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Nuvo 16


dougiek

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So this is being started about 2 weeks after the tank was actually started. I bought this tank with 2 spin-streams from a guy off craigslist for only $275! The tank was brand new and everything else was only used for 3 weeks so basically I got the brand new $400 set up for $275. Every fish store around me seems to have one of these as their display tanks so I have had some firsthand experience to go off of in setting mine up. They all run it stock except 1 store supplements an LED bar over it for coral growth. It's definitely a beautiful tank!

 

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Current 11/27/12

 

Tank: Nuvo 16

Lighting: AI Vega w/ New Controller

Heater: EHEIM Jager 50W

Rock: 15lbs Dry Rock

Sand: 20lbs Live Aragonite Fiji Pink

Extras:

-Purigen and PhosGuard

-JBJ Auto Top Off w/ Toms Water Lifter

-Eheim Auto Feeder (for short breaks and as a back up for long breaks)

 

Fish

2 Ocellaris Clownfish

1 Flame Angelfish

1 Yellow Watchman Goby

 

Inverts

1 Peppermint Shrimp

1 Tiger Pistol Shrimp

1 Horseshoe Crab

1 Pom Pom Crab

Astrea Snails

Bumblebee Snails

Nassarius

Mexican Turbo

Baby Starfish (from live rock)

6 Blue Leg Hermits

 

Corals

Frogspawn

Green Star Polyp

Encrusting Pavona

Various Zoas (don't know the names)

Red War Coral

 

 

I started with all dry rock and used the live sand to supplement. I have been dosing Microbacter7 and even with everything in there haven't seen much of a spike of anything. Not sure if there just hasn't been enough to start a cycle or if the bacteria can adequately manage the amount of ammonia that has been incrementally added.

 

Salinity is around 1.025.

 

9/25/12

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9/31/12

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10/3/12

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11/22/12

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11/27/12

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I'm pretty positive everything will be fine. The shrimp was added 1 week after the tank was up because my levels were all okay and shrimp are more sensitive than the fish. As long as the bacterial population can keep up with the ammonia production it will be okay. Obviously when you use live rock and there is a huge ammonia spike it will take a little while for the bacteria to multiply and handle the production however I'm assuming that since I basically started with nothing, the live sand coupled with the addition of Microbacter7 have kept up with the gradual increase in ammonia production.

 

The bacteria multiply exponentially and will handle a gradual increase.

 

Not once have my tests shown a large spike in anything, nor even so much as a little spike. These spikes are what kill livestock and cause a lag time in depletion due to the reproduction cycle of the bacteria however if you are steadily increasing their "food" aka ammonia I believe that their reproduction rate will adequately match that of the addition of ammonia through fish/food waste.

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This is why you buy live rock instead of dry rock.

 

With some good quality live rock, you will be able to put whatever you want in the tank with confidence. Just wait about 2 weeks. I don't know what all the rage is about with dry rock.

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I mean it is a small tank so it's not like there is a massive amount of livestock going in the tank regardless. Outside of the 2 clowns that are already in there, only 1 or 2 more things were going to be added (besides corals) - gradually of course. I didn't want live rock as it's really not "necessary." Live rock started as dry rock =p Plus I liked the look of the dry rock pieces I could find locally versus the live rock.

 

I really don't anticipate anything dying due to a "spike" in anything as there isn't going to be anything to cause a huge spike. The nitrifying bacteria in the tank can handle what is in the tank. When you use a bunch of live rock that has a large amount of die-off, that is when you see the spike because it is a sudden influx of decomposition and as such an increase in ammonia so great that the bacteria have to play "catch-up."

 

Plus, I test it daily just in case. But, so far so good.

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Well that was interesting. I just watched one of the clowns attack a Bumblebee snail. It was climbing on one of the hermits and had its feeler (I think thats what it is) out and the clown bit at the feeler. So far, the snail has not recovered and is sitting upside down on a rock...

 

 

Edit: It recovered but is missing the majority of its feeler/antenna. Crazy! I fed the fish after that in case it was due to them being hungry.

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Is it normal for Frogspawn to close up this much at night? (I had to turn on a light to take the picture, but it usually just has the moonlights on at night.)

