madtownguy Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 So I picked up some more live rock yesterday and I went against my gut instinct and started to believe the pet store guy since I have been out of the salt water game so long I thought maybe something changed and fish were hardier. I was going to throw a damsel in my tank just so my wife is satisfied, and then kill the damsel once the tank is ready to push forward. Telling the fish store guy that he said I could do a clown which is on my list down the road that they are virtually impossible to kill. I then told him I haven't tested the water, I don't even have a salinity measure or thermometer so that would be pretty damn risky. He said as long as it's anywhere close it will be fine. I've never got advice like that from a fish guy before, I knew better. So far the fish is not dead, but it is definitely struggling. I was surprised it made it through the night. I've actually heard one other fish place say that they will throw in clown fish right away on new tanks. I personally think it's too soon and there's nothing gained from it. Perhaps my poor clown fish will make it, but he isn't very happy right now. I'm so disappointing with the salt water fish "experts" in central Florida. I hope this hasn't become an industry standard. Nemo should never have to suffer after what he went through at the dentists office. Link to comment
HarryPotter Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 So I picked up some more live rock yesterday and I went against my gut instinct and started to believe the pet store guy since I have been out of the salt water game so long I thought maybe something changed and fish were hardier. I was going to throw a damsel in my tank just so my wife is satisfied, and then kill the damsel once the tank is ready to push forward. Telling the fish store guy that he said I could do a clown which is on my list down the road that they are virtually impossible to kill. I then told him I haven't tested the water, I don't even have a salinity measure or thermometer so that would be pretty damn risky. He said as long as it's anywhere close it will be fine. I've never got advice like that from a fish guy before, I knew better. So far the fish is not dead, but it is definitely struggling. I was surprised it made it through the night. I've actually heard one other fish place say that they will throw in clown fish right away on new tanks. I personally think it's too soon and there's nothing gained from it. Perhaps my poor clown fish will make it, but he isn't very happy right now. I'm so disappointing with the salt water fish "experts" in central Florida. I hope this hasn't become an industry standard. Nemo should never have to suffer after what he went through at the dentists office."I was going to throw in a damsel and then kill it" WTF..... So you don't care about killing a Damsel but are SOOO concerned for a clownfish? I don't get it Anyway it's probably a goner. No cycle, you don't know your salinity, ammonia is probably sky high since you just added live rock, etc. I would definitely pause and start to do some heavy reading. You need a thermometer, refractometer, and a basic API Master Reef test kit before continuing IMO Link to comment
ReefWeeds Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Yeah, I agree with Harry here. Why throw a damsel in to satisfy the wife just to kill it later? I don't get that. There's no need to cycle with live fish. That went "out of style" a long time ago. Bring the poor fish back to the LFS ASAP and start properly cycling your tank which includes testing. Link to comment
atrox Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Not going to make many friends here with you're post. I'd suggest pulling you're head out of you're... and buy the proper equipment. Not being able to even test you're salinity level is laughable. Link to comment
joy13 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 IMO it isn't worth cycling a tank with any live fish, the stress of cycling can cause disease that can only be safely killed by letting the tank sit fallow for 6 or more weeks. BTW a clown is a damsel. Link to comment
bpounds1991 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Do some research please, 9 times out of 10 LFS tend to be out just to make a quick buck. Link to comment
Mr. Microscope Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 You're planning to KILL the damsel??!!! Dude! NOT an acceptable action. Also, just gonna drop this here. Pay special attention to step one and the right side of the flow chart. Link to comment
HarryPotter Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 You're planning to KILL the damsel??!!! Dude! NOT an acceptable action. Also, just gonna drop this here. Pay special attention to step one and the right side of the flow chart. LOL perfect! You make that? It's hilarious Link to comment
pgrVII Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 You're planning to KILL the damsel??!!! Dude! NOT an acceptable action. Also, just gonna drop this here. Pay special attention to step one and the right side of the flow chart. Microscope, you're just too awesome sometimes sir.Science! Link to comment
