h3dgehog Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 Anyone tune into the Neptune Systems Announcement Today? The incompatibility of the "old" Apex is not too unexpected given that technology advances and sometimes hardware needs a new facelift. What makes me upset is the fact that they pushed the recent discount to the Apex Gold knowing that it will soon be obsolete and not backwards compatible. That's pretty dishonest. Holding back information that could help in the consumer decision making process in my personal opinion is wrong. That said, I was fairly lucky to have order it this weekend so I will be returning mine ASAP and ordering the Profilux... At least Profilux lets you know that they are putting out a new product PLUS gives you an opportunity to upgrade your old device to meet the new product's standard. Any one else have thoughts? Link to comment
jbb Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 Anyone tune into the Neptune Systems Announcement Today? The incompatibility of the "old" Apex is not too unexpected given that technology advances and sometimes hardware needs a new facelift. What makes me upset is the fact that they pushed the recent discount to the Apex Gold knowing that it will soon be obsolete and not backwards compatible. That's pretty dishonest. Holding back information that could help in the consumer decision making process in my personal opinion is wrong. That said, I was fairly lucky to have order it this weekend so I will be returning mine ASAP and ordering the Profilux... At least Profilux lets you know that they are putting out a new product PLUS gives you an opportunity to upgrade your old device to meet the new product's standard. Any one else have thoughts? Go watch again , it IS backwards compatible and they even made upgradable housings for old modules to match the new color and mounting system that comes with the new unit . Link to comment
h3dgehog Posted May 24, 2016 Author Share Posted May 24, 2016 Go watch again , it IS backwards compatible and they even made upgradable housings for old modules to match the new color and mounting system that comes with the new unit . I was under the impression the EB8 is no longer compatible at all regardless of any "upgrades". Please correct me if I am wrong. Link to comment
jbb Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 I was under the impression the EB8 is no longer compatible at all regardless of any "upgrades". Please correct me if I am wrong.They didn't speak on that , but if so I just see some of the software upgrades won't work with them, and then you also won't have the additional power ports of the new EB832 I would probably lean towards no on the EB8 , but everything else is Link to comment
gus6464 Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 The now classic apex will be fully phased out in 18 months guaranteed Link to comment
Water Dog Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 Go watch again , it IS backwards compatible and they even made upgradable housings for old modules to match the new color and mounting system that comes with the new unit . The new EB832 is NOT backwards compatible with our now "Apex Classic". I really hope this isn't a sign of things to come with new modules they introduce. If that's the case, they're going to have a lot of angry customers, me included. Link to comment
h3dgehog Posted May 24, 2016 Author Share Posted May 24, 2016 In all honesty, the backwards compatibility isn't too bad. I mean I haven't owned an Apex (was going to since mine is on its way here), but technology improves and not everything can be compatible going forward. Neptune just has the nerve to slip this under the rug while enticing people to buy their now "classic" Apex. Link to comment
HarryPotter Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 The new EB832 is NOT backwards compatible with our now "Apex Classic". I really hope this isn't a sign of things to come with new modules they introduce. If that's the case, they're going to have a lot of angry customers, me included. Seriously that would SUCK. Link to comment
Water Dog Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 I just hope that at least the already announced future modules will work, namely the return pump (COR) and the fluid monitoring module (FMM). Also, I hope the Fusion updates and the IOS app will be supported on "Apex Classic". After that, I don't think I'd really need anything else for future upgrades. Link to comment
Tamberav Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 They should have announced it and then discounted the gold as to not upset people who just bought it.... but the classic still works fine and costs $550 vs $800. I won't be upgrading my "apex lite" any time soon at that price point. It just looks like the new one has everything more integrated into a nicer looking package but you are also also paying for things you may not use. For example, I don't need orp, salinity monitor, dimming, or wave pumps ect. I guess if it breaks somehow, you lose everything since its all in one but that is a minor point. Personally I think/hope the "classic" is just their new cheaper starter option since they phased out the jr and lite. As long as they continue to support the classic with fusion, apps, ect. I don't really see any issue. The now classic apex will be fully phased out in 18 months guaranteed The old old apex models from 15 years ago still work on the current one. They have a good track record at keeping most things compatible. Fully phased out in 18 months is sort of dramatic. Link to comment