 

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This is what it looks like now. I've noticed that it tends to vary between the two over the night but still.. It comes out in full force when the main lights kick on in the morning though.

 

(Apparently my iPhone can't handle the blue lights -__-)

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Grr...so after feeding this morning, my shrimp decided to be adventurous for once and go after a piece of mysis stuck in my Frogspawn. Only thing is, he destroyed a few of the arms (?) in the process >.<

 

I tapped the glass and scared him off before he could do more damage.

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Unrelated first question- You don't happen to live by UCF and go to Living Reef do you?

 

I'm going to jump right into a quick discussion of why you really should research a little more before making bold claims. I am not trying to be harsh or rude but I wouldn't hesitate to say that a good percentage of the members on this forum have much greater knowledge of saltwater tanks than you currently. Especially the individuals who have already posted on this thread. They are offering advice as they have either experienced it themselves or have read countless articles about similar builds. I understand that everyone is new to the hobby at one point but to be successful long term (and easier on your wallet) I would listen to most peoples input on here especially if it is backed by other posters.

 

First off-

I mean it is a small tank so it's not like there is a massive amount of livestock going in the tank regardless. Outside of the 2 clowns that are already in there, only 1 or 2 more things were going to be added (besides corals) - gradually of course. I didn't want live rock as it's really not "necessary." Live rock started as dry rock =p Plus I liked the look of the dry rock pieces I could find locally versus the live rock.

One plus is that you recongize your tank is small, and you have found a wondeful reasource here at Nano-Reef. No matter what anyone else at a LFS will attempt to tell you small thanks are definitely not easier or cheaper; usually they are harder and more expensive to get setup correctly. 2 clowns in your tank is already full bioload in my honest opinion, see how it goes for a few months and then consider adding 1 other fish. Nothing big think small Goby, etc.

 

Live rock to an extent is necessary, it is extremely necessary when you are impatient or crushed for time. While Live rock did in theory come from dry rock most of it has been cured and cultured bacteria for a very long time. Setting up a system comprised entirely of dry rock will take months to cycle fully. I highly recommend you buy 4 or 5 pounds of live rock to seed the tank. It will be money well spent. Live sand is also a big marketing ploy, in theory the water does keep bacteria alive when backed. But through shipping, adverse climates and sitting in the LFS its probable that no bacteria remains.

 

I'm pretty positive everything will be fine. The shrimp was added 1 week after the tank was up because my levels were all okay and shrimp are more sensitive than the fish. As long as the bacterial population can keep up with the ammonia production it will be okay. Obviously when you use live rock and there is a huge ammonia spike it will take a little while for the bacteria to multiply and handle the production however I'm assuming that since I basically started with nothing, the live sand coupled with the addition of Microbacter7 have kept up with the gradual increase in ammonia production.

 

While you may feel that you are positive, everything is not fine and dandy. While I won't bet your Clownfish will die as they are pretty resilient fish a fish in cycle is not the most humane or safe thing, since you already are doing this I will drop the issue. The main problem you fail to realize is that the current bacterial population in your tank is pretty close to obsolete, while it will grow exponentially it will take time. Even with Liverock its best to allow 2 or so weeks as others have already stated for everything to adjust and settle down. Bottled bacteria is another marketing ploy that is largely based on unproven claims. While Shrimp are in theory more sensitive that fish IME that only applies to accilimation, once in a tank all common species such as Skunk Cleaners appear to be surviviors. A good water quality indicator for reef tanks are corals, corals are MUCH more sensitive than fish. Prime example, your hardy green star polyp appears to be very upset or dead.

 

How can you fix the issue created by not cycling? Add a few pounds of liverock and do water changes frequently. Even once cycled you are looking at around 25%+ a week W/Cs to maintain a tank.

 

Not once have my tests shown a large spike in anything, nor even so much as a little spike.

 

I hate assuming but I feel this is justified. Are you using API kits? They aren't the most reliable and there is a very good change you have ammonia in the tank. Any ammonia is bad, period.

 

These spikes are what kill livestock and cause a lag time in depletion due to the reproduction cycle of the bacteria however if you are steadily increasing their "food" aka ammonia I believe that their reproduction rate will adequately match that of the addition of ammonia through fish/food waste.

