DontBeKoi Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 Hi guys. After doing some freshwater tanks I looked up salt tanks the other day. Big mistake. Many hours later, I'm here planning on transporting a 29 gallon biocube from a family who can't give it much attention anymore. The price was really great for an all in one with a stand and live rock, inverts, clown fish, skimmer, and what looks like nice sized corals. I'm planning on replacing the sand when I set it up at my place, as it seems it's possibly old substrate and there looks to be an algae problem? If any water is needed there's a premix option at a store 2 miles away. I am a little dissapointed I'm not going through the process from start to finish with a new tank, but the deal was excellent. The other thing I noticed is a lot of nano reefscapers enjoy working with small rocks, and the owners of this tank have used large pieces. Maybe I'll break one or two down in the future to make them more managable? I'm not a fan of how it looks now, but I plan to replicate the set up for a while to help the tank aclimate after the move. Also on the topic, I don't like the piece that lays across the bottom flat and would prefer to make small arches or caves for the fish, but there are corals on it. I'm not sure if those would suffer from a new orientation of the rock if it places them sideways instead of up, etc. Would they adjust? Should I chip them off and reattach after the rocks are changed up?The photos aren't that good sorry, if anyone can identify the corals that would be great. I'll post more with better images after picking it up and installing. The (for now) semi-vague list is... Oceanic 29 gal BiocubeProtein skimmer (?)Lights (?)2 clown fish1 damsel fish3 zebra snailsred brain coral (in bad condition)mushroom coralsbutton coralsFirst Reading (still learning a bit..)Gravity - 36/1.26Phosphate 2.0Amonia between 0 -.05Nitrite 0 Nitrate false zeroHigh Range PH 8.2KH 5 drops / 89Calcium 460Temp 82 degrees Future possible occupants:Black Ocellaris ClownfishSix Line WrasseBicolor DottybackCatalina GobySpiny Star AstraeaSmall UrchinClamAnemoneZoanthidsMushroomsBubble CoralHammer Coral Torch CoralXenia CoralKenya Tree Plate CoralElegance CoralGreen Star PolypsDifficult but Desired:MandarinGarden EelsSaddle Valentini PufferImages are original owner's set up, not mine Link to comment
CronicReefer Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 Looks good just needs some cleaning and care. You can move the corals if you like they adjust to lighting and position over time. The brain coral can recover so don't give up on it. You might want to add a bit to the CUC to eat up the algae. Link to comment
DontBeKoi Posted November 12, 2014 Author Share Posted November 12, 2014 Thanks, I'll try to spot feed the brain coral and see if that helps...Will look into a CUC once I see what else the tank has. Link to comment
cju84 Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 Definitely add a good Clean up Crew. Go to reefcleaners.org and John will hook you up. There is an option for your 29 gallon. Definitely get it! http://www.reefcleaners.org/index.php?option=com_virtuemart&view=productdetails&virtuemart_product_id=223&virtuemart_category_id=20 Link to comment
DontBeKoi Posted November 12, 2014 Author Share Posted November 12, 2014 Owner says the sand needs a cleaning for heavy nitrates. Going to just start with new live sand instead. Link to comment
Deleted User 8 Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 Owner says the sand needs a cleaning for heavy nitrates. Going to just start with new live sand instead. Or don't use any sand at all and go bare bottom. Sand is not required! Buzz Link to comment
DontBeKoi Posted November 13, 2014 Author Share Posted November 13, 2014 Tank is set up! I heavily suspect the substrate was actually pulled from the ocean where they lived in Tampa Florida. It had so many crushed shells and tiny pieces in mixed black and white. I removed as much of it as possible, cleaned the bottom out with distilled water and removed that, added all the old water from it's prior set up (wow, water should NOT weigh so much).Even though I removed all the old icky nitrate laden substrate there was immediately a tiny starfish on the glass just minutes after it was full again. He's cute but I can't help but wonder what else stuck around. There is some green and red growth on the glass I scraped at, but was difficult to completely remove. Found a good scraper at the bottom of their supplies box after installing the tank, oh well. I'll clean the glass better after everything stabilizes.The brain coral was laying on it's side again the rock, fallen over from the tall base of putty or whatever it was mounted on. I relocated it to the sand bed as I read that's where they prefer to be, and it won't be falling on any rock surfaces...The third fish is a Four Stripe Damselfish, which the owners advised me to give away to the fish store as he was aggressive. Since I've changed the rocks to have more cave like hiding places, I'm gonna give the little guy a chance and see how he does for now.PS: How do you post images after the first post? Not able to see any way to use the gallery or insert them directly... Link to comment
Pinner Reef Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Most of us use photobucket or a similar hosting site to post pics. Take a razor blade to the algae, it comes off easier when wet. Little Starfish is likely a hitchhiking Astrena star. (Can be irritating to some corals) Damselfish are highly territorial making new additions nearly impossible. (Good idea to donate him to the nearest LFS) Dunno if it was the camera but those bulbs look pretty old. (It's best to change them every 8mos or so) Considering your plans for corals you may want to upgrade to LED retrofit system. They are kinda pricey up front but much cheaper to run long term. Sorry to say but you are going to want to skip out on all your "Difficult but desired" fish for various reasons. Also Catalina Gobys are cold water fish. Are there any filtration modifications to the tank? Look into intank's filter media baskets. They have biocube mods that will get a lot more out of the filtration area. Sorry that's probab;y a lot to process. let us know if you have any other questions. Link to comment
