First SPS - Help Needed

[rdck99]

The Story:

I just purchased an ORA plug of Birdsnest from a LFS and it's been in my tank for about 12 hours. Getting the frag into my tank was a nightmare...those black ORA plugs are like 1.5" long and I didn't have anywhere to "stick it," so I tried cutting the plug portion off (it's easy enough on ceramic plugs, right?), but in doing so, the pressure from the cutters caused the frag to fall off the plug and break into two pieces. So, I grabbed two LR chunks that were laying around and glued each one down to its own piece - exposing the frags to air for a few minutes. In doing all this, I was forced to handle/touch the frag (or now, "frags") multiple times. So far, it looks just as it did in the store - polyps extended, colored, etc. (albeit, it's now two frags), but this all must have been extremely traumatic for the coral, and I'll consider it a miracle if it pulls through.

 

The Setup:

Any who, I have a 16g IM with a NanoBox Duo (whites currently at 60%) and I typically do a 3g water change every 7-10 days using Red Sea Coral Pro. Salinity is usually right around 1.026. No skimmer/reactor and I have Chemi-Pure Elite/Purigen in a media basket. I currently dose alkalinity by hand with every water change, and my calcium has always maintained sufficient levels from my water changes. BUT, now that I've got SPS, I think I'd like to dose alkalinity daily, to avoid the drastic swings that come from a weekly dosage, plus, I may now need to begin daily calcium dosing as well, so I'm looking at the BRS two part dosing kit. Before purchasing the kit, I want to monitor my levels to verify the necessity of the kit and I was hoping for some guidance/confirmation that my plan will work:

 

The Plan:

Take nightly tests of both calcium/alkalinity (I'll worry about magnesium later), after my whites turn off, for 7 days to determine how much of each is consumed each day. Once verified, I'll purchase the BRS dosing kit. I'll first dose to get calcium and alkalinity to desired levels (Ca 420-450, dKH 8-9), then I'll setup a dosing schedule to maintain those levels. And then my tank and coral will live happily ever after.

 

The Questions:

• For what anyone may know about the NanoBox Duo, is 60% power a good level or should I plan to continue ramping it up (my tank is only about 13" deep total, and the Birdsnest is currently about 6" beneath the surface of the water or about 12" from the light)?
• Is testing at night, after the whites are off, the best time to test calcium/alkalinity? Any tips?
• Is a 7 day test period long enough to determine my tank's consumption and set a preliminary dosing amount/schedule, and if so, is it okay to begin this test period right away, or will my readings be more accurate/indicative of what's to come, if I wait a few days, after it's more comfortable/settled in (probably a dumb question)?
• During this time, will nearly two weeks of no dosing be okay for the Birdsnest, assuming it's consuming an average amount of calcium/alkalinity each day, or should I buy a calcium supplement immediately (I already have an alkalinity supplement), so I can dose after each reading? I'd prefer to avoid the latter, because I think dosing during this period will distort my tanks consumption and make it more difficult to pinpoint a dosing amount/schedule.

Thanks for the help!

[GTi]

I don't know answers to your specifics but Birdsnests are usually pretty tough and fairly forgiving so I would expect the frags to pull through.

 

If you do regular water changes, I doubt dosing will be needed until the coral grows larger and is pulling out more minerals from the water. Doing a baseline test for Ca and Alk may be a good idea but I would' think dosing will be needed for a while.

[markalot]

be careful testing both Calcium and Alk. Test Calcium to make sure it's not some insane value then concentrate on Alk only and keep Alk stable using either water changes or a good Two Part dosing equal parts based on Alk testing only.

[Begow]

The Story:

I just purchased an ORA plug of Birdsnest from a LFS and it's been in my tank for about 12 hours. Getting the frag into my tank was a nightmare...those black ORA plugs are like 1.5" long and I didn't have anywhere to "stick it," so I tried cutting the plug portion off (it's easy enough on ceramic plugs, right?), but in doing so, the pressure from the cutters caused the frag to fall off the plug and break into two pieces. So, I grabbed two LR chunks that were laying around and glued each one down to its own piece - exposing the frags to air for a few minutes. In doing all this, I was forced to handle/touch the frag (or now, "frags") multiple times. So far, it looks just as it did in the store - polyps extended, colored, etc. (albeit, it's now two frags), but this all must have been extremely traumatic for the coral, and I'll consider it a miracle if it pulls through.