 

Please do not make such bold claims without even having prior experience. To be completely honest you are wrong while spikes do kill livestock, sustained ammonia levels do also. Ammonia levels can also lead stress opening the door to other illnesses.

 

With that said once again I am not trying to be mean. Rather I am trying to point out some key topics that you should be more open to discuss with others that actually have first hand experience. Your reef keeping experience will go a lot smoother if you do.

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You're going to keep having problems the way you're rushing things. No, your bacteria that you're adding will not keep up with the waste of your two clowns. You're going to have major algae issues in the tank if you don't take a step back and just ignore your tank for a while. You should have waited a least 2 weeks before putting any fish. I'm not trying to tell you what to do. I've been through that time when you want to just add everything already! Your tank looks awesome. Last thing I would want is for it to be covered in hair algae. What is your maintenance routine?

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Unrelated first question- You don't happen to live by UCF and go to Living Reef do you?

 

Yea I go to UCF and I've been there a few times but so far prefer Top Shelf. Why?

 

Especially the individuals who have already posted on this thread. They are offering advice as they have either experienced it themselves or have read countless articles about similar builds.

 

I mean, none of them really added anything to the thread in terms of advice until you did. Just saying...so I mean I wasn't like trying to "ignore" any advice. Just trying to figure out the exact situation my tank is in.

 

One plus is that you recongize your tank is small, and you have found a wondeful reasource here at Nano-Reef. No matter what anyone else at a LFS will attempt to tell you small thanks are definitely not easier or cheaper; usually they are harder and more expensive to get setup correctly. 2 clowns in your tank is already full bioload in my honest opinion, see how it goes for a few months and then consider adding 1 other fish. Nothing big think small Goby, etc.

 

Microsoft pays me a retarded amount to do a very little amount of work lol and between my 3 tanks I've spent way more than I would admit to my parents ha... However, I feel that the Nuvo seems to be a fairly decent stock AIO without any upgrades. Obviously, there is room for addition improvement, but the stock version seems to work pretty well as many LFS around here have one running as a DT and I've asked all of them what they did to it and outside of Living Reef having a LED bar they all run it stock.

 

As for the fish, I mean a goby was about the only other thing I was going to add. Pref a diamond watchman.

 

I highly recommend you buy 4 or 5 pounds of live rock to seed the tank.

 

I had thought about getting a pound or 2 (prob not 4 or 5 as I don't know where it would fit in there) but had been told by a friend who has kept a reef for many years (and started it with base rock he got from under a bridge) that it wasn't completely necessary. So since I didn't really like the look of any pieces I had seen I just nerfed it. I mean if you think I really should add a little bit, I will - as I was going to in the beginning anyway.

 

Live sand is also a big marketing ploy, in theory the water does keep bacteria alive when backed. But through shipping, adverse climates and sitting in the LFS its probable that no bacteria remains.

 

Bacteria, obviously depending on the type, are insanely hardy but I suppose it could go either way. I guess I could have cultured a sample of the water and did an analysis of the concentration of living bacteria directly from the bag. I just switched my major from Microbiology and Molecular Biology so I'm not sure if I would still have complete access to the facilities. Although, it would be interesting to see.

 

Prime example, your hardy green star polyp appears to be very upset or dead.

I don't believe it is dead, as it is still a purple color. So it either just simply hasnt opened yet or as you said could be an indicator of something. I have done research about this and have come up with a lot of people saying their GSP will close up randomly for a week or two at a time then reopen with massive growth. So this could just be the case. Or that something is up with the water quality, but if it is, it's on a very small level as my tests don't show much nor do the tests at the LFS when I take my water in whenever I go. Which according to them - nothing really seemed to be out of wack. Which is why I went ahead and added my first fish.

 

So if you think I should add a few lbs of live rock I'll go ahead and do that this weekend. And again, I mean the only reason I even added anything was because everything was showing 0 and my friend said go ahead and add the first fish. So I could have been wrong in doing that....but obviously it's a learning process and I'm open to any suggestions!

