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Mother is interested in a small reef. Advise.


Sunstar

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My mother is showing a keen interest in having a reef of her own. But she has some issues - so I would like to get suggestions on equipment choices, that, with my assistance, that can allow her to have her reef - and enjoy it too.

 

My mum is somewhat disabled - a lot of knee issues, mostly a result from the chemo she had a few years ago. I am thinking Micro Reefs might be the type of tank she would be interested in, possibly no larger than about 4 gallons give or take.

 

I can easily supply her with mixed Salt water and RODI.

 

I could get her to get beverage containers with the tap to use as water dispensers for ease of water changes for her. I would like to keep her water changes simple to about a couple cups of water a day or a litre a week - perhaps not have.

 

I would suggest to her to get a nanobox tide Plus M - Easy for us to set up, and I can assist in managing her lighting. Failing that option - what other easily controlled light would go over a system that is tiny.

 

I might suggest to her an AIO, however space for a ATO float may be limited - so other alternative is a micro reefs reef ready tank and sump + ato. I was thinking three chambered without refugium. I want her to have an ATO because that will allow her peace of mind. She can go away for a night and not worry.

 

So I would be interested in suggestions for

Alternative non nanobox light,

Skimmer for such a small sump

Other equipment.

 

I want to avoid dosing - I can always bring my stuff or decant some if she really needs it.

 

Livestock I will have her avoid - anemone, SPS and NPS.

She indicates she wants zoanthids.

Livestock I think she would enjoy, Trumpet corals, acans and gorgonians (flow depending)

 

However she has also indicated a strong desire for sea horses. A creature she has always been in love with - I have cautioned her on that, because they are tricky and a lot of the beautiful things she loves about my reef she just couldn't have because the ponies would be harmed.

 

My mum can afford good quality equipment. And if I can't give her answers, I know you amazing guys can. I'll get her to get an account here if she does go the route of reef.

 

I am fully aware that picos can be somewhat trickier - hence my desire to get the best possible equipment to aid her, and with my experience I think we can do it.

 

Pico tank would also be easier, should the need arise for me to take it into my home.

 

So could some of you pico folks chime in with what you feel is the best equipment for an ease of operation (with assistance) pico reef?

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I wouldn't do seahorses period. The dwarfs need a brine shrimp hatchery and the standard need at least a 30 gallon tall tank.

 

For her tank, if you're going to stay in the 4 gallon range, maybe ricordea and zoanthid tank with a candy pistol shrimp (and other cool inverts like sexy shrimp) and maybe a hi-fin goby. Then the lighting requirements would be minimal, a skimmer will not be necessary with daily water changes and neither will dosing, and she can still have a colorful tank.

 

I would also stay away from acans in such a small tank. You really want to avoid all aggressive corals with sweepers in such a little tank.

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I wouldn't do seahorses period. The dwarfs need a brine shrimp hatchery and the standard need at least a 30 gallon tall tank.

 

For her tank, if you're going to stay in the 4 gallon range, maybe ricordea and zoanthid tank with a candy pistol shrimp (and other cool inverts like sexy shrimp) and maybe a hi-fin goby. Then the lighting requirements would be minimal, a skimmer will not be necessary with daily water changes and neither will dosing, and she can still have a colorful tank.

I never thought about the live brine shrimp. I know I am starting some cultures and I got loads of mysids kicking about. I had a neon goby in my DIY pico. I want her to avoid the largely complicated things, feeding stuff live foods is not her forte. She is an artist (mosaics) and loves colour, so colourful is important. I am still leaning toward sump because of hte ATO, I am not liking the smart ATO much, they seem to be beeping for whatever the hell.

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Elizabeth94

Really? How often do you scrub the sensor? I have had mine set up for quite a while, but scrub it with a tooth brush every few days to keep it clean. Never had an issue yet, but maybe I am just lucky?

 

I am not liking the smart ATO much, they seem to be beeping for whatever the hell.

 

I would probably set her up with a nice easy AIO tank. Very user friendly and many have modifications if she ever feels the need to "tinker" with her tank, i know I do As for lighting I think you are right to think about the nano box since they are so small and controllable. But don't leave out the AI Prime, I really have nothing bad to say about mine and it was a great price. Someone posted on the forum that they came out with a new gooseneck for it, Ill be picking one up soon.

