Jump to content
ReefCleaners.org

Hammerstone's Tank


Hammerstone

Recommended Posts

Hammerstone

I'm just starting this thread as a place to get help for my algae woe's. I have been battling cyano, have done chemiclean twice and eradicated it from my tank, or so I thought. Beneath the cyano was a soft clumpy type algae. I now have diatoms everywhere. I have no CUC at all due to my murderous clown but I think I am going to contact Reef Cleaners and get set up with a new CUC. I've heard nothing but good about them. I'm pretty sure that's the name right?

 

I had my tank all scrubbed and clean and then within a week it was bad again. Now I have cyano, green moss looking stuff, and diatoms everywhere.

 

I changed my regular light to a Marineland reef ready light and this happened. The tank used to be FOWLR. I had sun corals but they slowly declined at the bottom of my tank with the light change.

 

I have a 30 gallon tank with two clowns, a mated pair and 4 RFA's.

 

I'd like to hear more good stories about Reef Cleaners.

 

I'm using an iPod and have never had luck posting picture's.

 

Thank's for reading.

Link to comment
  • Replies 202
  • Created
  • Last Reply

i didn't realize i had to replace my GFO more often and that killed so much algae. I'm currently dealing with Dino and some brown hairy shiz i found out my rock is leaching my phosphate back out so I'm doing 10% every other day water changes. has dealt with a lot of it. algae removal is easy said how to get rid of and not easy done. here is how you remove algae. remove the phosphate the algae dies. the problem is that is nearly impossible. I'm currently feeding once a week. a lot of my fish have gone to prefer copepods so its nice, and my tangs have gone onto the brown hair algae. my red legged hermits eat the algae really good. i have been selling GSP to afford a super CUC to eat all the algae. and when i upgrade i will have a more adequate space for my CUC I found black margirita snails LOVE cyano. so get some of those.

Link to comment

John @ Reefcleaners.org is great to work with. I need to re-order from him. Great experience I had.

Link to comment

Pictures might be the most helpful thing you can post. Can you put them up on a picture hosting site? What are you having problems with? I'd really like to see what you're up against.

 

Have you been monitoring phosphate? And if so, which test kit are you using? What phosphate control, if any, have you been using?

 

How old is the tank? What type of sand, and how deep is it? What do you do for maintenance (size and frequency of water changes, etc)?

 

What type of water are you using (RO/DI, distilled, RO, or treated tap)?

 

I'm glad you started this thread. I know you've been getting frustrated, and that really makes this hobby a downer.

Link to comment

Hammerstone- so sorry you have been battling this and I know it can not only become very frustrating but it becomes discouraging. Don't give up.

 

First: try uploading the pics using the full version of the site. I find it the easiest. I click more options, choose a file, upload pic, then attach pic.

 

 

What we need to figure out is where the nutrients is coming from because thats feeding the algae.

 

I know you are great with maintenance, you don't slack on water changes...so the issue is elsewhere.

 

What is the filteration set up? You running a sump, aio, hob, canister filter?

 

What do you feed/feeding schedule

 

Any supplements you are adding?

 

Water type?

 

Did you start out vacuuming the sand or no?

 

Whats the water movement like in the tank?

 

Do you have a refugium

Link to comment

I had cyano and the first step I took was cutting my lighting schedule. I dropped it to no more than 8hrs.

 

Some black out the tank for 72hrs and it helps but if there is a nutrient issue in the tank- the cyano will reappear within a few days of lights.

 

 

My second step was cleaning out all my hoses, filter, pumps, powerheads- i had slacked on this and not only was there a lot of crap in it all but thry functioned better once cleaned.

 

I vacuum my sand regularly with every water change

I did a few extra water changes during the week

Changed out filter floss more often during my cyano outbreak

Added a powerhead more directed to mid/lower tank

Cut back on feeding, stopped adding zooplankton

 

I'm not sure what the culprit was but it worked. I got rid of my diatoms which were reappearing every few weeks and the cyano went bye bye too.

Link to comment
Hammerstone

Hi Seabass and Clown!!!??

I've written this twice and got

Disturbed by the kids and it erased. You know me well Seabass, I am bummed out. I'm going to try later to fill this out. I just wanted you to know I appreciate this a lot and am not ignoring you and find your help an invaluable resource and I know your time is valuable too!!! That almost sounded like when you are on the phone and put on hold.

 

Talk to you soon. BTW I was checking out the reef cleaners website with pictures of problem algae a and I might have Dino's too. I'm thinking how did this happen. All I did was change the light for reef. But I had purchased some anenomes a few months ago. But I'll fill everything out!!!

