Jump to content
ReefCleaners.org

Operation Cyano - Ughhhhh, tanksitter woes!


uisge-beatha

Recommended Posts

uisge-beatha

I’ve been battling cyanobacteria on my sand bed for a few months with weekly 10-15% WC and aggressive sand vacuuming, but it’s starting to migrate to my rocks, so it’s time for a stronger reaction. Some background… the cyanobacteria took hold because I was overfeeding to try to get a finicky fish to eat, while at the same time experimenting with changing water every two weeks instead of one week. In retrospect, not the best plan, but… live and learn.

 

The data… 6 month-old 24 gal nanocube, RODI, 2 fish, 2 shrimp, softies & one LPS. No skimmer or media reactor, running passive carbon only. Nitrates and phosphates are both elevated, judging by the healthy crop of both GHA and cyano. <_< I ran out of test kits for NO2 and PhO4 a month ago, and have more on order. DI resin is nearly exhausted, but output water is still testing at 0-1 ppm TDS.

 

Here’s the plan:

  1. Change the DI resin.
  2. Measure nitrates and phosphates to get baseline measurement. I expect that phosphates might be artifically low due to it being gobbled up by the cyano.
  3. Start dosing MB7 to out-compete the cyano.
  4. Start running about 1 tbsp Phosban in TLF reactor (combined with carbon to create minimum required volume) to remove the phosphate that will be freed as the cyano (hopefully) dies.
  5. Continue weekly WC and monitor nitrates, phosphates, and algae/cyano behaviour.

How does this sound to everyone?

Link to comment
mystersyster

I just want to point out I'm having a minor issue that I'm slowly beating... and I don't know how much gfo will take it out. I've been running a reactor for a while. Cyano gets its energy from photosynthesis.

Link to comment
phillyclownfish

I had an issue with my tank at about 3-6 months. Used my old rock but used new sand when I started my recent tank. I just continued to siphon and do my water changes and now its pretty much all gone. Was just using purigen and chemi pure blue. Key it to siphon it all out. If you leave some behind you know the rest...

Link to comment
mystersyster

I had an issue with my tank at about 3-6 months. Used my old rock but used new sand when I started my recent tank. I just continued to siphon and do my water changes and now its pretty much all gone. Was just using purigen and chemi pure blue. Key it to siphon it all out. If you leave some behind you know the rest...

+1 and I remember not to do anything drastic. You could always use chemiclean/red slime remover. It's reef safe, just make sure you follow instructions completely and point power head towards surface.

Link to comment
brandon429

I vote remove all the waste contributing w full tank cleaning all at once, the big thorough reset job, the hard work making your tank fully free of detritus in the sandbed job.

Link to comment
uisge-beatha

Thanks, everyone.

 

Will definitely go slowly with any treatments or changes. I'm considering the chemiclean option, but I'd like to try the MB7 first as it's less likely to cause problems.

 

Brandon429 - agreed, but I've been deep cleaning with every WC for several months, i.e. basting rock, cleaning pumps & back chambers, rinsing filter sponge, complete vacuuming of sand bed. The cyano keeps coming back, so I think I need to change the balance in the aquarium somehow.

Link to comment

I got rid of mine in about 6 weeks with weekly 30% WC, a small chemipure plus some phosguard, and siphoning out all the sand that had cyano on it with each WC. When I siphoned out the sand, I rinsed it briefly in lukewarm tap and then returned it to the tank.

 

Hope that helps. Good luck.

Link to comment
uisge-beatha

Thanks for your feedback, everyone! I finally got my new Salifert test kits, and the results were a bit surprising: nitrate 0.2 ppm, phosphate < 0.03 ppm. With phosphate that low, I'm not going to add any phosphate removing media. I've started the MB7 dosing today, in addition to my regular deep-cleaning efforts, and I'll update this thread with the results. If that doesn't work, I'll look at chemiclean or erythromycin.