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Really? How often do you scrub the sensor? I have had mine set up for quite a while, but scrub it with a tooth brush every few days to keep it clean. Never had an issue yet, but maybe I am just lucky?

it could be because they have it at work, and that tank is... a lost cause - I try not to think about that tradgedy (its not in my control and the one maintaining it is a moron). Everytime I go near that tank the darned thing is beeping. But if you could give me more information on your experiences with it, I would consider a real properly maintained view than what we got at my work place.

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I never thought about the live brine shrimp. I know I am starting some cultures and I got loads of mysids kicking about. I had a neon goby in my DIY pico. I want her to avoid the largely complicated things, feeding stuff live foods is not her forte. She is an artist (mosaics) and loves colour, so colourful is important. I am still leaning toward sump because of hte ATO, I am not liking the smart ATO much, they seem to be beeping for whatever the hell.

I have a hydor smartlevel ATO and never had any issues. it's been running for a year and a half.

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Talk to lawn,his mom has a tank.

LAWN! I summon you!!!

 

 

Edit: I suppose I should write down a pros and cons page for the two ATO's and see what works.

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Elizabeth94

Oh yes, I remember your post about the work tank. I wouldn't judge any piece of equipment that is on that tank lol. I do nothing special to keep it working right. I just scrub the sensor gently every water change or every few days. Gives me piece of mind knowing it is clean. I also make sure the reservoir is always filed above the pump, just incase.

 

I used to use a float valve set up in my 29gal, but it was not nearly as nice as the optical eye.

 

Mine is the Smart ATO Micro Top off (the new one the size of a penny), not sure if thats the same as the hydor smart level, i don't think it is.

 

it could be because they have it at work, and that tank is... a lost cause - I try not to think about that tradgedy (its not in my control and the one maintaining it is a moron). Everytime I go near that tank the darned thing is beeping. But if you could give me more information on your experiences with it, I would consider a real properly maintained view than what we got at my work place.

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Oh yes, I remember your post about the work tank. I wouldn't judge any piece of equipment that is on that tank lol. I do nothing special to keep it working right. I just scrub the sensor gently every water change or every few days. Gives me piece of mind knowing it is clean. I also make sure the reservoir is always filed above the pump, just incase.

 

I used to use a float valve set up in my 29gal, but it was not nearly as nice as the optical eye.

 

Mine is the Smart ATO Micro Top off (the new one the size of a penny), not sure if thats the same as the hydor smart level, i don't think it is.

New one size of a penny, this one is about half dollar sized, have a link to this tiny bitty baby?

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Elizabeth94

Here you are :)

It has been working really well and is really efficient. It used to be $99 when it first came out, I didn't realize the price went up. If it helps, I would still purchase it at this price, in my opinion it is worth it. This thing literally keeps my fusions water level within a table spoon of water. It even starts filling the tank when I take a little bit of water out to thaw some mysis.

 

I am sure there are people who have encountered issues as usual, but so far I have nothing bad to say about it.

 

http://www.marinedepot.com/AutoAqua_Smart_ATO_Micro_Automatic_Top_Off_System_Auto_Top_Off_Units-AutoAqua-CV12117-FIDPAT-vi.html

New one size of a penny, this one is about half dollar sized, have a link to this tiny bitty baby?

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yeah that is not the same thing as we got on that travesty. OMG... I want one for myself now!!! Okay that is definitely on the list of possibilities. If mum does not get that, I might.

 

One thing she can easily consider is picking corals she likes, and taking them to my place where I can Quarantine them, even fish can be QT'd here and that way I can observe them and she would not need to worry about sickness.

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For a parent tank I would honestly just keep it simple... Try to let her make as many decisions as possible and definitely don't rush it.

 

Like send her a few links of some different reef styles and then based on what style suits her a list of potential tanks, lights, pumps, etc that fits her style. Then she can put together what she wants looks/price wise and all you do is give it a quick review. IME with others that works better than showing the things you would get because then it's your tank and not theirs. Giving her options so she can build her own setup will make her feel more a part of the build. With regard to the other accommodations the ATO is a good idea, and with your help I'm sure you can work to create a simple maintenance routine that doesn't involve too much heavy lifting or anything. Extra equipment like a skimmer and such IMO aren't needed.

 

Same with livestock - offer to go to the LFS with her but let her sort of make the decisions. And even if some of them aren't the greatest decisions she can learn from them. I guess that's my advice... Probably not applicable for everyone though - I'm sure there are some who would rather that you just design the system for them and teach them about the maintenance once it's up and running.