BulkRate Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Mr. Microscope, that one's going up on the wall next to the bacon flowchart. Not so much for the OP's benefit, but my own. madtownguy - do a little more research in general, at the least it will save you some significant $. At a bare minimum get a midrange refractometer and one of the Seachem ammonia alert test badges so you can determine when your tank's cycle has passed the pit-o'-death point in it's cycle and get the salinity into an acceptable range. Not a lot of problems that can't be fixed in smaller tanks by changing out water. And as for cycling with live fish? If not actively monitoring water parameters and maintaining them such to run a soft-cycle,,, just don't. Cruelty concerns aside a bottle of cultured bacteria & dropper of pure ammonia run all of $20 including shipping and at the need of it you'll have a tank that is ready to handle a light initial stock-up of exactly what you want to have. Link to comment
kirbaay Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 soooo if you are concerned about the fish then why did you put it in the tank? wtf? am i missing something? You can tell your wife to wait. You CAN NOT rush things in this hobby Link to comment
madtownguy Posted July 27, 2015 Author Share Posted July 27, 2015 Whoa whoa whoa, damn guys I don't need to read up I've had many reef tanks in the past. I am not using the fish to cycle my tank, the live rock is for that. A damsel is cheap and to me not very nice looking so I don't really care about it, I have a problem with killing nemo though. Obviously I'm getting a heater, hydrometer and all the crap needed for the tank. But the shipment hasn't arrived yet. I've put fish in right away in certain scenarios if they were cheap, so I know it can be done. But I couldn't believe I let him talk me into putting a nice fish into a tank I have no idea what is going on with anything inside it. He justified it with clown fish being tank raised and as hardy as a damsel which I've never heard before. Most everything should show up today, maybe this guy will get lucky and pull through it. Harry I totally agree with the ammonia, I even told the guy that. Just adding 20lbs of live rock, he said that will help and not hurt. I realize long term help but short term ammonia spike. Well nemo is still alive, if he makes it another 24 hours I will be impressed. Link to comment
HarryPotter Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Whoa whoa whoa, damn guys I don't need to read up I've had many reef tanks in the past. I am not using the fish to cycle my tank, the live rock is for that. A damsel is cheap and to me not very nice looking so I don't really care about it, I have a problem with killing nemo though. Obviously I'm getting a heater, hydrometer and all the crap needed for the tank. But the shipment hasn't arrived yet. I've put fish in right away in certain scenarios if they were cheap, so I know it can be done. But I couldn't believe I let him talk me into putting a nice fish into a tank I have no idea what is going on with anything inside it. He justified it with clown fish being tank raised and as hardy as a damsel which I've never heard before. Most everything should show up today, maybe this guy will get lucky and pull through it. Harry I totally agree with the ammonia, I even told the guy that. Just adding 20lbs of live rock, he said that will help and not hurt. I realize long term help but short term ammonia spike. Well nemo is still alive, if he makes it another 24 hours I will be impressed. Well I just have an issue with you not minding killing a Damsel but you don't want to kill the "Nemo" (clownfish btw) because it's more expensive. It's not about how much you paid for it... It's just shitty to kill a fish accidentally, let alone ON PURPOSE Link to comment
kirbaay Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Whoa whoa whoa, damn guys I don't need to read up I've had many reef tanks in the past. I am not using the fish to cycle my tank, the live rock is for that. A damsel is cheap and to me not very nice looking so I don't really care about it, I have a problem with killing nemo though. Obviously I'm getting a heater, hydrometer and all the crap needed for the tank. But the shipment hasn't arrived yet. I've put fish in right away in certain scenarios if they were cheap, so I know it can be done. But I couldn't believe I let him talk me into putting a nice fish into a tank I have no idea what is going on with anything inside it. He justified it with clown fish being tank raised and as hardy as a damsel which I've never heard before. Most everything should show up today, maybe this guy will get lucky and pull through it. Harry I totally agree with the ammonia, I even told the guy that. Just adding 20lbs of live rock, he said that will help and not hurt. I realize long term help but short term ammonia spike. Well nemo is still alive, if he makes it another 24 hours I will be impressed. You have kept many reef tanks in the past and you are calling a clown fish nemo? LOL. I dont really like some damsels but i wouldnt justify killing one. A fish is a fish. Clownfish are extremely common now i wouldnt call them a 'nice' fish. I am not hating on you btw so dont get butt hurt about my reply Link to comment
ReefWeeds Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Whoa whoa whoa, damn guys I don't need to read up I've had many reef tanks in the past. I am not using the fish to cycle my tank, the live rock is for that. A damsel is cheap and to me not very nice looking so I don't really care about it, I have a problem with killing nemo though. Obviously I'm getting a heater, hydrometer and all the crap needed for the tank. But the shipment hasn't arrived yet. I've put fish in right away in certain scenarios if they were cheap, so I know it can be done. But I couldn't believe I let him talk me into putting a nice fish into a tank I have no idea what is going on with anything inside it. He justified it with clown fish being tank raised and as hardy as a damsel which I've never heard before. Most everything should show up today, maybe this guy will get lucky and pull through it. Harry I totally agree with the ammonia, I even told the guy that. Just adding 20lbs of live rock, he said that will help and not hurt. I realize long term help but short term ammonia spike. Well nemo is still alive, if he makes it another 24 hours I will be impressed. But you don't even have a heater in the tank yet. I honestly don't get it and don't agree with your steps here to cycle the tank. The live rock is used to speed the cycle - without test kits yet, you don't even know if it has enough of a biofilter for the one clown and/or the size of your tank. Regardless of whether or not you have had reef tanks in the past, there aren't many here that are going to agree with your idea of cycling. Link to comment