 

The Setup:

Any who, I have a 16g IM with a NanoBox Duo (whites currently at 60%) and I typically do a 3g water change every 7-10 days using Red Sea Coral Pro. Salinity is usually right around 1.026. No skimmer/reactor and I have Chemi-Pure Elite/Purigen in a media basket. I currently dose alkalinity by hand with every water change, and my calcium has always maintained sufficient levels from my water changes. BUT, now that I've got SPS, I think I'd like to dose alkalinity daily, to avoid the drastic swings that come from a weekly dosage, plus, I may now need to begin daily calcium dosing as well, so I'm looking at the BRS two part dosing kit. Before purchasing the kit, I want to monitor my levels to verify the necessity of the kit and I was hoping for some guidance/confirmation that my plan will work:

 

The Plan:

Take nightly tests of both calcium/alkalinity (I'll worry about magnesium later), after my whites turn off, for 7 days to determine how much of each is consumed each day. Once verified, I'll purchase the BRS dosing kit. I'll first dose to get calcium and alkalinity to desired levels (Ca 420-450, dKH 8-9), then I'll setup a dosing schedule to maintain those levels. And then my tank and coral will live happily ever after.

 

The Questions:

• For what anyone may know about the NanoBox Duo, is 60% power a good level or should I plan to continue ramping it up (my tank is only about 13" deep total, and the Birdsnest is currently about 6" beneath the surface of the water or about 12" from the light)?
• Is testing at night, after the whites are off, the best time to test calcium/alkalinity? Any tips?
• Is a 7 day test period long enough to determine my tank's consumption and set a preliminary dosing amount/schedule, and if so, is it okay to begin this test period right away, or will my readings be more accurate/indicative of what's to come, if I wait a few days, after it's more comfortable/settled in (probably a dumb question)?
• During this time, will nearly two weeks of no dosing be okay for the Birdsnest, assuming it's consuming an average amount of calcium/alkalinity each day, or should I buy a calcium supplement immediately (I already have an alkalinity supplement), so I can dose after each reading? I'd prefer to avoid the latter, because I think dosing during this period will distort my tanks consumption and make it more difficult to pinpoint a dosing amount/schedule.

Thanks for the help!

 

 

Honestly man in such a small tank with only one SPS frag I doubt you'll need to dose. Keep up with weekly water changes and you'll be golden. As far as the ORA Birdsnest goes, that stuff is super resilient man. I had a 6 inch colony not too long ago and accidentally snapped like 8 pieces off. I glued them all onto frag plugs, and they were fine. Keep in mind they won't encrust onto the plug much, but as long as it has polyp extension, and doesn't have flesh falling off of it you should be fine.

 

In small tanks with low SPS I've never tested for calc or alk ever. I still wouldn't test with monti's or birdsnests, they are very easy and hardy. I just recently picked up my first two "harder" SPS, and I test weekly for calc/alk/phos, but again in a small tank you shouldn't need to dose unless it is completely stocked to the rim with SPS. Keep up with your water changes bud.

 

As far as the light goes, I had the same issue. Didn't know what % to keep it at, I pretty much just did tests. I would let it run a few days at a certain % and if my corals looked worn out or shriveled after my day, I would turn it down some. I finally got mine to a good spot and it just takes some tinkering.

 

 

Good luck!

[farkwar]

I have about a dozen of that coral all around my tank.

I have like three live pieces loose on the tank bottom alive, I've got tired of mounting them.

 

While it is very fragile, it is very resilient.

[rdck99]

Thanks for the comments! I took my water to a LFS and Ca was 320, Mg 1200 and dKH 7 or so. All a bit low, but I've never seen my Ca lower than 400 and I just did a 5g water change 3 days ago. Either I gotta problem or the LFS doesn't know how to test. I bought some Reef Fusion 1 (already had 2) and will test/dose/monitor over the next week.

 

Keep the feedback coming, if anyone has other opinions/suggestions. Thanks again!

