Refugium Setup and Stocking...

[Dreichler]

So i have had my JBJ 45 up and running for a few years now and it is completely stocked with mostly LPS, zoas, and just a few pieces of SPS. I have 5 fish, a wild caught clown, one spot fox face, leopard wrasse, midas blenny, and mandarin dragonette. all the sudden i have had a major cyan outbreak, not only on the sand, but ALL over the rock work, and it builds up on every inch of rock in about 2-3 days. i went and tested every single parameter, and everything checked out perfect, but my nitrates were through the roof. i feed a full cube of frozen mysis that i let thaw out, then strain, about 5 times per week. i also target feed every coral 3 times per week with reef roids.

 

so my point of this post is i guess its time to setup a refugium... but i have a few questions and concerns because i can't rip the black off the back of the tank and stick a light in there because the tank is against the wall and theres no moving it...

 

1. Whats your thoughts on a hang-on refugium?

2. Whats your thoughts of just growing the macro in my display?

3. What should i grow?

4. Any special rubble i can throw in the chambers?

 

I have no intentions of buying a skimmer or reactor and i already do 25% water changes weekly...

 

 

this is not the most recent picture of my tank, but it gives you an idea of my stock...

[metrokat]

how big is the chamber in the back?

[Tamberav]

Beautiful tank.

 

The thing about a refugium is the bigger it is, the more of the impact it will have. If you don't have enough space, it won't solve your problems.

 

if space is limited, an algae scrubber will probably do more.

[Dreichler]

how big is the chamber in the back?

 

 

Beautiful tank.

 

The thing about a refugium is the bigger it is, the more of the impact it will have. If you don't have enough space, it won't solve your problems.

 

if space is limited, an algae scrubber will probably do more.

 

The chambers in the back are about 19 inches deep and from front to back, about 5 inches.

Anyone recommend a hang on refugium?

 

And whats an algae scrubber, I've seen them mentioned before but never researched them or even knew what they are?

[Kahmu84]

Off topic but what is the green,orange and cyan looking thing(new to the hobby on the sw side) its beautiful

[HarryPotter]

Dreichler, a PLS-50 Elite skimmer would be a great option to reduce available nutrients. I know you said you prefer to not have one, but skimming is a tried and true method of export.

 

As for a refugium, unless you had a large one I don't think it would be particularly effective. An algae scrubber would help though

[intarsiabox]

Off topic but what is the green,orange and cyan looking thing(new to the hobby on the sw side) its beautiful

 

A nice looking Scoly

[Subsea]

http://www.cermedia.com/marinepure-faq.php

 

 

 

Ceramic blocks in a limited space may provide the nitrate control that you need. The above link is one such product. I have not used it.

 

With respect to cynobacteria, the nutrients do not necessarily need to be in the bulk water. The nutrients can be in the substrate or on the rocks. Randy Holmes Farley wrote an interesting article on how cynobacteria converted inorganic calcium phosphate into organic phosphate using a biofeedback loop to control the process. Some people control cynobacteria with ChemiClean. I do not like anything that kills bacteria. I am waiting on some information on a product that adds probiotic bacteria to control cynobacteria. Cynobacteria is very successful at surviving since the dawn of time. It is a bacteria that is photosynthic. Without cynobacteriga, earth would have a methane athmosphere.

 

PS By the way, your tank is gorgeous.

[Tamberav]

 

 

 

The chambers in the back are about 19 inches deep and from front to back, about 5 inches.

Anyone recommend a hang on refugium?

 

And whats an algae scrubber, I've seen them mentioned before but never researched them or even knew what they are?

 

They have upflow (underwater) and downflow (above water) scrubbers, it is basically a plastic medium you grow GHA on to harvest/remove and is much more effective than a fuge for small spaces. There are many DIY methods and examples you can find using google.

[Dreichler]

 

They have upflow (underwater) and downflow (above water) scrubbers, it is basically a plastic medium you grow GHA on to harvest/remove and is much more effective than a fuge for small spaces. There are many DIY methods and examples you can find using google.

I've looked at a lot of the DIY and seen so many mixed options and methods... If you don't mind, would you provide a link to which you would think is the best?

Off topic but what is the green,orange and cyan looking thing(new to the hobby on the sw side) its beautiful

It's a trachyphillia (spelling?).... But it's a type of open brain coral

http://www.cermedia.com/marinepure-faq.php

 

 

 

 

 

Ceramic blocks in a limited space may provide the nitrate control that you need. The above link is one such product. I have not used it.

 

With respect to cynobacteria, the nutrients do not necessarily need to be in the bulk water. The nutrients can be in the substrate or on the rocks. Randy Holmes Farley wrote an interesting article on how cynobacteria converted inorganic calcium phosphate into organic phosphate using a biofeedback loop to control the process. Some people control cynobacteria with ChemiClean. I do not like anything that kills bacteria. I am waiting on some information on a product that adds probiotic bacteria to control cynobacteria. Cynobacteria is very successful at surviving since the dawn of time. It is a bacteria that is photosynthic. Without cynobacteria earth would have a methane athmosphere.

 

PS By the way, your tank is gorgeous.

Thanks for the info and compliment! What do you currently use for nitrate control?

[Subsea]

I have been skimmerless for 20 years. I use macro algae for nitrate control.

 

Actually, I grow decorative macros to sell and I add miracle grow and ammonia for a nutrient source.

 

In my mixed reef tank, I am presently dealing with a cynobacteria problem. I will provide two links for bacteria based solutions to cynobacteria problems.

 

 

http://www.drtimsaquatics.com/treat-aquarium-algae/treating-cyanobacteria

After reading the treatment, I was concerned with where the nutrients went after the "waste away" product was used without having a protein skimmer to remove bacteria.

 

https://www.tlc-products.com/pdf/HOW%20TLC%20BACTERIA%20WORK.pdf

This link with a differrent company that sells probiotic bacteria for aquariums and ponds gets very detailed into the science. It makes for a very good read if you enjoy that kind of stuff. The short answer to what happens to the nutrients from cyno bloom when using bacteria and enzymes is that the end product is carbon dioxide and sugar. Both are consumed by processes in the tank.

 

PS. I could not agree more with your signature. One small disagreement, it's an addiction not a hobby.

 

PSS: Power to the people.

[Subsea]

You asked me about nitrate control. I use a combination of macro harvesting and denitrification. Old school denitrification theories required DSB. I used a Jaubert Plenum with 6" of crushed coral to accomplish that. It served me well for 20 years. Since those days, it has been proven that denitrification and nitrification bacteria can be in close proximity of each other and do not require DSB.

 

As I read more on the science involved, I have come to the conclusion that the most important component in the long term success of our Eco-systems is bacteria. A pHD friend on this site calls them the "microbial overlords". The Martians in "War of the Worlds" proved the importance of bacteria.

 

I am convinced that bacteria are the solution to cyno problems. I like the detail to science articles at TLC. Also, their product is more economical than Dr Tim. TLC did not directly address cynobacteria while Dr Tim did. I have asked tech support at TLC to address their product use for cynobacteria.