DIY Oxydator experiment.

[albertthiel]

Thanks Les ... and yes all of that has been my experience as well and I would not do without one right now ...

 

Great water purifier and great for the fish and corals ...

 

[atoll]

Thanks Les ... and yes all of that has been my experience as well and I would not do without one right now ...

 

Great water purifier and great for the fish and corals ...

 

YVW Albert and to add to the above there are lots of other benefits to the use of Oxydator's as I have reported many times. The general health of the aquarium being one , water quality another, less stress on fish esp newly introduced ones that may get a hard time initially. Many like myself have not had an issue with white spot since using Oxydator's although I don't put this down purely to the use of Oxydator's. However I am convinced they are a great help to aid fish to stave off the likes of white spot which attack the gills preventing oxygen getting into the fishes lungs. Many also report that they have to clean the glass of the aquarium much less often which you have noticed yourself.

[albertthiel]

YVW Albert and to add to the above there are lots of other benefits to the use of Oxydator's as I have reported many times. The general health of the aquarium being one , water quality another, less stress on fish esp newly introduced ones that may get a hard time initially. Many like myself have not had an issue with white spot since using Oxydator's although I don't put this down purely to the use of Oxydator's. However I am convinced they are a great help to aid fish to stave off the likes of white spot which attack the gills preventing oxygen getting into the fishes lungs. Many also report that they have to clean the glass of the aquarium much less often which you have noticed yourself.

 

Indeed all very true and my experiences as well and I have not used it for 20 or so years like you have but I do see the same benefits but I should add that we both use the Sochting ones and that the bubbles they produce are very different from the DIY units, at least the ones that I have seen up to now ... now if a DIY one can be made that produce bubbles so small that they are not visible, that would be super indeed.

[atoll]

Indeed all very true and my experiences as well and I have not used it for 20 or so years like you have but I do see the same benefits but I should add that we both use the Sochting ones and that the bubbles they produce are very different from the DIY units, at least the ones that I have seen up to now ... now if a DIY one can be made that produce bubbles so small that they are not visible, that would be super indeed.

 

 

They can indeed be made to produce very fine bubbles as in the sketch I posted on your Forum thread Albert. That was made by a friend of mine some years ago and he used a pin head as a catalyst. All a bit crude but it seemed to work for him just fine.

[jedimasterben]

They can indeed be made to produce very fine bubbles as in the sketch I posted on your Forum thread Albert. That was made by a friend of mine some years ago and he used a pin head as a catalyst. All a bit crude but it seemed to work for him just fine.

As in a plastic pin head?

[metrokat]

My observations on running the Mini Oxydator which was severely undersized for my tank and water volume was that is reduces micro algae while promoting macro algae. I think the application for the device is awesome for planted tank and would be a great addition to any fuge.

[atoll]

As in a plastic pin head?

Sorry no as in a brass pin head. The Oxydator catalysts is made of some sort of ceramic with silver in it.

 

My observations on running the Mini Oxydator which was severely undersized for my tank and water volume was that is reduces micro algae while promoting macro algae. I think the application for the device is awesome for planted tank and would be a great addition to any fuge.

 

Well that's a first I have never heard of an Oxydator actually promoting any sort of algae as it only produces O2 and water. maybe the rapid breakdown of nutrients etc added something to your tank water. I have only ever heard of Oxydator's reducing algae growth as it is also reported to do in freshwater planted tanks.

[Islandoftiki]

Here's a question:

 

Could you not simply buy an oxygen tank and a regulator and dose oxygen into the tank that way?

[chachew]

Here's a question:

 

Could you not simply buy an oxygen tank and a regulator and dose oxygen into the tank that way?

I was thinking the same thing

[Grumblecakes]

i have though on how to get fine bubbles, assuming you have a skimmer. put a 'T' on your skimmer intake line and feed it to that, ideally it wouldnt pull enough vaccum to collapse your container.

 

I also feel i must comment that co2 and o2 exist idenpendently of each other in water. Not to sound like jerk but its something you learn in gen chem, henery's law.

[albertthiel]

They can indeed be made to produce very fine bubbles as in the sketch I posted on your Forum thread Albert. That was made by a friend of mine some years ago and he used a pin head as a catalyst. All a bit crude but it seemed to work for him just fine.

 

I will have a loo a that as I have not seen it yet but then I just got back from the storage place where I picked up another 300 books.

