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Innovative Marine Aquariums

Cycling dry rock


Nstocks

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I've just placed an order for 15KG dry live rock and wanted to start the cycle before my tank arrived in 3 weeks time.

 

If I place the rock in a 50L or smaller bucket with salt water, heater and powerhead, what else should I add to actually start the cycle? I don't want to add any live rock to 'seed' the dry rock, but based on what I've read I could add ammonia to start growing the bacteria. Also how frequent should ammonia tests be carried out as well as any other necessary tests during cycling.

 

Would water changes be needed or would this hinder the cycle? (lots of contradictory information out there)

 

Look out for my build thread in a few weeks :)

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Depends on the rock. A lot of time dry rock will have a lot of dead stuff on the rock unless it's synthetic which I'm assuming it's not. You can start by removing anything organic from the rocks by hand and then just letting it in the heated saltwater with a powerhead. During this time the remaining organics will start to decompose. You can also add ammonia but make sure that the ammonia does not go past 4-5 ppm. Once it goes past 4-5 ppm, the good bacteria begins to die off as it is too high of a concentration. You can normally dose up to 2 ppm and just let it go after that. Once the ammonia drops back down to zero then dose more ammonia. Keep this up and over time you will start seeing nitrites and then nitrates. Water changes should not be necessary but if your ammonia starts going past say 4-5 ppm then I would do a water change.

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+1 depends on the kind of dry base rock you get...

 

If it has some dead stuff on it then no need to dose ammonia, just add some bacterial starter like bio spira or dr. tims and let it sit for a while until the dead stuff decomposes (ammonia is a byproduct of decomposition).

 

If it's clean rock you can dose ammonia as above, but still use the bottled bacteria because you need the right bacteria to consume the ammonia.

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Good point about the bacteria. I used Brightwell Microbacter7 on my tank and it did really well. It was a bit of a "soft cycle" in that I didn't get any spikes but after about 3-4 weeks I added my two clowns and haven't had any problems after 3 weeks now. I did not add any ammonia but I did ghost feed the whole time. Pretty much all you do is feed like you would feed 1-2 small fish. Another option is to toss in a small piece of raw shrimp in the tank. That's also a good way to test if you're fully cycled or not. Toss it in and see if you get any ammonia spikes or anything like that. No spikes = fully cycled. One big thing is to keep your lights off for that.

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Good point about the bacteria. I used Brightwell Microbacter7 on my tank and it did really well. It was a bit of a "soft cycle" in that I didn't get any spikes but after about 3-4 weeks I added my two clowns and haven't had any problems after 3 weeks now. I did not add any ammonia but I did ghost feed the whole time. Pretty much all you do is feed like you would feed 1-2 small fish. Another option is to toss in a small piece of raw shrimp in the tank. That's also a good way to test if you're fully cycled or not. Toss it in and see if you get any ammonia spikes or anything like that. No spikes = fully cycled. One big thing is to keep your lights off for that.

Well, mostly... A cycle isn't a one time event, it's a process (see nitrogen cycle). When we say a tank is "cycled" we're saying it's in equilibrium and the capacity of the biofilter matches the amount of waste being produced in the tank.

 

If you ghost feed, use something that will readily decompose. Pellets and such can take a while. The raw shrimp method seems to get used a lot but be careful because it can introduce bacteria you don't want and cause a bloom or turn the water rancid - ultimately could end up with more work for you. Pure ammonia would probably work the best and certainly gives you the most control over things - but you need to be relatively consistent and dose every day.

 

Good luck.

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The rock came today, very happy with it as I specified the sizes for my tank.

 

It's fairly clean overall, slightly dusty with some dead life on it. From here should I rinse it in pure RODI water before adding it to saltwater and test the ammonia levels (only?) at least once a week?

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Yea, first I would rinse it and try to get as much of the dead organics off of it. From there you can just toss it in a bucket and let it sit for a while. Test about once a week and monitor the ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate for any spikes.