Link to comment
brandon429

That's good plan so far, mb7 is safer. Also don't discount the sand bed cleaning, what you are doing is better than no cleaning but it's still a partial action compared to a disassembly cleaning which removes all detritus at once

 

current way mixes it around into the water as cyano feed/ leaves some in the bed because only external cleaning removes all possible cyano, and cyano fuel. if you reached into the tank right now and grabbed a handful of sand and dropped it down, a massive cloud might result. If so, cyano fuel. If not, sand is not the source

 

The rip cleaned bed can be flipped 180 in the same tank and not cloud, that's the difference level should clouding be an issue

 

 

 

 

 

Any time a tank doesn't respond to light cleaning, or mb7 competitor bac, and requires antibiotic meds, the tank likely has waste issues, not cyano issues pics would show if applicable

 

I'd change up options and exclude the chemical clean just my take for next step, chemi clean has variable outcomes. It's no fun to repeat variable outcome steps, only once is worth the time to try a water action when a tank cleaning (which passes the clouding test) is the first go fix

Link to comment
uisge-beatha

Thanks very much for your detailed response, brandon429. :flower: Your point about the debris remaining in even a well-vacuumed sand bed is a good one. I hope I don't need to resort to removal and cleaning of the sand bed, but it's certain possible - one of the benefits of nano tanks!

 

I also completely agree with you about the bacterial balance in SW tanks - a tank that has no nuisance algae and cyanobacteria is hosting bacteria that favour these conditions. Something is definitely out of balance in my tank, and the cyanobacteria are simply one of the symptom. My hope is that the MB7, in combination with continued deep cleaning, will change the bacterial balance to one I like better! I've also brought a skimmer online (Tunze 9001) as of a few days ago, which will hopefully start to remove some of the organics before they have a chance to break down and feed the nuisance organisms.

 

I'll post pics tomorrow once the lights are back on, and you can see the tank in all its glory... or lack thereof! :rolleyes:

Link to comment
uisge-beatha

Here are some pics of the tank and its issues. The cyano actually seems to be somewhat lessened this morning, although we'll see what happens once the lights are on for a few hours.

 

Feeding is minimal: tiny pinch of flake & micro-pellets OR about 1/8 cube of frozen (not rinsed) daily. CUC consists of emerald crab, 3 blue-legged hermits, 4 astrea, 6 cerith, 9 nassarius, and 2 nerite snails. I may have lost some of the ceriths over the last 6 months, but everyone else is accounted for.

 

From two weeks ago:

IMG_1951_zps4hfwtryo.jpg

 

Today. Note that I haven't cleaned the glass in these pictures to show the cyano/algae build-up on the glass - I cleaned it yesterday afternoon, but the clouding comes back quickly.

IMG_2009_zpswa7fypsa.jpg

 

Close-up:

IMG_2010_zpschzmwstk.jpg

 

Side view:

IMG_2011_zpsxux2mini.jpg

Link to comment
uisge-beatha

Today's progress... on day 3 of MB7 dosing. It's hard to see in the picture, but the cyano actually less today. It didn't return to the rocks after basting it off yesterday, and there was less on the glass today too. I'll do a WC and vacuum the sand later today.

 

IMG_2013_zpsmpuadpnt.jpg

 

There's also a faint smell of hydrogen sulphide in the area of the tank today, which makes me think that something is dying... hopefully cyanobacteria. <_<

Link to comment
  • 2 weeks later...
uisge-beatha

It's now been a few weeks since implementing my plan of attack to fight the cyano outbreak in my tank. My approach was as follows:

1) Weekly sand vacuuming with 20% WC (as usual)

2) Daily cleaning of rocks and thorough sand stirring with turkey baster.

3) Daily dosing of MB7 (5 mL for 24 gal tank) for two weeks.

4) Adding Tunze 9001 skimmer to remove organics before they can break down.


Before starting this process, the cyano was advancing up my rock structure, and was threatening to cover my coral. Now, I'm very pleased to report that the cyano is completely gone from the rocks and mostly gone from the sand bed. B)

 

I'm going to slowly reduce the MB7 dosage until I'm on a weekly maintenance dose. However, I suspect that the skimmer was the major factor in the cyano reduction. I still have a pretty good GHA outbreak on my rocks, so that's next on my list of problems to solve. Interestingly, my sand bed is pretty clean, and passes brandon429's drop test. However, my rocks consistently release a huge amount of debris; I suspect this is a side effect of using Gulf live rock with its large amount of microfauna. I'm also going to monitor nitrate and phosphate levels, and consider adding adsorption media going forward.

 

Before pic:

IMG_2013_zpsmpuadpnt.jpg

 

 

After pic:

IMG_2034_zpsgu3prjxx.jpg

Link to comment
brandon429

drop test passer=linked to our thread below for others who have to delve into a bed to see how its done thorough, even if you did it in sections. the export mattered, not the all at once.