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I'm pretty sure I saw you at Living Reef around a week or so ago. You were asking the sales guy about their Nuvo 16 and the light bar and something about using some rock you found online for planted tanks. If that was you it's pretty crazy I ended up commenting on a thread of yours! lol

 

I know the feeling of dumping money into tanks also, luckily my dad keeps tanks back home so he understands a little although I do tend to go over board, haha. As far as local LFS go I'll be the first to admit that they have some nice Nuvo's but you have to remember they are more than likely using them since they have a deal with Innovative Marine and are spending a lot on them. They have the resources to try pretty much anything and not lose money and can rotate frags and livestock in and out. Not that's a bad thing because if they are truthful about what they do then perfect, however some will try and lie or stretch the proof to make a quick buck. Personally I'd say look for other reefers Nuvo builds for the best information. Although I do believe many use them stock so it's all good. I'm actually pretty sure, although may be wrong so check, that the three sponge filter system in the nuvo has a phosphate removal? So adding other ways may be redundant.

 

Watchman Gobies get pretty large and produce a lot of waste, especially diamonds. By shifting the sand in a nano you may end up with cloudy water from time to time also. If you want to minimize maintenance to keep your water pristine I'd say try a small species.

 

FWIW, Top Shelf>Living Reef in my discussions with them the guys at Top Shelf seem to be a tad more knowledgeable plus the prices are cheaper.

 

If adding a bit of liverock fits in your budget I'd definitely recommend it, it should help establish the aquarium that much quicker. Money well spend honestly. Live Sand also has bacteria without a doubt but nitrifying bacteria requires ammonia, and in a close system such as a bag they will die off very quickly. Hopefully you got bacteria in there but who knows, its pretty much the only way to buy nice reef sand anyway. That is unless you like play sand :P

 

The GSP looks pretty upset, I'd just check your parameters like you said and hope for the best. Sometimes corals just don't adjust for whatever reason. Not that it is a huge deal but do Top Shelf test your water? For whatever reason when they test client water they also use API which isn't known for accuracy :/

 

For placing the frogspawn spawn pick an open area with moderate flow so it can open up nicely. Keep in mind they do have the capability to put own long stinging tentacles if they feel threatened or encroached on. Not likely but its best to air on the side of caution.

 

So I could have been wrong in doing that....but obviously it's a learning process and I'm open to any suggestions!

Once again no one on here is intentionally trying to jump on you or be mean it's just loads of people trickle through the forums take no advice and kill things, which is sad and frustrating to see. I apologize if I approached it the wrong way just trying to let you know what the possible issues may. Keep us informed I expect a quality tank coming from a local! A lot of nice coral stock around here! :D

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How would you even connect that to me? lol but yea that was me. More like 3 weeks ago though. That's really funny though. Small world.

 

It does have a "phosphate sponge" which I believe is the black one? Idk, theres a mechanical yellow one at the top, a black one in the middle, and a green really dense one at the bottom. Seems to do a decent job although like people say, the holder for them only takes up like 60% of the chamber so not all of the water goes through the filters. I just added the PhosGuard because it supposedly goes hand-in-hand with the Purigen and it was like $6 on amazon with 2 day Prime shipping too ^^

 

But yea, they all have been using them stock and they look amazing. One store adds chemi-pure elite (same thing as purigen and phosguard) and the other has the light bar (which somehow is $200).

 

And yea, Top Shelf has the best prices I've seen so far. They have a good selection of smaller fish too whereas I feel like Living Reef generally has bigger fish. So far I've had better experiences there. They matched prices (as best they could) for most of the dry goods I bought there - pretty much everything for my tank minus a few things I just got online cause it was offered on Amazon Prime.

 

And yea I bought the Fiji Pink from Top Shelf and they said it's what they use in pretty much all of their tanks so I figured what the hell. It does have a decent amount of pink shell bits which are pretty visually pleasing. And Top Shelf sells live rock for $5 a lb for the Fiji rock so I could get a pound or two. Should I get rubble if they have it? Or the smallest rocks they have?

 

And yea I have had them test it everytime I've been in there. Mostly for salinity cause they have a refractometer to test it with.