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Basically, you're going to be curing it at this point - not cycling it.

 

Toss it in a bucket with fresh water (don't waste money using salt yet) and a pump and heater and let it go for a day or two.. then pull out a piece and smell it.

 

If it smells like putrid death, repeat with new water.. do this until it stops smelling like death. Then do it once more. Then you're good to put it in the tank :)

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Basically, you're going to be curing it at this point - not cycling it.

 

Toss it in a bucket with fresh water (don't waste money using salt yet) and a pump and heater and let it go for a day or two.. then pull out a piece and smell it.

 

If it smells like putrid death, repeat with new water.. do this until it stops smelling like death. Then do it once more. Then you're good to put it in the tank :)

 

 

Haha, it smells like ocean right now, but I get the hint of ammonia too.

 

I won't be collecting my tank for another 3 weeks so I'm going to start cycling it in a 80lire bucket with a heater and powerhead. I'll either leave it in the bucket until it's established enough bacteria, or continue the process in the tank.

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just some bacteria in a bottle, some strong flow, wiggle and rotate all the rocks to remove detrius, couple of water changes and may a piece of seeded live rock pest free from a trusted source your good to go

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just some bacteria in a bottle, some strong flow, wiggle and rotate all the rocks to remove detrius, couple of water changes and may a piece of seeded live rock pest free from a trusted source your good to go

 

Would bacteria in a bottle be used instead of dosing ammonia if needed?

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If your rock has dead stuff on it there's no need to add additional ammonia. Ammonia is a byproduct of decomposition and too much ammonia is a bad thing as mentioned.

 

As Xris said you're curing at this point - curing simply means you're letting the dead stuff on/in the rock decompose. There's no reason you can't start cycling the rock at the same time though.

 

To do that though you'll need to put the rock in saltwater and use a bacterial supplement (follow directions on bottle) or allow the bacteria to populate naturally - which takes a few weeks longer, at least.

 

If you're in a hurry or you see a lot of dead stuff then you can help the curing process along. Typical methods are to put the rocks into boiling water for a while to loosen up anything that's stuck on the rock and then rinse it off really well. Another simple method is to let the rocks soak in a vinegar solution (maybe 50/50 white vinegar/water) for a day or so. Either of these methods serve only to mechanically or chemically help break down any organics in the rock. It's not always necessary though depending on what kind of rock you have.

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Overall the rocks are fairly clean but I'll give them a soak in RO water for a day or two with a powerhead and go on from there with boiling water/vinegar soak.

 

Is there a preferable bacteria I should use? I know Dr. Tim's is popular but quite pricey, too. It's likely I will be cycling snd curing the rock in a bucket that is approx. 50L - as this is 1/4 of the aquarium volume would that be a problem with the dosage of bacteria or would I just need to leave it a little longer in the bucket (where it is at the right concentration)? The bucket it probably better since it won't have filter socks or protein skimmer...

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Overall the rocks are fairly clean but I'll give them a soak in RO water for a day or two with a powerhead and go on from there with boiling water/vinegar soak.

 

Is there a preferable bacteria I should use? I know Dr. Tim's is popular but quite pricey, too. It's likely I will be cycling snd curing the rock in a bucket that is approx. 50L - as this is 1/4 of the aquarium volume would that be a problem with the dosage of bacteria or would I just need to leave it a little longer in the bucket (where it is at the right concentration)? The bucket it probably better since it won't have filter socks or protein skimmer...

 

Depending on the rocks, vinegar is not advised. Vinegar will dissolve aragonite rocks. Boiling water is not needed either and should not be used IMO. There are toxic things on rock that you do not want to hit with hot water. Things that can ruin your life. Your dry rock is probably benign regards this point, but boiling water and rocks is not a good habit to get into. Avoid. Scrub brush and garden hose.