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For a parent tank I would honestly just keep it simple... Try to let her make as many decisions as possible and definitely don't rush it.

 

Like send her a few links of some different reef styles and then based on what style suits her a list of potential tanks, lights, pumps, etc that fits her style. Then she can put together what she wants looks/price wise and all you do is give it a quick review. IME with others that works better than showing the things you would get because then it's your tank and not theirs. Giving her options so she can build her own setup will make her feel more a part of the build. With regard to the other accommodations the ATO is a good idea, and with your help I'm sure you can work to create a simple maintenance routine that doesn't involve too much heavy lifting or anything. Extra equipment like a skimmer and such IMO aren't needed.

 

Same with livestock - offer to go to the LFS with her but let her sort of make the decisions. And even if some of them aren't the greatest decisions she can learn from them. I guess that's my advice... Probably not applicable for everyone though - I'm sure there are some who would rather that you just design the system for them and teach them about the maintenance once it's up and running.

I have sent her some links to look at. I think, for a stand we can get my brother in law to build it. providing I can get him to understand that chipboard just... just no. I want her to make choices, I would advise her. She has every bit of support and my nerdiness would allow for me to properly QT stuff.

 

What do you mean by reef styles exatly?

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What do you mean by reef styles exatly?

 

By reef styles I simply mean how she wants the tank to look/feel. So some tanks go with lots of rock, some with less rock. Some tanks have macros, some are softies only, some are mixed reef, rimmed vs rimless, etc... It's that look you're trying to achieve. It's better to see a tank first and say "that's what I want" than to buy a biocube because it's about the size you want and on sale only to realize you like the look of a 12g long much better.

 

It's all about looking at as many setups as you can.

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By reef styles I simply mean how she wants the tank to look/feel. So some tanks go with lots of rock, some with less rock. Some tanks have macros, some are softies only, some are mixed reef, rimmed vs rimless, etc... It's that look you're trying to achieve. It's better to see a tank first and say "that's what I want" than to buy a biocube because it's about the size you want and on sale only to realize you like the look of a 12g long much better.

 

It's all about looking at as many setups as you can.

I will get her looking, and if she chooses a style then I will see about helping her pick hte right type of rock. She loves purple so I could see her selecting real reef rock. Then again, she might think it ugly. We don't have a whole lot of LFS options here.

 

After some thought, I may direct her to the AIO because of her inability to get into lower locations, a sump might be problematic. I will do more research into the mini smart and the hydor ATO's because those are the best possible options. ATO is not optional for her. (And I am also in the market for another ATO as it were)

 

And LOL, I can imagine setting up the rocks with her. Being she is an artist, she can be extremely particular about how things are placed on walls and whatnot. Sometimes, just to make her twitch, I make a picture crooked.

 

 

I was under the impression there were smaller than 10 gallon IM tanks, I went to the IM site and did not see them - I was going to have her look at those.

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I wouldn't do seahorses period. The dwarfs need a brine shrimp hatchery and the standard need at least a 30 gallon tall tank.

 

For her tank, if you're going to stay in the 4 gallon range, maybe ricordea and zoanthid tank with a candy pistol shrimp (and other cool inverts like sexy shrimp) and maybe a hi-fin goby. Then the lighting requirements would be minimal, a skimmer will not be necessary with daily water changes and neither will dosing, and she can still have a colorful tank.

 

I would also stay away from acans in such a small tank. You really want to avoid all aggressive corals with sweepers in such a little tank.

 

actually the dwarves will do fine in a 5ish gal tank, the main problem is food as you mentioned, and hydroids .-.

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actually the dwarves will do fine in a 5ish gal tank, the main problem is food as you mentioned, and hydroids .-.

My mum is the sort of person, that if her beloved sea horses were to keel over, she would cry insanely for days. They are a species of fish, I am not overly keen on trying to keep myself. bad enough when her betta fish get old and die. She gets very emotionally invested in things. I mean, if that is what she ultimately wants, then I would do my best to learn what I can on the subject so I can assist her.

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Being a seahorse keeper myself i do not recommend that as a first fish, especially dwarfs as it can be rigorous keeping up with feeding and maintenance.

I do recommend the Smart ATO. I have had mine for a year and a half and it works wonderfully. I love it and it was simple to set up, unlike my first ATO that had floats and switches and then failed on occasion.