[Begow]

Thanks for the comments! I took my water to a LFS and Ca was 320, Mg 1200 and dKH 7 or so. All a bit low, but I've never seen my Ca lower than 400 and I just did a 5g water change 3 days ago. Either I gotta problem or the LFS doesn't know how to test. I bought some Reef Fusion 1 (already had 2) and will test/dose/monitor over the next week.

 

Keep the feedback coming, if anyone has other opinions/suggestions. Thanks again!

 

There has to be a LFS error, or a bad batch of salt. There is so way your calc dropped that low after 3 days with 1 SPS frag lol.

[rdck99]

There has to be a LFS error, or a bad batch of salt. There is so way your calc dropped that low after 3 days with 1 SPS frag lol.

No doubt, but perhaps its been low for some time? I don't know - my own Ca test kit arrives in a couple days, so I'll definitely verify before I go dosing.

 

Is there a time of the day that's best for testing Ca/dKH? Is there a time that's best for dosing each one (I know they shouldn't be dosed together)?

 

P.S. What's the GIF in your signature - Insidious?

[4x5]

Is there a time of the day that's best for testing Ca/dKH? Is there a time that's best for dosing each one (I know they shouldn't be dosed together)?

Any time is fine, just do it at the same time of day when you're figuring out consumption so that it's a full 24 hour period between tests.

 

As for dosing, again, any time of day leaving a gap (30 minutes or so) between dosing KH and Ca. With one piece of SPS you shouldn't have to dose yet if you're doing regular water changes.

[Chris!]

There has to be a LFS error, or a bad batch of salt. There is so way your calc dropped that low after 3 days with 1 SPS frag lol.

 

Yeah definitely an error somewhere. 1 birdsnest frag isn't going to deplete anything to dosing levels in a week let alone 3 days. If you are dosing already I suspect low mag as there is nothing really consuming anything to make dosing really needed anyway..... but low mag will play with your levels and have you all sorts of out of whack

 

 

BTW, touching the frags and exposing them to air isn't a concern at all. From the sounds of it you did everything right there. That said I strongly suggest looking into doing coral dips (I prefer bayer complete insecticide for SPS personally), and always remove the coral from the plug (yes I mean cut the coral off the plug even if it is encrusted, throw away the plug/base/ rock whatever...) and either glue the frag to a new plug or directly to a rock. This will help lower your risk of introducing pests to your tank greatly.

[rdck99]

I've been dosing alkalinity for awhile now - Reef Fusion 2 with each water change, bc my tank's softies/LPS eat through it. Would dosing Reef Fusion 2 (and not 1) cause my calcium to be lower than normal? Again, I'm certain the lone SPS didn't cause the drop, but maybe it has been low for sometime?

 

Also, I dip everything in CoralRx.

[CronicReefer]

All corals absorb calcium from the water but lps and sps do it much quicker since they build stony skeleton. Your lps were probably absorbing more calcium than you realized. I would bring your calcium up to at least 400 and then start dosing equal parts reef fusion, always focussing on keeping alk stable.

[Chris!]

I've been dosing alkalinity for awhile now - Reef Fusion 2 with each water change, bc my tank's softies/LPS eat through it. Would dosing Reef Fusion 2 (and not 1) cause my calcium to be lower than normal? Again, I'm certain the lone SPS didn't cause the drop, but maybe it has been low for sometime?

 

Also, I dip everything in CoralRx.

 

You dose alk with your WC not in between? What is your alk and calcium levels of the fresh WC and what is it in the tank before the WC?

 

I just checked out your tank and while you are getting some nice growth and have some larger pieces I don't really see anything that looks like it would be using a ton of alk/cal to warrant dosing with regular weekly WCs but if you do find that you really need the dosing yes, you should be dosing equal parts to keep them stabilized and balanced... dosing only alk would make sense that your calcium is lower. I would also highly suggest getting your mag up to atleast 1350.... slowly as it will help keep things balanced alot better as well. Personally I like to see calcium around 420-450 but 400+ for a mixed reef is typically suitable.

[dormreefer]

Something just isn't adding up in your levels. You said you are using Red Sea Coral pro at 1.026. Therefore, freshly mixed water should be 12.2 dKH and 450+PPM calc. If I were you I would mix a fresh batch and test it before adding it to the tank.

