause a greater amount of salinity change.

A lot of fish jump when spooked (some much more than others). You might lose some fish if you decide to go without a top. Mesh tops work well with rectangular tanks without HOB equipment (but they might not work for your tank).

 

Evaporation helps with cooling in the summer. Salinity changes usually aren't a problem if you top off your tank with distilled or RO/DI water everyday. There are auto top off units which can automate this task.

 

Gas exchange can be an issue too. However, HOB power filters actually do a good job of disrupting the surface and promoting gas exchange.

 

I was just thinking about this today after seeing a common AquaClear mod, where people turn them into refugiums for small tanks. At first I thought about running two identical HOBs one for my media and another as a refugium...then I thought about using a mini canister filter for my media and a HOB refugium. Ultimately I do not want to use a canister on such a small tank, and I am between one large HOB or two smaller HOBs. I have seen these HOB refugiums for sale but the pump itself is inside the tank which is a total eyesore compared to the pump being in the HOB unit outside the water.

AquaClear filters are great. Also, inTank offers media baskets and refugium inserts for them: http://shop.mediabaskets.com/AquaClear_c44.htm

 

There are advantages to running a refugium, but I feel that small fuges aren't always effective, and chemical filtration might still be necessary. Therefore, I tend not to run them. But again, I don't want to discourage you from using one.

 

I really want everyone's input on an 8.5 gallon (pretty much the dimensions of a 10 with the front corners rounded down to 8.5)... I can idle the HOB flowrate down and just use the volume an oversized HOB provides but I was also thinking maybe I could get away without needing a powerhead if I was to use the flowrate potential of an oversized HOB?! This would make a clean budget nano setup if you think about it, no powerhead and just a huge HOB filter + refugium in one.

My saltwater first tank was a 7 gallon bowfront. I really liked that tank. I don't see an issue with using an 8.5 gallon tank. I've also run tanks as large as 40 gallons with just HOB filters alone (and no powerheads). It's certainly doable. However, there are inexpensive powerheads available which are budget friendly (if that would work better for you).
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I will pick up some new test kits, I have plenty of time to do that while the tank cycles :)

I will start by keeping phosban on hand for when needed.

 

Wow that is a very frequent floss change, now I understand why so many love their roller units.

 

I am going to have to do some hardcore research into the comparison between Purigen and carbon, and I am not sure I would mix the two in the same bag because the carbon may deplete much faster than the phosban. I suppose once you dial your tank in you will know how much phosban you can add to get through the week without throwing it away with the carbon.

 

I will have to get creative with my hooding, because the tank by design is rimless.

 

I know small refugiums do almost nothing, but that is why I thought with such a small water volume that one would make an impact. I did knot know that InTank made baskets for them which is awesome and I also did not know about the AquaClear 110!

 

Touching on your confirmation of HOB filters without powerheads, price is not so much the factor here as space is in such a small tank. I do have a 110gph powerhead here that came with the tank meant to be used as a submersible filter but I would rather not see it in my tank. Now that you brought the AquaClear 110 to my attention I may just simply use nothing more than a 110 on the back of my tank that will run my media, provide all my flow in the tank, and also leave plenty of room to grow a nice sized ball of algae relative to the size of the display volume. A 110 on an 8.5 gallon is probably really large and depending on how much water the 110 body holds it will increase my water volume a tad bit...would be cool if there was enough room to even run a heater in the HOB for aesthetics and the InTank basket demo does show it holding a heater!

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On such a small tank you won't need a lot of phosban so thriwing it away is no biggy or if you put it in a seperate media bag, it can be regenerated.

 

I used chemi pure blue nano and the expense was far more than a container of phosguard and carbon. I was replacing the bags every 1.5 mnths@ $16 a pkg.

 

I saw no benefit with it to be honest. Worked the same as any carbon so i went with buying bulk media and media bags.

 

Filterfloss is cheap. Cost me $10/yr. Switching it out takes 2 mins. I'm not sure what rollers you are speaking of.

 

You can make your own mesh lid with window framing. Its really easy. Not only does it prevent jumpers but helps with gas exchange and doesn't impede lighting

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On such a small tank you won't need a lot of phosban so thriwing it away is no biggy or if you put it in a seperate media bag, it can be regenerated.

I think you are confusing Phosban and Purigen. Phosban is just a brand of GFO (which you can't regenerate) and removes phosphate, and Purigen is polymer resin which can be regenerated and adsorbs dissolved organics.

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The roller I am speaking of is the unit with floss pad on a roll, it slowly moves and unrolls clean floss and rerolls it back on the other spool after a portion has been used.