 

Hammerstone

Link to comment
Hammerstone

I'm going to do this in pieces.

 

My tank is 30 gallon, my husband set it up 3 years ago.

 

21/2 " live sand, caribsea I believe.

 

30 lbs live rock. I only run floss and carbon. Water change weekly five gallons. Used Amquel now switched to prime.

 

Salt water from LFS which is going to change, too far.

 

Tap top offs. Going to change since problems.

 

Haven't tested in a long time. ApI test kit. No phosphate test. Going to get a salifert.

 

Marineland Coral ready LEDs. That's when I noticed some algae.

 

HOB filter and powerhead. Also bubble curtain, I just like it.

Link to comment

I ran a bunch of chaeto in a fuge 24/7 for about a week or so and had great luck with getting rid of cyano. John is only place I get my cuc.

Link to comment
Hammerstone

I ran a bunch of chaeto in a fuge 24/7 for about a week or so and had great luck with getting rid of cyano. John is only place I get my cuc.

where did you get the Chaeto? Right now I have zero CUC. I have some bristleworms but their numbers are falling as I am feeding less. I have two clowns and four RFAS. It was recommended to use mysis just once a week. The rest of the week I put in a small pinch of ocean nutrition brineshrimp flavored flakes. I am going to order from reef cleaners, just trying to decide if I should go with a package or custom. I think I'm going to go with a package and get both snails and hermits. Hopefully Bob my female Behaves ?. There is plenty for them to eat.

 

Does cyano release toxins at all? Last night I got the cyano out manually and it made my trash stink right away. Theirs puffy miss like algae underneath the cyano. I'm doing it a part at a time due to detritus and not wanting the water column to have a bunch of stuff in it.

Link to comment

My tank is 30 gallon, my husband set it up 3 years ago.

3 years is long enough for your sand bed to become saturated with organics and nutrients.

 

2 1/2 " live sand, caribsea I believe.

This concerns me a little. I would prefer that it was an inch or less. Take great caution disturbing this substrate. I'm going to suggest taking it all out and cleaning it, or replacing it altogether (I'll write a post on how to do this without crashing your tank).

 

I only run floss and carbon.

Did you know that all activated carbon releases some phosphate? Some much more than others. That said, I still like activated carbon. I just use better brands and watch phosphate.

 

Salt water from LFS which is going to change, too far. Tap [water] top offs. Going to change since problems.

Without really testing their water, it's hard to say how good it is. Tap water anything is just bad. I recommend getting a RO/DI unit for your home; otherwise, use distilled water.

 

Haven't tested in a long time. ApI test kit. No phosphate test. Going to get a salifert.

You should be testing (the nutrients) nitrate and phosphate. I'm less concerned with calcium, alkalinity, and magnesium when it comes to algae problems (although they are important when dosing elements). However, the bloom(s) may be using up most of the nutrients, making tests look like you have good nutrient levels.

 

Marineland Coral ready LEDs. That's when I noticed some algae.

I really think this is just a coincidence.

 

HOB filter and powerhead. Also bubble curtain, I just like it.

The bubble curtain is fine (salt creep aside). A protein skimmer might help, but you can achieve acceptable results with just activated carbon and water changes. How often do you change your activated carbon?
Link to comment

It was recommended to use mysis just once a week. The rest of the week I put in a small pinch of ocean nutrition brineshrimp flavored flakes.

You can feed mysis more if you want. Just don't overfeed. For flakes, I prefer Ocean Nutrition Formula One.

 

I am going to order from reef cleaners, just trying to decide if I should go with a package or custom. I think I'm going to go with a package and get both snails and hermits.

Write John; he'll work with you and help you decide.

 

Does cyano release toxins at all?

Cyano is toxic. It's best to get rid of it as soon as you can.
Link to comment
Hammerstone

3 years is long enough for your sand bed to become saturated with organics and nutrients.

 

This concerns me a little. I would prefer that it was an inch or less. Take great caution disturbing this substrate. I'm going to suggest taking it all out and cleaning it, or replacing it altogether (I'll write a post on how to do this without crashing your tank).

 

Did you know that all activated carbon releases some phosphate? Some much more than others. That said, I still like activated carbon. I just use better brands and watch phosphate.

 

Without really testing their water, it's hard to say how good it is. Tap water anything is just bad. I recommend getting a RO/DI unit for your home; otherwise, use distilled water.