[rdck99]

All corals absorb calcium from the water but lps and sps do it much quicker since they build stony skeleton. Your lps were probably absorbing more calcium than you realized. I would bring your calcium up to at least 400 and then start dosing equal parts reef fusion, always focussing on keeping alk stable.

Once I get my own Ca test kit, I'll retest and begin to bring it up. If using Reef Fusion, what's an appropriate amount to raise to each day? Meaning, if I truly am at 320, should I aim to raise it by 10 each day - more, less?

 

The Reef Fusion 1 bottle says 1 ml = 4 mg/L of Ca, and not to exceed 4 ml of dosing per day for every 6.5g. So, if I have 13g of water, then I should be able to add 8 ml per day of Reef Fusion 1, raising my Ca about 16 per day. Does this sound right?

 

You dose alk with your WC not in between? What is your alk and calcium levels of the fresh WC and what is it in the tank before the WC?

 

I just checked out your tank and while you are getting some nice growth and have some larger pieces I don't really see anything that looks like it would be using a ton of alk/cal to warrant dosing with regular weekly WCs but if you do find that you really need the dosing yes, you should be dosing equal parts to keep them stabilized and balanced... dosing only alk would make sense that your calcium is lower. I would also highly suggest getting your mag up to atleast 1350.... slowly as it will help keep things balanced alot better as well. Personally I like to see calcium around 420-450 but 400+ for a mixed reef is typically suitable.

That's correct. I usually do a water change, test the alk shortly thereafter and dose accordingly. I, like you, didn't think I had enough in my tank to really worry about dosing, but I had a zoa colony begin to melt away, so I had a LFS begin to test my parameters - Ca always tested in the 400's, but my alk was as low as 5.3 on one of the tests. I then bought an alk test kit (confirmed the low readings) and began dosing Reef Fusion 2.

 

I was using DDH20cean salt mix when my alk issues were going on, but that freshly mixed saltwater had an alk of around 8-9 (lower than advertised) and my tank was consuming about 0.15 per day, so after a week, it'd drop nearly 1-1.5 points. My water changes are closer to every 10 days, than 7 days and the changes alone haven't been enough to keep alk in the 8-9 neighborhood.

 

Something just isn't adding up in your levels. You said you are using Red Sea Coral pro at 1.026. Therefore, freshly mixed water should be 12.2 dKH and 450+PPM calc. If I were you I would mix a fresh batch and test it before adding it to the tank.

I'll be doing this next week, when I mix my next batch and get the Ca test kit.

[CronicReefer]

Once I get my own Ca test kit, I'll retest and begin to bring it up. If using Reef Fusion, what's an appropriate amount to raise to each day? Meaning, if I truly am at 320, should I aim to raise it by 10 each day - more, less?

 

The Reef Fusion 1 bottle says 1 ml = 4 mg/L of Ca, and not to exceed 4 ml of dosing per day for every 6.5g. So, if I have 13g of water, then I should be able to add 8 ml per day of Reef Fusion 1, raising my Ca about 16 per day. Does this sound right?

I would just go with the max amount till it hits around 420. I don't see how bringing calcium up quickly would harm anything in the tank but I guess it's always good to follow directions. Be sure your test is accurate though because the salt you are using has elevated levels of essential elements.

[dormreefer]

You can pretty safely adjust calc by 50PPM a day if your ALK is balanced. Personally, with such a small water volume I would probably do two 50% w/c (48 hours apart) with your new salt once you test the batch.

[rdck99]

I have a bunch of parameter updates to share...

• The LFS told me my params were Ca 320, dKH 7 and Mg 1200.
• When my test kits arrived, I tested and found Ca 370, dKH 5.7 and Mg 1240.
• My freshly mixed saltwater (1.026) was at Ca 450, dKH 9.9 and Mg 1320.

I completed a 3g water change and have been testing each night between 10-11pm...