 

And yea it gets decent flow on the bottom I think because I see it moving in the current. Wondering if I should upgrade the pump to get more flow or just leave it as is though. But I meant more for the visually appealing look where should I put it. Idk if I should leave it in the sand there or take it off the base rock and put it somewhere in the rock on the left side. Or something else lol

 

Not that it is a huge deal but do Top Shelf test your water? For whatever reason when they test client water they also use API which isn't known for accuracy :/

Yea they have a few times. Although you can ask them to use the more accurate stuff I'm pretty sure. The guy I always talk to there said he just uses the API more frequently because its an easier test or something and it puts you in the general area unless you need to know an exact number.

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hypersnyper694788

when your ready to see some awesome corals go check out World Wide Corals. There a little more pricey but its worth the trip just to see there display tanks. Good luck with the nuvo, there nice little tanks and im sure you'll get it all figured out.

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hypersnyper694788

Also you may want to move that GSP to an island, thay stuff grows like a weed and will easily take over that entire section of rock. Trust me.

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I've been there and yes they are definitely more expensive lol. Maybe when I'm ballin ill go back there and look again =p I feel like every frag they had was ridiculously small with a $50+ price tag lol. Nice selection though.

 

And yea I've read that. I just don't know where I woul move it to. The only "island" is underneath the overhead which doesn't get any light.

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I really don't know how I have such a good memory of people I've been around, it's a weird trait sometimes lol. I just remember someone asking about their setup and mentioning the rocks and craigslist. I'm actually trying to get all us UCF reefers together to form an on campus club. Would be pretty sweet!

 

I second the fact that WWC really is over priced. Their main stock is geared towards larger reefs and their small selection of smaller frags seem to be comparable to other stores in the area other than 1 or 2 rare zoa morphs, which can easily be ordered from others cheaper. Their show tanks on the other hand... :o

 

I'm not a huge fan of the way Living Reef have their show Nuvo set up. The bar LED seems to take away from the clean flow of the tank. I'd Much rather have a AL Sol (like WWCs tank :lol:) or a Kessil.

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Yea the bar looks pretty dumb and somehow is $200. I like the JBJ Unibody too. A more economical approach would be maybe the BoostLED Par30 light. It's sort of minimalistic look would look pretty good with the tank I think - as the tank itself looks great even with nothing in it.

 

On a side note...a little update.

 

One of my snails apparently died and is being demolished by the shrimp. It was a snail that had fallen over and it looked like it was going to be able to get back up but when I woke up in the morning it was still turned over. So I flipped the guy back up and then today the shrimp was eating it lol...so the first casualty of the tank due to poor motor skills with the snail. I've got some killers in my tank.

 

The bumblebee snail is a tank though. The one that got attacked by the clown was trying to eat the dead snail too and then I looked a few hours ago and it was somehow in the shrimp cave and it was getting picked at by the shrimp and I thought I had 2 casualties then. Now that same bumblebee snail is back to eating the dead snail! Seriously invincible.

 

Also, a bumblebee snail got underneath my GSP frag and eventually knocked it off the shelf. I put it back but on top in the middle (temporary) however, it apparently must have liked that (or something) as one of the tubes is opening up so maybe it just didn't like where I had it originally. -___-

 

You can sorta see it in this picture.

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JBJ unibodies are what 350? An AI Sol would be 299.99 without controller similar price with but is much sleeker looking. I think for your tank you'll need 2 par30s from boost. My dad has a 13 gallon bow front mr aqua with a pair of them and it seems to be just enough light. I'll have to ask what bar they are using I'm intrigued, I know that my Panorama pro 18 inch modules are 89 each new plus at least one power supply at 35. Dang LEDs are so pricey, but sweet!

 

The snail was likely on its way out your tank inhabitants aren't killers its just nature has a way of cleaning up after sickness and saltwater animals key in on "death" and finish the job.

 

When you find a spot for the coral go ahead and buy some super glue gel to keep it it the desired spot. As for the GSP is the flow in the new location more? They do prefer medium-high flow

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Yea unless I just wanted 1 of them for sort of a spot-lighting in the center where I could put the higher light corals. I wouldn't get rid of the 2 stock lights if I did that either.

 

And yeah I know haha. Was just saying "killers." lol

 

Yes it definitely had a better flow there. Maybe it was just peeking its head out cause it retreated again. But it was nice to see that it's still alive and just hibernating I guess lol.