 

I have some pool sand I want to use in this tank, I did read that play sand will pack too hard but it raises pH...my pH is 7.0 so wouldn't a pH raise be a good thing? I would rather a neutral sand so it does not slowly loose its pH and throw my dosing off.

 

It is difficult to cut a bow front lid, this is my tank it hasn't really been used I can not find a single scratch on it. This is the powerhead I speak of if I had to use one but I am going to try to get away without one. Since this tank is 20" wide like a standard 10 gallon I may try modding a hood to cover at least 80% of the top, but without the plastic rim it may be hard.

NuoOlH6.jpg

PZSdMIO.jpg

 

 

The AquaClear 110 is 13.5" wide which will certainly fit, here is a picture of one on a 10 gallon.

n3oLbXD.jpg

 

 

I took another look at my Phosphate test and it does read in 0.5ppm so I can at least start with this seeing how I never use it with my freshwater.

XNEpt7o.jpg

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Using that type of sand may not be a good option long term.

 

There are negatives to using it such as silicates. Far better to use aragonite sand.

 

I wouldn't worry about ph. Ph chasing is an issue. As long as alkalinity is normal, you're fine. Alkalinity effects ph. Ph also fluctuates throughout the day and is effected by photosynthesis.

The silica and quartz base in playsand will cause nothing but issues with diatoms and high phosphates.

 

It also doesn't offer the buffering that aragonite does.

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I took another look at my Phosphate test and it does read in 0.5ppm so I can at least start with this seeing how I never use it with my freshwater.

But the target value is 0.01 to 0.03 ppm. Your kit goes up in 0.25 ppm increments, so you won't see any results until it is about ten times higher than it should be. By that time you will probably already have a bloom (which will be utilizing the phosphate in the water to fuel its growth). Also, you would have no idea when to change your phosphate reducing media. Just throw that high range kit out; it does you no good.
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Okay new phosphate kit :)

Is pool filter sand considered aragonite?

 

I have seen a lot about live-rock and live-sand, one one or the other or both. I have mixed opinions from the little I know, I am not in any rush so just having a tank with saltwater, reef rock and some sand is something new for me to look at for a while during cycling. I would ideally rather start fresh, clean, and be patient by using dry rock, dry sand, and adding Bio Spira. However maybe Bio Spira does not contain some of the strains of bacteria found on some of the live rock or sand? Just trying to avoid unwanted critters I don't know how to deal with right now.

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jedimasterben

Purigen is fine. In fact, ChemiPure Blue contains Purigen.

No, it doesn't. Purigen is a Seachem product, not Boyd.

Okay new phosphate kit :)

Is pool filter sand considered aragonite?

 

No, it is silica.

I would highly suggest starting a tank with fresh live rock from somewhere like KP Aquatics or Gulf Live Rock. I prefer the stuff from KPA, which is done in the Atlantic vs the gulf.

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No, it doesn't. Purigen is a Seachem product, not Boyd.

No, it is silica.

I would highly suggest starting a tank with fresh live rock from somewhere like KP Aquatics or Gulf Live Rock. I prefer the stuff from KPA, which is done in the Atlantic vs the gulf.

 

Thanks, so do you have any input on Purigen vs. good carbon?

 

If I was to do live rock, I was just going to buy it from my LFS which has large chunks ready to sell completely covered on coraline. I can not say whether this rock came from a real reef though :( maybe someone could tell me? The store I am talking about is a PetCo in MA. I know of one other that is a backwoods store, I can ask them where they get their rock from.

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No, it doesn't. Purigen is a Seachem product, not Boyd.

I guess you're right. I didn't think of that. :blush: Maybe it's a similar resin?

 

I guess I just read that somewhere and it stuck:

Blue = elite + purigen Winning

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The best bet is setting up:

 

1. Livesand or dry aragonite sand(no play sand, you'll have nothing but problems)

 

2. Rock choices- liverock, this will cycle the tank with the sand. If its in a tank at a store its liverock. Most is listed as fiji or pukani

 

3. Dry reef rock with the sand, ammonia dosing and bacteria additive to start cycle. Theres nothing on the dry roxk to start a cycle so you have to add ammonia

 

4. A mix of dry reef rock and liverock- liverock will seed the dry rock and stwrt the cycle

 

5. Liverock with caribsea life rock(dry rock with bacteria injected)

 

Caribsea livesand or dry sand is a good option.

 

Adding the rocks on the glass then adding the sand at the same time is easier.

 

Carbon and phosphate medias are different and do different jobs. Most use carbon. The other media is added as/when needed.

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