DontBeKoi Posted November 13, 2014 Author Share Posted November 13, 2014 Very helpful, thanks! I'll probably evict the Damsel after everything is fully tested and in good working order. He's actually incredibly shy and runs away to hide if I move in the slightest. Not the best personality so far.Currently working on learning more about the protein skimmer that isn't producing bubbles (old one, so shouldn't it?) and the Hydor jet on the side and how best to set up the water flow. After pointing that up and opposite of the tank's jet, the clown fish aren't shoved into the back corner anymore where they lived prior. They seem to enjoy the change and now move around the front of the tank glass.The tiny starfish spends all of it's time on the glass so I don't think he'll bother any of the corals? Also how long should I wait before adding a cleaning crew?Also focused on trying to save the poor brain coral... he's mostly skeleton. Wondering about a dip, going to talk to the LFS and see what to do for it. Once everything's stopped being cloudy I'll post more images. Most of us use photobucket or a similar hosting site to post pics. Take a razor blade to the algae, it comes off easier when wet. Little Starfish is likely a hitchhiking Astrena star. (Can be irritating to some corals) Damselfish are highly territorial making new additions nearly impossible. (Good idea to donate him to the nearest LFS) Dunno if it was the camera but those bulbs look pretty old. (It's best to change them every 8mos or so) Considering your plans for corals you may want to upgrade to LED retrofit system. They are kinda pricey up front but much cheaper to run long term. Sorry to say but you are going to want to skip out on all your "Difficult but desired" fish for various reasons. Also Catalina Gobys are cold water fish. Are there any filtration modifications to the tank? Look into intank's filter media baskets. They have biocube mods that will get a lot more out of the filtration area. Sorry that's probab;y a lot to process. let us know if you have any other questions. Link to comment
CronicReefer Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 You could probably get a nice goby in exchange for the damsel if he remains a problem. Six line wrasse are very visually appealing as well. Link to comment
Deleted User 8 Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 You reused the old salt water? Did you add any fresh salt water? What are your water parameters? Salinity, ammonia, nitrate? What top off fresh water are you using? RO/DI? Also you may go through a short cycle now. Are you testing as per above? Dont overfeed. Feed less than you think you should. Do frequent 20% water changes at least once a week. What are your plans far making saltwater? Go slow. In the next several months get the tank dialed in and stable before you start adding a bunch of cool livestock. You need to get into a grove with your maint schedule and get to know what your tank needs. They all have a different "personality". KISS Frequent water changes Use RO/DI Test Feed lightly Go slow Buzz Buzz Link to comment
DontBeKoi Posted November 13, 2014 Author Share Posted November 13, 2014 I transported all of the old water for the move, and I plan on buying saltwater for now from the shop 2 miles down the road from me. However the owners did include two boxes of instant ocean so I can do it myself when I want. My local publix has distilled water, but not RO. Is that a problem? The big (button?) corals aren't looking so good, bleached out. But one was closed up and when I turned on the lights it opened up. The other smaller corals are good, the 'fingers' are out and most are fully opened and look normal in color.The poor brain is still half dead. Should I cut off the high base they added so it can rest on the sand? Should I use RESTOR on it? I may try to hand feed the corals tonight to help perk them up. BTW There wasn't a big algae issue, it was the camera doing that. On the Damsel, I haven't seen a single aggressive incident. He likes to explore or if movement happens near the tank - to hide. I'm not in a rush to add fish, waiting until a cleaning crew can be introduced firstly. When should that happen?Gravity - 36/1.26Phosphate 2.0Amonia between 0 -.05Nitrite 0 Nitrate 0 or minorly approaching 5.0High Range PH 8.2KH 5 drops / 89Calcium 460Temp 82 degrees Link to comment
DriftingNemo Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 I would take Buzz's advice, and take it sloooowwww. If you have the time, try doing 3 gallon water changes twice a week to make less of an impact. Buying a fully setup tank is a quicker way to have fish and coral in the tank, but I would never do it. It's too much of a headache. But hopefully everything settles down and you don't get any unwanted pests or a mini cycle. Link to comment
DontBeKoi Posted November 13, 2014 Author Share Posted November 13, 2014 Yeah, but this was about a $1000 set up for $200 and much of my job includes sitting in the office working next to the tank where I can check on things often. Hope I can make it work and sadly if not, I can turn it into a freshwater tank.When should I do the first water change? Link to comment
DriftingNemo Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 That sure is a good deal. Don't give up on saltwater if things go bad, freshwater is just depressing. The only reason I wouldn't buy an already established setup is simply because I like to have full control of what happens in my tank from the start. Do the first water change a week after you set the tank up, but only do 10% because the system has had so much stress amd you don't want to add much more. The following weeks do 20%. Link to comment