 

The bacteria is going to get started regardless as the bacteria is all around in the environment--it would actually be difficult to stop it! It does take time though. You could speed the process up a bit with a cycle starter like Dr. Tim's. Pour the bacteria starter onto and over the rocks and then add them to your saltwater. You may need an ammonia source if the rock is very clean, shoot for 2 ppm ammonia.

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I've attached a few pictures showing some remains of marine life (shells mostly) which will need scrubbing. So tap water isn't too harmful for cleaning? I tested out water with a TDS and it has 320ppm!

 

Dr. Tim's video pages are helpful, I understand how it works now... Apparently he claims the bacteria is able to support a few small fish in less than a week!

 

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Yeah, I have way better tap water. 320ppm is up there! Use RODI, soak and scrub. There is quite a bit of gunk on the rock still--some green too I see.

 

Don't rely on Dr. Tim's two week claim. It takes as long as it takes. Probably faster with something like Dr. Tim's, but it may take longer than two weeks. We really should not use a calendar when thinking about establishing the bacterial colonies in our tank (cycling). Too many variables.

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I was quite surprised at how high it was. We have a filter in our fridge and that water was still 300ppm!

 

I'm not in a hurry to add any livestock and I'd want to waste at least 4 weeks anyway but like you say, Dr. Tims just makes it a little faster.

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Depending on the rocks, vinegar is not advised. Vinegar will dissolve aragonite rocks. Boiling water is not needed either and should not be used IMO. There are toxic things on rock that you do not want to hit with hot water. Things that can ruin your life. Your dry rock is probably benign regards this point, but boiling water and rocks is not a good habit to get into. Avoid. Scrub brush and garden hose.

 

What? Name something that would be found on dry rock that shouldn't be boiled... There's no harm to boiling rock other than it smells bad. What it will do is help loosen stuck-on organic material, just like it would a dirty plate with stuck on food.

 

As for a 50/50 vinegar/water mix, that would take forever to dissolve rock. Muriatic acid is often used to clean rock so how is vinegar "Not advised"? What it will do is help chemically break down organic material and loosen it from the rock.

 

You don't need to worry about using RO water vs. declorinated tap water at this point (it's not like the rock is going to "get dirtier" from your water...). Also you'll probably discard this water once you start the tank up. To be honest your rock looks a lot like mine did when I got it. I gave it a vinegar bath, then boiled it, and it's been sitting in elevated temp saltwater and there's still stuff that's not completely decomposed yet... I also use a turkey baster and every day or so baste off the rocks and sometimes I still dislodge a chunk or something. If I were to do it again I would have gone for the muriatic acid treatment as it's much faster and more thorough.

 

Here's a piece of rock when I first got it, and here it is after boiling for 15 minutes...

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I actually wouldn't recommend boiling the rocks. The issue is that any moisture on the inside of the rock can actually cause it to explode. I don't mean like a fireball or anything ridiculous but a build up of pressure that can cause the rock to fracture. I would actually recommend just pouring boiling water over it inside of like a 5 gallon bucket. The water will quickly stop boiling but will stay hot for a good while.

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As I said, probably benign for dry rock, but I am not smart enough to know for sure so I don't boil any marine rock: wet, dry or other.

 

This is why:

 

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/blog/personal-experiences-with-palytoxin-poisoning-almost-killed-myself-wife-and-dogs

 

What a horrid and frightening experience. I'd never put the rock 'to boil' anyway, just pour some boiling water if I ever did that.

 

I'll give them a scrub, soak them in RO and see what comes out after a few water changes and go on from there.

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RODI unit arrived today! Unfortunately we only have 28PSI so I'll need a booster pump. Does the RODI water need to be heated for cleaning/soaking the dry rock or is it only saltwater that need to be heated at this point?

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Swing2Harmony

I run mine in FW RODI for 2-3 weeks, then cycle in a bucket of SW with some rubbles from the main tank. Aim for the higher temp if you can to speed thigns up.

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