 

Pinhead ... interesting !

 

I was thinking the same thing

 

Interesting you bring that up as in in the mid-80's Thiel Aqua Tech sold exactly that : Oxygen reactors with a container, regulator etc ... all to increase the tank's water oxygen content ... of course the cost of all of that would be much higher than using a regular Oxydator or using a DIY one that produces the fine bubbles. I guess history repeats itself :-o but that would be another way to do it of course, albeit at a greater cost overall and having to source the oxygen and the regulators etc ....

[metrokat]

Well that's a first I have never heard of an Oxydator actually promoting any sort of algae as it only produces O2 and water. maybe the rapid breakdown of nutrients etc added something to your tank water. I have only ever heard of Oxydator's reducing algae growth as it is also reported to do in freshwater planted tanks.

Yeah I documented the growth of macro algae with a few pictures.

[Islandoftiki]

I also feel i must comment that co2 and o2 exist idenpendently of each other in water. Not to sound like jerk but its something you learn in gen chem, henery's law.

 

Woot! We have a chemistry expert joining in on the conversation! Can you give us a quick rundown of how Henery's law applies to this?

 

As I understand you can reduce the CO2 levels in the water by saturating it with O2. Likewise, as is seen on planted tanks, you can reduce your O2 levels in planted tanks by adding too much CO2. So, you're saying that you can saturate both CO2 and O2 at the same time?

[albertthiel]

Sorry no as in a brass pin head. The Oxydator catalysts is made of some sort of ceramic with silver in it.

 

Well that's a first I have never heard of an Oxydator actually promoting any sort of algae as it only produces O2 and water. maybe the rapid breakdown of nutrients etc added something to your tank water. I have only ever heard of Oxydator's reducing algae growth as it is also reported to do in freshwater planted tanks.

 

Yes Brass and Bronze and many other metals will work too ...

 

And on the algae ... never heard of it increasing algae growth either ... as you say only O and water is produced so that would not promote algae growth ... but if the tank contained a lot of nutrients and they were broken down that could happen until the levels are low again and then the algae would go away but that is just an assumption, as oxydators producing algae growth is not documented anywhere unless it is anecdotal by one or so hobbyists ... and due to other reasons ... not the Oxydator.

 

Yeah I documented the growth of macro algae with a few pictures.

 

A link to it maybe ? I have not seen it ... but will certainly look at what you documented ... Thanks ...

 

Woot! We have a chemistry expert joining in on the conversation! Can you give us a quick rundown of how Henery's law applies to this?

 

As I understand you can reduce the CO2 levels in the water by saturating it with O2. Likewise, as is seen on planted tanks, you can reduce your O2 levels in planted tanks by adding too much CO2. So, you're saying that you can saturate both CO2 and O2 at the same time?

 

This is getting more and more interesting :-o

[Islandoftiki]

In physics, Henry's law is one of the gas laws formulated by William Henry in 1803. It states:

 

 

"At a constant temperature, the amount of a given gas that dissolves in a given type and volume of liquid is directly proportional to the partial pressure of that gas in equilibrium with that liquid." -- Wikipedia

 

Anyhow, I'm not sure how you get "I also feel i must comment that co2 and o2 exist idenpendently of each other in water." from the above law or how it's relevant to the project at hand. Please enlighten me.

[zemuss]

My current setup has a CO2 scrubber attached to the skimmer and was thinking I might have cause a performance issue with the skimmer production of skimmate.

 

I am very curious of adding a Oxydator and anxiously awaiting the results here. However, maybe if I want a better ph level I should change my setup by adding a air pump to the CO2 scrubber instead of it being hooked up to the Skimmer? (Thoughts?)

[albertthiel]

My current setup has a CO2 scrubber attached to the skimmer and was thinking I might have cause a performance issue with the skimmer production of skimmate.

 

I am very curious of adding a Oxydator and anxiously awaiting the results here. However, maybe if I want a better ph level I should change my setup by adding a air pump to the CO2 scrubber instead of it being hooked up to the Skimmer? (Thoughts?)

 

What skimmer are you using and does it have a venturi valve for the intake and is it one with a pinwheel ? I think after knowing that I may be able to add some more comments ... Thanks ...

[Islandoftiki]

Ok, I found an article that describes what the guy who's not trying to be a jerk was getting at as he reminded us all that we have a sub-grade school chemistry education...