• 1/12 (after water change): Ca 40, dKH 6.4 and Mg 1250
• 1/13: Ca 380, dKH 6.3 and Mg 1200
• 1/14: Ca 380, dKH 6.1 and Mg 1200
• 1/15: Ca 380, dKH 6.6 and Mg 1200
• 1/16: Ca 390, dKH 6.7 and Mg 1260

After each test, I've been dosing 4ml of Reef Fusion 1 and 2...per the directions, this should be contributing 8 mg/L of Ca and 0.352 meq/L of alkalinity, considering my tank has about 13g of water. If I'm not mistaken, my Ca Salifert test kit reads in mg/L, so the Ca directions are apples-to-apples, but my Alk Salifert test kit reads in dKH, so the Reef Fusion directions need a conversion - if I did it right, 0.352 meq/L = about 1 dKH. SO, assuming that's all correct, I've been dosing Ca 8 and dKH 1 each night.

 

Ignoring Mg for now (because the test results are all over the place), it looks like my tank is consuming approximately 10 mg/L of Ca and 1 dKH each day. Am I doing this right?

[rdck99]

Anybody, anybody?

[rdck99]

I would love to get a confirmation that I'm looking at this correctly - please see my questions from 2 weeks ago above.

Here's a more detailed look at my test results:

 

Not counting the first day's initial testing, this was done over a 9 day period (1/17 was missed and 1/20 was a water change day). My tests were all taken between 9 and 11 pm and all dosings were done immediately after testing. What I learned while doing all this is that tests can flip around all over the place, making it difficult to make any sort of confident conclusion. I stated 2 weeks ago that I believed about 1 dKH and 8 Ca were being consumed each day, but the 9 day period averages shows about 0.7 dKH and 2.7 Ca...but I really don't trust the numbers fully.

I did determine that my salt mix is okay:

 

I think I'm going to do two 3g water changes back to back, to hopefully get the params where they should be, at which time I'll probably setup a dosing pump, at least for alkalinity. It looks like between 5-7 dKH are consumed each week and to keep it where it needs to be would require manual dosing almost daily. Even though I don't trust the number, I'm going to hope that Ca consumption is in fact around 2.7 per day or almost 20 per week, which I think I can manage with 1-2 dosings per week, manually.

Any comments, concerns, cautions...?

[CronicReefer]

Looks good to me. The readings from Jan 22 are pretty ideal if you can maintain those parameters.

[GokesReef]

Congrats on the new frag! Just a heads up though, you don't need to dose anything for a single birdsnest frag your water changes will be more than enough to keep it happy. It's also one of the hardiest SPS out there and can do well even in neglected tanks.

 

Also keep in mind that as you add more SPS you will need to keep testing and adjusting your dosing - it's not a set it and forget it

[rdck99]

Congrats on the new frag! Just a heads up though, you don't need to dose anything for a single birdsnest frag your water changes will be more than enough to keep it happy. It's also one of the hardiest SPS out there and can do well even in neglected tanks.

 

Also keep in mind that as you add more SPS you will need to keep testing and adjusting your dosing - it's not a set it and forget it

That's what I've always heard too - no need to worry about dosing, but I do 3g water changes every 7-10 days and my dKH was around 6 and my Ca around 380, before I began manual dosing. Isn't that too low, if I want moderate growth? My tank is decently stocked, even though there's only one SPS frag.

[GokesReef]

That's what I've always heard too - no need to worry about dosing, but I do 3g water changes every 7-10 days and my dKH was around 6 and my Ca around 380, before I began manual dosing. Isn't that too low, if I want moderate growth? My tank is decently stocked, even though there's only one SPS frag.

 

A little low... also keep in mind that LPS use Ca to build their skeleton.

 

One question though, I was searching through and couldn't find what salt you are using.. is it still the H20cean? If so, which variety?

 

I feel like if you just switched to a "reef" salt like IO Reef Crystals, Red Sea, or at least the H20cean "Natural Reef Salt" you would find your levels better right out of the gate since they all have extra Ca, etc.

 

Sorry if that info was already covered and I missed it somewhere!

[rdck99]

 

A little low... also keep in mind that LPS use Ca to build their skeleton.

 

One question though, I was searching through and couldn't find what salt you are using.. is it still the H20cean? If so, which variety?

 

I feel like if you just switched to a "reef" salt like IO Reef Crystals, Red Sea, or at least the H20cean "Natural Reef Salt" you would find your levels better right out of the gate since they all have extra Ca, etc.

 

Sorry if that info was already covered and I missed it somewhere!

I'm using RSCP salt now...