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I haven't read through all the responses, but agree with Dawn about the seahorses. They're one of my favorites as well, however, I know that I won't give them the care they deserve and need so it's better to admire from afar :)

 

In regards to an AIO - I actually think for your mum that is the way to go. If you go with a sumped system, there's lots of bending down to do stuff in the sump and that may be tough for her. Have you looked at the IM Fusion 10s? Teeny has one, as does KGuske2 and a bunch of others. I think the AIO compartments are big enough for ATO stuffs and I think with just a little more water volume, it will be easier to offset say an over-feeding or two. With anything smaller than 6 gallons, I think it is much tougher to keep water parameters stable. With 10 gallons, all your mom would need to change out is a gallon a week and I think that is easy enough. Plus, it will open up fish choices just a little. A clown would be good since they're hardy and they add a nice burst of color to a tank. Plus, with a bit more height, you can definitely add some gorgs and other types of flowy coral.


Also, a thought on the lighting. Have you looked at the AI Primes? it's the light Lawn has over his tank and it seems really user-friendly. Might be another option rather than NanoBox, however, I still say go with a tide :)

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I haven't read through all the responses, but agree with Dawn about the seahorses. They're one of my favorites as well, however, I know that I won't give them the care they deserve and need so it's better to admire from afar :)

 

In regards to an AIO - I actually think for your mum that is the way to go. If you go with a sumped system, there's lots of bending down to do stuff in the sump and that may be tough for her. Have you looked at the IM Fusion 10s? Teeny has one, as does KGuske2 and a bunch of others. I think the AIO compartments are big enough for ATO stuffs and I think with just a little more water volume, it will be easier to offset say an over-feeding or two. With anything smaller than 6 gallons, I think it is much tougher to keep water parameters stable. With 10 gallons, all your mom would need to change out is a gallon a week and I think that is easy enough. Plus, it will open up fish choices just a little. A clown would be good since they're hardy and they add a nice burst of color to a tank. Plus, with a bit more height, you can definitely add some gorgs and other types of flowy coral.

 

Also, a thought on the lighting. Have you looked at the AI Primes? it's the light Lawn has over his tank and it seems really user-friendly. Might be another option rather than NanoBox, however, I still say go with a tide :)

I have a fusion 10, so I know how its operation is. I just feel, that mightbe a bit too big for her. I love mine. But if I am not there to do a water change once a week.

 

Part of me thinks that an acrylic would work for her on teh ground of it less likely having its seams fail - downside is scratching. I never owned one,s o I do n ot know the best way to clean them.

 

Mum, if shelooks att his thread and I gave her the link, should know the Fusion 10 (my tank) is 12"x13"x15"deep

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actually the dwarves will do fine in a 5ish gal tank, the main problem is food as you mentioned, and hydroids .-.

He wants a low mainanence tank and a tank that can be left alont for a night or a weekend. A dwarf tank def does not meet those reqs.

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Simplicity is in the waterchanges...

If your mom isn't energy intensive go big

29 gallons with a high quality skimmer. To reduce water changes. A bigger cabinet so you can store 5 gallons of top off and 5 gallons of salt water.

 

Automate the water changes with a litremeter3 or with a DJ power bar so she can flip a switch pump a gallon out and then flip a switch and pump a gallon in.

 

I saw a nano set up like this with a litremeter3 all you had to do was fill the water chambers.

 

A little 1/10 Hp chiller and a quality light your good to go.

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Simplicity is in the waterchanges...

If your mom isn't energy intensive go big

29 gallons with a high quality skimmer. To reduce water changes. A bigger cabinet so you can store 5 gallons of top off and 5 gallons of salt water.

 

Automate the water changes with a litremeter3 or with a DJ power bar so she can flip a switch pump a gallon out and then flip a switch and pump a gallon in.

 

I saw a nano set up like this with a litremeter3 all you had to do was fill the water chambers.

 

A little 1/10 Hp chiller and a quality light your good to go.

Limitations are apartment lease rules. I am think she can have a small tank - but anything larger could be more problematic for her with building management.

 

I was watching something about the litremeter the other week. I was drooling. But that sort of setup screams me - more so than her. ALso I would need somewhere to plumb wastewater out.

 

I was looking at the hydor ATO.

 

Those who use it, can you elaborate on your experiences with it? What pump do you use, is it easy to set up? I had a hard time reading the instructions - it appears my prescription for monocle is needing changing.

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