 

thanks tons for that mighty nice shot update. hand guiding gold. you guided the bed clean vs one rip change, same ends

 

 

mb7 is a fine bioassistant to use for your cause, there are so many posts of that helping as a combatant against the bad cells, I don't see how you could go wrong with this approach.

 

http://reef2reef.com/threads/the-official-sand-rinse-thread-aka-one-against-many.230281/page-4

 

see bottom

Link to comment
  • 1 month later...
SquishyFishy

I just redid my bed, replacing rubble with course Live Caribbsea Bimini sand. Removed everything I could cleaned like a banshee, replaced floss 5 times! 2 days in, the Cyano has returned! :furious:

 

I have a skimmer running with Phosban and carbon running along with Chemipure.

 

I blast almost every day, WC 10 days to bi weekly.

 

I have fed my fish every day once a day with a pinch of Thera A granules and once a week, Rod's food and mysis. Coral are only fed Phyto Feast once a week. Cyano seemed to be only in a part of the tank where the light was predominate. I've used ChemiClean and Red Slime Remover to no avail...it always comes back. I have recently been dosing Red Seas NOPOX too, this stuff is just horrifically stubborn. Let me know if this works. But I've all but done it myself at one time or another. I had the light cycle turned down to just 5 hrs a day and the corals got peeved so its back up to around 8 hrs. now.

 

I think its so unfair that my lfs' tanks are only WC every 3 weeks and they do not seem to have a problem at all.,,these are their show tanks,

Link to comment
uisge-beatha

Sigh, and I was doing so well! :wacko:

 

I got back from a two-week vacation last night, and knew something was wrong with the tank as soon as I entered the house - I could smell trouble. Note before and after pics below.

 

IMG_2034_zpsgu3prjxx.jpg

 

IMG_2132_zpsa8mx451o.jpg

 

My tank sitter must have bumped the autofeeder, because the opening was too wide. Instead of dropping a few pellets twice a day, it was dropping a metric tonne of food. Okay, more like 10x too much food, but still! :eek:

 

I think I'm gonna have to rip clean the tank to fix this problem. When I turkey baste the rocks, the water gets absolutely thick with uneaten food. I need to figure out how to get it out of there before it breaks down any further. Then I need to figure out how to battle back from all this cyano. This is not going to be fun. <_<

Link to comment

You could do a teardown. I've seen store owners vacuum their tanks with a canister filter. If you have the money that might be an option. Usually cyano likes low flow and low light and I think I heard someone say that it sustains itself with its nitrogen so even if you remove phosphates and nitrates it can still stick around. I have a little cyano and I have a skimmer, filter pad, chemi-pure blue and I'm putting an algae scrubber in soon. That is also an option.

Link to comment

Woah. Did you stop/lessen the MB7 dosing like you mentioned? In your situation, I would've actually overdosed it while doing the rigorous cleaning, and continued to dose it even after the cyano disappeared. Along with fresh activated carbon at least once a week (it may exhaust faster as cyano dies or the detritus is kicked into the water column), GFO to limit phosphate's availability, etc.

 

Also maybe Microbacter Clean might be better at outcompeting the cyano?

Link to comment
uisge-beatha

jeffmr4: yup, that's what I did! See Post #53 under http://www.nano-reef.com/topic/367533-24-gal-water-of-life-rip-clean-time/page-3

 

Mariaface: yes, I had slowly lessened the MB7 dose. I was also back to changing the carbon every 2 wks. It had been 2 months since I got the cyano under control, so everything was pretty much back to normal before the vacation. Clearly, however, the cyano was just biding its time, waiting for its chance to strike again! <_<

Link to comment

I am having a horrible time with cyano. First I was starving my coral. Tank was too clean. Now ithe cyano is out of control. Phosphates have remained at 0

Link to comment

Not that its any consolation but cyanobacteria are thought to have caused the oxygenation of the earth and Prochlorococcus (a type of cyanobacteria) is said to provide half of the ocean's photosynthesis.


uwharrie, is that using a low phosphate test kit? Mine test close to 0 but that is with an api test kit which doesn't measure smaller amounts.

Link to comment

Yes I got a low test kit

Not that its any consolation but cyanobacteria are thought to have caused the oxygenation of the earth and Prochlorococcus (a type of cyanobacteria) is said to provide half of the ocean's photosynthesis.

uwharrie, is that using a low phosphate test kit? Mine test close to 0 but that is with an api test kit which doesn't measure smaller amounts.

Link to comment

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recommended Discussions

×
×
  • Create New...