 

You should be testing (the nutrients) nitrate and phosphate. I'm less concerned with calcium, alkalinity, and magnesium when it comes to algae problems (although they are important when dosing elements). However, the bloom(s) may be using up most of the nutrients, making tests look like you have good nutrient levels.

 

I really think this is just a coincidence.

 

The bubble curtain is fine (salt creep aside). A protein skimmer might help, but you can achieve acceptable results with just activated carbon and water changes. How often do you change your activated carbon?

about once a month but I bought a bunch of boxes of it. I can start changing it more if need be. There is a lot of rock in my tank making it difficult to clean the sand. I have always vacuumed over the top of the sand. Crashing my tank with the clowns in it would be devestating. It's funny how the fish don't seem to mind the algae. My fish are starting to be hosted by an area of soft algae on a rock. Also The fish seem to have decided to dig a large whole in the sand, led by the female. She tail slaps the sand to do this. So I have a nice clean patch. She did this in the back of the tank as well. I think they are getting ready to spawn. I'm surprised that she didn't crash the tank.

 

I took out most of the cyano last night. Thank God. Now I will make sure to keep on top of the cyano. It just comes on so quick and hard. I can't believe that I have like every kind of algae in my tank.

Link to comment

As promised, here's how to clean or replace your sand bed without crashing your tank. Replacing it is easier, and arguably safer than cleaning it (but cleaning is an option).

First don't disturb the sand bed with livestock in your tank. Disrupting it will release trapped organics and nutrients into the water column. You must remove everything from your tank first. Any tank water you wish to reuse, must be saved prior to disturbing the substrate.

Now fill some buckets with tank water to hold your livestock. Use a separate bucket(s) for your live rock (so it doesn't crush anyone). Then move everything out of your tank. Again, trying to disturb the sand as little as possible. Once the sand is disturbed, you must discard the remaining water in your tank.

Now you have a tank with just sand and dirty water. It's time to clean. Remove the sand, then clean out the tank and equipment. A vinegar solution is a good cleaning product.

If you are using new sand, you can add it now, or wait until you have returned the rocks. If you plan on reusing the sand, skip this step until after you have your tank back up and running.

If there is any cyano on your rocks, clean it off before returning it to your clean tank. You can use a turkey baster to blow it off, or a soft bristle toothbrush. I would also consider a peroxide treatment before returning them to your tank. Again, I'll write a separate post for you on this topic.

Fill your tank about half full of saltwater. Or enough to cover the rocks once they are in the tank. You can use saved tank water, new saltwater, or a combination of the two.

Return your rocks to the tank. Then return your livestock. Use a turkey baster to gently blow off any cyano from your corals prior to returning them. If you wish, you can use a peroxide treatment for your corals as well (I'll discuss this later).

Top off the tank with saltwater. Note, you'll need a lot more new saltwater than you think you will.

So if you plan on reusing your sand, it's time to clean it. Use a five gallon bucket. Fill it no more than 1/4 full of sand. Add enough water to cover the sand, plus a few extra inches. I've been using RO/DI water, but you can use saltwater if that seems better to you. Now stir the sand with your hand until the water is nice and dirty, empty the dirty water, and repeat until the water is just slightly cloudy (but not dirty). It's this point where I dump in a bottle of peroxide, stir, empty, then rinse again (but using peroxide is an optional step). Generally I'll let it sit overnight, and rinse it again the next day before I return it to my tank. I know this sounds like a lot, 'cause it is. But it has to be clean, or you risk adding nutrients, organics, or even causing an ammonia spike.

Link to comment

about once a month but I bought a bunch of boxes of it. I can start changing it more if need be.

I'd switch out the activated carbon once a week. Use less if you wish. I'd also start adding some Phosguard to it. You'll have to monitor phosphate to know when to change it out. You want phosphate to be between 0.01 and 0.03 ppm. You don't want it too low or your corals will suffer; and well... you're living what happens when it gets too high. When using a Salifert phosphate kit, you want just the slightest tinge of blue. If you are having problems determining if it reads 0.03 or 0.1, it's way too high.

Link to comment

I can't believe that I have like every kind of algae in my tank.

My clownfish like it, isn't really a good reason to let it be.

 

Once you deal with your nutrient problems, peroxide might be the best way to deal with the remaining algae. I don't like recommending it, but your tank seems like a prime candidate for it. Here is a long thread on using it: http://www.nano-reef.com/topic/268706-peroxide-saves-my-tank-with-pics-to-prove-it/

 

Before starting, manually remove as much algae as you can.