hyhy Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 This is like the apex ditching the aqua controller (Whatever its name is I forget) right? don't fix it unless it breaks They should have announced it and then discounted the gold as to not upset people who just bought it.... but the classic still works fine and costs $550 vs $800. I won't be upgrading my "apex lite" any time soon at that price point. It just looks like the new one has everything more integrated into a nicer looking package but you are also also paying for things you may not use. For example, I don't need orp, salinity monitor, or wave pumps ect. Personally I think/hope the "classic" is just their new cheaper starter option since they phased out the jr and lite. The old old apex models from 15 years ago still work on the current one. They have a good track record at keeping most things compatible. Fully phased out in 18 months is sort of dramatic. It is already facing out today LOL The now classic apex will be fully phased out in 18 months guaranteed does anyone know how much they charge for the EB832? Link to comment
Tamberav Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 This is like the apex ditching the aqua controller (Whatever its name is I forget) right? don't fix it unless it breaks It is already facing out today LOL does anyone know how much they charge for the EB832? I don't see any evidence that the old apex will suddenly stop working when the new one comes out. They stated new models/features will work with the classic so seems like two routes to the same end. The EB832 offers nothing that is particularly new or "wow" factor. I was honestly hoping their new announcement would be something more innovative. Where the hell is the frozen fish food automatic feeder already? Link to comment
h3dgehog Posted May 24, 2016 Author Share Posted May 24, 2016 I'm just mad I didn't get the newest and greatest with all the shiny new bells and whistles. If I'm paying $500+ on a gadget, I'd hop that it's the latest on market for at least a year till I'm invested in it to the point where I'll find ways to justify upgrading to the next best thing XD Just being honest here~ Link to comment
gus6464 Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 They should have announced it and then discounted the gold as to not upset people who just bought it.... but the classic still works fine and costs $550 vs $800. I won't be upgrading my "apex lite" any time soon at that price point. It just looks like the new one has everything more integrated into a nicer looking package but you are also also paying for things you may not use. For example, I don't need orp, salinity monitor, dimming, or wave pumps ect. I guess if it breaks somehow, you lose everything since its all in one but that is a minor point. Personally I think/hope the "classic" is just their new cheaper starter option since they phased out the jr and lite. As long as they continue to support the classic with fusion, apps, ect. I don't really see any issue. The old old apex models from 15 years ago still work on the current one. They have a good track record at keeping most things compatible. Fully phased out in 18 months is sort of dramatic. Actually not really if you think about it. There is no new interface with the new apex. It's still all aquabus which is USB which the classic has. The AC3 from Apex actually replaced the entire connection interface from RJ11 to USB based and to compensate they added an RJ11 port to the Apex. What has changed between the new Apex classic hardware connection wise? Absolutely nothing. So not letting the new EB832 connect to the Apex Classic is nothing but a marketing decision and cash grab. Now let's cover the new Fusion features. The guy who did the presentation is the head of marketing for Neptune. If the new Fusion stuff was coming to Apex classic as well this would be one of the main things that would have been covered in the announcement. Why? Marketing 101. Never omit anything that you know will make your customer happy but always hide and prolong when you are about to piss people off. Now the new headunit. Why reinvent the wheel when there is absolutely zero need to? The aquabus USB interface works perfectly and still modern so there is no need to mess with that. What did they do? Take the apex classic pcb, PM2 pcb, add a wifi chip, and basically stuff it into one pretty new box. All the interfaces are exactly the same. Throughout the presentation you could easily see that this product was designed by marketing and not engineering unlike the original apex which was a complete departure from the old product. From this point on the Apex classic will be getting neutered to all hell in terms of Fusion features in order to force people to buy a whole new device which is not really a whole new device. It's considerably cheaper to force obsolescence via software than hardware and this is exactly what they are doing. Link to comment
holy carp Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 gus - you're probably right, and it's sad to see other companies play Apple games. I do hope they don't cripple the prior versions. Also, the new modules look totally ginormous. I don't think it would even fit in my cabinet where my current Apex is (which I bought only 1 month ago). Link to comment
HarryPotter Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 It's more of a downgrade than an upgrade. They took away 6io ports and the display, they added amp reading on each outlet. Yay? Link to comment
gus6464 Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 It's more of a downgrade than an upgrade. They took away 6io ports and the display, they added amp reading on each outlet. Yay? The amp reading is absolutely useless for most people. Who the hell is going to open their stand to look at the reading? My Apex is in the garage so I will never see it. If anything they should have redesigned the temp probe so it looks like the rest of the probes like DA does. The current temp probe looks cheap and it's a pain to put into regular probe holders which the others just slide into. Link to comment