lkoechle Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 When ever you want as long as salinity and temp match up. A note on your future stock list: The 2 clownfish will kill any new clownfish. Unless you have massive set up (100+ gallons), bonded pairs cannot exist with other clowns. If they're all juveniles, that's a different story, but mature clowns are very territorial and the female would kill any introduced clown while her mate is alive. I like sixlines. Ours didn't get along with our clowns and he later jumped but he was interesting, beautiful, and crazy active. Link to comment
Pinner Reef Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Be wary of any pubic water source. Metal piping can leech heavy metals into the tank. LFS should always have a ready supply of RO. Check the air intake line on your protein skimmer for kinks/clogs and make sure the intake is above the tank's water level. Also it does take time to "break in" a skimmer so that it foams up properly. Hate to say it but that brain looks pretty far gone (probably beyond feeding) but don't give up on it. I've had coral reduced to nothing but a splattering of flesh come back. Outside that looks like you're pretty well taken care of. Take you time and enjoy! Also we love pics here any or all of them. Link to comment
DontBeKoi Posted November 14, 2014 Author Share Posted November 14, 2014 Original set up. then new rock arrangement in tank with new sand after unclouding. The rocks are leaning like building a campfire with three pieces resting together at the top.. so there's hiding spaces in the center. You can also see the bad flow making the clownfish huddle upside down in the back in the original photo. Since aiming it at the right corner and up they are at the front of the tank swimming normally. Link to comment
DontBeKoi Posted November 14, 2014 Author Share Posted November 14, 2014 Original substrate after removal Sad mostly dead brain coral + shots of the rest of the coralThe LFS said to remove the brain coral because it even lacks mouth tissue, to keep the dying material out of the tank. Now that I have a photo up, what do you guys think for it? Remove or give it a try? A dip? Move to the other side or closer to the rock overhang? Remove the base and put it on the sand? Link to comment
Pinner Reef Posted November 14, 2014 Share Posted November 14, 2014 Wow, great improvement! The new aquascape is more pleasing and should make for easier cleaning/ coral mounting. The brain looks stable but obviously hating life. That is an Astrena star I'd say pull him out next time you see it. Have your read about Palytoxin yet? Link to comment
Tamberav Posted November 14, 2014 Share Posted November 14, 2014 Catalina Goby <--- This is a temperate fish, needs 50-60 degrees F. Not compatible Also there is no room for a garden eel. They need a large very deep sand bed and preferably laminar flow. I would think it would be... not just difficult... but impossible with this tank footprint and your current livestock. I would give it at least a 12x12 area of sand which means no room for rock/corals. *bursts bubbles* On a positive note.. you may want to check out the mimic puffer: http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=15+30+1724&pcatid=1724 It looks like the corals are not receiving enough light. The bulbs are most likely ancient and need to be replaced (PC stock lighting should be enough for low light corals but they need replacement at least once a year as they lose spectrum as they age). You will want to think about upgrading the light though if you want to keep clams, ect on your list. Link to comment
DontBeKoi Posted November 14, 2014 Author Share Posted November 14, 2014 Thanks, the only one really disappointing me is the Mandarin. So cool but so difficult. Mimic puffer is nice, but I wonder if he's hard to find stocked locally. Saw one of the tiny starfish on a coral. Yanked his butt out. Link to comment
DontBeKoi Posted November 14, 2014 Author Share Posted November 14, 2014 Corals aren't standing up straight anymore, leaning over one touching the rocks, doesn't look so good. LFS said to do a 50% water change to avoid the ammonia turning into nitrate/nitrites. Guess I'm going to give it a try today. Temp 81Gravity 37/1.027 Nitrates 20Nitrite 0Ammonia 0.25 Phosphate 2.0PH 7.8 KH 7 dropsCalcium 22 drops, 440 Link to comment
DriftingNemo Posted November 14, 2014 Share Posted November 14, 2014 Turn down your temperature to 79, your salinity is a little bit too high so try and get it down to 1.025, the ammonia might be causing your corals stress. Your ph is a little bit low, it should be upwards of 8.0 (8.2 to 8.4 is the best) but a slightly low ph shouldnt be too much of a problem. Your calcium is perfect, kh is alright. Phosphates should be lower than 2.0. Your water parameters are surprisingly good especially since you had to move the tank and livestock. Over the next few weeks of good water changes your parameters should become more stable. Link to comment
DontBeKoi Posted November 14, 2014 Author Share Posted November 14, 2014 Apparently I was doing the nitrates test wrong. It was 40 when tested at LFS. I picked up a 50% change of water from them, added Prime and bacteria suppliment as they suggested. Poor corals were completely drooped over unhappy when I got home... they are already starting to perk up since the water change. Strange because I read somewhere these brown buttons like dirty water?Going to do a small mysis feeding tonight for the fish. As for the Temp I'm not sure what to do, I'm not using a heater... I live in Florida and that's naturally how warm the water is. I looked into chillers for when summer comes around, the prices were scary.Moved the Hydor to the other side of the tank to cross streams. Don't tell ghostbusters. Nitrates after water change, a true zero!Ammonia reads worse... but the color doesn't really match well. Looks like .50 but that seems wrong. Gravity is now 35/1.026 Link to comment
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