 

What I do is put about three gallons of peroxide in a five gallon bucket, then mix in a cup and a half of salt mix (to make the specific gravity close to my tank water). I use another bucket, this time filled with tank water (to rinse off the peroxide).

 

You can use gloves to protect you hands from the peroxide. It won't really hurt them, but new peroxide can irritate sensitive skin. Eye protection wouldn't hurt either.

 

I dip each rock in the salty peroxide solution for about 5 seconds (or a couple of minutes for any rock that doesn't have livestock on it). Then I pick it up and let it drain off for about 5 to 10 seconds (this provides some more time for the peroxide to oxidize), before rinsing it off good in the bucket of tank water. Then I return it to the tank. You'll notice the rock still bubbles from the peroxide.

 

I've done this with hearty corals and anemones (like RFAs) without losses. However, caution should be used if you keep shrimp (as they seem especially sensitive to peroxide). This can also be hard on your pod populations (even bristle worms).

 

You'll notice the algae start to die over the next couple of days. It usually take a few treatments to be successful. After each round, I use a dental scaler to remove any holdfasts from the rock (prior to the next treatment).

 

This isn't for everyone, but can provide some help in removing stubborn algae that isn't responding to typical nutrient reduction techniques.

Link to comment

Everything i have read says you are safe to vacuum sandbeds 2" or less. You don't want to disturb deeper sandbeds especially 3" or more.

 

Now here is the issue. Tap water. Theres the culprit.

 

If you have been using it for 3 yrs then a lot will have been absorbed into the sand/rocks and when you disturb the sand, you disturb the buildup.

 

I agree with Seabass- either remove and thoroughly wash or replace the sand. I think replacing it or going barebottom is easier than washing what you have.

 

I did see a tank where they had a small amount of sand surrounding the rockwork and it gradually went to bare bottom...this looks awesome.

 

I would suggest using ro/di, ro, or distilled.

 

Do a few good water changes with your own mixed water and your problems will start going away.

I don't trust lfs water.

 

Start testing nitrates and phosphates weekly until things are under control.

 

Carbon- i love Matrix carbon.

You could also try chemi pure blue or chemipure elite.

 

Try changing your floss more often during cyano outbreak

 

Your light and algae. Its known that changing to led lighting can cause algae outbreaks but in this case, I think we found the problem and the lighting just aids the cyano.

 

Cyano in small amounts won't harm the tank but as it spreads and thickens it becomes more toxic and smothers corals.

 

So good news- we found the issue

Bad news- a little more work ahead but it is a fixable issue which is good:)

Link to comment

Everything i have read says you are safe to vacuum sandbeds 2" or less. You don't want to disturb deeper sandbeds especially 3" or more.

While this might be true about releasing accumulated hydrogen sulfide in DSBs, disturbing any mature sand bed (that hasn't been stirred manually, or by animals), can release trapped organics and nutrients in the water. This action can, by itself, be enough to cause an ammonia spike.

 

I like a one inch sand bed because it stays oxygenated. Plus, this layer is more easily kept in motion by nassarius snails, and other critters (helping to release the organics for your filter to remove). This makes it relatively safe to vacuum whenever you wish.

 

I get more uncomfortable about 2 to 3 inch beds because the lower layers tend not to get disturbed and can accumulate more organic matter. This can eventually saturate the bed and cause nutrient issues similar to Hammerstone's tank.

 

Seabass- way to go on the awesome instructions.

Thank you!

Link to comment

Hammer, I'm glad you finally started a tank thread. With help from experienced reefers like Seabass and Clown79 (and many others) I'm sure your tank will be looking awesome in no time. Once you get it cleaned up, having a cleanup crew and NOT using tap water will be key to helping you keep it clean. Besides, clean up crews are almost just as fun to watch as fish and corals. You have a project ahead of you, which while a chore, can be rewarding in and of itself, and the jumpstart you need to stay involved in and excited about your tank. Chin up. Keep us updated. :)

Link to comment

When I said the fish like it, it was a joke. Iam not good at jokes.

I knew you were kidding. But it can be easy to get sucked into the feeling that maybe it's not really that bad. Then pretty soon your tank will look like this:

012316a.jpg

Yep, that's my tank. Looks a lot different today.

 

So you're not alone. Here's a shot from another one of my tanks:

061516a.jpg

Again, it's all clear today. I've gone through most of these problems before, so it's not just something I've read about. It can happen to any of us. Please don't take it as criticism, and there is no reason to feel embarrassed.

Link to comment

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recommended Discussions


×
×
  • Create New...