zsxking Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 The amp reading is absolutely useless for most people. Who the hell is going to open their stand to look at the reading? My Apex is in the garage so I will never see it. If anything they should have redesigned the temp probe so it looks like the rest of the probes like DA does. The current temp probe looks cheap and it's a pain to put into regular probe holders which the others just slide into. Amp reading can be useful to monitor equipment failure though. Link to comment
Tamberav Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 Actually not really if you think about it. There is no new interface with the new apex. It's still all aquabus which is USB which the classic has. The AC3 from Apex actually replaced the entire connection interface from RJ11 to USB based and to compensate they added an RJ11 port to the Apex. What has changed between the new Apex classic hardware connection wise? Absolutely nothing. So not letting the new EB832 connect to the Apex Classic is nothing but a marketing decision and cash grab. Now let's cover the new Fusion features. The guy who did the presentation is the head of marketing for Neptune. If the new Fusion stuff was coming to Apex classic as well this would be one of the main things that would have been covered in the announcement. Why? Marketing 101. Never omit anything that you know will make your customer happy but always hide and prolong when you are about to piss people off. Now the new headunit. Why reinvent the wheel when there is absolutely zero need to? The aquabus USB interface works perfectly and still modern so there is no need to mess with that. What did they do? Take the apex classic pcb, PM2 pcb, add a wifi chip, and basically stuff it into one pretty new box. All the interfaces are exactly the same. Throughout the presentation you could easily see that this product was designed by marketing and not engineering unlike the original apex which was a complete departure from the old product. From this point on the Apex classic will be getting neutered to all hell in terms of Fusion features in order to force people to buy a whole new device which is not really a whole new device. It's considerably cheaper to force obsolescence via software than hardware and this is exactly what they are doing. I don't see any proof it will be neutered, just assumptions. You guys are jumping the gun. https://www.neptunesystems.com/faq-for-customers-about-the-next-generation-apex/ The Apex Classic will continue to be sold and supported both with Apex Fusion as well as new product releases such as the upcoming FMM (Fluid Monitoring Module) and COR (Return Pump). The Apex Classic product HAS NOT been end-of-lifed. Think of it like the iPad and the iPad Pro. Link to comment
blkhwkz Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 The amp reading is absolutely useless for most people. Who the hell is going to open their stand to look at the reading? My Apex is in the garage so I will never see it. If anything they should have redesigned the temp probe so it looks like the rest of the probes like DA does. The current temp probe looks cheap and it's a pain to put into regular probe holders which the others just slide into. The amp reading is done via the same software you look at for everything else. The assumptions in this thread are kind of funny. I was planning on getting an Apex for my new build. Now I need to decide if I want this one or not. Considering I had no plans to buy the gold before this announcement, I will probably end up with the classic. Link to comment
NYfishies Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 I don't see any proof it will be neutered, just assumptions. You guys are jumping the gun. https://www.neptunesystems.com/faq-for-customers-about-the-next-generation-apex/ The Apex Classic will continue to be sold and supported both with Apex Fusion as well as new product releases such as the upcoming FMM (Fluid Monitoring Module) and COR (Return Pump). The Apex Classic product HAS NOT been end-of-lifed. Think of it like the iPad and the iPad Pro. I was just about to post this link. Chill out current Apex users (I have $3,000 in 2 full Apex Gold's at home as we speak) all is fine. This is for people who do not already own an Apex or for somebody with a lot of money who wants the WIFI convenience and the ability to plug their WAV and DOS directly to the brain without using a plug. Link to comment
masterbuilder Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 It's new and different. So....no matter if it's better or worse than before.... I must hate it. Link to comment
HarryPotter Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 I'm happy about this; apex "classic" accessories are going to crash in price!!! See here http://www.nano-reef.com/topic/373907-apex-controller-new-lab-grade-ph/#entry5338040 Link to comment
HarryPotter Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 Hey way too many rumors. Its not getting phased out, the Apex classic is getting even more features. https://www.neptunesystems.com/faq-for-customers-about-the-next-generation-apex/ I was under the impression the EB8 is no longer compatible at all regardless of any "upgrades". Please correct me if I am wrong. Link to comment
tanacharison Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 Hey way too many rumors. Its not getting phased out, the Apex classic is getting even more features.https://www.neptunesystems.com/faq-for-customers-about-the-next-generation-apex/ So i've concluded this is summer I get an apex running on more than one tank. +1 to the OG Link to comment
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