amphipod Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 mad town, just saying you should probably stop what you are doing, buy salinity testing equipment and whatever else you are missing (probably a lot), and do a full water change, and make things right. second option, euthanize, or refund nemo so he doesn't have to suffer with you anymore, leave the tank fallow, and don't come back to this forum until we have forgot about you (truthfully some people have longer memories than you may realize), maybe switch your forum name to speed our forgetting of you. delete your posts and rename this thread some time in the future and never comment in it again so it isn't really obvious you did this. hope this can help some. Link to comment
kirbaay Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 mad town, just saying you should probably stop what you are doing, buy salinity testing equipment and whatever else you are missing (probably a lot), and do a full water change, and make things right. second option, euthanize, or refund nemo so he doesn't have to suffer with you anymore, leave the tank fallow, and don't come back to this forum until we have forgot about you (truthfully some people have longer memories than you may realize), maybe switch your forum name to speed our forgetting of you. delete your posts and rename this thread some time in the future and never comment in it again so it isn't really obvious you did this. hope this can help some. Thats a little extreme he doesnt have to leave the forums haha. All he has to do is learn from his mistakes and fix them.. We shall forgive!! Link to comment
Murphs_Reef Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 So what we have here is a tank full of possibly freshwater, that's cold, new plan... Get a gold fish! It's kinda the same colour as a clown... In fact - get the gold fish, paint white lines down it and your good to go.... The ammonia will kill it before the paint does anyway so it's cool Link to comment
lkoechle Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 If you had tanks in the past, why would you ever think it would be a good idea to put a tropical fish in a heaterless tank? Or one better, a saltwater tropical fish in a heaterless tank with no salinity check? NVM everything else, you don't even have the most obvious part of the process: temperature and salinity. Even people who know nothing about cycling usually get those two down. Hell, my folks who could care less about fish bought aquarium salt for the freshwater tank my siblings had because it needed to be a little salty (brackish fish). And let me tell you, my parents are not the ideal when it comes to informed fish keepers. They were just following what the sales tag for the fish said! If they can do it, so can you. And yes, usually clowns are considered as hardy as damsels, but you should still never cycle with live fish, cheap or not. Nemo or just some ugly dude. They are still living animals. Link to comment
Snow_Phoenix Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Some people choose to learn the hard way. Don't get me wrong - I started my first setup on the wrong foot as well. But at least I let my tank cycle completely and had the tools (cheap ones like a plastic hydrometer and fake silicon nems) to start off. I have incurred livestock losses along the way thanks to my impatience and carelessness, but never once did I have the mentality of, 'Don't worry - it's just a cheap fish so that I'll kill it LATER.' That's a wrong train of thought to have in the fishkeeping hobby. Right now I'd advice you to return your clownfish to the store or give it away to someone who has a cycled/established tank until your basic equipment arrive. Then read up on cycling and do more research during the weeks when it takes your tank to cycle. Map out your budget, future livestock choices, equipment, setups etc. Spend more time reading and asking questions on forums rather than randomly throwing things into the tank and hoping a magical TOTM setup will pour out of it. Link to comment
Murphs_Reef Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 This has to be a troll. I really hope so.. It's mad to think that some people would actually do this... Link to comment
afyounie Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 I think the real problem here is OP refers to a clownfish as Nemo. I have no idea what type of Nemo we are discussing. Is this a Gold Maroon Nemo, a Tomato Nemo, Skunk Nemo? Seriously though, if you don't care for damsels, don't add one to your tank. Killing a 3 dollar fish is a waste of money and life. Already so many die in transport and such, no reason to add to the death because you don't like the way they look and can't tell your wife to be patient. Link to comment
HarryPotter Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 via Imgflip Meme Maker please don't feed the trolls. Link to comment
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