 

 

This is actually useful information:

 

http://www.koivet.com/a_carbon_dioxide_water_quality_koi_pond_fish.html

[zemuss]

What skimmer are you using and does it have a venturi valve for the intake and is it one with a pinwheel ? I think after knowing that I may be able to add some more comments ... Thanks ...

It has a venturi and a pin wheel. (Bubble Magus 3.5+)

[albertthiel]

It has a venturi and a pin wheel. (Bubble Magus 3.5+)

 

That skimmer has a powerful venturi ... you should not need an air pump IMO ... and you are using Soda lime right ? I would use a container where the air has to travel through it for a longer time so a more tubular and long container so the scrubbing goes on for longer ... that may help ...

[zemuss]

Yes I am going to use a Two Little Fish reactor.

 

I am using the CDX from Two Little Fishes.

[albertthiel]

Yes I am going to use a Two Little Fish reactor.

 

I am using the CDX from Two Little Fishes.

 

CDX is soda lime yes ... and pulling the air through a longer container should scrub the air better and may help indeed. Is there a company called AirGas in your area as they sell Soda Lime (color changing) in larger sizes ...

[metrokat]

Yes Brass and Bronze and many other metals will work too ...

 

And on the algae ... never heard of it increasing algae growth either ... as you say only O and water is produced so that would not promote algae growth ... but if the tank contained a lot of nutrients and they were broken down that could happen until the levels are low again and then the algae would go away but that is just an assumption, as oxydators producing algae growth is not documented anywhere unless it is anecdotal by one or so hobbyists ... and due to other reasons ... not the Oxydator.

 

 

A link to it maybe ? I have not seen it ... but will certainly look at what you documented ... Thanks ...

With all due respect though Albert, nothing has been documented except clear water, increased oxygen levels by inference of the breakdown of the stuff used in the oxydator. No papers published or otherwise, no oxygen levels before or after, and clearer water is in the eye of the beholder and the quality if glass and how clean it is too. Not a measurable number and certainly not a selling point in favor. Carbon gives me very clear water too.

 

I would be interested to read english documentation of oxygen levels.

 

As for it promoting macro algae growth, that has been my observation in my tank. I have a couple of pictures showing this. Conclusive? For me yes. Open to speculation? Yes. But open to being dismissed based on lack of documentation from others of my finding? No. Because very little if anything is documented about this device.

 

I have no doubt it does what you say it did for you, but did it remove your pest algae? It didn't for me or for Island of Tiki.

 

I specifically asked about its effect on macros, nitrates and phosphates from a few sources with no conclusive 'documented' evidence of any result. I was actually afraid it would kill my fuge macros.

 

So yeah, my results may not be documented, but if Island of Tiki would do me a favor and install his device so the pest algae is closest to it and see if it increases growth or kills it, maybe we will have more than just my observation.

[eitallent]

In physics, Henry's law is one of the gas laws formulated by William Henry in 1803. It states:

 

 

"At a constant temperature, the amount of a given gas that dissolves in a given type and volume of liquid is directly proportional to the partial pressure of that gas in equilibrium with that liquid." -- Wikipedia

 

Anyhow, I'm not sure how you get "I also feel i must comment that co2 and o2 exist idenpendently of each other in water." from the above law or how it's relevant to the project at hand. Please enlighten me.

 

From what I remember ( along time since college chem) I think what he means is that dissolved CO2 and O2 function independently from one another chemically in the water. In other words if the water is saturated with O2 it has nothing to do with how much CO2 is already in the water. For example in a container of water with no living organisms the presence of CO2 does not prevent O2 from dissolving into the water and vice-versa. In a system with living organisms the amount of CO2 that is in the water is related to atmospheric CO2 levels, water surface exchange, water temperature, animal/plant respiration/photosynthesis and whether there is an artificial filter removing the CO2 in the case of aquariums.

This article explains Henry's Law and equilibrium equations for CO2 and O2 in H2O:

http://butane.chem.uiuc.edu/pshapley/GenChem1/L23/web-L23.pdf

[zemuss]

CDX is soda lime yes ... and pulling the air through a longer container should scrub the air better and may help indeed. Is there a company called AirGas in your area as they sell Soda Lime (color changing) in larger sizes ...

I would need to order it from them.