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hypersnyper694788
I've been there and yes they are definitely more expensive lol. Maybe when I'm ballin ill go back there and look again =p I feel like every frag they had was ridiculously small with a $50+ price tag lol. Nice selection though.

 

And yea I've read that. I just don't know where I woul move it to. The only "island" is underneath the overhead which doesn't get any light.

 

I agree about WWC, as far as the GSP goes just get a small rock and make a new island. whatever you do don't let it start growing on your structure. Unless you enjoy picking it off ever few weeks to keep it at bay.

 

I really don't know how I have such a good memory of people I've been around, it's a weird trait sometimes lol. I just remember someone asking about their setup and mentioning the rocks and craigslist. I'm actually trying to get all us UCF reefers together to form an on campus club. Would be pretty sweet!

 

I second the fact that WWC really is over priced. Their main stock is geared towards larger reefs and their small selection of smaller frags seem to be comparable to other stores in the area other than 1 or 2 rare zoa morphs, which can easily be ordered from others cheaper. Their show tanks on the other hand... :o

 

I'm not a huge fan of the way Living Reef have their show Nuvo set up. The bar LED seems to take away from the clean flow of the tank. I'd Much rather have a AL Sol (like WWCs tank :lol:) or a Kessil.

 

I like Living Reef's Nuvo, i think the stock lights were not cutting it for them so they had to add that bar LED. Check out Sea In The City, they have a pretty nice selection, there staff is very knowledgable and very very nice.

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Well currently my GSP is on the group half the time since I haven't had time to glue it anywhere.

 

And yea, their tank looks great! It's just the we were saying we didn't like the look of the light bar on it. Not that the light bar was a bad light hah.

 

Where is Sea in the City?

 

Have to say I'm still a big fan of Top Shelf though. Was there over the weekend and at the Saltwater Livestock re-opening and got a few sweet things for pretty good deals. I got 20% off at Saltwater Livestock for it being their grand reopening and 10% off at Top Shelf for their student discount (love it).

 

If you can positive ID any of these, let me know! I forget what they were/didn't know in the first place. I kinda just picked based on if it looks cool or not and by recommendation of employees for neat stuff.

 

(prices are before discounts)

 

Fuzzy Mushroom (I believe). This is an awesome piece and sways a little in the current. ($10 Top Shelf)

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Massive colony of red and green zoas. Must have at least 40 heads on there. ($15 Saltwater Livestock)

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I don't know what this one is. It moves in the current and is pretty awesome. ($10 Saltwater Livestock)

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This is a little hard to see, especially under my lights, but it's a zoa colony (obviously) that is blue-ish. ($10 Top Shelf) The guy said blues were a little harder to find (I asked for help picking some cool corals that he would buy if he were shopping). If I upgrade the lights in the future maybe it will pop a little more color out.

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--------------------

That's it for the new corals. On another note, my GSP (I'm still assuming that's what it is) seems to be pretty happy with where it is now and has fully opened. Snails keep knocking it on the ground and it has fallen off its plug rock too. Can I just put glue on the underside of the coral? Or does it need to be attached to a rock first?

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I also picked up a pretty nice piece of cured live rock from Top Shelf too. The guy picked it out for me and it ended up working with my current design versus having to take it out after it's sort of seeded the tank. It's got a good amount of coralline, a nice sponge growing on it, some bristle worms, and I've also noticed a few really small feather dusters. 0.4 lbs for like $2.

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I'm starting to get some brown patches (hard to see in this picture) but I'm assuming it's a good thing. At least I know my tank isn't as sterile as a hospital now. Plus it gives the crabs/snails something to eat.

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Had my water checked again, twice, and everything was at 0 again still. Next time I go in, I'll have them test for the obscure stuff like phosphates and calcium. Then I'll decide on possibly a 2 part dosing regimen.

 

FTS:

Everything seems to be happy where it is placed now. I just need to go about getting them off their plugs and gluing them down. Any tips to doing that? I got a little super glue pack from Saltwater Livestock ($1.99, figured why not) and they said just use a razor to pop it off the plug and put a dab of glue on it and stick it in.

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